My cousin is in jail

[Taverner]

Fuckall, she got a DUI. Working full time, of course she can't do the community service and pay the fine.

Hence, a warrant, and she is in jail.

Fuck.

This is not what it is supposed to do.

Lindsay Lohan gets 3 hours for her repeated violations, yet my cousin gets months for her mistake - first time.

[freshwest]

1. The system impoverishes people. Sorry about her. Hope she gets another job later.

The wealthy are seldom inconvenienced by the system that they set up for us.

[Inchworm]

8. oh gawd

I felt drippy

:brr:

[freshwest]

15. Then quit drooling on people. This is about Taverner's cousin, not you or me.

[Lasher]

13. It will be harder for her to get a job from now on.

Employers blackball everyone who has ever been convicted of a DUI. A conviction can be expunged in California, however, if you have the money to hire a lawyer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expungement

[elleng]

2. She should not be jailed for inability to pay a fine.

She should see attorney = legal aid etc, asap.

[auntAgonist]

3. She's lucky she's alive. She's lucky she didn't cause an accident

and kill an innocent person.
Sorry she's had to do time, really. Hopefully lesson learned.

aA
kesha

[LeftyMom]

4. She's damned lucky she didn't kill anybody, including herself.

I'm glad she's not on the roads.

[Riftaxe]

5. You should have taken the time to inform your cousin

a) driving while loaded is against the law
b) it might lead to inconvenient consequences
c) you might fucking kill someone or her self!!!!!

[Riftaxe]

6. Lindsay's behavior is only protected by theCalifornia laws

which those people have chosen. She would be serving at least 3 years in NH no matter her fame or wealth if she did it here.

truth in sentencing, look into it....

[LeftyMom]

7. California jails and prisons are enormously overcrowded and are under federal supervision

The state got around the federal requirements by sending a bunch of state prisoners to county jails, and as a result the county jails don't have the room to house the drunk drivers, parole violators and such who make up their usual clientele.

Tav's cousin would probably have got kicked out already if she could pay up for an ankle monitor.

[Riftaxe]

9. Which overlord dictated that it had to be this way?

And yes, I mean it is the silly priorities of the people and the laziness of the state Government from opening new prisons.


Unfortunately CA can no longer gouge the people who earn minimum wage to open new prisons for their laws, so what do they do?


normally this would mean the legislators would sit down and re-gauge priorities.


Unfortunately, with the state in question, this would result in yogurt enemas for all inmates.

[LeftyMom]

10. Well I'm sure glad you've got that all figured out for us.

Why don't you give Jerry Brown a ring and 'splain things, once his office opens on Monday. :eyes:

[Riftaxe]

11. Hmmm i live in NH

why would i care how CA spends their budget, other then the obvious vulgarities?

Since you have hidden where you live, i am going to assume you live in CA and just are lazy, bored, and ignorant.

[blueamy66]

12. How much time did she get?

She couldn't make payments towards the fine?

Fucked up everywhere...

[vard28]

14. Drunk driving is a CHOICE

Sorry, not much sympathy here. I was almost killed by a drunk driver. Had to learn how to read, write, and talk again. Years of rehabilitation. Multiple surgeries because of the crash. Still have problems from it and I was hit in 1987. The guy who hit me ended up with nine stitches.

[LynneSin]

18. I think the OP intent was how the systems works

Rich Hollywood type - give them time and time again to get it right even as the rich hollywood type flaunts the law.

The rest of us - jail.

[HopeHoops]

20. Yeah, Lynne, that's how I read it too.

Money talks.

[geardaddy]

61. That's how I read it, too.

Here a former Vikings player's wife hit and killed (and ran) someone and still seems to be getting off.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1944784#1944794

[freshwest]

29. Yes, it's about the inability to pay the fine, not the quality of the crime. I'm as anti-DUI as any.

But I've posted cases of wealthy people literally running over people, maiming them for life or kiling them, and never doing a day in jail or not even being charged for the crime..

Because they could pay the fine, the interest, penalties and an attorney, and had time off work to do community service. Some of them have done their community service *get this* working to elect the GOP candidates in their backwater communities.

Not exactly working in a dangerous job for their hours, such as killed a mother who was the support of her mother and children being crushed to death in a recycling center in my city while working other jobs to pay her fine, stay out of jail and continue to work for her family.

Oh, no, some people get to choose what they will do. We should think about how that happens and wonder about inequality.

Sure, whoever they are, they made the choice to drink or take illegal or even legal drugs and get behind the wheel. But does the one who makes so much money they can avoid imprisonment, really have the suffering of the one who is head over heels in a panic and tries to escape for a minute?

I'm not talking about a confirmed drunkard who knows better, refuses to get help and is in complete possession of their senses otherwise. There but for the grace of god or gods, goes I, who never got to such a sorry pass, was able to say no.

Who are we to throw the first stone and scream? Why not find the cause rather than take the typical rightwing position and start yelling you filthy sinner at someone?

Good luck to those who want to pile on this person who never had to walk in their shoes. And now, I'll shut my big mouth up. Oh, besides there's always the Ignore option.

[Kali]

42. have to agree

major stupidity driving drunk, but unequal punishment is the point of the post

[freshwest]

49. Thanks kali. Somedays it seems the flames from GD ignite the Lounge, too.

[dembotoz]

16. to all you folks who want capital punishment for 1 dui........

what can i say and it will never convince you.

a dui should and could be a wakeup call.
not so sure it should be handled by the "justice" system.

if she need help i hope she gets it.
I do hope this does not destroy her.

[vard28]

17. I never said anything about capital punishment

There is NO excuse for drunk driving. Drunk driving isn't like running a stop sign. It isn't an accident. Sometimes it only takes someone's first DUI to kill another person.

[Major Nikon]

19. I didn't get that the OP was making excuses for drunk driving

The point was that a DUI conviction disproportionately affects the poor. This is a completely valid point and I happen to agree.

Our society most certainly should set harsh penalties for DUI convictions, but the punishment should be equally severe whether you are rich or poor. If I were to get a DUI, it would cost me quite a bit of money in the way of fines and increased insurance costs, but assuming I didn't have an accident that's the worst that would happen to me. For others it destroys their life.

Other countries seem to have figured that one out. In Finland, they are giving some people 6 figure speeding tickets because the fine is based on your income. That's a pretty smart way of doing things.

[snagglepuss]

33. Finland looks like it has the right idea. Fines should be geared to income

and if certain crimes like DUI are repeated jail for every one, no exceptions.

[Swede]

21. Lots of folks don't live in glass houses,looks like.

Good luck to your cousin.

[datasuspect]

22. don't drink and drive

you drink, you drive, you lose.

and yes, we have the best justice system money can buy.

if you MUST drink and drive, get good at it - it's a learnable skill.

[soleiri]

23. WTH?

"if you MUST drink and drive, get good at it - it's a learnable skill."

Why would you encourage people to "get good" at drinking and driving?
And how would they "get good" at drinking and driving?
By practicing every thursday? An hour a day of driving drunk?
It's not a learnable skill, they just haven't gotten caught yet.
And in what circumstances is drinking and driving a MUST?

Possibly the most ridiculous and dangerous advice I've ever seen on DU.

[Chan790]

24. My biological father had 5 accidents in the six months after he stopped drinking.

He'd never driven sober in his life, he'd taken his driving test pissed to the gills.

[datasuspect]

26. my pet fox, Michael J., almost had his paw cut off in a bear trap

we were at the hunting camp doing target practice and having a tequila championship and I had to get my beloved pet to the vet.

that was one situation where it was necessary.

[geardaddy]

63. lol n/t

[snagglepuss]

34. I wish we could alert for TEH Stoopid. The reason that the are so many dui is

that millions of jerks are convinced they mastered the skill. Friggin unbelievable.

[Kali]

41. pssst

l-o-u-n-g-e

[datasuspect]

60. right? saucer of xanax, aisle 4 please.

[Gormy Cuss]

25. I'm sorry Tav but I just don't get it. Was she unaware that the courts would follow up

to see if she met the terms? Was there no know to explain to her that going to jail would be a big risk to that full time job? Was there no way to do that community service on her days off? Did she try to borrow the money for the fine rather than just ignore it?

She's learning all of this the hard way now.

[Taverner]

27. She's just young and doesn't get it

This happens to the best of us when we are in that early 20s stage...

[Missy Vixen]

31. Really?

>This happens to the best of us when we are in that early 20s stage...<

Is that so?

I've never gotten behind the wheel of a car after even ONE drink. My husband hasn't, either. The only people who get DUI's in that "early 20s stage" are those who are too irresponsible to have a driver's license in the first place. If they can't afford alternate transportation, perhaps they shouldn't be out drinking.

Signed,
Yet Another Family Hit By a Drunk Driver

[Taverner]

36. OK, You're special. You win a prize. Not everyone else is.

Besides, shouldn't the goal of DUI legislation be to simply get the driver off the roads?

Instead of "let's make them rue the day they were born, and make some serious cash off them too?"

[Missy Vixen]

37. I'm not special at all

I have the intelligence and the reasoning ability to know that driving while drunk is a stupid thing to do. I might also mention EVERYONE I've ever met who was busted as the result of driving drunk has done so multiple times before actually getting caught.

>Instead of "let's make them rue the day they were born, and make some serious cash off them too?"<

And what would you suggest as a punishment instead? "Aww, honey, it's okay if you killed a guy coming home from Costco while blowing three times the legal limit*! His wife and kids didn't really need him or anything." The only thing some people understand is losing a large amount of cash due to their stupidity, and sometimes, that's not enough, either. (See Moon, Warren, for example.)

There is NO excuse for drunk or impaired driving. NONE. Those who serve as apologists (or do it themselves,) shouldn't have a driver's license in the first place.

-MV

*Actual case, happened in Kirkland, WA, last month. The guy who died was in his thirties. He was running an errand. He had a wife and two kids under 5. The guy who hit him walked - or shall I say, staggered? - away.

[Taverner]

38. My punishment? Auto loss of license for 1 year for 1st offense

No jail time, no fines

2nd offense, 2 years

3rd offense, loss of license for 10 years

It does what really needs to be done - which is get them off the road

[raccoon]

56. In theory, yes. In many cases they drive without licenses.

I know of someone who got a DUI, lost his license, then drove without it and was involved in an accident. Uh-oh.

Last time I heard, the family was being sued.

[Missy Vixen]

59. Of course those with a suspended license won't drive while it's suspended!

After all, they're so good at following the law in the first place, like not getting behind the wheel after drinking, aren't they?

:sarcasm:
:sarcasm:
:sarcasm:

The apologists for drunk drivers make me sick to my stomach. Drunks behind the wheel have brought so much misery to the lives of those they injure and kill. It's ENTIRELY preventable. There is NO excuse.

[MineralMan]

47. In jail is off the roads.

:shrug: Do you think she should have no punishment at all for her DUI? I believe she was offered an alternative, but chose not to take it.

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ptah]

28. If you can visit her, please do.

A visitor will help her deal with incarceration.

If you can't visit, mail is also a godsend.

Depending on how long her sentence, you can send books through Amazon.com.

:grouphug:

[MineralMan]

30. Well, I've known several people who work full time jobs

who have done community service. One is now the Executive Director of the place he did the service. Quite a story, there. The day is 24 hours long. Driving while under the influence definitely has consequences. Yes, it's unfair when some people get off lightly, but...

[Taverner]

35. I guess its a matter of "does the punishment fit the crime"?

I would argue no...

Again, I do think the end goal of Drunk Driving laws should be get the driver off the road. I have no problems with suspending licenses, impounding vehicles, etc.

It's when it becomes a money maker for the Courts that it becomes a problem

[MineralMan]

45. I would argue that it does.

We have so many multiple offenders with DUI that I believe the punishments must be very painful for early offenses. Community service is not an onerous punishment. In fact, most people who do it benefit from it in ways no other form of punishment can match. Working a full-time job is no excuse for not doing court-specified community service. Nor is it an excuse for failing to pay a fine.

DUIs are completely avoidable by everyone. They are a voluntary crime entirely. Given the enormous impact they have on others, I am not sympathetic with those who are convicted of DUI. If anything, I'd recommend much harsher punishment for first offences than is now meted out. Since so many re-offend, and frequently, it's hard for me to find a good argument for leniency. I am not a teetotaler, but I do not drive when intoxicated. Ever. I've known several people who have died as a result of DUI. I do not wish to know more.

Your cousin may profit from her time in jail. She probably would have profited more by paying her fine and doing her community service, but she chose not to accept that penalty. My sympathy is not for her. Sorry.

[Burma Jones]

32. My Cousin was in Jail for a couple of years until his accessory to Murder Conviction was overturned

He was 20 years old and picked up Hitchhikers who forced him to drive them to a robbery where the Store Owner was held up and shot dead. It took two years to get it sorted out, he got five years Probation for picking up Hitchhikers. He turned to Heroin, worked at a Car Wash, started to get his shit together, got his Bachelors Degree, was engaged to be married and was killed at age 30 in an Auto Accident the day before my Brother's Wedding.

I tell this story to emphasize that it will be very important to support your cousin upon her release from Jail.........

[no name no slogan]

39. My ex-wife got her first DUI when we were still married

She ended up paying a several hundred dollar fine, paid restitution to a car she hit, AND served a weekend in the workhouse. And quite frankly, she deserved more.

If you drink and drive, you deserve whatever you get. No matter who you are.

[Taverner]

40. Wouldn't you rather get them off the streets, than over punish them?

There's all kinds of big talk here

"I think drunk drivers should be SHOT!!!"

"I think drunk drivers should be TORTURED, then SHOT, then brought back to life and then TORTURED again!!"

Which really doesn't solve the problem. It just makes someone want to eliminate witnesses to an event.

Getting them off the street, however, seems like a better goal.

Revenge much?

[Maine-ah]

43. it's a sensitive subject for some of us who have lost loved ones

because of a drunk driver.

I hope she'll learn a lesson from it all and never do it again. She's very lucky she didn't kill herself or someone else.

As for sentencing...I don't have much of a comment on that subject.

[no name no slogan]

44. Project much?

When did I ever say any of that oral diarrhea you just spewed? Does NOWHERE ring a bell?

Drunk drivers should be treated twofold:
1) Punish them for their reckless and dangerous behaviour. That means jail or prison in the most serious offenses. Take their license away for a while-- driving is a PRIVILEGE, not a right.

2) Rehabilitate them and get them clean. If you've got a DUI, chances are you probably have a drinking problem. If that's the case, put the offender through rehab. Follow up with him/her in the community when they've completed their sentence. Make sure they don't re-offend.

I've known several people who have DUIs, and the vast majority of them are alcoholics. They need help, and rehabilitation, after they've paid their debt. Do that and we'll solve the problem.

[MineralMan]

46. Being in jail does serve to get someone off the streets.

With luck, it will convince that person not to drive drunk again. Your cousin chose her own punishment. She had an alternative, but decided not to take it. Tough.

[Taverner]

50. But most likely it will just make them mad, and wishing to get revenge

[MineralMan]

54. I suppose that happens to some. They're the ones who spend

a lot of their life locked up. You say your cousin is young. Perhaps she'll learn from this experience and not drive while intoxicated in the future. That's the reason she's in there - to learn that lesson.

[TK421]

48. well, at least she won't kill anyone in jail n/t

[suninvited]

51. She is young, as you said

and maybe now is a great time to really learn a hard lesson the very hard way.

My young nephew got two DWI's, lawyers and fines were paid for by his parents and they worked out a repayment plan for him to pay them back. He didn't learn his lesson. It wasn't until his third DWI and an accident in which he could have killed someone or himself that no one came to get him out of jail and let him stay there and learn his lesson the hard way.

Hopefully there will be no more. I doubt he will ever get a license again.

I don't know if Texas has gotten more lenient on DWI's, but my cousin spent 10 years in prison after his third conviction and none of them involved any second party damage, only single car accidents (his own).

[Prisoner_Number_Six]

53. A good friend's brother was recently killed by a drunk driver

He was 47. He was a musician and he worked for his brother in his carpentry shop. This happened 2 months ago.

You'll understand if I'm less than sympathetic.

Rest in peace, Stephen Carranza.

[backtoblue]

55. There are boys and girls clubs that allow community service.

Don't ask me how I know this...

They allowed a "certain someone" to come after work and help with the kiddos.

That really stinks for her...Was there something else or a repeated offense to get her jailtime?
This "certain someone" spent one night in jail and was released until a courtdate, where their license was suspended for six months and had a "blow and go" on their car.

Maybe she needs to see a lawyer....

[DebJ]

57. I don't understand the inability to do community service just

because she worked full-time. A guy I know was given 45 hours of community service, and he worked 65-70 hours a week in a management job, plus had a long commute. He did the community service without ever taking a day off.

As far as the fine, how much was it? Did she even try to make partial payment on it?

Finally, how much jail time did she get? My mother would trade some time in jail instead of the rest-of-her-life-in-a-wheelchair and numerous devasting ongoing health issues for the past 23 years that was HER 'sentence' given to her when hit by a drunk driver. In addition to the devastating health impact, my father had to retire early to take care of her, costing them megabucks in their retirement years...plus they pay out more for health care issues caused by the accident, for the rest of their lives. My Dad has to wait on my Mom quite a lot because of her injuries.

My Mom was hit 6 weeks before her 60th birthday. She was in shock trauma for 8 weeks, had major surgery every week. Her blood was totally transfused 11 times, resulting in serious immune system deficiencies for life. (For example, she got a bee sting on her leg. Four years later, it had 'healed', but left a one-inch indentation/hole in her leg where the flesh just died, slowly and painfully.) Her eye socket was crushed, and at age 78, she got eye cancer, which was attributed to the shock of the accident. Being confined to a wheelchair has caused her muscles and cardio-vascular system to degenerate at an advanced pace.

Instead of jail, I think your cousin should be sentenced to living with my mother and waiting on her hand and foot, and observing all of the painful and crippling things my mother has had to endure for the last 23 years, with new issues cropping up as she ages. I think this would be much more effective than jail time. Also, she could pay them rent while living with my mother, since my parents can barely struggle along now with rising costs and their severely reduced fixed income.

Sorry, but I have absolutely no sympathy. Your cousin is getting off easy. She really should be waiting hand and foot on someone hit by drunk driver. That MIGHT make her change her thinking.

Being in your twenties is no damn excuse for seeking only your own pleasure and to hell with everyone else on the planet. Responsibility to others should be ingrained well before the age of 21.

[datasuspect]

62. damn straight

[geardaddy]

64. I'm sorry to hear about your mother.

What happened to the person who hit your mother? Why isn't he sentenced to taking care of your mother?

[DebJ]

66. The driver and his passenger were flown to shock trauma,

and believe it or not, released in like 10 minutes after their arrival. My mother on the other hand was transported via ambulance through heavy traffic in Montgomery County Maryland.

The passenger in the car actually sued my mother as if it was her fault. She had to go to court in a wheelchair within
days after she got out of shock trauma. The judge dismissed it as nonsense, but still my mother had to retain a lawyer
and stress herself further by going to court to defend herself. The way the accident happened was that both Mom and this other car, an old Mustang, were driving north on 355 in Montgomery County, parallel to each other. The Mustang ended up in my mother's lane under the front end of her pick-up truck, shoving in the front axle and forcing the steering wheel into my mother's face and the dashboard into her body and legs, causing compound fractures in every major bone in her body. The tow truck driver said that the Mustang was full of empty beer cans and smelled like a brewery. So I guess they were both loose enough from the alcohol that ending up under a pick up truck resulted in minor scrapes only.

The driver was driving his Dad's car though I think he was in his 30s or late 20s. Maybe he couldn't get insurance on a car himself from multiple DUI's...no idea there just venting steam because that is what happens so often... That car had minimum liability requirements of the state (Maryland), and that did not even cover the first few weeks Mom spent in shock trauma. My Mom's employer was unbelievably outstanding and accomodating. They paid her several months of sick leave, even though she wasn't entitled to any but a few days if anything. They paid her in full. (She had saved them thousands and thousands of dollars by knowing what she was doing in her job). She tried to go back to work after many months but she could not handle it, and had to quit and my dad had to retire.

I honestly don't know what happened to that driver. My parents wisely did not tell me of the pending court date nor anything about it until after it was over. I'm not a violent person but it would have been a very bad idea for me to be there...........

[geardaddy]

67. That's an incredibly sad story.

I can understand your anger.

[DebJ]

58. Japan doesn't have this problem: with one DUI, you lose your

license for LIFE.

[geardaddy]

65. I think that's how it's done in Germany, too.

It doesn't stop people from driving here, though. I was hit by a guy who had his license revoked for having several DUIs (he wasn't drunk at the time). He was borrowing his friend's truck, so I was screwed on getting any insurance to pay for my damages/medical.