Amendment II Democrats in the news!!!!!!

[virginia mountainman]

But, it sounded like their minds where already made up, but Good Job getting the name out their fellers!!!

http://www.wickedlocal.com/bourne/news/lifestyle/columnists/x1665952386/Who-Cares-Taking-aim-at-gun-control

[Caliman73]

1. seconded (no pun intended)

Anything that puts a rational argument out there for the preservation of the 2nd Amendment is a small victory.

[iverglas]

2. as long as they don't call them late for dinner ...

... there's no such thing as bad publicity ... Hey, even if they managed to look like morons, they got their name in print!

Gun laws vary from state to state and so I called the Gun Owners' Action League (GOAL), which bills itself as the official firearms association of Massachusetts, to try and find out what their views were on unlicensed guns and having someone turn their home into an armory. But Angela Fisher, the organization's director of communications, wasn't into communicating, and said I needed to speak with Jim Wallace, the executive director, who wasn't available.

I was told that Wallace was at the State House that week. I imagine he was there to lobby against House bill 3991 "An Act to Reduce Gun Violence," a legislative proposal filed by Gov. Deval Patrick. The intent of the bill is to slow the flow of illegal weapons that make their way on to Massachusetts’ streets. One of the provisions of the bill would be to limit gun dealers to the sale of one rifle, shotgun, firearm, machine gun, large capacity weapon or large capacity feeding device to any one buyer within a 30-day period.

The purpose of that restriction is to hamper "straw purchasers" who buy guns for people unable to obtain a gun permit. Limiting sales would help to cut down on the number of illegal guns on the streets of our cities and towns and the crimes that are committed by those wielding these weapons. GOAL has been trying to stop that bill from even being considered.

In a letter sent to members of the Joint Committee on the Judiciary, Wallace referred to the bill as the "Lawful Citizen Imprisonment Act" and argued that by limiting the number of guns that lawful gun owners could purchase at any one time the bill was taking the position that lawful gun owners are responsible for the illegal gun trade.

"How would that deter crime?" Wallace asked. "The criminals committing gun related crimes do not go through the proper channels to get licensed and purchase guns legally, so changing the law will not affect them or gun related crime. The law-abiding citizens of the Commonwealth should not be punished for the actions of criminals."

Yup. Gun militant logic. There's just nothing like it.

[friendly_iconoclast]

3. More "faith-based" gun control proposals

Some people just "know" lax gun laws cause crime and encourage conservatives.

Like the ones in Vermont that have caused rivers of blood in the streets,
and made that state a well known haven for right wingers.

Wait. What? "Much lower crime rate than Mass"? "Bluest of blue states"?

Why, that's just unpossible!

Seriously, the "pursed-lipped disapproval, with snarky asides" schtick is getting kind of
threadbare.

[iverglas]

4. eh? what?

Like the ones in Vermont that have caused rivers of blood in the streets,
and made that state a well known haven for right wingers.

Wait. What? "Much lower crime rate than Mass"? "Bluest of blue states"?

Why, that's just unpossible!


http://www.statemaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir-death-rate-per-100-000


I can't figure out what time period that's for, but heck, it really doesn't matter, does it?

Firearms Death Rate per 100,000 (most recent) by state

#34 Vermont: 9.6

#50 Massachusetts: 3.1

Poor Vermont. What a very lot of incompetent / suicidal firearms owners it apparently has.

[gorfle]

6. I'm curious.

Is there any data on the number of sales to people within 30 day periods? In other words, is a mountain being made out of a molehill? Are there really lots of people out there buying multiple firearms within 30 day periods?

With the average price of firearms exceeding $400, I'm lucky if I buy a firearm every 3 years. I'm finding it very hard to believe that there are very many people out there buying multiple firearms in a month. NICS should be able to document this sort of behavior.

[iverglas]

8. Are you a straw purchaser?

With the average price of firearms exceeding $400, I'm lucky if I buy a firearm every 3 years. I'm finding it very hard to believe that there are very many people out there buying multiple firearms in a month.

If you're not buying firearms for trafficking, what do your purchasing habits have to do with gun trafficking?


NICS should be able to document this sort of behavior.

As I understand it, there is a prohibition specifically on NICS being used for that purpose.

That's what a firearms registry is for.

[pipoman]

10. Many collectors have more money than you or I.

Many have enough money and the inclination to buy several guns at one time as in an auction venue. If you have ever been to a gun auction you know that there are many people who are in our position and only buy one or two guns, the rest of the guns are usually purchased by a small handful of collectors/people with deep pockets, to the betterment of the seller of the collection. Almost without exception in any city in the US you will find huge numbers of homes with $2k-$20k mortgage payments, so yes, there are many, many people who have thousands and thousands of dollars of disposable cash to buy expensive cars, homes, boats, and guns.

[virginia mountainman]

11. Actually I have went several years, without buying any...

BUT, just this past month, I purchased, 4.....The prices where too good to pass up. I am even considering buying a CRATE of Mosin Nagant rifles...as an investment...A crate has 20 rifles.

[enfield collector]

12. I saw that deal on the M-Ns as wel and was sorely tempted. Had it

been a deal on Enfields then I'd have gotten the credit card out without hesitation.

[virginia mountainman]

13. Yea, Enfields are definitely starting to "dry up"

O well, here is one of mine, a example from Toronto's Long branch arsenal, with a Long branch marked sling and bayonet to match...

[tburnsten]

14. I did just this week

And the NICS does keep track of multiple transactions, at least multiple handgun tranfers. Any time an FFL transfers more than one handgun to an individual in a five day period, they have to fill out a form and send it to the ATF to document it.

I bought three, cause the price was right, they are great guns, and I won't be able to buy any more for some time. These ones will

[pipoman]

9. The result

"I was told that Wallace was at the State House that week. I imagine he was there to lobby against House bill 3991 "An Act to Reduce Gun Violence," a legislative proposal filed by Gov. Deval Patrick. The intent of the bill is to slow the flow of illegal weapons that make their way on to Massachusetts’ streets. One of the provisions of the bill would be to limit gun dealers to the sale of one rifle, shotgun, firearm, machine gun, large capacity weapon or large capacity feeding device to any one buyer within a 30-day period.

The purpose of that restriction is to hamper "straw purchasers" who buy guns for people unable to obtain a gun permit. Limiting sales would help to cut down on the number of illegal guns on the streets of our cities and towns and the crimes that are committed by those wielding these weapons. GOAL has been trying to stop that bill from even being considered."

The result would be that a law abiding person who has a lifetime accumulation of firearms who wishes to liquidate them in, say, an auction venue, would not be able to do so. The only people able to purchase them would be an FFL who would pay only wholesale prices. Not all collectible guns (in fact a great many) do not fall into the definition prescribed by the rules surrounding the curio and relic FFL (C&R FFL). So many guns which may be in fact collectible couldn't even be purchased in quanity by a C&R FFL holder who may actually be willing to pay retail for those guns. Examples would be pinned and recessed S&W revolvers, Colt DA revolvers, most 1911 pistols, high end trap and skeet shotguns, and commemorative guns.

So, as is seen in so many instances, intent and actual results are very different.

Edit: The purpose of that restriction is to hamper "straw purchasers" who buy guns for people unable to obtain a gun permit.

Straw purchase is already illegal. As has been demonstrated in the past, very few straw purchasers, even those known by federal authorities, are actually charged criminally for violation. Again I repeat the drone, why not enforce the laws we already have instead of making new laws which will only effect the law abiding negatively?

[derby378]

5. Thanks for catching the story!

We may have a follow-up on the site in a day or two. I wrote Joe Burns back and told him what I thought of the bill, what won't work, what might work, and all that.

[virginia mountainman]

7. Good deal!!

Keep us informed!!