The Palestinian people will not forgive the thugs

[pelsar]

What is happening in the Gaza Strip and to a lesser extent in the West Bank is a cardinal crime against the Palestinian people and its enduring cause. It is a hideous act of profanity against our past, present and future by the thuggish forces which are at America’s and Israel’s beck and call.

It is no secret that the vast bulk of the senseless killings, vandalism and abductions are perpetrated by thugs and gangsters answerable to Muhammad Dahlan, the Fatah leader who is being financed and armed and encouraged by the United States and Israel.

It is also no secret that the ultimate goal of the Dahlan’s financiers and arms supplier is to destroy the Palestinian people ability to continue the struggle for freedom and liberation and weaken their immunity to withstand Israeli criminality and pressure.

http://www.ptimes.org/main/default.aspx?xyz=BOgLkxlDHteZpYqykRlUuI1kx%2fVDUOFo3Y7wiMwdIFFyDMc8e%2fEOTEAK6eRwPe%2bIH0Z2BqbNkGRoJMxTktNdPZqvvcyH%2fiLPsggle1gbJ8X4rXjt8%2bCPo7qqP7TXAF7t8rdnfIrHXDY%3d

_______

i thought the palestinian times was going to be an intelligent paper (along the lines of haaretz)...what is wrong with the writer/editors?.....writing such nonsense, and with such an attitude, explains a lot about their current situation in gaza

blaming israel and the US on the internal strife within gaza: Whats "no secret" is that hamas is fighting fatah is fighing islamic jihad, is fighting the clans and the local neighborhood watch groups..and it has nothing to do with anybody else but themselves.

different article: same paper:
There is no doubt that Israel is a satanic creature, an evil entity not unlike the Third Reich.
http://www.ptimes.org/main/default.aspx?xyz=BOgLkxlDHteZpYqykRlUuI1kx%2fVDUOFoAHa6UyLtf8ZFnpO4UVn664gdinJkc63melob5feN%2f3GVL5ec4hesyUZ6YceItPPutoiAg5fKNauO8bFuoLGe1xfWP6941gceh7R%2fNBYpoVw%3d

rather pathetic.....just another paper in the arab world....but it always interesting to read just who 'evil" we really are....nor how many stories they will spin to blame israel and america on their own problems

[azurnoir]

1. So are we to assume that the US is not

financing Fatah? or that the Palestinians are stoopid for not falling in line behind who they're told to?
on edit: Israel and the US are not the cause of internal strife among Palestinians however the US will "encourage" the side it wants to win. The US and Israel seem to have the same attitude about the Palestinians as the US has about Iraq they're sovereign when it suits and not when doesn't i.e. your problems are your own fault and not when what is deemed "necessary" action is to be taken by outside forces. In Iraq Maliki has ordered the US to stop building the wall in Baghdad, let's see what happens with that.

[pelsar]

3. how about assuming...

that the palestinains can make their own decisions...and if they disagree with one another its not some conspiracy?....or are you saying that they're not smart enough to have different views...it must be someone else telling them what to think?

[azurnoir]

5. It was publicly anounced on the US news

that Ms Rice would offer support to Fatah. As for the other conspiracies you enumerated (reply to MsMcGhee) I truly have never heard of any of them, but both sides have enough "tinfoil" to wrap the earth a couple times over


http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewForeignBureaus.asp?Page=/ForeignBureaus/archive/200704/FOR20070419a.html
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53816

[msmcghee]

6. When faced with no other argument to refute . .

. . the claim you pull out the old "they both do it" canard.

And for evidence - you provide links to articles that the IDF is concerned that weapons provided by the US to Fatah could end up being used at some point to attack IDF forces.

Boy, what a crazy tin-foil theory that is. :sarcasm: Probably has nothing to do with that exact same thing happening in the past when the US and other western states helped arm the PA militia under Arafat.

To qualify as a conspiracy theory you might find an example that didn't actually become part of established history in the recent past. As some famous hippie once said, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you."

[azurnoir]

8. My point was that the US interference was not

a conspiracy theory, it is fact. I stated before the US or Israel did not cause the split between the Palestinians. The US has an established history of taking advantage of a split between a perceived enemy.
Personally I prefer the more recent "The question isn't are you paranoid, but are you paranoid enough"

Edited to add maybe I should have inserted:sarcasm: into my first comment, that is exactly what it was.

[msmcghee]

2. Conspiracy theories are part of the mindset . .

I found this article that some here might like to read - as it proposes some explanations for why the I/P conflict is so intractable:

Mainstreaming Conspiracy Theories II: Arab Conspiracy Thinking before and after 2000
Filed under: Arab-Israeli Conflict, Global Jihad, Conspiracy and Hidden Hands, apocalyptic, millennial — RL @ 6:20 pm — Print This Post

Conspiracy Theory in Arab/Muslim world

It is something of a commonplace that the Arab and Muslim media are full of conspiracy-thinking. Indeed, anyone bold enough to defy Edward Saïd’s prohibition on seeing Arabs as different from Westerners, remarks among the most salient features of Arab culture a propensity to conspiracy theory: Everything is part of a plot; every motive has secret and malevolent motives. The frequency with which even quotidian political events are conceived as the playing out of conspiracies confirms what observation also notices: this is a culture where the political axiom “rule or be ruled” dominates.

Nor is this kind of thinking a recent phenomenon. After WW II, for example, the Nazi conspiracy theories about the Jews, in particular, their foundational conspiracy theory, The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, found earnest welcome in the Arab world. It provided the perfect escape from facing the nature of their failure to wipe out any trace of an independent state made by dhimmi. This same need to explain their humiliating failure by blaming the conspiratorial malevolence of others accounts for why one of the major disagreements in the Arab world today is whether the US is a pawn of Israel or vice-versa.

Dan Pipes’ 1998 book, The Hidden Hand, describes the role of conspiracy theory in the Arab world. There he finds a mentality that pervades almost all forms of thought, that contributes fundamentally to both the insolubility of the Arab-Israeli conflict and the economic stagnation of the Arab world. But he also finds that conspiracy theory works primarily as a depressant: the forces are so great, the Arabs such victims, that nothing can be done. Pipes finds this quality among the most damaging:

Imagining conspiracies of malicious, omnipotent adversaries can induce a profound sense of hopelessness. After all, how can an enemy so shrewd, so powerful, and so vast be challenged? At the same time, how can one negotiate or compromise with such an implacable and evil force?

http://www.theaugeanstables.com/2006/06/19/mainstreaming-conspiracy-theories-i-arab-conspiracy-thinking-before-and-after-2000/

[pelsar]

4. theres actually far more

just in the "every day life"...stuff that any western paper would be embarrassed to print:

• candies with aids
• gas attacks

• my favorite was a couple of years ago about the naked israeli female soldier who stood on a tank, ,when the Palestinians approached her to "cover her" she pulled out a pistol that was hidden and shot them. (dont ask where it was hidden, the article didnt elaborate)
• we've got israelis stealing arab organs to sell
• how about the bird flu that only attacks arabs
• the "ethnic bomb (again genetics)
• the bio engineered virus that killed arafat
• poisoning the water supply
• and of course the new missiles that amputate but dont "burn" and then disappear

and those are just the ones i remember.....
____
but i do agree with the "group-think" aspect of the culture.....it seems to be a very strong part of it.....

but the paper was disappointing, i was hoping for some real insights in to the palestinian culture..

[The Magistrate]

7. The Tale Of The Young Woman On The Tank, Sir

Reminds me of some arcane aspects of war-fare in old China, that could be seen on occassion even in the early twentieth century. War fighting was conceived to incorporate magical elements as well as material ones, and exposure to menstruation was generally viewed as disarming sorcery. Thus, menstruating women, exposing themselves from the waist down, were at times pressed into service atop beseiged city walls, or in the vanguard of an advance, as a sort of counter-measure against enemy magics....

[azurnoir]

9. Well I had heard that menstrating women can

turn meat rancid by mere touch, but magically break a siege by simply exposing themselves?
Wish I would have realized this kind of power 10 years ago while I still had it LOL:sarcasm: