So, "Vegetarian diets are often associated with a number of health advantages, including lower blood

[Flaxbee]

cholesterol levels, lower risk of heart disease, lower blood pressure levels, and lower risk of hypertension and type 2 diabetes. Vegetarians tend to have a lower body mass index (BMI) and lower overall cancer rates."


I am not a total vegetarian; I occasionally eat fish and I looove eggs (but only if the fish is locally caught and the eggs are from hens treated humanely and vegetarian-fed). I object to meat not so much on health grounds, but because industrial farming is brutal and cruel and inhumane to the creatures we live with side-by-side on this planet. And industrial farming is just as harmful, if not more so, to the planet's climate than all the damn cars we drive around like lunatics dashing from one place to another just to try to pay the rent.


But aside from that. Knowing that a predominantly plant-based diet would make you a healthier person, could you / would you give up 80-90% of the meat you eat on a regular basis?


Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-freston/a-solution-for-diabetes-a_b_312219.html


This might not be appropriate for the Lounge; I don't want to start a flame war or anything. I just hang out here 99.9% of the time ... and I like Loungers. Interested in your thoughts.

[flvegan]

1. Don't mind me.

I'm just going to sit here and watch.

[AlienGirl]

4. Pass the popcorn? nt

[flvegan]

5. Anything for you, my dear.

:popcorn:

[Flaxbee]

7. noooo! I don't want a flame war!

Hope it doesn't turn into one. If it does, and I've gone to bed, will you guys ask for it to be locked?

Wish we could talk about stuff like this here...

[ThomCat]

22. So far, no flame war.

Very nice thread. Thank you Flaxbee! :hug:

[Flaxbee]

8. ...

;)

[CaliforniaPeggy]

2. My dear Flaxbee...

And you too, my dear flvegan...

I hear these data, and I think it's wonderful, all those health benefits.

And then I remember how much I love a good steak, or broiled fish, or chicken...

And I just can't do it.

More power to those who can!

No flames from me, sweetie...

:hug:

[Flaxbee]

10. hi CaliforniaPeggy!

How are you these days? :hug:

I used to love filet mignon, a good hamburger, fish tacos, etc. But I've read too much and seen too much and I can't do it anymore.

And gradually, I have lost the taste for it.

Overall, though, aside from my conscience attacking me, it just seems we'd be a much healthier group of people if we ate less meat (and less high fructose corn syrup, less salt, less sugar, etc....)

But I certainly am not sitting in judgment. Just wondering, really. Life is to be enjoyed, but I wonder what the balance is - where, when, how enjoyment overrides health concerns, humane concerns, etc.

If the way we eat makes life worse for other humans, would we change our habits? Is it because the way we eat makes life worse for 'animals' that we don't care? Speaking as liberals, not as Americans (knowing the US's history for consuming way more than our fair share of resources). Is it part of being a liberal to deprive ourselves of things we might otherwise enjoy for the sake of the planet? Why do some people drive hybrids but eat tons of steak? Why do we choose what behaviors we'll alter, and what ones we won't? :shrug:

:hi:

[CaliforniaPeggy]

12. I'm really good, thanks, sweetie!

My marriage is good, I'm having a ball with my poetry, and life is generally wonderful right now!

Your questions are all good ones, and I have no real answers for them.

I hope someone does!

:hug:

[Mojambo]

3. Give up 80-90% of the meat I eat? No.

But I would be willing to cut my consumption of meat by up to half.

Meat is just too delicious to give up mostly entirely, but I do think it would be a good idea to eat less of it.

[Flaxbee]

14. what would move you to cut your consumption?

:shrug:

Better recipes? Better choices at restaurants?

[Mojambo]

15. To cut my consumption beyond the 50%?

I'm not sure. I really enjoy eating meat.

I've had plenty of vegetarian recipes. They're all delightful.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that I simply want meat to be a part of my diet. A smaller part, yes, but definitely in there.

[Flaxbee]

16. you know, the one item that is hardest for me to resist is...

lamb. Won't do it, can't do it, but when having Lebanese or Indian food, it is (was) hard for me to avoid because it just seems to be an integral part of the cuisine.

I just meant what it'd take to cut your consumption by 50% ... what you'd said you'd be comfortable doing.

[Mojambo]

18. Oh

I suppose it would just take a bit more effort.

I'm only just learning to cook for myself. It's a job for me to put together rather mainstream meat based meals at this point. I feel like delving into vegetarian cooking at this point would be like skipping a grade.

The thing I should really be focusing on is cutting my portion sizes with regard to meat.

[kentauros]

19. Have you ever watched any of Jamie Oliver's shows?

He started out with the show "The Naked Chef" (I don't remember why it was called that) and has had other good shows. I really like "Jamie at Home". Though I don't eat meat, his use of flavorings and seasonings gives me ideas for cooking vegetables. You might learn something watching, though I highly recommend recording the shows. He's got a lot of energy and goes pretty fast! It's fascinating watching his expertise and you can't help but learn ;)

[Kali]

6. No I would not give up 80 to 90% of the meat I eat.

Eat like the rest of the world - use meat as a side or flavoring part of your meals. Save the big slabs for special occasions. Meat can be a perfectly good, delicious, healthy food. Its the western-style binging like a college student at a frat party that is really bad.

[Flaxbee]

11. If we had more of a Mediterranean or Asian style diet

where, as you say, we didn't eat huge slabs of meat piled on top of or next to huge piles of starch, we would be healthier.

And again, it's not so much the "meat" part of the diet I object to, it's the way we obtain meat / how we treat the animals we eat before we eat them.

[kentauros]

9. I've been veggie for over 8 years now.

I gave it all up at the beginning of the millennium (2001) , though I had given up red meat almost ten years prior to that (it was upsetting my stomach too much.) Unfortunately for me, my BMI is not low because I'm a sugar addict.

I remember in the early years of it dreaming of eating meat, but I noticed in a recent dream when that came up that I was as disgusted by the thought of eating it as I am when awake :D

[Flaxbee]

13. yeah, I gave up red meat long before I phased out chicken

and fish.

:hi:

What's your sugar weakness? Anything in particular? I have a problem with brownie-based sundaes, and pie. But the quality of so much of the food at the local grocery store has really deteriorated; unless I make a dessert myself it's just not worth it. And I'm too lazy to bake a lot (and my husband has asked me to not bake too much...) so I have managed to wean myself off sugar just through laziness. :D

[kentauros]

17. Sodas and desserts

I try to get sodas that are made with sugar instead of HFCS, but can't always find Dublin Dr Pepper ;)

I can bake desserts (pastry background) but get lazy, so end up buying stuff like Clif Bars, Newman-O's and dark chocolate. When I eat out (like tonight) it's cake or cheesecake, so long as the latter is dense and crumbly. I'm picky about cheesecake. I do love Mediterranean food, so for the sweets it's either baklava or namoura (a syrup-drenched semolina cake) :9

[MajorChode]

20. Correlation does not imply causation

Vegetarians are generally more health conscience than non-vegetarians. It's not a stretch to assume they live a healthier lifestyle than non-vegetarians on average and the alternative leads to all the adverse things you mentioned regardless of diet.

Becoming a vegetarian won't do you much good if you still weigh 300lbs and sit around all day watching TV and eating Cheetos.

[ThomCat]

21. That does not change the fact that just changing your diet

by itself is one of most important things you can do to improve your health.

Yes, getting more exercise should also be part of the equation if at all possible. For some people, because of sedentary jobs and family duties, or disabilities like mine, or whatever other reasons, just can't get that exercise. We are sedentary and just sit around whether we like it or not. A vegetarian/Vegan diet is all we have.

But let's not it. It's a great step in the right direction. In this case, this one step all by it self is causation for a lot of good changes. It lowers your risk for a lot of major health problems, such as many cancers, diabetes, heart disease, and many others.

Just make sure you have a well balanced vegetarian diet, and don't live on meat substitutes, cheese and carbs. Replacing a very limited omnivore protein and carbs diet with a very limited vegetarian protein and carbs diet isn't going to help anyone. Becoming a vegetarian or vegan means eating a wide ranging plant based diet.

[MajorChode]

25. I agree that a healthy diet is always a good idea

However, it doesn't have to be a vegan diet in order to be healthy. So I can't agree that a vegan diet is all you have. If that's your choice, there's nothing wrong with it, but it's not the only one that can accomplish the goals you mentioned.

[old mark]

23. I don't believe one type of diet would be good for every single person in the world.

I have been on a doctor ordered high protein low carb diet for over a month, because I don't metabolize carbs well. I am slowly losing weight and feel better than I have for a long time.

If it works for you, I'm happy for you, but it's not for me.

mark

[stray cat]

24. I know vegetarians who don't eat vegetables - just processed food mainly empty carbs

It depends on your diet not whether you are a vegetarian. The low calorie people who eat least than 1000 calories per day or fewer also avoid health problems - should we all be required to follow their diet?

[MidwestRick]

26. Nope

I love meat too much. I stay away from the high fat types, but to give up grilled chicken, lean turkey or a nice steak from time to time...that's not going to happen. If it works for you, that is wonderful. *cheers*

[SidneyCarton]

27. No.

I eat too much meat, and cutting it by 30-50% is possible, but I'm not cutting it out of my diet that much.

[unpossibles]

28. already did. I think some things would have to happen first

For one thing, we'd rethink how we look at meat culturally. A lot of people think eating meat is a manly/macho thing, and would refuse to not eat 4 helpings per meal because they don't want to appear to be 'girly.' I wish I were joking about that one. Look at the quadruple burger ads and such for examples of this, and how marketing pushes this further and further.

Also, we would have to start being exposed to more veggie meals/options as not lacking something. Many cultures eat meat far more moderately and don't really seem to think twice about it, either by eating meals without, or by having more reasonable portions. This is another way we could be more responsible eaters, not just in meat consumption, but in consumption in general. Our restaurants serve giant portions, and largely that's what people seem to want. A solution could be what many Italian and Chinese restaurants offer: two portion sizes for many dishes.

It's complicated because while I agree 100% this is an important issue, it's also one people don't like to feel pushed into.

[Akoto]

29. I could not do so.

Of course, it's exactly because of my health, which makes me an unusual case. Between IBS-C and chronic pelvic pain, digesting any excessive amount of ruffage causes me immense agony. I'll have small portions of fruit or vegetables with dinner - the kinds I find easiest to process - but to make it 80-90% of my diet would be unimaginable. I live on chicken, which does not provoke the same problems.

[hippywife]

30. We already have,

See "In Defense of Food" by Michael Pollan. :hi:

[RadiationTherapy]

31. Improving my eating habits has been the single most transformational choice I have made.

And I have made many transformational choices.

[susanr516]

32. I tried to cut out all red meat

After a week, I had to have a steak. Beef is what I can't seem to give up. I might be able to go meatless 5 days of the week. I probably could reduce my meat consumption by 75%. The biggest obstacle is that my husband can not eat more than a few bites of raw vegetables or too much non-soluble fiber, which makes going vegetarian/vegan a little more challenging.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

33. i have drastically reduced my meat intake for more or less those reasons

i would not however give it up