American and Australian shot by Israeli army

[Aidoneus]

better un-buried, Indy? :)

American and Australian shot by Israeli army
By Odai Sirri
Saturday 25 October 2003

Two international peace activists have been shot by Israeli soldiers at a Palestinian refugee camp near Nablus.

Details of the shooting were released to Aljazeera.net within hours of the incident on Friday evening, but the identities of the injured are being witheld until their families can be contacted.

The Australian and American men were both shot in the legs at the Balata refugee camp and were taken to Rafidia Hospital where they are now undergoing treatment.

According to the representatives from the International Solidarity Movement (ISM), the two were shot after escorting Palestinian children away from Israeli soldiers who entered the camp.

ISM officials said two Palestinian boys were hit by rubber bullets, but the American and Australian volunteers were shot with live bullets and remain in hospital.

--snip--

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/01AA7ECA-7018-447B-A10D-9E4139D4788A.htm

[La_Serpiente]

1. Oh my gawdd

the pigs. They probably didn't even have their guns pulled out or anything. They don't even have guns.

Shooting unarmed people (I am assuming this) is totally immoral.

[Resistance]

10. The ISM is Gandhi-style non-violence

Therefore, indeed they would have been unarmed.

[acmavm]

2. Dang peace activists, shame on them for trying to protect children.

Especially Palestinian children.

[Resistance]

24. yep that's what they get

Israeli bullets ripping through their bodies.

Way to go IDF. You're so brave.

[madrchsod]

3. it`s a neat trick

shoot at the legs -you don`t kill and the injuried will prob. never walk again.

[sam sarrha]

8. they found that if they shot the children throwing rocks in the side of

head just behind the eye and above the cheek bone they could get a sure kill with a rubber bullet. over 900 children under the age of 14 were shot dead last year, and over 9000 adults. I saw documentary video tape of Israeli soldiers shooting children at about 200 yards with a big bore long barrel sniper scope, they were concealed behind a wall apparently receiving detailed instruction's about their targets by radio, they kept sighting then communicating and sighting and communicaning..it really looked like they were discussing a particular target.. they fired and a child went down. then a Palestinian official displayed a can of rubber bullets said to have to come from dead children. some of the slugs were apparently 30 Cal.like our deer rifles, they had very thin layers of rubber, others had thicker rubber but make a loud clink! when dropped into the can to show their weight. We have all these debates about spanking children, where is the debate about shooting them...? I have X-friends who said that if they were throwing rocks they should be shot. I was curious about this and showed the NEWS paper article asked people around the area like at quick stops i met regularly, Most said that they should be shot dead.. even from hiding at great distance... for throwing rocks. I was depressed for a long time.

[The Magistrate]

23. You Are Going To Have Validate Those Figures, Mr. Sarrha

Nine hundred children under fourteen shot dead in the last year alone, along with nine thousand adults, is simply outlandish. Since the recent bout of active hostilities late in 2000, roughly three thousand Arab Palestianes have been killed, according to most sources on both sides, and of these, only a few dozen have been children under the age of twelve.

You seem also to be under rather an illusory view of the accuracy of the rubber-coated slugs. Precise shooting with them is no more possible than with an old musket.

[pschoeb]

27. Your right Magistrate

Those numbers seem more inline with the numbers of people injured or killed by rubber bullets since the start of the intifada. There have been 5818 non-fatal injuries by rubber bullets since the start of the intifada, it's not clear how many of the 2483 deaths are from rubber bullets from the data I could get. This is from Palestine Red Cresent.

http://www.palestinercs.org/Database/Date/mf.pl?moin=09&yin=2000&mout=09&yout=2003

Patrick Schoeb

[mike_c]

4. the IDF are murderous bastards....

eom

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mike_c]

6. welcome to DU, DL!

eom

[mmm]

7. Looks like you have your ducks in a row then

Welcome!

[loudnclear]

9. Those who never cease to amaze me are the US supporters of these

IDF terrorists. Mostly in Congress and mostly running and ruining our government.

[Herschel]

11. A suspect source

These were likely accidents. We can hope this does not spawn more Rachel Corrie type of fables.

[Darranar]

12. Every time...

that soemthing from Al-Jazeera has been posted, it's been confirmed by other news sources.

How do you know that they were accidents?

[Herschel]

14. The IDF is moral

They do not make practice of purposely killing innocents. It is likely these were accidents. I prefer other sources.

[Darranar]

15. How can an extension of the government's will...

be moral?

National interests, and the pursuit of them, are rarely moral.

[bluesoul]

17. Morality

If the IDF is so moral one would wonder whey there is a number (not so small) of IDF refuseniks and people unwilling to participate in combat and flying combat planes on the ground that the occupation and policy itself is IMMORAL?

[Herschel]

18. There are some undesirables

that refuse their missions. This does not mean the IDF is not as careful as warranted in their activities.

[Darranar]

19. Why are they undesirables?

the refuseniks are heroes - they refuse to work against innocent Palestinians and add fuel to the fire of terrorism.

[Herschel]

20. It is not their place

to refuse missions in defense of Israel. They will be dealt with.

[bluesoul]

21. Spooky

"They will be dealt with."

Now that's a chilling response. Are you sure you are a progessive and on the right forum?

[Herschel]

22. I was referring to the fact

there are ramifacations for these refusals, as there should be.

[Resistance]

30. What exactly are the ramifications

you threaten these heroes with?

[SOS]

25. Here's another source

http://www.harpers.org/online/gaza_diary/gaza_diary.php3?pg=7

[Gimel]

29. The totals of injuries

Are remarkably devided equally into 4 groups, with Miscellaneous being one quarter. Tear gas being one quarter and rubber bullets one quarter, live ammo one quarter. Quite random, it seems.

Where do the deaths of the suicide bombers (close to 300) and the deaths of collaborators fall into this scheme?

http://www.btselem.org/English/Statistics/index.asp

http://www.btselem.org/English/Statistics/Al_Aqsa_Fatalities_Tables.asp

[bluesoul]

13. Right

Of course, they'r ALL accidents, Israel would never intentionally shoot at Palestinian civilians, peace activists or Americans. And they never ever did..

[Herschel]

16. Very rarely perhaps

If the IDF were interested in killing Palestinian civilians, the results would be horrific.

[drewb]

26. Thank goodness it hasn't reached the horrific stage yet...

:wtf:

[Resistance]

28. actually it has

Israel is killing innocent civilians, and the results are horrific.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Tinoire]

31. Israelis shoot Australian activist (in both legs) - some details

An Australian activist campaigning against Israel's occupation of the West Bank was shot through both legs during a protest, the International Solidarity Movement (ISM) said.

Perth university student Joshua Taaffe, 24, was shot through both legs by Israeli troops who used a searchlight to spot him, ISM spokesman Michael Shaiq said.

M<snip>

Mr Taaffe is now receiving medical treatment in a Nablus hospital, although Israeli troops had earlier entered the ward where he was lying and allegedly trained a weapon on him, Mr Shaiq claimed.

<snip>
A Palestinian man wounded by Israeli fire near Nablus died.
He was reported to have been shot in the back while walking to work in Nablus from his home in the nearby village of Bureen.


http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/10/26/1067103266494.html

[Adalah]

33. The sad thing

is we often get caught up in debating the circumstances of the deaths of peace activists. Certainly, we would want anyone deliberately harming them to be brought to justice. But this shouldn't distract us from paying homage to their courage and commitment. Many of these people will forever have my admiration.