Kids with ADD

[gyopsy]

I was diagnosed with Attention Deficit Disorder when I was 7. The doctor, who I now know was a creep, had me medicated in no time at all. I went to see this doctor once a week who administered all sorts of tests about practically everything on me. Under the medication, I lost a lot of weight and never felt hungry.

My mother took me off the medication when I was 8. She did it despite the extreme pressure she was receiving from everyone else (including my dad and my school.)

Today, I'm very successful in college with a solid GPA. I exhibit far fewer signs of any ADD than any of my classmates actually.

Anybody else diagnosed with ADD when they were kids? Do you have kids who were diagnosed? I think this "disease" is complete bullshit in 90% of the cases in which it is diagnosed. Just a way to get young kids to shut up I think.

[Another Bill C.]

1. I agree.

I just can't see labeling a kid who won't sit there like a zombie all day as having a disorder. I think the term "disorder" is being applied in an inverse manner.

[Shoedogg]

2. I have no experience with ADD

But I suspect that many (not all) cases are total bull.

(When I was 7, the speech therapist at my elementary school recommended to my parents that I get help for my "lisp." A lisp that only she could hear.)

[Sequoia]

3. You are right on!

My daughter's teacher in 1st grade tried that crap on us and got all these people in a meeting and she was just bound and determined to tell me my daugher had ADD. During the meeting as I was having my say she'd rustle papers and point to stuff and have mean looks in her eyes. She was a control freak. The doc said my child was spunky, healthy and smart. It is a way to keep kids down. How can adults expect to keep those energized bunnies still. They need to play more, not sit and memorize crap all the time. I'm happy your mom did what she did and I know you are too.

[teach1st]

6. Teachers shouldn't diagnose

My daughter's teacher in 1st grade tried that crap on us and got all these people in a meeting and she was just bound and determined to tell me my daugher had ADD.

In my state (I think in most states) teachers can't by law diagnose. It sounds like that teacher is diagnosing. I just describe for the parents the type of behavior I see and let them decide. If I'm asked about possible ADD, I advise them to seek a professional diagnosis.

This isn't about kids who can't sit like zombies. There are kids (not many) who can't focus and don't get much out of school. I've seen medication help some of these kids tremendously. I've also seen medication hurt some kids. There are other useful strategies for classroom use, strategies that in most cases work very well.

[Debi]

4. My son has mild MR

And the 'team' at his school 'decided' he had ADD and wanted to have him put on medication. His father and I took him to the hospital for testing...and guess what? He was diagnosed with mild MR...found out one of the 'team' leaders had just had her daughter diagnosed and placed her on medication...she said it made her life better (yeah, but what about her daughters?)

I'm sure there are legitimate ADD cases out there - I just think the term and diagnosis have been abused.

[djeseru]

5. I agree.

I also tip my hat to you and your mom - that's wonderful to hear.

I've wondered about this for a while - this idea of "let's just medicate to placate" that seems to be going around. I was alarmed to hear what all they dose kids up with these days. Anti-depressants for 7-year-olds?

[Zookeeper]

7. I actually had to fight to get my son's ADD recognized...

If a child is hyperactive, too many teachers can't wait to get the child medicated. But, kids without the hyperactive component don't always get noticed.

One of my sons was identified as "gifted and talented," and just sailed through school with A's until the 5th grade. His teachers had been telling me for a couple of years that he would completely space out during class, but his work was great. He was somewhat impulsive at home and very disorganized. I had suspected ADD for quite a while, but it wasn't until Middle School, when he was expected to keep himself organized, that things really fell apart.

To make a long story short, the stress of dealing with ADD challenges finally caused him to become quite depressed. He has taken Adderall with some success, but we are now trying something new, "Stratera." My husband and I have realized that we probably have ADD as well. Which makes it harder to keep things tightly structured for him. The contrast in organizational abilities between that son and my other children is huge!

[The Spirit of JFK]

17. I was your son

I am 36 (at least for a couple more days now) and was diagnosed with ADD about 3 years ago.

When I was a kid, I completely breezed through school. Homework and tests were easy. It wasn't until high school until things started falling apart. My grades were all over the place, my study habits not cutting it anymore, and I got frustrated quickly with a lot of classes and projects. I became a classic underachiever, but one who got nearly perfect scores on SAT's and would start papers the day before they were due and still get A's. This pattern continued in college and professionally.....being able to both hyperfocus and not focus at all. And not being able to see it and learn from it, so continuing to make the same mistakes over and over. It was sheer torture. I knew I was smart but fundamental principles and tasks of daily living and working were simply too much for me at times.

It was only after my older brother was diagnosed with ADD that I even bothered to think anything of it, consciously, at least. I was working as head of design and production for a small publisher....and really struggling. I was churning out books that the publisher said were the best looking ever, but I could not keep track of schedules to save my life...not a good quality to have when in publishing, especially when you are keeping track of 30+ titles all by yourself. So I quit and decided to see someone about ADD. About the same time, I had thumbed through a copy of Driven to Distraction (a pioneering book on ADD), took a couple of the quizzes and failed miserably...or passed, depending on you look at it.

Luckily for me, I was able to see one of the foremost authorities on ADD. To say that it changed my life would be corny, to say the least, but it wouldn't be a lie. The feel good short story is that it enabled me to go back to school and do well, as well as deal with many other aspects of my life that were suffering, including the way I was able to think about myself which is very hard for someone with ADD. The reality, though, is that while the drugs improve things immensely, it IS an ongoing struggle...to keep myself organized, set priorities, and other basic things most people take for granted. These are learned skills that I just never learned when the other kids did. Sometimes I look back at high school and college with regret that I didn't know then what I do now. What if...? That's not the most productive use of time or emotion, but at least I am very conscious of all these things now and can step back and examine them, and that in itself is a daily victory and progress.

The other battle I wage, as I'm sure you do, is both the odd stigma of ADD ("it's really just laziness", "it's a made up illness", "mental illness") and the mis-diagnosis, both missing it and the tendency to rush to diagnose it, especially in children. The last thing we need is for ADD to become the "Chronic Fatigue Syndrome" of our time. My advice is to use the many many resources available on the 'Net and to find a certified ADD counselor or coach who can help with teaching yourself and your son tricks and skills to keep things structured. I would have killed for that.

I didn't mean to share that much, but that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[Zookeeper]

18. Thank you!

Actually, my son's doctor gave me the name of an ADD coach for adults....for my husband and I!

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

22. Make sure he's been evaluated by a good pediatrician and/or

neurologist. "Spacing out" (if brief episodes staring into space uncommunicative) can represent "absence seizures", a type of generalized seizure without the movements. In other words make sure the diagnosis doesn't just come from some teacher.

[Zookeeper]

29. Yes, we have had him checked...

by a good pediatric psychiatrist and have had other neurological testing done. But, it is a good suggestion. I would say if anyone has any doubts about the diagnosis their child has received (if it doesn't seem like it fits), push for further testing.

On edit: He wasn't JUST staring into space...he did an enormous amount of doodling, too!

[Droopy]

8. my mom wants to comment

Hi I'm Mom. I'd like to say that I couldn't agree with you more! It used to be that kids went outside and played all day when I was little and ran off all that energy that adults today can't seem to cope with. Today for so many reasons that's not the case. I wish people would realize that kids are not little adults! I personally can't think of anything more joyful than the laughter and playfulness of a child. I hope my grandchildren always feel free to be noisy and roudy at my house. I also am happy that you realize what happened to you and that you won't let any "so called" doctor or school official convince you that a babysitter in a bottle is necessary.

[Fight_n_back]

30. Sorry Mom

but that is a load of horseshit.

Having undiagnosed ADD is agonizing. I thought I was crazy because I couldn't make myself focus on things that everyone else did with ease. Rarely a week would go by when I wasn't blurting out a joke, usually at a bosses expense, that made me popular with my peers but killed me with top execs.

When I was a kid I would sit in my room and cry because I didn't know why I couldn't get my homework done. I kept thinking I would grow out of it but I never "matured".

To alternate between creative genuis and incompetent boob is incredibly depressing. Since I have been on medication I can actully have serious conversations with people, sit and listen to a lecture, and, miracle of miracles, edit before I speak.

This is not about having "excess energy", it is about needing constant stimulation and seeking it out in more and more dangerous ways. I won't even go into some of the shit Ive done because I didn't have the normal gap between an impulse and an action.

Im still not Mr Organization but I can read an entire magazine article without the TV and radio blaring while I surf the net.


And sex is better, too.

[Djinn]

33. see myself in a lot of these posts

I have always been very smart but unfocussed, unorganised and easily bored.

At what point is it a personality trait and at what point is it a "disorder" I beleive ADD (or ADHD) exists but is massively over diagnosed.

[Fight_n_back]

35. "believe" anything you want

if it is not diagnosed when it should be then it is a huge deal.

[Djinn]

41. Oh OK then

thanks for your permission to "beleive what I want" I never disputed it existed but the problem is with any "disorder" as opposed to "disease" and there's a difference between those - where the line is drawn betweeb behaviour and disorder is a relevant question.

You might wanna pull the stick out of your butt by the way - when people have suggestions/theories/ideas etc they are not neccesarily attacking you - strangely enough you're NOT the centre of everyone's world

Edit: "I can read an entire magazine article without the TV and radio blaring while I surf the net."

See I CAN'T do only one thing at once never have been able to - at the moment I'm browsing teh forums, working at my paid job, writing an essay AND listening to an interview on the radio about a complicated political process in Australia - do I have ADD or am I a good multi-tasker? - the exact point I was making is where do you make the line between "this is personality" and "this is ADD"

[The Spirit of JFK]

36. Excellent question

And that IS the real diffdrence....personality trait vs. disorder. I mean, we all can be disorganized at times, or even a lot. Or unfocused...etc. But it's the long term chronic existence of many traits that can point to the possibility of ADD.

There are a bunch of "tests" you can take to see if you have the "profile" that would fit the ADD description. I have seen this one online: http://www.addresources.org/article_checklist.php

And I did the ones in the book Driven to Distraction.

I know you aren't supposed to take them yourself...have someone else do it for you, or at LEAST do it with someone else,

[Djinn]

42. but why would I want the tests

it may have helped some of my teachers at school - but I'm waaay beyond that point in my life and while it'd maybe be nice every now and then to be able to relax without my brain revving in a million different directions, I quite like my abilities. The point I'm trying to make is when you're talking about "disorders" rather than disease you're talking about something that often (not always) is only a problem in the eyes of other people. It doesn't actually neccesarily NEED to be medicated or solved - just accepted. Just as you might accept one kid is excessively shy without medicating them.

Again not saying that a lack of diagnoses and/or medication isn't EVER a problem - just disputnig the beleif that it ALWAYS IS

[The Spirit of JFK]

48. Never past the "point"

I think you misinterpreted my comment about the personality traits. Those traits are merely physical and physchological manifestations of ADD. ADD is a biological condition affecting neurotransmitters, especially those dealing with concentration and learning. Comparing it to excessive shyness is completely missing the mark.

And in order to meet diagnostic criteria, these behaviors must be excessive, long-term, and pervasive. A crucial consideration is that the behaviors must create a real handicap in at least two areas of a person's life, such as school, home, work, or social settings. These criteria set ADD apart from the "normal" distractibility and impulsive behavior of childhood, or the effects of the hectic and overstressed lifestyle prevalent in our society.

Of course, the severity of symptoms differ from person to person. Approximately one-third of people with ADHD do not have the hyperactive or overactive behavior component, for example. So some people with less severe manifestations are able to adapt better from the start. If you can work through it with no problems, than more power to you.

But if it DOES meet the criteria of being a real handicap, then it really SHOULD be dealt with as it indicates that person needs counseling to learn coping skills and adaptive behaviours. And yes, sometimes this counseling is in conjunction with medication (but, yes, only when necessary, as any ADD specialist will tell you).

The "tests" are really not meant for anybody but yourself (and parents). Teachers can alter their methods somewhat to better accomodate ADD children, but this is not just a school issue nor an age issue, It's more about being able to get an idea of limitations or behaviours that you may have and never been aware of...which is why you don't take the tests yourself....and then being able to do something.

I enjoyed the "speed" of my brain, too. And I still do. Medication doesn't really slow anything down, it simply helps the other transmitters fire better....enabling me to not spend so much time and energy trying to wade as much through all the input and thoughts to try and pull out what I need. The apperance of "slowing down" is more about being less manic about trying to concentrate.

[Zookeeper]

49. Hey, "Spirit.."

Your posts are excellent and appreciated. Thanks for taking the time to share your experience and insight.

Welcome to DU! :hi:

[The Spirit of JFK]

53. Thanks!

I appreciate it.

ADD has recently become a very big issue for me and my family, so I have sort of made it a priority to learn about.

[Zookeeper]

45. Obviously, most adults with ADD are functioning,

are getting by, just not living up to their potential. I'm not in favor of just carelessly medicating people, but at some point, as much as a lively, creative, intelligent adult may appreciate those qualities, they may realize that all that unfocused activity also causes a lot of stress. And for many, that their boring day-to-day tasks aren't getting done, or are done late. Most of us have in the back of our minds a memo about the things we're not getting done, while we're running around doing things that are more interesting. That is a lot more stressful than just taking care of business, and then being free for other activities. Medication does slow people with ADD down enough to be able to handle the boring stuff. That's a huge relief!

[geniph]

66. Impulsivity is a huge problem for adults with ADD, too

as it tends to make one buy things one shouldn't buy, spend money one shouldn't spend, say things one shouldn't say, quit jobs one shouldn't quit, drive carelessly, etc. We won't even go into the problems impulsivity can cause in personal relationships.

Impulse control, in one sense, IS adulthood - and for some of us, it's a much bigger struggle than many people realize.

[Zookeeper]

70. Yes! Excellent point. n/t

[Lizz612]

9. My sister actually has it.

She really does have it, one day off her meds and it all goes down hill. She can't focus, but when she does she hyper-focuses. She gets mean and snippy, picks fights. On her meds she is bright and cheerful, she can focus on things she needs to and wants to. She went to a special school for four years, classes 8 kids or smaller. She now knows what she needs, she knows how to tell people what she needs, be it extra time on a test or a quieter room. She still fights with it, but she's doing much better.
During the years when my parents and the docs were searching for the the right meds at the right dosage, life was bad. Lots of fights over things as simple as eating. I remember dropping a book while standing on my bed, just to get A parent to come and help me with my math homework.
I agree that most of the time its misdiagnosed, but let me tell you, when the kid really does have ADD, you know right away, and you want to get them help soon.

[undergroundpanther]

23. I have it

I was diagnosed with ADD in the early 70's when it was a newer"disorder" before ADD was turned into a popular way for teachers to use shrinks to shut kids up.I think there was one other kid besides me in my school showing up at the nurse's office to pop Ritalin.
For me ADD manifests in disorganization, I still sometimes forget to eat,I forget what day it is,I forget what I was doing.I forget to stop and take breaks or eat my lunch.I get irritated as hell at myself and at people intruding and asking me stupid questions when I'm doing something that matters to me.
I bet if I had to organize my way out of a paper bag,I'd forget why the hell I was sitting in this stupid bag for and tear it to shreds.

I have found especially fastidious people have little tolerance for my disorganized or different ways,they want everything done yesterday and they want it done,in an emotionally pleasing to them way that has nothing to do with the task itself.People who are controlling don't like ADD people because we do things differently than how it's *supposed* to be done. We organize the way we think differently,we have different priorities and do not care to please authority and play with egos. ADD can appear as pain in the ass for people who are used to others doing as they prefer.I thought school existed to torment me,I saw no joy in school,learning was made dull memorizing crap just was not worth wasting my sparse attention on.The bullies in school made my days miserable.Teachers because they didn't care about a pain in the ass hyper kid like me,ignored the bullies and looked the other way.For me I am selective about what earns my attention when I can pay attention to it.My attention is scatter shot ,but sometimes when I do focus it is intense. So I use it to focus on what matters most to me,because times of focused attention are precious. I'm not gonna force moments of clarity to do other peoples silly conformity requests or unrewarding tasks like a trained monkey,or do their organizational games that give them the illusion I can be controlled and managed.

I'm 38 years old.I take Adderall now.And it has not changed my feelings about authority and conformity at all after all these years.As a kid in the early 70's I took Ritalin. Adderall is less harsh than Ritalin is on the body.Like Ritalin Adderall helps my focus last longer and manages the intensity of it and it helps to take the edge off my anger, the despair and frustration. I don't notice the positive particular emotional effects of Adderall inside myself but other people say they do. Taking Adderall doesn't cure my frustration about living in this sick society. It doesn't cure a sick society of deeply ingrained bigotries or psychological control issues If we got honest..We'd admit most of what we memorized in public school is useless information we never use in our adult life.
Most kids that are bored to tears with school know this too.I did.
Not every kid is cut out for what society or parents say they are supposed to be cut out for.Not every kid wants to excel in Gym or math.Some are too creative or have too many interests to settle into one kind of mental box of bullshit our culture provides for it's kids to fit into.For some misery is to be in public school all day.when the sun is out,living a lie that apparently pleases satisfies parents,peers and teachers and feels like a hopeless prison to them.

Don't turn ADD symptoms or dissociation into power struggles.Ritalin and Adderall and Medication"Therapy" are not brain restraints, they are amphetamines, or powerful,hardcore drugs.If it was not for ADD it would be a crime for you to possess alot of these drugs.Adderall is also a street drug.So do not give people who are 'difficult'to manage
amphetamines if you can't admit you might tend to be authoritarian personality who thinks you are entitled to conformity out of other people.Sometimes it really does take two to tango.

In reality there are damaging effects amphetamines have on different human bodies over years of use.Speed freaks do have bodily damage from their habits.I know ADD allegedly makes the brain process amphetamines differently than non ADD people but alot of this stuff is still theory because the differences in brains are so subtle.

Alot of people who grow up in abusive families or deal with bullies in school can look like they have ADD because they are so vigilant and stressed out.Dissociation is one way to cope with abuse. I grew up in a bad home,I got bullied .My life then was hard on me psychologically and it started to show.Back in the 70's my first therapist who diagnosed my ADD did not know to ask me about my home life.Vigilance from abuse at home was not even discussed.Because it was assumed parents did not abuse their own kids and it was improper to presume they could do that.In the 70's it was also believed ADD wore off upon adolescence. So when I hit middle school I was taken off the Ritalin. And I went out of the frying pan and into the fire.I had a total breakdown. I failed everything in middle school. I was the school scapegoat too. Eventually I went to the psych hospital because I was really that far gone.

It took years for doctors to be able to admit to themselves what I had was dissociation/trauma/PTSD and not schizophrenia , temporal lobe epilepsy or manic depression..And unknown to me and them I still had ADD too. (I was misdiagnosed and given horrible ineffective drugs in obscene doses because of my doctors held these beliefs about the presumed rarity of dissociative disorders many doctors believed it to be rare.So because they doubted me I suffered,..This misdiagnosis was made before that belief in rarity was totally reversed ,when dissociation became a "fad" diagnosis back in the 80's when Geraldo started the SRA panic..This professional reluctance and reaction doctors had about child abuse and trauma was partly caused by the political climate of the times)I was in therapy for years, Psych medicines had weird and paradoxical effects on me. Ever since childhood I drank coffee to go to sleep.In those years I confronted my issues,I recovered from alot of traumas,I learned to manage my dissociation and triggers.I steadily got better when I was listened to..and if I stayed out of authoritarian controlled situations like hospitals,day programs.I did well except for those unrecognized ADD symptoms that never went away. Until I finally started on Adderall my disorganization was bad. I was still frustrated about my lack of focus,my snappiness,always forgetting to eat,to take breaks when I did things,a lack of motivation was unrelenting even after years of talk therapy ,psych hospitals and trying out every psych drug you could imagine..Adderall has helped me when nothing else did with this issue..when nothing else I could do, has worked.ADD is real,Dissociation is real too. The two disorders can mimic each other and even overlap in symptoms to the outside observer..But both problems might not be as common or as rare of a problem in society as has been presumed.

They say beauty is in the eye of the beholder,but if the beholder hates something about you ,Tell me, will they be capable of seeing the beauty in you even if the part about you that they hate is where the beauty comes from in you when they try to "help" you?
I have had plenty of "well meaning" helpers rush in to crush the what they did not understand or prefer from my soul,to make me like them.In my despair to be appreciated I even crushed myself.
The only way out of this box is to resist, say no to them when they insist on medicines that make you feel crappier than before,or use humiliating behavior modification or other such torture techniques to force you to be like them..You must find for yourself what gives you a sense of balance and peace with ADD and stick to your guns and listen to your body first,even if others around you still would prefer that you would be polite,just sit still ,shut up and do what they want you to do.Everyone has their own life to live regardless of what others think,or want. This is important to know if you have ADD.
With ADD or not you still must live YOUR own life inside your own brain and still be able to interact with people around you too..They can only see what they observe about you.They do not know how ADD feels like on the inside. So do not let other people's preferences be the final say. Disregard how they want you to behave and ignore the reward and punishment games if they confuse you about honestly finding what medicines,techniques or habits may or may not work for your symptoms.Everyone is different.They cope different.Amphetamines are not one size fits all brain restraints for annoying disobedient people.Don't let people use them on YOU that way.
They do not live with ADD 24-7,you do.Life is all about give and take regardless of what some "experts"touting ADD might say about your "willfulness".Just my $0.02 on it..

Underground Panther in the Sky.

[Gman]

43. Thank you for your post

[Gman]

10. As the parent of a child with ADD

I can tell you ADD exists and in fact is a legally defined disability. When I hear people say that all someone wants to do is medicate kids that don't act like zombies, I get really pissed because comments like that come from someone who has no clue whatsoever what ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder) is.

My wife and I took over a year to make the decision to get our daughter tested and that came only after a couple of serious episodes happened with my daughter's behavior.

The "personal responsibility" police of the right wing are the ones who started the bad mouthing of ADD and some people innocently pick it up because, like a lot of RW things, it sounds like a good idea as long as you don't think about it or learn about it.

The medication for ADD does NOT make a kid a zombie, period. It speeds up their body (its an amphetamine) to the point the body catches up withh the brain. The net effect is to actually calm the kid down. If your kid is on medication for ADD and you don't think its working, leave the kid off of it for a day. If the kid drives you nuts, the medication works.

I might add that ADD kids can be highly annoying. That's the nature of this disorder. Their brain moves too fast and they have a hard time sorting out auditory stimuli. The effect is for the kid to often jump from one silly thing to another, zone out, and act immature for their age.

So you may think that parents put their kids on medication so they won't be annoyed. That its more for the parents than the kids. However, its not just the parents that find the child annoying. The child's peers will often ridicule the kid and pick on him/her because the kid is immature for his/her age and does annoying things. My daaughter once sat in the middle of the playground at school one day and howled like a wolf because, according to her, she wanted to annoy as many people as she could. This was probably passive aggressive but also a reaction to being picked on for being annoying. So the medication is also good for the child to build social skills and relationships. Her relationship with her peers has improved tremendously.

Despite my daughter's problems with her peers because of her disability, she had decent grades in the B - C level. However, Her conduct grades were all below what is acceptable. She has now gone to an A - B student and her conduct has greatly improved, although its not perfect. We also keep her on the minimum dosage necessary so there's still some annoying behavior at times but it is much better.

And what's this crap about how terrible it is for teachers to "diagnose" and its supposed to be against the law? I wish like hell someone would have told us early on that our daughter likely had ADD. Her life would have been much better. If it bothers you as a parent that a teacher tells you your kid has ADD, get over it. Its not about you and whether or not YOU have a kid with something wrong with him/her. Its about the kid and giving that kid the best quality of life that you can

Read up on ADD and learn about it.

[Zookeeper]

13. Well said!

I found that my son's elementary school teachers were very reluctant to venture an opinion on whether or not he might have ADD, perhaps because he wasn't disruptive. His (horrible!) second grade teacher used to humiliate him in front of the class, for being disorganized, forgetful and distracted. But she acted like it was a moral lapse or a personal affront and dismissed my suspicions regarding ADD.

[Gman]

21. Disorganized, forgetful and distracted

are classic symptoms of ADD. Just this morning, after I asked her last night, my daughter informed me while I was in line to drop her off at school that she had a test I needed to sign. She fumbled through her backpack with literally wadded up pieces of notebook paper, uncrumbling them to see if one was the test or not. I finally told her she was out of time. She knew she had to get the test signed, she neglected to write it down in order to remember, so she was therefore out of time and would have to take the consequences. She has ADD, but we still hold her responsible for the things she has control over.

She is supposed to be using a journal to keep track of what she needs to do. She often doesn't do it. Now THIS is something that is a responsibility issue. She knows she has problems remembering, she knows its her responsibility to keep track by writing things down and she didn't do it probably because she just didn't want to. So THIS is a situation where you hold the kid responsible. You DO NOT yell at a kid that really doesn't know or understand why he/she has this problem because he/she hasn't been diagnosed and treated. If the child knows they have this disability and a system is developed to help the child and the child still doesn't do what they're supposed to do then the child deserves to be in trouble.

[Zookeeper]

31. Even the forgetting to write things down...

is part of ADD. It has to do with "executive functioning." My son is extremely bright ("gifted"), but one morning I reminded him to have his planner signed by his teachers and he said, "Oh. Am I supposed to do that?" This was after about 100 conversations about having his planner signed! :freak:

[Fight_n_back]

37. Thank you

as a life long "underachiever" who was told that I lacked character because I couldn't do homework but aced every test I can say that your daughter is very lucky. As someone who spent countless hours in the hall for blurting things out in class I can tell you your daughter is lucky.

Annoying is not the word for a kid with ADD. ADD people can drive you bat shit crazy.

But I did play a video game for 48 straight hours once and not a lot of people can say they did that.

Yes, the medication has a relaxing effect. If you take stimulants and relax as a result it is probably becuase of ADD.

If you want to know what "good" ADD is, look at Robin Williams.

If you want to see "bad" ADD look at Courtney Love.

I can tell when my medication is wearing off just by how my posts look.

[NuckinFutz]

55. Thank you, GMAN. Well said...

Being married to a man diagnosed with ADD before it was even called ADD, and having two sons with it, I, too, get angry when people assume the whole thing is just laziness and bad parenting. If that were all, then why is it that stimulant actually settle people with ADHD, instead of making them bounce off the walls like most of us do? That's enough physiological evidence for me.

As for teacher's diagnosing ADHD...that's a load of hooey. They may make suggestions that you have the child tested, but if you go to the doctor and he/she just take the teacher's or school's word for it, you need to see another doctor.

[Gman]

68. The Right Wing tries to turn ADD and ADHD into a personal responsibility

issue. As I posted previously, just like a lot of things the right wing says, it sounds good on the surface as long as you're completely ignorant otherwise about the issue. When you start learning about the issue its far from the issue the RW would have you think it is.

[Carni]

11. My eight year old kid has an IQ over 130

And the schools were pushing us down the "ADD" path because she was bored in a typical grade appropriate class...

I personally think that IF ADD exists, that it is being BROADLY diagnosed for kids that don't have it and it really makes me mad.

In any case thank God I didn't listen to people that weren't qualified to make such a diagnosis.

You had a smart mom IMO!

[TSIAS]

12. I'm no expert on ADD

I'll leave the medical analysis for those who are fit to give it.

However, I agree that you should only take medication when it's necessary. You know that I was on Paxil for a few years. It was a low dosage (10 mg) for someone my size (200 lbs). I probably needed to take it for a few months, but not for the remaining years. I knew I didn't need it, but others thought I would start getting angry without it. I was confident that wasn't the case. Well, when I stopped taking it, I didn't notice any difference.

I have absolutely no problem with people who take medication who need it. I am just leery of doctors who prescribe medication as a first, and not a last resort.

-Taylor

[Cursive_Knives512]

14. I don't have any experience with ADD,

But a few years ago (I'm 17 now) I was diagnosed with depression and have been on medication for about two years. A lot of people put meds like that down, but I have to agree with most of the other messages here: it can help, but it shouldn't be the doctor's first choice all of the time. I'm glad for my Prozac, though.

[corporatewhore]

15. ADD is a fake disease that big pharma created to make money

selling drugs i mean come on what are the symptoms short attention span hyperactivity that seems like the person is suffereing from being a normal child

[Zookeeper]

16. Read the posts a little more carefully.

[put out]

19. Yes, my younger brother suffered mightily.

I still am sorry for his pain, at not being able to use his good good mind, when he was so young, and being seen as a pain in the ass.

Hey, Bruce, you are still a pain in the ass. And still smarter than I. I love you, little brother.

[lazarus]

34. Where did you get your medical degree?

I'm really curious, because you obviously know a great deal about this topic.

Why not come and try living with me when I'm not medicated, and see what a night and day difference it is? Then tell me it's a fake disease, okay?

In the meantime, let those of us who know it's for real do the best we can to deal with our lives.

[TopesJunkie]

20. Pediatricians don't have the time to get a thorough history --

So... they really can't rule out everything that must be ruled out in order to include ADHD. That's why parents would be wise to take a child suspected of such a diagnosis to a psychiatrist or psychiatric nurse practitioner who can get a thorough history. The other thing that must be noted by any practitioner is that, unless we're talking Strattera, the drugs used to treat ADHD, if they are going to work, are going to show a difference right away. So there is no need to keep a kid on a drug for a long period of time if no benefit is noted.

Is ADHD overdiagnosed? Probably. Is it overdiagnosed by 90 percent? No.

[opihimoimoi]

24. Bush shows extreme signs of being an untreated ADD person

He is Lolo and worse, he is SLooooooWWW. When he goes, uh uuuh uhhhhh, you can just hear his brain gears click instead of the normal "whirrhhhh" doing 1725 RPMs. His RPM rate is .0006

[The Spirit of JFK]

25. Nah...he's just slooowwww.

ADD brains actually fire faster.

My doctor said Clinton is a poster boy for ADD, though.

[Wapsie B]

26. Yeah, or it could be

all those years of booze and nose candy catching up with him.

[SarahB]

27. I think it can be overdone

There are real and valid cases that benefit from treatment, but sometimes children who have alternate learning styles or those that are gifted can act out out of shear boredom at times. It must be diagnosed by a specialist and testing must occur. It shouldn't be a Pedi or a FP writing off another script.

My mother used to try to tell me my children had ADD, and at first because she's a pediatric nurse, I had some concern. Turns out she was being her psycho self and my children did not have symptoms of ADD. They're just energetic in a way normal way and above average in cognitive ability. If it were more available at the time, she would have drugged me too. There are parents cruel enough to use medications to make their life easier when it's not prudent, so a solid, expert diagnosis must be made.

[DavidMS]

28. You may have grown out of it...

I have ADHD and used to need medication when I was in school. By the time I hit college I didn't meed it so much (neurological maturing) and am off them. ADHD unfortunately isn't easy to diagnose properly so many people are misdiagnosed, its also a popularly abused both by parents who want special rights for their children, teachers use it to deflect blame for unruly students and big pharma loves hooking kids on drugs.

That said, most of the problem is diagnosis. For instance my parents took me to two local (Washington-DC area specialists) for diagnosis and a proper psychologist for medication management. The family physician or General Practitioner should not be doing medication monitoring as they are unlikely to have the training and experience for it.

For a while in High school and College, I was on Ritalin, nasty medication that I stopped taking because it was causing me to have dinner late at night (at college) so I was gaining weight and couldn't force myself to eat lunch. If there was a medication that works well for me and doesn't cause problems like appetite suppression I would use it.

[Zookeeper]

57. If you feel like it would be helpful to treat your ADHD..

with medication, you may want to try an extended release med like Adderall XR or Concerta. Otherwise, many people are having good results with Strattera, which is not a stimulant.

[DavidMS]

67. Once I get my health insurnace sorted out, I will.

Curently I am dealing with the stupid private insurance system. I left my job at Wachovia Securities and am temping untill I can get into the computer field. Needless to say I need a private insurance plan untill I get a more perminant job. Untill then I don't have the money for it.

[LWolf]

32. No.

Never had it, and my kids were not diagnosed. My mom was, at a very late age. No meds, just awareness and some modifications to deal with it.

As a classroom teacher, I have dealt with many cases; a few each year. Most of my students are not medicated; I support parent's efforts to find alternate routes, and we are successful most of the time. There is definitely a difference between an active, lively kid who doesn't like being cooped up at a desk and an ADD or ADHD kid; there is really no comparison.

I support medication for those kids who are not able to find success through various other avenues. I've seen it make a life-changing difference. I don't support medication when other options have not been tried.

[Triple H]

38. I have ADHD and it's getting worse with age.

I have it so bad right now (I'm 22) that I have to go to disability services to take tests and such. I can't even afford to get medication (I have no health insurance or money).

I can't sleep, I can't do my homework, I can't concentrate on much of anything anymore. I need to remedy that problem quick, but that requires money (again, which I don't have).

I've screwed up my college career. I am a very smart person (IQ of 135), but it doesn't show in my schoolwork. In my past semesters, I average about a 2.0 solid, sometimes a little higher, sometimes a little lower.

I'm on my second straight semester of academic probation.

It's a problem that I have a hard time fixing because of the lack of medical insurance/money. It sucks, and it's ruining my life. :cry:

[The Spirit of JFK]

62. You Have Rights

Triple H,

If you are a college student then you should have access to health care through your school's health services. Go there immediately.

And from http://www.help4adhd.org/en/systems/legal/legalissues

Two federal laws -- the Rehabilitation Act of 1973 (RA)1 and the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990 (ADA)2 -- prohibit discrimination against individuals with disabilities in higher education and the workplace. Some state laws may go further than these federal laws in prohibiting discrimination so check with your state government or a legal counsel in student affairs (whom you should have free access to) to determine your rights under state law in addition to the applicable federal laws. Adults with AD/HD may sometimes be eligible for protection and accommodations in higher education and the workplace under these laws.

Under the RA and ADA, most higher education institutions must accommodate qualified individuals with disabilities. It is the student's responsibility to disclose his/her disability to the college and show that s/he is qualified for the program; the college is not required to seek out students with disabilities. The accommodations requested by the student must be both reasonable and necessary because of the particular disability. The institution is not required to make modifications in courses or examinations that would alter the essential nature of its program, or would constitute an undue hardship on the institution.

If you have been diagnosed before, then you need to get the doctor who diagnosed you to give you the diagnosis in writing and then take it to the administration. And again, I would certainly go to health services and talk to someone there as well.

At least promise me you will do this.

[Triple H]

65. I already did it...

I sent papers in and I'm working through disability services for tests and such.

The problem with the university health insurance plan is that they don't cover preexisting conditions. It's pure bullshit and it pisses me off. :grr:

Is what they do legal?

PS>Thanks for the info. I appreciate it. :hi:

[The Spirit of JFK]

69. Legalities..ouch.

Afraid I can't help you much on the legal issues, but I DO know if your school is a public college or university, or accepts federal aid in any way, you have guaranteed rights and protections under the he Rehabilitation Act of 1973 (RA) and the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990 (ADA). But that's about ALL I can tell you. I am sure you can get more information from the local Office of Civil Rights. http://wdcrobcolp01.ed.gov/CFAPPS/OCR/contactus.cfm

As for health insurance and paying for medication, you might be able to use Medicaid (http://www.cms.hhs.gov/medicaid/consumer.asp). If not, there are a few private organizations:

State Pharmaceutical Assistance Programs -http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/drugaid.htm
Needymeds.com - http://www.needymeds.com/
RxAssist - http://www.rxassist.org
HelpingPatients.org - http://www.helpingpatients.org/index.cfm
CHADD Discount Prescription Card - http://www.chadd.org/webpage.cfm?cat_id=7&subcat_id=46

Chadd.org http://www.chadd.org/ is a good general resource as is http://www.help4adhd.org, which is done on conjunction with CHADD and the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Hope this is helpful.

[jpgray]

39. ADD is mostly a cash cow for pharma

Every parent wants to believe their child has it, because the alternative is...?

BAD PARENTING, OR STUPID/LAZY CHILD.

For kids where it is seriously a problem, it's great if the medication helps. But every kid sooner or later will display the 'symptoms'--being bored and inattentive is part and parcel of a kid's daily life. King of the Hill did a great episode on this. :D

[Triple H]

That episode was just on today.

:D

[Triple H]

40. Clicked twice.

Sorry.

[Gman]

44. You apparently did not take the time

to read the personal stories here. People like you with your attitude get in the way of people getting what they need to live full lives.

[jpgray]

58. Feel free to tell me what was so offensive

It's difficult to respond without that.

[Zookeeper]

46. Kick. n/t

[noonwitch]

47. I work with kids and I agree that it is overdiagnosed and overtreated.

Kids have a lot of energy. This is not a bad thing. Medication should only be used in the most severe cases, as a last resort. Even then, the meds should only be for during school hours. Diet changes should be the first step, after enrolling the kid in Little League. More homemade foods (even cookies and such) and less products with corn syrup, food dyes and additives. Fresh fruit and vegetables, instead of canned products.

Schools manipulate parents into putting their kids, especially boys, on Ritalin because they want the kid to be easier to manage. Parents don't want their kid to stigmatized by being placed in an EI classroom, so they go along with it. Prescribing drugs for kids that drastically change the way they feel predisposes them to have drug problems later in life. I'd rather deal with the energetic kid than the drug-addict teenager.

[The Spirit of JFK]

52. Myths

Studies actually show that individuals with ADD who are properly treated with stimulant medication such as Ritalin have a LOWER risk of developing problems with alcohol and other drugs than the general population. And those who AREN'T dealing with their ADD (or don't know they even have it) have a higher tendency to "self-medicate" with alcohol and/or drugs.

Studies regarding diet and ADD are inconlusive at best. Some of the more positive studies deal with minimalizing the symptoms, hyperactivity mostly, in the children that exhibit it (about 2/3). While this can be extremely important, it is not necessarily curative.

[NuckinFutz]

56. maybe you should go home with some of them.

ADHD doesn't go away when they go home. It affects every aspect of the person's life. If left untreated the person is actually in more danger of self-medication later, not to mention other mental issues. The diet might help some, but it's not the best answer for too many people.

[noonwitch]

59. Meds are not a permanent solution, either

The kid needs to learn to channel his or her energy in better ways, and to cope with the tendancy to be easily distracted. It blows my mind that parents would rather have their kids medicated than placed in a classroom geared toward kids with difficult behavior, because they fear the stigma.
Ritalin is a stimulant-when I was in college, students bought it to use when they were studying all night. I think that it is being overused to treat ADD-some kids do need it, but it is being prescribed too frequently for kids who might be better off with a special education setting. If the kid is afraid of the stigma of being in a special education setting, maybe he'll be more motivated to change his behavior and get moved back to regular education. The child is not totally without responsibility for his behavior in this.

[NuckinFutz]

60. From what I've read and seen, usually

both meds and therapy/structure are needed. A lot of folks have trouble learning the coping skills without first having the meds to settle them enough to focus and learn.

It should always be about what is best for the child in question. As I've said before, if the drug treatment concerns parents, they should do their homework and get second, third, fourth, umpteenth opinions.


As for the responsibility aspect, I've been dealing with this with both my sons a lot this year. We've always pushed to make them responsible for their behaviors, and expected them to pay the consequences for not getting things done on time, etc. It's a never-ending battle.

[Snow]

63. Ritalin is a stimulant in adults,

but in kids, like many other meds, it has the opposite effect. Another strange med for kids is benedryl, the antihistamine. They'll frequently get nightmares from that.

[The Spirit of JFK]

64. Would you blame asthmatic...

for not being able to keep up without using medication?

ADD is a neurobiological disorder. Only once the child is aware of their problem and has started counseling and medication, can they really be held accountable.

ADD professionals routinely teach children that ADD is a challenge, not an excuse. Medication corrects their underlying chemical imbalance, giving them a fair chance of facing the challenges of growing up to become productive. Accommodations for the disabled, as mandated by laws, are not ways of excusing them from meeting responsibilities, but rather make it possible for them to compete on a leveled playing field.

And multi-modal educational treatments geared towards kids with ADD never been proven to offer anything more than minimal improvment, and that is WITH medication. So never mind classrooms geared toward kids with difficult behavior...

Until we address the biological, we won't see much change.

[Zookeeper]

71. Maybe Little League should be part of the test for ADD...

My observation is that nothing will bore a kid faster than being in the outfield during a Little League game! My son found many interesting things to do out there, and none of them was watching for the ball. It didn't bother me, but, not surprisingly, it didn't make him a popular member of the team.

[Ilsa]

50. Yes, but which cases are bullshit?

And who decides?

I don't want people second-guessing my family's choices in something like this.

[HEyHEY]

51. I have something to say about this

I have ADD, but my parents didn't want to give me drugs, so consequently I had a terrible time in school. I failed everything all the time. It made my life hell, so I stopped trying. Well, when I got kicked out of summer school I went to boarding school for a summer. The school was based on a 1940s style of teaching. And it was awsome, I got excellent grades. For example, I failed math ten alternate that year....at the Boarding school I got a B in regular math ten and truly understood the material.

My parents couldn't afford to send me there year-round. So I went back to public school. And almost right away began failing everything again.

After highschool (which took me an extra semester to finish) I somehow weaseled my way in to college then university. I got good marks in both (80s and above almost always).

The point is, with the right system ADD can be conquered without drugs. That system is a strict, old school one. University and college were better for me because of the learning structure.
Public schools where I grew up were shit for a kid like me.

[Zookeeper]

54. Kids with ADD really need a lot of structure...

and small class sizes are very helpful. About the best I've been able to manage for my middle-school son is a small school with class sizes limited to 21. The teachers are able to keep the classes calmer and more "on task." He is in the 7th grade, but because it is a small school, they were able to put him in the 8/9 class where he fits academically. That also wouldn't work in a larger school. My daughter is in a different middle school with about 39 per class. I have the impression that it gets fairly wild at times, but she does very well. My son would suffer in that situation.

[Snow]

61. A couple of thoughts from your DU epidemiologist....

one of the more foolish things we in medicine do is diagnose by response to meds. In the case of Parkinson's Disease, this is okay because we're replacing what's missing. We used to think that only ADD or ADHD or whatever DSM is calling it patients responded to ritalin and that was diagnostic. In the words of Oscar the Grouch, ding-dong, you're wrong! Non-add-hd kids also get calmed down by ritalin. So, a rethink is taking place.

Second, about diagnostic differences. There's a disease out there called asthma - do I hear arguments that it doesn't really exist, or is a creation of big greedy pharmacy companies? If so, I'll meet you out back in the alley. Now, for the rest of you, it's well-known that boys tend to get diagnosed more, and African-american boys even more with asthma. The big question is, are they really at higher risk? Well, it turns out that a lot of diagnosis comes from people like teachers, school nurses, or docs in public clinics in poor neighborhoods who expect these kids to have more asthma - so they look for it. This is something we epidemiologists call "diagnostic bias". I guess the rest of you call it that, too, but there it is. So to some degree, the disease is falsely elevated in some segments of the population (or falsely depressed in others). Now, here's the simile with add/hd: this misdiagnosis, ethnic bias does not mean the disease does not exist, yet that argument is often advanced to argue the non-reality of add/hd because it is the same ethnic/gender group that gets hit with the most add/hd diagnoses. Okay? Anyone still want to go out back to the alley with me?