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tinrobot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 01:34 PM
Original message
Lotus throws its weight behind methanol
Edited on Tue Jun-24-08 01:35 PM by tinrobot
British sportscar-maker and engineering firm Lotus may be known for its lightweight vehicles, but in the industry it still packs a punch as a heavyweight. It's that weight which Lotus is throwing behind methanol as the most viable alternative fuel.

Towards that end, at this year's Geneva motor show Lotus unveiled the flex-fuel 270E prototype based on the lightweight Exige sportscar. The vehicle is designed to run on gasoline, ethanol or methanol, but it's the latter which the company feels is the most viable for the near future. Like bio-ethanol, methanol can be made from natural materials, or can be made from hydrogen combined with CO2 pulled out of the thin air, which allows for zero-emissions operation. The most convenient aspect, however, is that most car engines on the road today could be converted to run on methanol.



http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/06/24/lotus-throws-its-weight-behind-methanol/

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The thing that stands out here is not the car, but the method of fuel production. Pulling CO2 out of the air seems like it might be more efficient than other forms of biofuel production. Sure, once you burn the methanol, the carbon goes back, so it's not a sequestration method -- but I wonder how energy efficient the methanol production process would be compared to growing crops or cultivating algae for biofuel.
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MichellesBFF Donating Member (313 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. Aha!
A replacement for DH's Elise. And it's still purty....

(But try to get in and out of one. You need to do yoga to be flexible enough!)
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izquierdista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
2. Methanol synthesis
Methanol has always been a desirable fuel to make, since the ingredients are easy to come by and it burns so cleanly. Unfortunately, the pressures required are quite high and are only economical on a very large scale. Where there is a ready supply of carbon (coal, biomass, CO2 emission, etc.) and energy to run the pumps and compressors, methanol can be a viable byproduct.

Biodiesel and ethanol have an advantage over ethanol in this respect, as homebrewing of both fuels is possible. Given the sophistication of some of the methanol synthesis processes, no one is going to be brewing fuel methanol in their garage. In fact, small biofuels operations are net consumers of the methanol, since biodiesel is usually transesterified using methanol.

Reference to an interesting process for making methanol: http://pubs.acs.org/cgi-bin/abstract.cgi/enfuem/2003/17/i04/abs/ef020240v.html
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eppur_se_muova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 02:56 PM
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3. Pulling CO2 out of common air is not very practical.
After all it's still only 350 ppm. However, pulling CO2 out of exhaust air -- in which much of the O2 has been converted to CO2 -- is more realistic, but still requires energy to separate and purify. And you have to burn something containing carbon to make CO2. Actually, burning biomass (including wood, paper, ag waste, garbage) and collecting the energy and CO2 is one method that has been considered for "reformulating" various forms of biomass into liquid fuels. This would mean diverting some of that energy to H2 production, then combining that with CO2. Of course, the energy value of the liquid fuel will be considerably less than what you started with in biomass.

But as izquierdista points out, it has always been cheaper to make methanol from coal or natural gas, and probably will be for a long time to come. Until some incentive is awarded to "cogeneration" plants and penalties imposed on fossil fuel consumption, the Invisible Hand will always prefer to disinterr fossil carbon and turn the planet into a smokehouse.

Frankly, I doubt if there's any incentive/subsidy plan strong enough to permit "performance" cars to continue to be produced in a world of sustainable fuels. The one key to sustainibility is MINIMAL CONSUMPTION -- only what is needed to get the job done, with none left over for expensive toys.
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
4. Oh good, a highly toxic compound that is completely water soluble.
That sounds like a great idea for preserving the car culture.

I feel great about it!

It's the best idea ever!

And it comes absolutely free!

Perfect!

Great!

I'm personally so relieved. Where do I put my order for the Lotus in? Is the millionaire fundie anti-nuke Amory Lovins taking orders?
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tinrobot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. You're absolutely right.
Edited on Tue Jun-24-08 04:22 PM by tinrobot
I guess I'll go buy some solar panels and an electric car instead of this toxic machine.
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. You mean you don't already have solar panels and an electric car?
I assumed, of course, that you did.

I also assumed that you couldn't care less about the toxic properties of batteries, but that's another question entirely.

The car cult cannot be made ethical or sustainable, but it's fun to watch all the fantasy wiggling about it.
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tinrobot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. You really don't understand sarcasm, do you?
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. No. I'm entirely lacking a sense of humor.
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OffWithTheirHeads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
6. Did you ever see a Lotus actually running?
I didn't think so.

Their reliability is on par with Bush. Fun as hell to drive on those rare occasions when they are actually out of the repair shop though. Sort of like driving a go-cart.
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