In the 19th century, many people married their first cousins.

[raccoon]

Queen Victoria and Charles Darwin, just to name two.

And frequently people married their first cousins in 19th century fiction, and nobody seemed to think it was a big deal. For instance, in WUTHERING HEIGHTS Catherine II married successively two of her first cousins.

And yet, now, we hear of it, and we go, "ICK!"

Wonder why the BIG change in social attitudes about this...

(Disclaimer: I'm not married to a first cousin, nor do I wish to. They're either too young or too right-wing.)

[MineralMan]

1. In 26 states in the USA, first cousin marriage is perfectly OK.

All 50 states recognize such marriages when performed in those 26 states.

There are oodles of first cousin marriages in the US.

[Rabrrrrrr]

2. Even into the 20th century - I have many non-branching limbs on my family tree

And I'm not sure, either, why it became such a taboo starting in the 20th century.

I have a couple cousins I think I would have been quite happy with, rowr rowr.

[Bunny]

3. My great-grandparents, who probably married in the 19th century, were first cousins.

My mother has blamed this for everything that's ever gone wrong in our family. :)

[JCMach1]

4. People marry 1st cousins here in the Arab world all the time

However, the genetic issues pile up. People have become more aware of that as blood related diseases have really spiraled out of control in places like the UAE.

[redqueen]

9. I thought it was recently determined to carry no significant risk.

Not sure where I read that, but I do remember reading it not too long ago.

[JCMach1]

11. Thalassemia and other blood diseases are common here...

Essentially any genetic disease would be magnified in a culture that marries cousins in any consistent manner... here one happens to be Thalassaemia. There are so many cases the government had to setup special centers for blood transfusions.


Thalassaemia (American spelling, "thalassemia") is an inherited autosomal recessive blood disease. In thalassemia, the genetic defect results in reduced rate of synthesis of one of the globin chains that make up hemoglobin. Reduced synthesis of one of the globin chains can cause the formation of abnormal hemoglobin molecules, thus causing anemia, the characteristic presenting symptom of the thalassemias.

Thalassemia is a quantitative problem of too few globins synthesized, whereas sickle-cell anemia (a hemoglobinopathy) is a qualitative problem of synthesis of an incorrectly functioning globin. Thalassemias usually result in underproduction of normal globin proteins, often through mutations in regulatory genes. Hemoglobinopathies imply structural abnormalities in the globin proteins themselves.<1> The two conditions may overlap, however, since some conditions which cause abnormalities in globin proteins (hemoglobinopathy) also affect their production (thalassemia). Thus, some thalassemias are hemoglobinopathies, but most are not. Either or both of these conditions may cause anemia.

The disease is particularly prevalent among Mediterranean people, and this geographical association was responsible for its naming: Thalassa (θάλασσα) is Greek for the sea, Haema (αἷμα) is Greek for blood. In Europe, the highest concentrations of the disease are found in Greece and in parts of Italy, in particular, Southern Italy and the lower Po valley. The major Mediterranean islands (except the Balearics) such as Sicily, Sardinia, Malta, Corsica, Cyprus and Crete are heavily affected in particular. Other Mediterranean people, as well as those in the vicinity of the Mediterranean, also have high rates of thalassemia, including people from the middle east and North Africa. Far from the Mediterranean, South Asians are also affected, with the world's highest concentration of carriers (18% of the population) being in the Maldives.

The thalassemia trait may confer a degree of protection against malaria, which is or was prevalent in the regions where the trait is common, thus confering a selective survival advantage on carriers, and perpetuating the mutation. In that respect the various thalassemias resemble another genetic disorder affecting hemoglobin, sickle-cell disease... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thalassemia

[JCMach1]

12. UNHCR on the risks

...Closely-related couples in Syria are choosing to marry even when blood tests detect genetic conditions.

By an IWPR-trained reporter (16-Apr-09)
When she turned 17, Nagham Salahiya's parents announced that they had found a good husband for her - her first cousin.

The couple went to a private clinic for a mandatory pre-marital blood test, which revealed that they both carried a recessive gene for thalassemia, a potentially fatal genetic blood disorder that could affect any children.

Nonetheless, they decided to go ahead with the wedding and married in January this year.

"My family set up this match and it would have shamed them if I refused the man they picked for me," said Salahiya. "I am clinging to the hope that all our children will be born healthy."

Dr Ghassan Qanatri, head of a doctors' association in Idlib in the northwest of Syria, reckons that cosanguinous unions between cousins account for between 35 and 50 per cent of all marriages. Syria's health ministry gives a lower figure of 20 per cent for marriages involving close relatives, a definition that includes first and second cousins.

Whatever the precise figures, Dr Qanatri says there is a close correlation between such marriages and the incidence of birth defects, although accurate statistics on the prevalence of genetic diseases and their link to cosanguinous marriages are thin on the ground.

Last year, a law was introduced requiring couples to produce a medical certificate before they can be legally married. This was aimed at lowering the prevalence of hereditary diseases, particularly blood disorders such as thalassemia and sickle cell anaemia.

Although a couple can still marry if the results show that one or both partners has a genetic condition, Dr Qanatri said the test means they are aware of it and of the potential consequences for children they may have.

In the case of thalassemia, if both parents are carriers of the recessive gene, there is a 50 per cent chance that their child will also carry the gene and a 25 per cent chance that he or she will develop the condition.

"Blood disorders such as thalassemia are painful, crippling, life-long diseases that currently have no cure," said Majid Yaziji, director of the Thalassemia Centre in Idlib city. "Patients require regular blood transfusions and extensive, ongoing medical care."... http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/topic,45a5fb512,45a608be2,49ed6fef1e,0.html

[Gormy Cuss]

14. As JCMACH1 noted, it is a problem when certain genetic diseases are present.

Marrying your cousin is not much of a risk if there are no nasty little recessive disorders coded into your genes, but if there are it can be a different story. There's evidence that close consanguinity in the polygamist Mormon groups has lead to an unusually high rate of fumarase deficiency, for instance.

We're fairly well protected in our mobile society because we tend not to intermarry among close cousins. We'd need to pick a mate by chance who had the same recessive gene, and that happens.

[Xithras]

16. The risk is directly related to how often it happens in your family. If it's rare, there's little.

If I remember correctly, the overall birth defect rate in the U.S. is somewhere around 2%. The birth defect rate for married cousins from a family without a history of that sort of thing is about 3%. The increase is real, but it's tiny.

The only real problem with the practice arises when it occurs in very small communities and happens several generations in a row. If the offspring of you and your cousin marries the offspring of two other cousins, the birth defect rate jumps exponentially. Repeat that a second time with more cousins, and it jumps exponentially again. In only a few generations you can end up with nearly every child being born with some sort of birth defect.

It's important to keep perspective though. Cousin marriages are legal in every country except the U.S. and China, and the world isn't exactly full of inbred deformed children as a result. It's very rare for this to happen a few generations in a row.

[redqueen]

18. Thanks for all the responses.

I remember reading that article at the time, and thinking that there would probably be a push to legalize it in the rest of the states... but I guess that hasn't happened.

[XemaSab]

20. I'm under the impression that the occasional marriage is not a big deal

but when you have generations of first cousin marriages, that's a problem.

[rcrush]

5. But NOT FOR POLAR BEARS DAMN IT

It ruins it for the rest of us!

[old mark]

17. I took a vow in high school to never marry a Polar Bear (catholic high school),

the only vow on abstaining from sexual behavior I have ever been able to keep.

mark

[Xithras]

6. It's an echo of the 19th and 20th century eugenics movements. No joke.

Remember the forced sterilizations of "undesirables" that happened in the U.S.? The attempts to limit reproduction among the "poor and weak"? It was a major campaign that was openly waged throughout much of the western world prior to WW2 by people who wanted to "improve" the human race.

A major part of that campaign was a war against cousin marriages, which were seen by the eugenicists as a practice that reduced genetic variation. There were posters denouncing the practice plastered in public squares, the press and radio media portrayed it as a barbaric practice, and a whole generation of kids was raised to think of it as a "sick" idea.

Eugenics largely lost favor with the public after WW2 when everyone saw the result of it being taken to its extremes, but that mindset was already burned into a generation of Americans, who grew up and passed it onto their kids, and on, and on.

Most Americans aren't aware of this, but we stand almost alone in our disdain for it. Many western nations passed laws against it during the heyday of the eugenics movement, but they've now all repealed those laws. Only two nations still regulate the practice...the United States and China. In the rest of the world, it's considered a little unusual, but it barely raises an eyebrow and it isn't considered to be morally objectionable at all.

[AngryAmish]

7. especially in Shelbyville

[Rabrrrrrr]

10. Yes, those people in Shelbyville are barbarians!

[JTG of the PRB]

23. But our cousins are so attractive!

[Duer 157099]

8. Queen Victoria married Charles Darwin???

And they were cousins???

[JCMach1]

13. I have known people stricken with some of the genetic problems that come up

Trust me you don't want to go there... :(

I had to talk a friend down over just this issue recently as his family trying to arrange a cousin marriage for him to a cousin from a family with 'known' genetic problems. Heart defects... It just isn't worth it.

[jberryhill]

26. If they were gay, though... /nt

[JCMach1]

32. LoL... true, but gay men and women in the Arab world

Also tend to have traditional heterosexual marriages for breeding purposes at least.

[Bucky]

15. Yeah, I'd get freaked out if I found the girl I was dating was even a 4th cousin

[alphafemale]

19. Well...it might simplify the wedding invite list.

Lots of shared relatives there.

I can't see getting the hots for a guy whom my mother and grandma likely both saw naked before I did.

shudder

[XemaSab]

21. I changed the diapers of both of my male cousins

They both have tiny peepees, too. :P

[juajen]

27. Babies tend to have small penises, as they are small. Get it ?

BTW, it doesn't take a large penis to hit a woman's G-spot, just caring and knowledge. That beats size every time.

[soleiri]

33. Who said they were babies when their diapers were changed? nt

[jmm]

25. The list may be simple but how do you decide which side the bride's and the groom's family sit on?

:crazy:

[Ptah]

22. And now, they're all dead.

Be careful out there.

[rurallib]

24. were any of these same sex marriages?

[LostInAnomie]

28. There's a lot of reasons...

... 1. Back in the 19th and early 20th century it was actually pretty rare for someone to have ever traveled further than 100 miles from their home. Many would live their entire lifetime within a 20 mile radius. This really narrows the number of members of the opposite sex you could meet. As our population became more mobile the option became more numerous and people that married their cousins were inbred hicks.

2. Inter-marriage was a good way to secure property along family lines. As laws changed about inheritance and social attitudes changed about women doing business there was no longer a need to make sure that property was passed down to a male member of the family.

I could think of a few more, but it's important to remember that most changes in moral outlooks are really based on people just deciding that the previous behavior was wrong. What actually changes the mores is changing economics and logistics.

[madinmaryland]

29. Yes. I found out I have ancestors that married cousins. I have not finished

tracing finding their lines.

They were three generations before me.

NO, YOU FUCKING VILLAGE IDIOTS, ITS NOT ME!!

:mad:

[Terra Alta]

30. cousin marriage will eventually be accepted once again

But it's still a long ways off. Gay marriage will be accepted first(already is among my generation -- the Millennials). Frankly, I have no problem with any two consenting adults getting married -- as gross as it may sound, even siblings.

[elleng]

31. AND WE'RE STUCK WITH THE MESS!!!!!

[jberryhill]

34. Not true.. Some Republicans Steal Babies From Other Tribes...

...and do not actually reproduce. They do not understand why furtive washroom activities fail to result in offspring.