Nonsense about the sacrifice of motherhood

[murdoch]

There was an article in the Boston Globe about childless adults a bit back. One lady wrote a letter in complaint.

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/magazine/articles/2004/03/21/letters

Both the author and the people she interviewed use the word “breeders” to describe the people who have chosen to have children. I do not think there could be a more derogatory word used to describe people who have chosen to sacrifice themselves financially, emotionally, and physically for giving life to another person. The term “breeding” denotes something that farm animals do, not human beings. My husband and I made a decision based on mutual love, respect, and commitment to each other and to God to bring other human beings into this world. I think a better word could have been used to describe the people who have decided to carry on the human race.

Letitia Bottino, Wareham

First - hey lady, you did not sacrifice anything! You made a *choice*. If you don't want a kid - don't have one! You are not a martyr! If it is such a sacrifice for you to have a kid - don't have one!

"The people who have decided to carry on the human race" - hey lady, if you don't decide to have your kid/s - the human race is going to carry on! It is not only carrying on, but growing every year. Adding however many you have to that number is not doing anything special.

Then all the gibberish about commitment to God...ugh.

I get sick of hearing from people like this. You are not some martyr sacrificing everything. If you didn't want to have a kid, you should have never had one! I feel sorry for the kids whose mother tells them what a sacrifice she is making in having them, which she most assuredly will be doing. If it's so much trouble for you - don't do it! You sound like a complainer with a martyr complex, not someone I will be giving the adulation which you are apparently expecting. You popped a kid out, just like six billion other people did - you "carried on the human race", congratulations.

Tired of hearing from people like this!

[hayu_lol]

1. WOW! Speechless....

There seem to be several groups of younger people who are against children, seniors, and whatever else ticks their fancy.

[zanana1]

2. People will have children if they want them.

I don't have kids and when people ask, they usually say something like "Oh, that's too bad", as though I couldn't have any. When I tell them it was by choice, they just don't know what to say. I thought the bad old days were gone when women were nothing but vessels for breeding.

[CBGLuthier]

3. Wow. You are one angry little man aren't you.

I mean, the nerve of this lady to put something you don't like in a magazine.

And how fucking very dare her to talk about her own personal relationship with a god. How fucking dare her. She should be horse-whipped and forced to listen to you talk all day long about how wrong and ugly she is.

[RoyGBiv]

4. How are you on the term "breeder"?

One of my very close friends (over 25 years) went off on a rant quite similar to yours while having dinner with my daughter and me, only he used the term "breeder" repeatedly to disparage those who had chosen to have children.

My daughter now refuses to speak to him, and he doesn't understand why.

I don't quite know what to think about it all. I've become accustomed to him belittling things other people choose to do in which they take some measure of pride. When it's directed at or near me, I generally just ignore it so as not to validate him. But him doing such a thing around my child, seemingly oblivious to the fact he was making her feel worthless and our relationship as father and daughter meaningless, I am left wondering what purpose is of those who use terms like "breeder" and tend to go off on rants about those who have children.

[AngryOldDem]

5. I, for one, find it offensive.

Always have. Sorry if I take umbrage at being compared to a stable animal.

And I don't blame your daughter at all for being offended.

[RoyGBiv]

6. Yeah, me too ...

My friend is a bit of a sociopath I have discovered ... one of those things that's hard for a friend to see unless something happens that slaps one across the face, and that did. (This was all recent, about two months ago.) I haven't been speaking to him much myself either.

[zanana1]

10. I regret having used the term.

What I meant to say was that some people see women as only "breeders". I didn't mean it as an insult to women who have children; only to the people who see them that way.

[AngryOldDem]

14. I understood what you meant.

And, getting back to your point, I think it is just as presumptuous and rude for people to assume that a childless woman or couple is such because of some kind of "defect" that is deserving of some kind of pity or sympathy. Having children is a highly personal choice, and frankly, the reasons behind it are not anybody's business one way or the other.

[RoyGBiv]

15. I don't think you did, did you?

You certainly didn't use it as the individuals I'm questioning have.

You clearly have a valid complaint yourself, and that brings me to the other half of my problem with my friend. He has chosen not to have children. I have always been supportive of that decision, which in realistic terms means it's not an issue at all that we've ever discussed except for the one time he brought it up. Also, I've never in my life asked (nor to my memory even thought) a woman without children "why not?" or "when will you be?" Mostly, it's none of my damn business.

I do not understand why my friend felt it appropriate to criticize in my presence and the presence of my child my decision to have a child, particularly in light of the fact I have never once been critical of any of his life decisions. I don't understand why any of us think it is anyone else's business why we choose to do or not do these things.

[lunatica]

7. Saying 'breeder' is the magic word that gives away the hateful disdain

Why get angry at the woman who reacts to it by daring to be insulted?

This is a conversation that can actually be respectful. Whoever chooses to disrespect people on this issue is the person who has the problem.

[Orrex]

8. I don't mind them using "breeder" as long as they don't mind being called "evolutionary dead ends"

[zanana1]

11. I don't mind being called an "evolutionary dead end".

That was one of the reasons I didn't have children.

[Orrex]

17. See? And thus we achieve harmony.

Problem solved. :)

[seabeyond]

9. of course there are sacrifices made having kids. and you better damn well understand that is part

of the job. not a pat on the back, but a reality.

a sacrifice does not mean martyr, btw

[annabanana]

22. +1 for the Moms & Dads out there. . . . n/t

[Tommy_Carcetti]

12. So you are claiming that this lady is being preachy, and you respond....

...by being preachy.

I agree with the general principle....if you choose to have kids, fine. If you don't choose to have kids, fine. But either way, don't try to come off preachy for either having kids or not having kids. It's much like religion. People will believe in God, or they won't believe in God, and it doesn't bother me personally either way, because that's their own personal belief. But you have the fundamentalists on one side (as opposed to mainstream believers) and the Dawkins-type atheists (as opposed to passive atheists and agnostics) on the other side trying to make themselves to feel better than the other side. In the end, it just turns the whole rational debate into a screaming match and a mockery.

And yes, use of the word "breeders" is a smug, self-righteous comment, and a sign of general douchebaggery. I'm sorry.

[SoxFan]

13. GET OFF MY CHIC BEACON HILL CONDO STEPS, YOU DAMN KIDS!

[JitterbugPerfume]

16. the term "breeder" is offensive

It was no sacrifices to have my children but my function was way beyond being a mere breeder

[Orrex]

18. I also don't mind being called a "breeder" if it's an acknowledgement that I'm hung like a stallion.

[struggle4progress]

19. Don't be mean-spirited

[BlueIris]

20. "Breeder" is possibly the most offensive term for parents in existence.

Awful.

[Lucian]

21. +1

And I don't find the term "breeder" offensive at all. That's all some people are (*cough*Duggars*cough*).

[JohnnyLib2]

23. I see mothers making sacrifices all the time.

Fathers, too.

Of time, of sleep, of personal needs or wishes being deferred and on and on. Yes, the parenthood was a choice, but it certainly isn't the easy road for most!

[tk2kewl]

24. Jackass

Without "breeders" where would you be? :freak:

[jobycom]

25. Bullshit there aren't sacrifices.

My spouse and I had our first kid while I was in grad school, so I stayed home and raised the kid while she continued on in her career. I ultimately gave up grad school in part because of our kid, but I still took the lesser job with the flexible schedule, and passed up other opportunities for a richer career so I could have the flexibility to stay home more hours. Our second kid was/is a borderline discipline issue. She doesn't do well around other kids, and gets angry too easily, and that job allowed me to stay home with her more, and that has helped her over a lot of her anger issues, where tossing her into an aftercare program with the same kids that bullied her and gave her problems in the first place could have easily turned her in the wrong direction.

Yeah, I made a choice and that choice had its own rewards, but there were things I sacrificed to do it. I don't regret them in any way, but society looks down on me more because I made less money than one of my abilities was expected to make. She is a bank VP, I'm a simple bookkeeper, and our friends and family see me as the slacker. My spouse still calls me to get me to "make" one of our kids do something because she can't relate to them the way I can. Things are sometimes sacrificed to be a good parent, and what is gained by that sacrifice can't be quantified in dollar terms, so it is ignored by society, and apparently by people like the OP.

And the term "Breeder" has always sickened me, especially when I see it around here. There are times it works as satire, but it is dehumanizing and it is especially misogynist, and I can't see how any decent person would use it or defend it in general.

[seabeyond]

28. +1 to your whole post.... kept saying, yup, uh hu, so right. true that. nt

[MicaelS]

26. Progressives who denigrate parenthood never cease to amaze me

They call people breeders, or they wrap themselves in their self appointed sainthood of childlessness. The best way to pass on your values is to teach them to a child from birth. Conservatives have been doing it for a very long time. And Progressives wonder why it so hard for people to learn Progressive values. :shrug: :banghead:

[ismnotwasm]

27. I alway respond to certain folks

When these lovely, lovely people tell me "they can't believe" that I'm a grandmother of an eleven year old, that both my daughter and I "were young breeders" It just happens to be true.

I wonder what the writers position is on reproductive choice? I'll just bet she doesn't want anybody to have one and all her high-sounding words are simply there to indicate her superiority over others. Those kind of people *are* breeders in the truest sense. Without reproductive choice, all women are potential breeders in a legal sense.

[fishwax]

29. neither having kids nor not having kids is evidence of moral superiority, but using the term

"breeder" is generally condescending (though there are some contexts in which it may not be). Like most terms intended to dismiss or disparage people who make different choices with their lives, generally counterproductive.

I don't blame the lady for taking umbrage at the term, although I do think her letter is sighted a bit narrowly. Not all parents "have chosen to sacrifice themselves financially, emotionally, and physically for giving life to another person." (I'm not saying that raising children doesn't involve sacrifice, but not all parents are good parents--perhaps the writer would be okay with those people being called breeders.) Also, there are plenty of people who aren't parents who also sacrifice themselves financially, emotionally, and physically to help children as well. And the decision to have a child is not really a decision to carry on the human race, which isn't exactly in danger of disappearing for lack of new recruits.