Israeli Troops Open Fire at Coffee Shop

[Aidoneus]

Israeli Troops Open Fire at Coffee Shop
Friday October 3, 2003 7:31 PM
By RAVI NESSMAN
Associated Press Writer

JERUSALEM (AP) - Israeli troops raided a West Bank coffee shop filled with men playing cards Friday morning, wounding three and arresting more than a dozen others during a search for fugitives, Palestinian officials said. The Israeli army said its soldiers fired at three men who had ignored orders to halt.

Two of the wounded were electricians doing repair work.

Military officials said troops did not fire into the coffee shop. An Associated Press reporter counted eight bullet holes in the windows of the coffee shop and 11 more inside, and saw glass shards on the floor.

--snip--

The Friday raid on the coffee shop in the northern West Bank town of Qabatiyeh began when about a dozen jeeps suddenly pulled up outside and soldiers jumped out, said Nasser Zakarneh, 30, who owns a shop next door.

Soldiers opened fire at the coffee shop filled with card players, he said.

Two electricians working inside ran out when they heard the shooting and were about 40 yards from the buildings when they were shot, Zakarneh said. A third man was shot about 20 yards away, he said.

--snip--

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-3223334,00.html

[Cappurr]

1. But that isn't terrorism, of course

Its combat. :eyes:

[sushi]

5. No, it isn't

It's self-defense.

[tinnypriv]

2. The associated press guy who found bullet holes must have been an ay-rab

The IDF never lies.

[Gimel]

41. Unbelievable

A dozen tanks outside this one shop, all the soldiers firing into the shop at the card palyers. Only two wounded. Incredible. Must be lousy shots, these IDF soldiers.

Edited to correct error in number of tanks.

[damnraddem]

3. This is business as usual for the IDF.

What's different is that it's being reported as 'IDF opens fire at coffee shop,' not 'IDF catches terrorists at coffee shop.' Note that the headline still doesn't say 'IDF fires into coffee shop,' which is apparently what happened.

It's cowboys and Indians all over again, but the Indians outnumber the cowboys, and this will increase over time. Settlers have already destroyed the possibility of a two-state solution. Someday Israel will face the prospect of pressure to extend democratic rights to a non-Jewish majority. Israel has tried to turn the West Bank (and Gaza) into a series of Bantustans. I await the day that a democratic majority takes power in Israel -- a la South Africa (no, the disjuncture in sizes of populations is not at all like in South Africa, but the Palestinians are a growing majority nevertheless).

[Equinox]

4. Racism at its best....

The raid came hours before Israel announced it was sealing off the West Bank and Gaza Strip - keeping about 3 million Palestinians from entering Israel and preventing Palestinian residents of the West Bank from leaving their communities. The closure was part of an effort to prevent militant attacks on Israelis over the Yom Kippur holiday beginning Sunday evening.

Palestinians have to suffer so the Israelis can enjoy their holiday.


Fucking ridiculous.

[drdon326]

6. Yeah.....fucking ridiculous...

i mean , who would be low enough to attack Israells
on the Yom Kippur...thw holiest day in israel ?

[Equinox]

7. Who would be low enough to lock down and entire people...

...so that some can enjoy their holiday. That's utterly ridiculous.

[Herschel]

8. Problems with the noose

should be addressed to the terrorists.

[drdon326]

9. Yeah.....fucking ridiculous.....

i mean....israel should do NOTHING to upset the
poor terrorists who are sooooo inconvienenced by the
mean ol' IDF.

Heres a novel idea....get rid of terrorists.

[Jackie97]

11. Were the card players and the electrician terrorists?

Give me a fucking break! What I hate most about the "pro-Israeli" argument is their acting like every Palestinian killed or injured is a terrorist. It's as disgusting as the argument that if he/she Vietnamese and if he/she dead, then he/she Viet Cong.

Disgusting!

[Equinox]

13. Hey Jackie97....they were suicide card players....

I think one of them had the suicide king.

[Jackie97]

21. ???

[Equinox]

28. It was a pun....

[bluesoul]

30. Agreed

I share your sentiments Jackie. Labeling a whole nation as terrorists is disgusting. What is then a nation with a war criminal (Sharon) as PM?

[Equinox]

12. So your saying all of the Palestinians are terrorists?

What about Israeli terrorists? Does that make all Israelis terrorists? How about we lock them up? Where does it end? Drdon and Herschel school of logic is one big stinkin' joke.

[drdon326]

15. Uhhhhh....that was your diversion.

"The raid came hours before Israel announced it was sealing off the West Bank and Gaza Strip - keeping about 3 million Palestinians from entering Israel and preventing Palestinian residents of the West Bank from leaving their communities. The closure was part of an effort to prevent militant attacks on Israelis over the Yom Kippur holiday beginning Sunday evening."

are you able to logically follow a issue ?

the issue YOU brought up was sealing off the west bank and gaza.

[Equinox]

16. Come again?

[LastDemInIdaho]

17. If the entire people won't hand over their terrorists then force is needed

If you choose to harbour killers that target innocents then expect the worse.

[Violet_Crumble]

24. Obviously we shouldn't be complaining when an entire people is punished...

Damn, I knew those silly Afghan and Iraqi populations were just a bunch of whiners who don't understand that any number of deaths and any amount of destruction towards them is what has to happen. For some strange reason, collective punishment is no more palatable now than when the Nazis used it with similar 'security' excuses back in WWII...

Violet...

[Gimel]

42. Closure

All places of business are closed. Why would Palestinian workers need to enter? No work is available.

[Darranar]

45. Not today...

and the blocking of the palestinians is in effect today.

[Jackie97]

10. Israelis don't blow up coffee shops like Palestinaians do....

They just shoot into them. I am looking forward to seeing "pro-Israelis" try to wiggle out of this one.

[Equinox]

14. Spin Spin suga

Spin Spin suga.

[LastDemInIdaho]

18. No wiggle needed

Those that harbour terrorists are as guilty as those that terrorize.

[Jackie97]

22. So.....

Let's ASSume that any Palstinian attacked is harboring a terrorist. LOL.

Lovely logic.

[Violet_Crumble]

25. When's yr trial or extrajudicial execution?

After all, you Americans are harbouring a few terrorists over there ;)


Violet...

[Aidoneus]

29. I'm curious..

A few questions if you can find time to answer..

Were the people that were inside this coffee shop that was shot up "guilty"? You seem to be rationalizing the IDF attacking this coffee shop, do you oppose this act? What is your opinion of the shooters? How is it any different from the "terrorism" you claim to oppose when somebody else does it?

[Fight_n_back]

19. Weren't you the one

questioning that there were sides?

[Jackie97]

23. Not everybody is on a particular side....

Some people are solely on the side of Israelis; don't really care much about life on the other side.

Some people are on the side of Palestinians: don't really care much about life on the other side.

Most people care for people on BOTH SIDES of the issue, and it makes them sick to hear from somebody from one of the first two.

[Violet_Crumble]

26. Couldn't agree more with that...

:)

Violet...

[Fight_n_back]

27. I think you are having me on

you have arbitrarily put me on the side of "only cares abot one side" with no history to back it up. Their are reasons I could guess at but I'll give you a chance to explain yourself.

[Jackie97]

33. Did I say particularly you?

However, I think I will put you notice if you sound like you only care about one side in the future; just to show you what I'm talking about.

[drdon326]

31. HEY JACKIE.....

You wonder why the lock down??

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=124&topic_id=18135

pathetic

[bluesoul]

32. That's an EXCUSE?

So you kill innocent people in return and that's justice. Great...

[Jackie97]

35. Are you an Amnesty International member?

I was wondering by the candle.

[Jackie97]

34. The problem....

is that Isreal is collectively punishing the Palestinians. They're pretty much declaring that all Palestinians should be treated like terrorists with their occupation and their wall. If it wasn't for that collective punishment which causes Palestinians to loose jobs, homes, and not be able to provide for themselves, there would hardly be any Palestinians willing to do the despicable act that was in that post.

[drdon326]

36. Oh HORSESPIT.

The only "COLLECTIVE PUNISHMENT" is on innocent
israelis enduring endless terrorism.

[Darranar]

37. BOOM!

Sharon is tearing down the wall! The settlements are being removed! Extra-judicial assasinations have stopped!

If drdon is telling the truth, that is...

[Jackie97]

38. Exactly...

What he's really saying is that one has to be an Israeli to be a victim. All Palestinians hurt are guilty of something.

[drdon326]

39. No...thats NOT what I said.

thats a pathetic lie.

[Darranar]

40. See post #37...

and reply to it, please.

[drdon326]

43. My pleasure

"Sharon is tearing down the wall! The settlements are being removed! Extra-judicial assasinations have stopped!"

The wall is self protection. period.
settlements are to be negoitiated.
extrajudicial assasinations...self defense and i hope
they get everyone of those who engage in terrorism.

[Darranar]

44. I'm not talking about their possible merits...

the fact is that both the settlements and the wall are collecxtive punishment, justified or not. Can you dispute that?

[laura888]

20. I think the only solution is to send in...

...a UN peacekeeping force....

[Aidoneus]

46. fortyfive as yet

and none of the pro-Israel people that have posted to this so far have hinted at the slightest opposition to this shooting, and in fact seem to be trying to rationalize it in the most vague and desperate of attempts. I guess being a Palestinian electrician is a crime of "terrorism" now, punishable by death:--I must've missed that memo. Now, I knew merely commiting the offense of existing while Palestinian makes one a "suspected terrorist", but I didn't know it was being extended specifically to one's trade..

Such a reaction is a bit disheartening, but unfortunately I've seen worse. (see, I resisted the urge to look silly by calling this "the most disgusting thing I've ever seen", as there is the tendency to ritually spit out on occasion). The words from these hypocrites in the future will ring hollower.

Skimming through the Haifa thread(s), no such behavior.. duly noted.