California Senator Boxer unveils gun safety proposal

[La_Serpiente]

California Senator Boxer unveils gun safety proposal

LOS ANGELES - Sen. Barbara Boxer on Tuesday unveiled a proposed federal law requiring safety locks on all handguns sold in the United States.

"Most handguns have so little trigger resistance they could be fired by a 3-year-old, yet there are an estimated 3.3 million children in the United States living in houses with guns that are always or sometimes kept loaded and unlocked," said Boxer, D-Calif. "The potential for tragedy is overwhelming."

Boxer, whose seat is up for election this year, plans to introduce the bill in Congress later this week. It would prohibit manufacturers and dealers from selling or transferring a handgun for retail purposes unless it had a safety lock.

Violators could have their licenses revoked and face up to $15,000 in fines.

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California Senator Boxer unveils gun safety proposal

[Superfly]

1. This will not make it past committee.

[FeebMaster]

2. Boy,

it hasn't even passed yet and I feel safer already. Now that's a hell of a law.

[GainesT1958]

3. Why would the NRA be against THIS?

Sigh:shrug: ...I guess for the same reason they would oppose prohibition of plastic guns; you know, guns that can escape metal detection! :mad:

How would simply LOCKING a handgun be tannamount to prohibiting OWNERSHIP of a handgun?

Michael Moore had a good point about "Today's NRA"!:eyes:

B-)

[FeebMaster]

4. NRA

NRA NRA NRA NRA NRA NRA

You know what might be nice? Maybe discussing things without bringing up the NRA.

Like, maybe we could discuss the merits of having an integral lock on a firearm. How maybe it isn't the greatest of ideas to complicate the machinery that you have your life depend on more than is necessary? Will the police and military be exempt from this law? Like we even have to ask. Will these fanciful locking devices shake from unlocked to locked under recoil?

How much will these amazing locks add to the price of a gun? Will they add any weight? Will all the keys be different for every gun? Will they be for a particular model? Maybe just one key for every gun in America?


Nah. Let's just go on about the NRA.




Edited: I had some more questions.

[DavidMS]

40. I get the feeling that

instead of requireing a gun lock to be sold with every handgun, put a few cents of the relivat federal taxes on fireamrs to use to run 30 second spots emphasizing the 4 rules of safe gun handling and emphazing that "guns don't just go off," its more properly called a neglegnt discharge.

It would be a much easier way to acheive the same goals.

[slackmaster]

5. Speaking only for myself personally

I paid good money for a sturdy gun safe, and I live alone. Children visit my home occasionally and when they do I make doubly sure all of my firearms and other potentially dangerous objects are locked up.

How would simply LOCKING a handgun be tannamount to prohibiting OWNERSHIP of a handgun?

Nobody here has ever advanced such an argument.

Senator Boxer's bill does not require anyone to lock up their handguns anyway. It's about mandating sales of gun locks even to people like me who have no use for them. That would be kind of like requiring everyone who buys a car to buy a child safety seat whether they have kids or not, wouldn't it?

[demsrule4life]

25. Sounds about right

to me.

[Township75]

6. Back this up!

"I guess for the same reason they would oppose prohibition of plastic guns; you know, guns that can escape metal detection! :mad:"

Where did you hear this? The Brady Campaign?

Provide some proof.

[happyslug]

7. Ineffective and Dangerous

1. Gun Locks should not be used on LOADED guns (Locking the trigger with the lock may cause the trigger to drop the hammer on a live round causing the gun to fire).

2. Gun locks on UNLOADED guns only prevent people from loading and than shooting. As such not a method to prevent CHILDREN from shooting the weapon (Unless the child loads the gun first).

Please note gun locks are to be used on UNLOADED guns only. It is UNSAFE to use them on loaded guns. This is why the NRA and other oppose this type of law, it is INEFFECTIVE AND DANGEROUS.

[FeebMaster]

9. The way I read it

they aren't talking about trigger locks. They're talking about locks integral to the gun itself. Maybe not, but that's what it sounded like.

[demsrule4life]

11. Will that piece of falsehood ever die?

If an all plastic toy gun can be detected by xray machines, why wouldnt a gun with a plastic frame, steel slide, steel springs and steel bullets not be detected?

[Withergyld]

12. What good is a plastic gun without plastic ammunition?

Ammunition would show up on an x-ray machine or a metal detector

[alwynsw]

13. back up your claim.

Show us ANY plastic gun that can fire a bullet with deadly force - or any other force for that matter. Aside from a few toys that fire foam pellets there is no such thing. Get educated about these things before you repeat such gross inaccuracies.

Yes. We are mostly all aware that you're referring to the Glock "plastic" gun. That would be the composite handgun that contains over ONE POUND of steel. As ffor being invisible to x-ray: Posh! Look at the screen sometime when your nags are getting x-rayed at the airport or other similar sceurity station. They can see a friggin' pocket comb.

[jimsteuben]

14. plastic guns?

There is no such thing as a "plastic gun." This myth started in 1980 when Glock introduced a handgun with a polymer frame. Most of the Glock is metal (83% by weight) and very detectable in common metal and x-ray detectors. "espite a relatively common impression to the contrary, there is no current non-metal firearm which is not reasonably detectable by present technology and methods in use at our airports today, nor to my knowledge is anyone on the threshold of developing such a firearm." Billie Vincent, FAA Director of Civil Aviation Security, House Subcommittee on Crime, May 15, 1986.

"How would simply LOCKING a handgun be tannamount to prohibiting OWNERSHIP of a handgun?"

I keep a revolver for self-defense. For the weapon to be effective, it needs to be ready to use. If trouble strikes my home, I wont have the luxury of finding the key and fiddling with my gun lock while robbers are kicking down the door to my home.

[FatSlob]

19. I wouldn't consider Michael Moore to be a good source

He is a blowhard.

[FatSlob]

21. Are you coming back?

Or is this a drive by. I rather suspect it isn't a drive by, as cogent people don't do that.

[RoeBear]

8. How would requiring a gun lock...

...translate to using the lock?

If someone, right now, doesn't have the brain power to keep a loaded gun out of reach of a three year old what difference will the inclusion of a gun lock at the time of sale make? Will a gun lock make someone smarter?

[Baclava]

10. Who the hell keeps voting Boxer in?

"It would prohibit manufacturers and dealers from selling or transferring a handgun for retail purposes unless it had a safety lock."

If this is truly more than about "trigger locks", it's just a new way to put the gun manufacturers out of business.

The integral safety locks are being used on the new S&W revolvers...
but, I doubt a Glock could ever be re-designed this way.

[Hammie]

15. It is about establishing a precedent

for Federal regulation of the design details of Firearms.

BTW why is there a safety lock on a double action only revolver? According to Boxer's expert opinion they are only necessary on guns with light trigger pulls?

[Cinic]

20. Glock Optional Safety

Optional Internal Lock
The Glock lock is another item featured in the 2002 Glock Autopistols/Glock Annual. The system resides in the hollow backstrap and comes with two keys. When locked, the magazine release and slide still function but the trigger does not. This allows the gun to be loaded or unloaded while it is locked.



http://www.glockfaq.com/generalinfo.htm

[Baclava]

29. Dang...

Wellllllll, shut my mouth...I guess they gone an done it anyway....

[Hammie]

16. The potential for tragedy? LOL

What a creep. There isn't an actual problem so we will just imagine one and then propose a law to fix it. With so many actual problems it is positively criminal for her to be wasting time on a non-issue.

[lcordero]

17. Better idea

Punish BOTH parents every single time one of these incidents happen. A gun in a home should not be accessable to a minor and that is a parent's fault. Stop punishing everybody else for one person's stupidity.
AGAIN, this is gun control. People are being priced out of defending themselves.

[Columbia]

18. Congrats people, we got it

Boxer added this measure as an amendment to S.1805 this morning and it passed 70-27. Thank all your Senators.

[MrSandman]

22. Wasn't the amendment for a locking device?

Not integral safety locks. If so I missed the point of the debate.

[Columbia]

24. Yes

I believe both proposals are for mandatory external locks, although it isn't real clear from the article above.

[MrSandman]

26. Thanks, that is the sense I got from...

floor debate that I saw. Didn't catch whic one was voted on.

[demsrule4life]

23. I cant tell if it is for external locks

or internal. If it is for internal then I guess I will only be buying older handguns in the future.

[alwynsw]

28. Same here.

I don't need another mandated gadget to get broken.

[Withergyld]

27. The three new firearms I have purchased in the last year all came

with an external locking device. I think most manufacurers are ALREADY including external locking devices with their weapons. I also lock my weapons in a gunsafe, and do not need these external locking devices. Is this law really necessary.

[Young Socialist]

30. no this law isn't needed.

what is needed is for people to start taking responsibility for their own actions. if you're stupid enough to leave a gun where a minor can get to it then you are responsible for whatever happens.

[slackmaster]

32. Child Access Prevention (CAP) laws work mostly after the fact

I don't have a problem with CAP laws as long as they only assign liability for negligence and don't dictate specific storage requirements. We have a CAP law in California, but it's only rarely enforced because too often the kids who shoot themselves by accident did so with a gun belonging to a parent. Prosecutors are reluctant to prosecute someone who just lost a child through his or her own stupidity.

IMO the only truly effective way to protect kids from guns is education. Teach gun owners to do the right thing, and when kids are old enough teach them gun safety. Sooner or later most US children are going to encounter a gun that was stored in a negligent manner, discarded in haste by a criminal, etc. The older they get the less control you have over their movements. Parents MUST teach their children survival skills for all environmental hazards they are likely to encounter. Here in Southern California we teach kids how to be wary of black widow spiders and rattlesnakes. Improperly secured guns are another danger in their environment in spite of all of California's tough gun laws.

I learned gun safety at 10, my brother at 6. We were both ready. Neither of us have ever had a problem with ourselves or our children and guns.

[Columbia]

31. The 870 I purchased

Has an internal lock (which I subsequently replaced) and I was still required to purchase an external lock (CA law). Pretty pointless huh? I still have the lock in it's original plastic wrap, anyone want it?

All this mandatory lock talk is making me wonder if Boxer is getting any kickbacks (campaign contributions) from lock manufacturers...

[slackmaster]

33. That's the problem with laws that dictate specific solutions

Too often they aren't flexible enough to accommodate more creative and even superior solutions to the problem they are intended to fix.

The best solution IMO for a gun owner in California is to buy a DOJ-approved gun safe. That way you can get out of the silly trigger lock requirement by signing an affidavit stating that you own an approved storage device.

http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/fsdcertlist.htm

[alwynsw]

37. I use safes. Anyone need locks?

Safes aren't required here in Kentucky. I use them for three reasons: I get a break on my insurance, it's far easier to control moisture (90% humidity is the norm in summer), and I don't lose anything. We have no kids in the house, so there's no issue with kid safety. A couple of pieces live outside the safes at all times.

I've taken to keeping a Mini-14 handy. Bagged 2 coyotes in my back yard day before yesterday. If I'd had to run to the safe, I'd likely have missed my chance. The little bastards are hard on household pets and small livestock. Theey're getting brave, too. I got these two with 2 quick shots out the back door at about 40'. I'm tired of cleaning up their leftovers.

[slackmaster]

38. Just to clarify California law...

Gun safes aren't required here either, but if you own one you don't have to buy a trigger lock with each new firearm.

The law does not specify how to store guns within your home, but it provides liability if someone under 16 gets one of your guns and someone gets injured as a result, if it can be shown that you were negligent on how you stored your gun.

The law specifically exempts gun owners from liability when their home was broken into and a gun was stolen by a juvenile then someone gets injured or killed.

[alwynsw]

39. I've done my homewrok on CA law lately

I'll be in your neighborhood (OK, I'll be in Fallbrook) around the end of March. Maybe we can hook up. PM me a number and I'll call you when I get close. The trip is unstructured so I don't have an exact date.

[FatSlob]

34. Barbara Boxer legislating gun safety is like

a monkey directing the London Philharmonic Orchestra.

[Columbia]

35. Hey, that's not nice

To monkeys that is.

[alwynsw]

36. maybe Babs can get some more ideas in safe handling and storage

from her buddy, Di.

[lcordero]

41. People are going to have to start telling these officials to GET LOST

Rights are completely off-limits as far as limiting them are concerned. This is just another piece of garbage legislation which is meant to price people out of being able to defend themselves.
Sometimes I really wonder if the Democrats should really be let into becoming the majority even with all the damage the GOP has already done and all the damage that the GOP will do in the future.