Cuba gives its citizens 2 months to register guns ...

[spin]

By WILL WEISSERT, Associated Press Writer

Monday, February 1, 2010

Cuba has declared a two-month amnesty for citizens to register unlicensed guns, and says those passing aptitude and psychological tests will be allowed to keep their weapons.

The move is unusual in a state where almost no one except some active military personnel and plain-clothed state security agents are allowed to possess weapons.

Even most police officers are required to leave their pistols at the station or in a regional barracks when on vacation or leave, and young men participating in mandatory military service are given unloaded firearms for most exercises.

Starting Feb. 12, Cubans will have the "exceptional and one-time only" chance to register their guns with police, and will be allowed to keep them provided they are over 18 and have passed the proper tests administered at police stations.

***snip***

Cubans were encouraged to register any weapons they owned in the years after Fidel Castro and his band of rebels toppled dictator Fulgencio Batista on Jan. 1, 1959. But later authorities used a list of those who had sought licenses to go door-to-door and encourage them to turn over their firearms — even antiques considered family heirlooms.

While Cuba is among the safest countries in the hemisphere, it is not unusual to find firearms in Cuban homes, though most are weapons improvised from household materials or guns that were smuggled into the country and bought on the black market.

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2010/02/01/international/i081504S46.DTL#ixzz0eUT31lq1

[no_hypocrisy]

1. One more reason why the NRA thinks Cuba is anti-American.

[Euromutt]

2. Why would anyone comply?

Given past form, it looks like if you register your firearms, it may be confiscated now, or confiscated later, while the fact that an amnesty system like this is even implemented after fifty years of communist rule is a strong indication that the authorities don't have the means--even in a police state--to find any significant amount of illicitly owned firearms anyway.

[spin]

15. So if the government required registration for all firearms in the U.S. ...

how many people would fail to comply?

Canada tried gun registration and it proved to be expensive and many consider it a failure.

It has been estimated that as many as five million gun-owning Canadians have not registered their firearms. As of June 2003, only 6.4 million firearms had been registered, despite a 1974 estimate of ten million guns in Canada. In February 2003, the government announced plans to strengthen the administration of the gun control program. Two days before the election in May 2004, the government dropped all fees for transferring firearms.

Supporters of the firearms registry argue that it makes no sense to abandon the project midstream and that firearms registration assists police forces in knowing where legal firearms may be held when answering calls. They further argue that registration compels gun owners to be more responsible for the safe storage and use of firearms they possess.

Opponents argue that firearms registration does nothing to prevent crime and that gun owners are already licensed. They state that given a significant data error rate and high levels of non-compliance with current legislation, firearms information is often unreliable. They further claim that registration will lead to confiscation. In this regard they note the promises made by the Liberal, NDP and Bloc Quebecois parties during the 2008 election campaign to prohibit certain types of semi-automatic firearms and handguns.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Canada

[GreenStormCloud]

3. So, in a police state they are giving people a chance to confess to...

the police that they have been naughty by disobeying the police. I think I would pass on that opportunity.

[Remmah2]

4. Naval Base Gitmo

I wonder if the Marines in Gitmo will comply?

[oneshooter]

17. Guantanamo Naval Base is considered to be US soil. It is not required to

do anything the Cuban Government asks/requires.

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[TheWraith]

21. It would be hillarious if they volunteered a registration record though.

But I doubt their COs would find it nearly as funny.

[oneshooter]

22. I also believe that the Commanders would fail to see the humor in it. n/t

[DonP]

5. This must be wrong

I have been assured by numerous gun control advocates that anyone that thinks registration might lead to confiscation is just paranoid.

[slackmaster]

6. They don't want to take peoples' guns, they just want to BORROW them

[Jackson1999]

7. I love this line...

"But later authorities used a list of those who had sought licenses to go door-to-door and encourage them to turn over their firearms"

"encouraged"? Way to sugar coat it AP!!

[oneshooter]

12. Does this "encouragement" happen at the point of a bayonet? n/t

[safeinOhio]

8. No need to do that here.

The government has a list of dues paying NRA members.

[spin]

9. That would cover 4 million gun owners ...

estimates are that 80 million people own firearms.

[rd_kent]

10. You think that only NRA memebers own guns.

Not sure what you are getting at.

[safeinOhio]

14. Of course not.

However, If they wanted to take away guns, 99% of NRA members (just a guess) own guns. Be a great place to start looking for them.

I just find it funny that many members always throw out the government may come and take your gun someday argument against any kind of registration. Yet it is like they have already volunteered that information by belonging to the NRA.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[eqfan592]

19. Volunteering that you may have a gun...

...is not the same thing as providing a list of what specific guns you do have at any given time. Oh sure, they could try and start with that list, but given how ambiguous it is to begin with, they'd have a difficult time actually doing anything with it, if they were so inclined.

[PavePusher]

25. And I bet $100 that a lot of agents would vanish mysteriously...

and it would soon become a job in search of employees...

[spin]

20. I've known people who were very careful ...

not to belong to the NRA, or to subscribe to firearms magazines. Some bought only used firearms and reloaded their own ammo. They didn't get concealed carry permits because they felt the government would know they had firearms. A few bought everything with cash.

None of these people struck me as truly dangerous but they really didn't trust the government.

I would tell them that I really didn't care if the government knew I owned firearms, but I really didn't want the government to know what firearms I owned. Registration often leads to confiscation.

And I would point out that our government is so incompetent that they would be incapable of confiscating firearms even if they were registered nationwide. The government would probably have to farm the job out to Blackwater.

[SteveM]

30. Then, there is always that deep lake where the accident occurred. nt

[Euromutt]

24. It does?

That's news to me. Do you have some evidence to support this assertion? (Not trying to be snarky, I'm genuinely curious.)

[safeinOhio]

26. NRA is happy to sell you a list of members.

Then, I don't think it would cost the government anything anyway.

Look, I'm not saying this to be serious. I am just pointing out that it is no more crazy than the gov. coming some day to take away your shotgun. Myself, I'm all for the registration of all handguns, but not long guns like shotguns and hunting rifles. If there was a revolt against a rouge government take over, handguns would be of little use. Battles are fought with rifles.
Most crime violence is from illegal handguns, not all but most. I'm all for reducing crime and violence. I can't think of any better way to slow the number of illegal handguns than registration. If someone is stopped with an unregistered handgun, it would be taken off the street. If your gun was registered and stolen, there would be a better chance of you getting it back some day. It wouldn't stop, but it could slow the the number of straw sales. I have a CCW, so don't get me wrong. I just want to lower the chance that I'll have to use my gun in self defense against a crook with a gun.
Now, before you get upset with my view, it is just that a view. Something that can be debated. The only other plan I ever hear about is longer sentences for gun violators. I'm all for that too. Now, you all can come up with some better ideas for keeping law abiding people armed and keeping handguns, or at least lowering the number, out of the hands of bad guys and gals.

[X_Digger]

27. "stopped with an unregistered handgun"

What probable cause would an officer have to check whether or not a handgun was registered? Under what circumstances would this 'stop' happen?

If this is after the fact, during the investigation of a crime, that gun will taken 'off the street' already.

Surely you're not suggesting NYC style 'stop and frisk' abridgment of the fourth amendment for the rest of the country are you?

[safeinOhio]

28. Hell no

There are enough legal searches during arrest or legal stops. I take it is legal for the cop that pulls over a car coming out of a drug area with a burned out light to ask "any guns or drugs in the vehicle". "I'm just going to pat you down for weapons for my safety". You don't think any weapons are ever found during legal stops and searches? I remember being at a gun range in Michigan, where handguns must be registered and registration on you when in possession and having the cop next to me ask to see my registration. I like knowing if someone is caught with your gun, you might get it back. Now where did I suggest random frisk.

[X_Digger]

29. "having the cop next to me ask to see my registration" -- did you comply? If so, why?

Was / is there a law on the books saying one must present registration anytime a cop asks?

The scenario you presented re a traffic stop for coming out of the wrong area of town- that sounds like a fishing expedition.

I've had cops ask to search my car, and being the good citizen I am, I told them to take a flying leap. (In much more respectful terms.)

Sickens me how so many people just bend over to the merest appearance of authority, legal or not.

[pipoman]

31. Yea,

routine traffic stops resulting in 'officer safety' frisks and car searches are what should be outlawed. Before either an officer should be required to advise, similar to miranda, 'you are not under arrest, you are in no way required to allow an officer to search your person or your property without a warrant issued by a court. Any contraband found or planted by an officer during a voluntary search will result in your arrest. Are you really sure you want to volunteer to be searched?'.

I personally don't want a stolen gun back. I will make the police report and file the insurance claim, but for most of my guns wouldn't want them back after some thief had done who knows what with them.

[safeinOhio]

34. Stupid people that carry illegal guns do stupid things

and get busted. Drunk driving, fights and theft and suspicion of. There are plenty of legal stops that uncover guns. Lets make sure those are taken off the streets. I have no problem with registration of handguns and see no violation of the 2nd in doing so.


Now, other than longer sentences, how do you propose reducing illegal hand guns? Come up with some of your great ideas. I'm just asking for a discussion on the topic. No problem with your questions, however I'd love to see some of your ideas on the subject. I think reducing handgun crime is the best way to stop gun control movements and arguments and safe guard our 2nd rights. Anecdotal stories about shooting bad guys does not convince the other side at all. Reducing crimes will convince people that new laws that restrict law abiding citizens from gun ownership are not needed.

[spin]

36. First we need to treat illegally carrying a firearm as a serious crime...

all too often it is plea bargained away or the perp gets a slap on the wrist.

In areas where illegal carry was severely punished, the bad guys didn't walk around packing heat as often. Consequently, when some fool "disrespected" another fool, they didn't whip out their pieces and start blazing away.

Tactics used by police to detect and deter illegal possession and carrying of guns include activities such as directed patrols in high crime areas, surveillance of probationers and parolees, weapon reporting hotlines, consent searches at the homes of youths suspected of having guns illegally, and roadblock checkpoints. In recent years, there has been particular interest in the use of directed patrol to suppress illegal gun carrying. Gun carrying is a necessary element for the commission of gun crimes in public locations, and, indeed, many gun offenders carry guns on a regular basis for protection and to be prepared for criminal opportunities (Sheley and Wright 1993; Wright and Rossi 1986).

A number of published studies have examined the effectiveness of directed patrol in reducing gun crime in cities in the United States (Kansas City, Missouri; Indianapolis; Pittsburgh) and Columbia (Cali and Bogota) (Cohen 2002; McGarrell et al. 2001; Sherman et al. 1995; Villaveces et al. 2000).4 In these interventions, officers sought to detect and deter illegal gun carrying by increasing patrol levels and initiating greater numbers of traffic stops (in some cases, using roadblocks) and field interrogations, often focusing on particular patrol areas with high levels of gun violence (and sometimes on particular high-risk persons in those places). In some cases, officers received special training in the detection of gun carrying.

For the most part, the studies have shown favorable results, indicating that focused patrol efforts can reduce gun crime. In Kansas City, for example, police initiated special nighttime gun patrols in a high-crime patrol beat for approximately six months in the latter part of 1992 (Sherman et al. 1995). The officers conducting these patrols were freed from answering calls for service and focused on proactive gun detection. Gun seizures in the target area rose 65% while total gun crime fell by nearly 50%. In contrast, there were no statistically meaningful changes in gun seizures or gun crime in a non-contiguous control beat that had levels of gun violence similar to those of the treatment beat prior to the intervention. There were no statistically meaningful changes in gun crime in patrol beats adjacent to the target beat, suggesting no clear displacement of gun crime or diffusion of benefits to other areas. After a 5-month pause, the special patrols were reinitiated, resulting in another drop in gun crime in the target area. Finally, survey evidence suggested that the program also had favorable impacts on residents’ perceptions of neighborhood conditions in the target area.
http://www.sas.upenn.edu/jerrylee/research/ccjg_guns.pdf

[pipoman]

37. The number one suggestion

I have offered over and over for several years is voluntary access to NICS for all transfers through any FFL for a statutory fee (low, like $20). Anyone who transfers a gun through an FFL is relieved of any possibility of civil or criminal action against them for later wrong doing with the gun. A public awareness campaign, and kiosks at gun shows..I really believe that states would then begin to adopt legislation making NICS mandatory for private transfers. I believe this would be very effective. I feel that registration does nothing to reduce criminals from obtaining guns.

[farmout rightarm]

11. Fortunately, 2 months is enough time to find a good hiding place.

...

[spin]

13. Welcome to DU. (n/t)

[oneshooter]

18. Gee ossifer I had a tragic boating accident about 2 months ago!

Welcome to DU. Have a flame suit, popcorn, and a damn good sense of humor available.

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Katya Mullethov]

39. Why Provis

You wound me .

[proteus_lives]

23. Unsurprising move from Cuba.

They're a dictatorship.

And commies have always been gun-grabbers.

[Remmah2]

32. Next month; Cuban gun buyback. nt

nt

[jeepnstein]

33. Considering how...

the Cuban Revolution came to power, I find this very interesting. When a revolutionary no longer trusts the people who "support" him, he's not much of a revolutionary anymore. I wonder why they are getting around to doing this now? Nobody in government ever just decides to do something because they are looking for more work.

My bet is they want to hedge their bets about an upcoming transfer of power.

[spin]

35. My suspicion also. (n/t)