Premise: Global climate change caused by human activity cannot be stopped.

[Kaleva]

If one agrees with the statement, then wouldn't it be wise to prepare as best as one can for the possible changes and that governments ought to spend as much time and effort in preparation as they are in attempting to reduce green house emissions? If sea levels are expected to rise, then wouldn't it behoove a nation or nations to encourage their citizens to move out of the expected affected areas?

[Deja Q]

1. Life is what we make of it.

Also, hasn't the "sea rising" theory been debunked? (at least the glaciers, which are already floating in water -- that ice cube in a glass of water parallel...) Unless you're not including the snowy mountaincaps, but depending on rate of melting and ambient rainfall, that might all get absorbed by the ground anyway... remember, all this is prediction.)

Indeed, look at those who have said the most on global warming. See if their post-speaking actions have followed suit, if global warming really is that much of a crisis to them. It might be, but I'm more inclined to listen to people who walk their talk. (I may as well run around yelling "Relationships only!" while boinking every person I meet. Doesn't work that way, unless I'm like really mentally ill or something, and even then... thankfully, I'm not boinking every person I meet so my credibility on that issue isn't in any danger of being broken.)

[OKIsItJustMe]

13. “hasn't the ‘sea rising’ theory been debunked?”

No.

"at least the glaciers, which are already floating in water"

Glaciers (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/glacier">by definition) do not float on water. Ice which floats on water goes by terms like "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_ice">sea ice," "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iceberg">iceberg" or "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_shelf">ice shelf." You can read about this at the http://nsidc.org/">National Snow and Ice Data Center.


Glaciers, are land-based, and when they melt, sea level rises. It's just about that simple.
http://www.buffalo.edu/news/10191

News Release

Ice Sheets Can Retreat "In a Geologic Instant," Study of Prehistoric Glacier Shows

Findings are relevant to modern Greenland ice sheet, says UB researcher

Release Date: June 21, 2009

BUFFALO, N.Y. -- Modern glaciers, such as those making up the Greenland and Antarctic ice sheets, are capable of undergoing periods of rapid shrinkage or retreat, according to new findings by paleoclimatologists at the University at Buffalo.

The paper, published on June 21 in Nature Geoscience, describes fieldwork demonstrating that a prehistoric glacier in the Canadian Arctic rapidly retreated in just a few hundred years.

The proof of such rapid retreat of ice sheets provides one of the few explicit confirmations that this phenomenon occurs.

Should the same conditions recur today, which the UB scientists say is very possible, they would result in sharply rising global sea levels, which would threaten coastal populations.

"A lot of glaciers in Antarctica and Greenland are characteristic of the one we studied in the Canadian Arctic," said Jason Briner, Ph.D., assistant professor of geology in the UB College of Arts and Sciences and lead author on the paper. "Based on our findings, they, too, could retreat in a geologic instant."

…

Ice floating on the ocean (like the Arctic ice cap) presents its own risks if/when it melts. While ice is very reflective, open water is not (see "http://svs.gsfc.nasa.gov/vis/a010000/a010000/a010021/index.html">Ice Albedo.")

Also important to consider is that melting "sea ice" means that the ocean is warming. Water expands when it warms, and until recently, the majority of sea level rise has been due to just that (the thermal expansion of water.)

[elocs]

2. My guess is that it cannot be stopped because there is a lack of will to stop it

or the urgency to do so. The trouble is that the deniers will not want to do anything in the way of preparation because it will cost money.

[Kaleva]

4. But I don't see a great sense of urgency in those who believe that climate change is happening

Meaning, that while there is a great deal of talk about it happening or that it will happen, where are the discussion about how best to prepare for it?

[elocs]

20. Most of the talk and thought is that climate change can still be reversed.

The urgency won't occur for everyone until the wolf is at the door.

[pscot]

22. We are so screwn

We've dithered away our marging of error.

[kestrel91316]

3. Of course it cannot. Because humans are too stupid and self-centered to

change their ways.

The "ME" generation may be the LAST generation.

[Kaleva]

5. But can we change our ways enough to make a difference?

Even reducing global green house emissions to 1990 levels will only delay the inevitable for a few years or maybe a couple of decades. Reducing emissions to pre-Industrial Revolution levels is at present an impossibility.

[kestrel91316]

8. We can change as individuals, but as a group, there are too few who

are willing to do so, especially since it requires no small amount of personal sacrifice. Doing anything for the greater good is apparently beyond most humans.

[exboyfil]

6. Actually I saw a plan to flood a low level area in Africa

to reduce the sea level. Want to bet now on whether that happens. Remember this is Africa - the land of the exploited. Bet on it.

[Kaleva]

7. Are you refering to the proposed Qattara depression project in Egypt?

[exboyfil]

9. I think you know a lot more about it than me

I just thought it was something that Africa got mentioned (seems they get the short end everytime).

[joshcryer]

11. Pretty much. :(

[joshcryer]

10. I thought they were talking about the Congo Basin Lake Project

Would be pretty insane and would flood a lot of untouched forest. How much CO2 is sequestered by that forest, I dunno, but it seems like a bad idea to drown millions of trees in order to avert sea level rise which would mean less CO2 being sequestered, leading to the possibility of even more ice melt.

[Kaleva]

12. I think the focus on both projects is for hydro-electric power generation...

and not as a way to compensate for rising sea levels.

[joshcryer]

14. Indeed, but I believe they were also proffered as solutions to sea level rise.

I know one guy (libertarian type) who threw it out there on my website as a solution to sea level rise. I was too incensed to respond.

(These are types that believe global warming means nice warm winters and happy go lucky resorts in Alaska, no biggie!)

[Kaleva]

15. I've read about digging canals to the Dead Sea and Caspian Sea

But I don't know if all together can hold all the water expected from melting ice caps and glaciers.

[joshcryer]

16. Just dug out an old book I had that discusses it. Chad Sea and Congo Lake plans.

Unfortunately the book I have (Engineers Dreams; discusses these fantastic engineering projects, only one of which was realized since its publication; the Channel Tunnel) does not have volume numbers for these two engineered lakes.

[Kaleva]

17. Flooding below sea level. A discussion.

http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering/browse_thread/thread/b7f7df3af53a672c

[joshcryer]

19. Thanks, very interesting discussion. :)

:hi:

[joshcryer]

18. I think I ought to say something, I agree with your premise, but often times it's too late before...

...governments and people act. I find it unfortunate but I don't think individuals alone can prepare for any coming ecological catastrophe (such as sea level rise; how do you as an individual prepare for mass migrations?).

I think we'll be "OK" because, for instance, sea level rise can be mitigated over time, and there will be plenty of warning before people have to move (a generation or more).

Ocean acidification and mass dieoff of sea life would be a bad thing but going vegetarian would quickly fix that (stop growing food for meat and just grow food for food, etc).

I think we're OK in many regards, however, I think if we are really smart about it we should stop fucking shit up before it gets to that point (though I realize this rejects your premise, I think we haven't *quite* reached that tipping point).

[phantom power]

21. "It's time to stop talking about cures, and start talking about hospice."

I forget where I saw that. It may originally have been in the context of peak oil. Either way.