H.R.2038/S.1431 total semi auto ban

[thomas82]

First of all i was not aware of this until I read an earlier post here in the gungeon.

The below info was compiled from info from the NRA websight so if it is inacurate please tell me and I will update/correct/delete it.

This scares me cause if this was to pass virtualy all semi auto rifles would be banned.

Also if posting this is offensive tell me, as I dont think I am violating the TOS.
Tom

H.R. 2038/S. 1431, introduced by Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.) and Sen. Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.), does not just "reenact" or "reauthorize" the 1994 federal "assault weapon" law. It bans millions more guns and begins backdoor registration of guns. All told, it`s a giant step closer to the goal There is no 10-year sunset provision in H.R.2038/S.1431. It permanently bans every gun banned by the Assault Weapon ban, and:


Bans every gun made to comply with the Assault Weapon ban.
The Assault Weapon ban dictated the kinds of grips, stocks and attachments new guns can have. Manufacturers and gun owners complied and new guns conform to the Feinstein requirements. H.R. 2038/S.1431 bans the new guns too.



Bans guns exempted by name or type under the Assault Weapon ban.
Commonplace Ruger Mini 14s, Mini-30s, Ranch Rifles, .30 Caliber Carbines, and fixed-magazine semi-automatic center-fire rifles.



Bans all semi-automatic shotguns.
Bans Remington, Winchester, Beretta, Benelli, and other shotguns commonly used for hunting, trap, skeet, sporting clays, and self-defense. Bans them by banning their main component, called the "receiver" (sec. 2(a)(30)(J)), and bans them because they have "any characteristic that can function as a grip"(sec. 2(H)(ii) and (b)(42)). Any characteristic.



Bans all detachable-magazine semi-automatic rifles because they have "any characteristic that can function as a grip." (sec.2(a)(30)(D)(iii) and (iv), and (b)(41) and (42)). Any characteristic.


Bans target shooting rifles.
Bans the three centerfire rifles most popular for marksmanship competitions: the Colt AR-15, the Springfield M1A and the M1 "Garand."



Bans guns for self-defense.
Bans any semi-automatic shotgun or rifle an Attorney General one day claims isn`t "sporting," even though the U.S. Constitution, the constitutions of 44 states, and the laws of all 50 states recognize the right to use guns for defense.



Bans 65 named guns (the Assault Weapon ban bans 19);
Bans semi-auto fixed-magazine pistols of over 10 rounds capacity;

Bans frames, receivers, and parts used to repair or refurbish guns;

Bans importation of magazines exempted by the Assault Weapon ban;

Bans selling a legally-owned "assault weapon" with a magazine of over 10 rounds capacity.



Bans guns rarely used in crime. A fact proven by every state and local law enforcement agency report, and every DOJ felon survey on the subject. The Congressionally-mandated study of the Assault Weapon ban found that the guns "were never used in more than a fraction of all gun murders."


Begins backdoor registration. Requires private sales of banned guns, frames, and parts to be conducted through licensed dealers. Thus, the bill bans private sales and establishes de facto registration.

[DarkPhenyx]

1. Cool! n/t

[Columbia]

2. Where ya been, Phenyx?

Haven't seen ya around lately.

[DarkPhenyx]

3. Oh I'm around.

Just pissing off a different set of people is all. I try to spread the love ya know!

Also work has been a bitch, I bought a "new to me" house, adn my Sister is getting divorced so she's moving in with me. It's probably a good theng they took away my high explosives. Probably. :evilgrin:

[kikiek]

4. Here is the bill

I don't understand what it means. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:HR02038:@@@L&

[Vladimir]

5. A summary from the related S.1431

Assault Weapons Ban and Law Enforcement Protection Act of 2003 - Amends Federal firearms provisions to revise the definition of "semiautomatic assault weapon" to include conversion kits (for converting a firearm to a semiautomatic assault weapon) and any semiautomatic rifle or pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and that has any one of the following characteristics, respectively: (1) a folding or telescoping stock, a threaded barrel, a pistol grip, a forward grip, or a barrel shroud; or (2) a second pistol grip, a threaded barrel, a barrel shroud, or the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at a location outside of the pistol grip.

Amends the Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act to repeal the sunset provision for the assault weapons ban. Modifies exemptions from the ban to: (1) retain the exemption of any firearm that is manually operated by bolt, pump, level, or slide action, that has been rendered permanently inoperable, or that is an antique firearm; and (2) remove the exemption of specified firearms, or replicas or duplicates, as manufactured on October 1, 1993, any semiautomatic rifle that cannot accept a detachable magazine that holds more than five rounds, and any semiautomatic shotgun that cannot hold more than five rounds in a fixed or detachable magazine.

Prohibits the transfer of a semiautomatic assault weapon except through a licensed dealer or a State or local law enforcement agency, subject to specified requirements. Directs the Attorney General to: (1) establish and maintain a record of the make, model, and date of manufacture of any semiautomatic assault weapon which the Attorney General is made aware has been used in relation to a crime, and of the nature and circumstances of the crime involved; and (2) annually submit the record to Congress and make the record available to the public.

Prohibits: (1) the transfer of any assault weapon with an large capacity ammunition feeding device; and (2) a licensed manufacturer, importer, or dealer who transfers such a a device that was manufactured on or before September 13, 1994, from failing to certify to the Attorney General, within 60 days of the transfer date, that the device was manufactured on or before that date. Sets penalties for violations.

Prohibits: (1) the transfer of a semiautomatic assault weapon or a large capacity ammunition feeding device to a juvenile; and (2) the importation of such a device.

[kikiek]

6. I don't see the problem with it.

[Vladimir]

7. I am not a lawyer

but what I want to know is, what does this do for the grandfather clause? Someone please decipher for me, the hampster in my brain is turning slowly tonight.

[VTMechEngr]

65. Just something i noticed that you have wrong.

It says it bans the M1 carbine.



NOT the M1 Garand.




Big difference.

sorry, this is to thomas82

[mongo]

8. Politicians prefer unarmed peasants

[MrBenchley]

12. GOP politicians seem to prefer heavily armed dimwits....

preferably those with some sort of mental disorder...



"PITTSBURGH -- A man whose son was killed in the Columbine High School shootings literally walked in his child's shoes to the National Rifle Association convention, where he hoped Vice President Dick Cheney would address the federal assault weapons ban set to expire in September.
Tom Mauser, whose son Daniel was killed with an assault weapon in the Littleton, Colo., killings five years ago Tuesday, said continuing the ban is common sense.
Assault weapons "are the weapons of gangs, drug lords and sick people," Mauser said before his three-block march to the convention, which runs through Sunday. "It is a weapon of war and we don't want this war on our streets."
Mauser entered the convention hall where the NRA was meeting, but was turned away by a security guard as several conventioneers applauded. A couple of conventioneers yelled "Get a life" and "Vote for Bush." "

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/3015989/detail.html

[MrBenchley]

9. For those in the pool...this is four

Yeah, it would be horrible if assault weapons were banned...NOT!

By the way, please note that someone who has been telling us for some time how the Assault Weapons ban is only cosmetic, blah blah blah,seems only now to have read the actual bill...

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[LibraLabSoldier]

13. "ignorant gun loony"

Love the way you climb up on your high horse and get all condescending to us "ignorant gun loonies". This law has far reaching implications. One of the guns I own(the one I am teaching my daughters to shoot with) is a M7 survival carbine. It is a .22, magazine fed, breaks down into three pieces that store in a water proof, floatable butt stock. How is this an "assault weapon"? This is a blatant attempt to disarm the entire American public, without putting it to a vote. The least you could do is let Americans decide for themselves if they wanted guns or not.

[LibLabUK]

14. Err..

"The least you could do is let Americans decide for themselves if they wanted guns or not. "

You need to go look at the definition of a representative democracy.

[MrBenchley]

16. Remember, it isn't liberal Democrats

who are keeping this bottled up in committee in congress...but two of the scummiest right wing Republicans...

And they know that very few of their fellow party members are actually willing to vote AGAINST this eminently sensible and popular proposal in the light of day...which is why they are fighting to keep it bottled up.

[skippythwndrdog]

38. Regardless of who is doing it

This piece of "work" needs to stay in comittee until it dies. Hopefully forever.

[MrBenchley]

15. And I love that this is the third or fourth wowser

who turned out not to know what was in the bill he'd been condemning for a helluva long time.

"This is a blatant attempt to disarm the entire American public"
Horseshit. And what's especially hilarious is that "pro gun democrats" have spent months telling us this bill covers "only cosmetics" and that these guns don't do anything ordinary guns don't do.

"The least you could do is let Americans decide for themselves"
The party platform, pretty much every Democrat anyone's ever heard of, pretty much every liberal or moderate organization, pretty much every liberal writer or pundit, and 70-80% of American voters want these weapons OFF the market. And it isn't Dianne Feinstein and Nancy Pelosi keeping this bill from coming to a vote...it's those two GOP scumbags Tom DeLay and Bill Frist.

[Romulus]

17. Mini-14 - BANNED by name

The Remington 11-87 - BANNED (because a police department, somewhere, purchased one for patrol use)




Benelli Super Black Eagle -BANNED (because the USMC uses the similarly-designed Benelli M-4)



Horseshit. And what's especially hilarious is that "pro gun democrats" have spent months telling us this bill covers "only cosmetics" and that these guns don't do anything ordinary guns don't do.

Yeah , sure - this bill only bans the e-e-v-v-i-l-l guns :eyes:

[MrBenchley]

22. So fucking what?

Wasn't the bitching about the previous version by you "enthusiasts" that it wasn't "specific" enough?

[UpsideDownFlag]

42. the m-14 is as deadly a weapon as any other. wasn't it one of the ones

involved in that deadly FBI shootout in the eighties where all those agents got shot up?

[FeebMaster]

44. The mini-14 was.

There was no M-14 involved.

[UpsideDownFlag]

45. i thot we were talking about the mini-14. that's what the pic was of

in the thread i responded to.

[UpsideDownFlag]

46. typo- i meant mini14.

[TheRovingGourmet]

18. This should really help the middle class. I'm glad politicians

are spending time on this.

[goju]

19. Close, but not quite right...

"This should really help the <politicians>. I'm glad middle class are spending <money> on this."

Yep, that looks better.

[TheRovingGourmet]

20. Yes, but gas prices at the pump will be lower due to less

problems with global warming once this bill is passed.

[goju]

21. Oh yeah

I think I remember one our "concerned" gun controllers say something to that effect.

[MrBenchley]

23. Yeah, it will...

So few "middle class" people want some fuckwit with an assault weapon shooting up a schoolyard or a busy street.

Meanwhile, why don't you tell us what the dimwits in the Second Amendment Caucus are doing to "help the middle class," since you seem to have your panties in a knot over that issue suddenly.

Here's some of what McCarthy has done:
H.R.828 : To amend the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act to allow certain applicants for approval of a generic drug to be eligible for a 180-day period of protection from competition, and for other purposes."
H.R.894 : To amend the Public Health Service Act to require the Director of the National Institutes of Health to expand and intensify research regarding Diamond-Blackfan Anemia.
H.R.895 : To provide for the construction and renovation of child care facilities, and for other purposes.
H.R.896 : To provide for substantial reductions in the price of prescription drugs for Medicare beneficiaries and for women diagnosed with breast cancer.
H.R.934 : To amend the Higher Education Act of 1965 to expand the loan forgiveness and loan cancellation programs for teachers, to provide loan forgiveness and loan cancellation programs for nurses, and for other purposes.
H.R.1397 : To amend the Employee Retirement Income Security Act of 1974 to ensure that employees are not improperly disqualified from benefits under pension plans and welfare plans based on the misclassification or reclassification of their status.
H.R.4335 : To amend the Public Health Service Act to provide for a program of screenings and education regarding children with sudden cardiac arrhythmia syndromes.

Here's some of what Lautenburg has done:
S.338 : A bill to protect the flying public's safety and security by requiring that the air traffic control system remain a Government function.
S.2105 : A bill to improve the Federal shore protection program.
S.2473 : A bill to require payment of appropriated funds that are illegally disbursed for political purposes by the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services.
S.2601 : A bill to amend title 37, United States Code, to require the payment of monthly special pay for members of the uniformed services whose service on active duty is extended by a stop-loss order or similar mechanism, and for other purposes.
S.AMDT.192 to H.J.RES.2 To increase the appropriation for the Hazardous Substance Superfund
S.AMDT.408 to S.CON.RES.23 To require polluters to pay for cleanup of toxic waste sites, by reinstating the original superfund taxes.
S.AMDT.982 to S.1 To make prescription drug coverage available beginning on July 1, 2004.
S.AMDT.2171 to H.R.2861 To maintain enforcement personnel for the Environmental Protection Agency at the fiscal year 2003 level.

[TheRovingGourmet]

25. But what have they done about bollweavel eradication?

[MrBenchley]

26. Still waiting for the Second Amendment Caucus' record

since "helping the middle class" is such a burning concern of yours, and not just a desperate attempt to smear two respected Democratic congresspersons, or anything........

[TheRovingGourmet]

27. Not until I get my bollweavel report!

[MrBenchley]

28. Yeah, that "concern for the middle class" was horseshit

and the Second Amendment Caucus is a bunch of useless right wing loonies....

[TheRovingGourmet]

29. But what about this?

http://www.dpoe.com/manuals/sharp/EL-2630P%20manual.pdf

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

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[MrBenchley]

32. It's the manual for a calculator

which proves MY point in spades...the "concern over the middle class" was a cheap attempt to slander respected Democrats and the Second Amendment Caucus are useless right wing fuckwits.

[TheRovingGourmet]

33. At least my post adds up.

[MrBenchley]

34. Yeah, it adds up to a load of right wing crap

[LibraLabSoldier]

35. Flamebait

Profanity is the last refuge of the unintelligent.

First off, this bill is much much more far reaching than the 1994 AWB. However, since evidently to you that A) All gun owners are "right wing Fuckwits" and B) need to be stopped from spraying down a street or a schoolyard.....You have proven time and again that you know nothing about guns, and just like to be an abrasive asshole who picks fights. Quit being such an elitist prick.

[MrBenchley]

36. Nope...it was the proper response for a load of crap

"this bill is much much more far reaching than the 1994 AWB."
Yeah, no shit. Tell me something I don't know.

Feel free to tell us what the Second Amendment Caucus has done for the middle class...since that's such a burning concern of our "pro gun democrats."

"Quit being such an elitist prick."
Like I said, back when I was being a prick over civil rights, annoying the sort of good old boys who kept loaded shotguns under their beds because "those people" might break in, I used to hear that same "elitist" epithet. The more things change....

[FatSlob]

37. Brilliant!

LibraLabSoldier wrote:

Profanity is the last refuge of the unintelligent.

First off, this bill is much much more far reaching than the 1994 AWB. However, since evidently to you that A) All gun owners are "right wing Fuckwits" and B) need to be stopped from spraying down a street or a schoolyard.....You have proven time and again that you know nothing about guns, and just like to be an abrasive asshole who picks fights. Quit being such an elitist prick.

You deserve a round of applause. Good work.

[Vladimir]

43. Sadly he only got a tombstone n/t

[TheRovingGourmet]

49. Talk about shooting the messenger. :)

[Vladimir]

50. It wasn't me wot done it guvnor! :) n/t

[FatSlob]

48. It seems he did.

I still like his little nugget, though.

[library_max]

51. Said the Tombstone . . . /nt

[gatlingforme]

24. Yeah it's closing the loop hole on the first bill. LOL IT will never pass

[thomas82]

41. Yep it will never pass

Hell they even dropped the REG/HI capacity mags in an attempt to get the current ban extended. Well the way its looking as of now the AW ban goes by-by in 15 DAYS!!!!!!


Tom

[UpsideDownFlag]

39. about damn time.

[MrBenchley]

40. Absolutely right.

[7th_Sephiroth]

47. hope so

i hate peoples puritanical belief that guns are bad because a few dumbshits let thier kids have acess to them, it somehow allways comes back to children "think of the children" well maybe if a few dumbshit parents would have investen is a $5 trigger lock we wouldent be in this situation

[library_max]

52. Gee, you'd think there'd be more enthusiasm over this bill

from our regulars who regularly complain that the current AWB bans only "cosmetic" features. Other than the original poster's NRA spin, what's the complaint this time?

[MrBenchley]

53. Sure seems to address their concerns, doesn't it?

You don't suppose those "it's only cosmetic" cries were just so much horseshit, do you?

By the way, let's count up how many statements like "We're going to put assault weapons back on the market like red-blooded Americans want" there are at the Republican convention...after all, aren't we told banning them is a losing issue?

[Beren]

54. "Military-style" firearms are the only ones /protected/ by the 2A

The sad truth is, "military-style weapons" are the only ones the 2nd Amendment really protects, as per US v. Miller. Only firearms which can be shown to have a clear military utility have 2nd Amendment protections. The AWB is bunk, "military-style rifles" made up a tiny minority of weapons used as an instrument of murder before the ban and a tiny minority after the ban.

The vast majority of firearm-related killings take place with handguns, not rifles or shotguns. (Of course, firearm-related killings are dwarfed by auto accidents and avoidable medical mistakes in hospitals.)

I don't really care if MA, NY, MD, CA, IL, and certain other states implement conservative and reactionary gun control measures. Any state should have the freedom to do so in accordance with their state constitution. As free citizens, we can move to a more liberal, freedom-loving state which respects our rights. States like Pennsylvania, Florida, or Vermont.

Want to save lives? Stop wasting your time whining about "guns on our streets." Concern yourself with CARS on our streets, a pointless and liberty-compromising Jihad Against Some Drugs, and overworked or sometimes careless doctors in our hospitals. We are far, far more likely to suffer death or injury due to the latter three than the former.

Do you really want to see a drop in gun-related violent crime?

If someone dies during the commission of a violent felony with a firearm, the parties responsible for initiating the crime should be sentenced to death by hanging. Yes, this means that if two punks try to rob a store and the clerk shoots one of them, the OTHER punk hangs.

[Vladimir]

55. Hanging?

Now if only you could prove that the death penalty has a deterrent effect on crime, you may have a point...

[Beren]

56. Deterrent? Who cares?

Now if only you could prove that the death penalty has a deterrent effect on crime, you may have a point...

Who cares about the deterrent effect? I can promise a hung scumbag will never murder or instigate a murder ever again, and hanging is pretty cost-effective.

[Vladimir]

57. So this is about punishment

in which case, why should murder with a gun recieve the death sentence, and murder with a knife not recieve the same?

[library_max]

58. It's more about hijacking the thread

to proclaim the glories of the death penalty. Let's see how long this newbie lasts.

[library_max]

61. Eight posts.

And another RKBAer gets his tombstone.

[thomas82]

62. so someone

That defend 2nd Amendment rights needs a Tombstone?? sorta Nazi like talk correct??? So whats next we burn all the pro gun books??
Tom

[library_max]

63. Posters get tombstoned when they are identified as disruptors,

freepers, trolls, etc. Funny, it seems to happen quite frequently to RKBAers down here. Might almost lead one to question whether RKBA is really a progressive, Democratic point of view.

BTW, I sure hope you aren't comparing DU moderators to Nazis.

[thomas82]

64. No

I just think it would be Nazi like to ban someone because the believe/support in the 2nd amendment.
Tom

[Beren]

59. My mistake!

why should murder with a gun recieve the death sentence, and murder with a knife not recieve the same?

Because guns jump off tables and leap at people, whereas knives wait until a human consciously makes a decision to harm another person, employing the knife as an extension of their will.

Oh..wait..y'mean guns /don't/ jump off of tables either?

I guess you're right. Let's punish the act of murder and not the instrument.

[Vladimir]

60. Well if you view a sentence as punishment only

then indeed this is the only logical conclusion. Now if you want a chat about punishments as deterrents... but that is a lot more complicated. The death penalty in particular represents a discontinuity in the cost function of the offence, so it makes discussion of deterrents doubly hard.