americaforum.net (publicised here) mods calling the left "nazis"

[mouse7]

Normally, what happens at another internet message board wouldn't matter, however, this particular board was allowed to advertise here because they were promising they would be different in their behavior towards progressives.

It's not. The moderators are just like the moderators in freeperland.

Here's the thread whith the links that show everything degenerating...

http://www.americanforum.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=153

It my opinion they only want progressive there to be meek Alan Combes like target for their Hannity rants. You can decide for yourself.

I would suggest considering going back to banning at least this board from publicising itself here.

[BigDaddyLove]

1. I guess one sees what the right was pissed of about when......

it was so in vogue to refer to Bush as Hitler.

[el_gato]

3. Prescott Bush helped finance the 3rd reich

so the comparison is valid

not to mention all the other parallels such as lying to justify invasions, demonization of parts of the populace, etc. etc.

[BigDaddyLove]

4. Bullshit........

The comparison is nonsense.

[el_gato]

5. bs just because you say so? I don't think so.

but you can act outraged if you want to I DON'T CARE.

[BigDaddyLove]

7. I'm not outraged, though you seem to be.......

caps and all that.

[el_gato]

21. you are the one cussing not me

[BigDaddyLove]

37. You're right........and I apologize.

.

[Breezy du Nord]

29. My grandfather was a racist

Pure and simple, he used the word "nigger" frequently. By your logic, I'm a racist, because my grandfather was one. That is BS, because I am not a racist. so calling Bush a nazi because his grandfather may have been one is also a crock of shit.

That brings me to this: You're forcing me to defend a man I didn't think I would EVER want to defend. I dislike Bush as much as the next person with a brain, but calling him a nazi using that reason is, as BigDaddyLove said, bullshit.

[mouse7]

6. Rush started using term "femi-nazi" 20 years beforehand.

It was an ugly insult then. It's an ugly insult now.

[BigDaddyLove]

8. Ugly and useless, I agree.......

which is why I think it's dumb for either side to throw it around.

[el_gato]

22. the parallels should be examined as well as the connections

it's not a baseless insult to investigate these issues

And it's not just throwing around insults a la "feminazi"
to look into the financing of the 3rd reich by western capitalists
such as Ford, Dupont, and Bush.

It's an issue that should be discussed.

[BigDaddyLove]

24. Who should you discuss it with?

Where will you get with it?

Bush is a lot of things, but a Nazi is just not one of them.

[el_gato]

33. are you saying

that Prescott bush did not have property seized in 1946 under the Trading With the Enemy Act?

Are you saying that lying about external threats in order to justify an invasion is not a tactic used by both hitler and bush?

Are you saying they have not systematically demonized entire segments of our society for the purposes of political manipulation just like hitler?

You get my point.

[BigDaddyLove]

38. Of course I get your point........

but I have no idea how what Prescott Bush had seized in 1946 has anything to do with George W. being Hitler.

Of course Bush lied in order to get us into a war that he wanted us to get into....still doesn't make him a Nazi.

When Japanese Americans were interred in prison camps during WW2 (which is one Hell of a lot closer to ACTUAL Nazi activity) were parallels drawn between Roosevelt (A Democrat) and Hitler?

[PROGRESSIVE1]

2. I would like to join "mouse7" in asking that "americanforum.net"...

NOT be allowed to be advertised here at Democratic Underground.

:dem:

[supernova]

9. Heh.

I think you do have to have a thick skin over there. Maybe even thicker than for GD2004 or the Gungeon. :scared:

On a lighter note. I responded to a thread in their editorials section about a conflated piece from a "columnist" tying together the Presbyterian Church USA and Moveon.org. :wtf: The article then proceeded to really talk about PSUSA's opposition to the partial-birth abortion ban.

I notice no one has had to guts to respond to me since saturday, including the "columnist."

Mouse7, I think you have to pick your battles. Suggesting that mods be removed probably won't get you anywhere. Just make sure that you stick to the forum rules and they can't get you.

[mouse7]

13. I don't go to right wing websites looking for flame wars.

I never would have even looked twice at the site if it hadn't been advertised in here, and there hadn't been a promise of respect being given to members. They said it was going to be different over there, and it's not.

There's LOTS of places I can go to and get in a raging flame war. I can give what I get in those circumstances just fine. I know all about having "thicker skin" in those situations.

This forum was not advertised as a place to get in a good raging flame war. It was supposed to have moderators that were going to control that mess. Instead, some of the mods are the most inflammitory people on the board.

I went there because people here said it was a calm place to have a discussion. That is clearly not true.

[gulfcoastliberal]

10. They are Soooooo Wrong!

Nazi = Socialist is a fallacy, just like "compassionate conservatism". The Nazi's were corporate fascists, just like Mussolini's Italy. Government in Nazi Germany was run by corporations -- the government existed to serve corporations, not the people. And guess what corporations ruled? Yup, the military-industrial complex. Just like what's happening here. Just because the word "national socialists" was used by the Nazi's does not mean that they were "real" socialists as we understand the word today. They were corporatists. Shows how much those dumbasses know about history. I agree, they are idiots and there's no reason DU should accept advertisements from such morons. Read their responses to mouse. They make no sense at all.

If you don't believe it, just run a google search of nazi+corporatism and educate yourself. That's what the dumbfu*k moderators should do over at americanforum.

edited for spelling

[supernova]

12. Agreed.

The real problem in this debate is Hitler's skewed use of the term "socialist".

[Touchdown]

56. Not to toot my own horn...

But I responded to that Nazi=Socialist crap twice on that thread alone. And my words look amazingly like yours.

Give a guy a little credit here...I (Borneo) was right there, and I kind of resent the omission. "Read their responses to mouse. They make no sense at all."...Am I to be included as one of "them"?

[EV1Ltimm]

11. Well, we're obviously a bunch of nazis...

i mean, we all have an irrational hatred of homosexuals and minorities and are hell-bent on global domination... right?

[reprehensor]

14. Looks like Freeperville to me.

We should take up a collection for tin-foil hats. God knows they need some over there. I think that's where Tom Tommorow gets his 'clear-eyed conservative' jargon from...

[GreenPartyVoter]

15. They need to review their history.

Just because Hitler used the word "socialist" when naming his regime does not mean he was an actual socialist. :eyes:

[HuckleB]

16. Good point.

I hope you passed this directly to the mods at DU.

Thanks.

[mouse7]

17. I did.

Thanks :)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

18. Heh. I hate to say this (nah, I don't really) but...

I TOLD YOU SO

[mouse7]

19. ROFLMAO!

Yes, you did. You've officially earned the right to say "I told you so" in 20 pt type.

I think I'll go back to keeping my off-DU message board traffic confined to the Tigers forum at MLB.com

[TrogL]

20. Pretty much what I predicted

[Breezy du Nord]

23. That guy apparently doesn't notice the subtle difference

between beinga socialist and exterminating a few million people.

However, I don't think you should judge the whole site by the actions of a few. I think it could turn out to be alright if we get enough DUers there.

[BigDaddyLove]

25. Neither do many notice the difference between being........

a Republican and exterminating a few million people.

Neither comparison works.

[mouse7]

27. Republicans have exterminated 10,000 needlessly in Iraq

And they want to continue to invade Syria, Iran, Lebanon, and Saudi Arabia.

At what point does one stop looking at civilian casualties as collateral damage, and start looking at them as needless slaughter?

I would have thought that point had been reach when we realized there was no WoMD to justify an invasion.

[BigDaddyLove]

31. Not only that, but I'll bet a fair amount of Nazi's liked.......

chicken; Republicans like chicken.....the similarities are eerie.

[mouse7]

34. You did not answer my question

At what point does one stop looking at civilian casualties as collateral damage, and start looking at them as needless slaughter?

I would have thought that point had been reach when we realized there was no WoMD to justify an invasion.

[BigDaddyLove]

36. Collateral damage is ALWAYS needless slaughter........

but that STILL doesn't make Bush Hitler and the Republicans Nazis.

[mouse7]

39. Fair enough.

As long as you recognize the civilian deaths in Iraq were needless, we can get along.

[bobthedrummer]

40. Real Nazis found a political home in the RW of the Republican Party

They were recruited secretly and given identities and jobs as Americans working in national security.
http://www.spiritone.com/~gdy52150/ratlines.htm

An unknown number of these Nazis were brought here to battle godless communism, many of them were war criminals. One of the programs that recruited them was called Operation PAPERCLIP.
http://www.goordnance.apg.army.mil/OPpaperclip.htm

http://www.infoage.org/paperclip.html

http://www.dc.peachnet.edu/~shale/humanities/composition/assignments/experiment/paperclip.html

Some of the Bush family wealth comes from the Holocaust.
http://globalresearch.ca/articles/ROG309A.html

http://www.spiritone.com/~gdy52150/bushies.htm

I call the neo-cons and George W. Bush fascists, not Nazis, fair enough??

Prescott Bush merely continued with the Bush/Walker families other tradition of trading with the enemy, just like with the bin Ladens and BCCI IMHO.

[BigDaddyLove]

42. You may refer to them anyway you see fit........

but if you insist on sticking with the Fascist moniker then you'll find yourself debating and discussing it with yourself more often than not, as most people in this country see the ridiculousness of it.

Knock yourself out.

[bobthedrummer]

47. There are a growing number of anti-fascist websites

and a strong group of anti-fascist researchers right here at DU-I'm certainly in good company and not isolated.

Bush, PNAC, the neo-conservatives are fascists IMO.

[BigDaddyLove]

49. There are also a growing number of child pornography websites

and conspiracy theory websites and cookie recipe websites.

Good luck though with the Fascist angle though.

I'll stick to the good old stand by; Bush and the Republicans are fucking this country up and need to go.

[mouse7]

26. Not when the mods are the ones acting the worst

If it was just a few outlandish members, it would be one thing. However, it's the moderators that are acting the worst of all. A board always follows the example of it's moderators. The site is going to be nothing but a right wing flame zone just like freeperville or the Yahoo message boards.

[Breezy du Nord]

30. Link

<http://americanforum.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=163>

Looks like they've decided to adress the problem.

[mouse7]

32. I just saw that. AF OWNER FIRED ALL MODERATORS!

The issue sat on the board for a day and a half without the owner saying a word. It's not unreasonable to come to a conclusion that when a board owner allows something to happen for 36 hours without saying a word about it, he is allowing the behavior to continue.

But he brought the hammer down. Good. A little late, but maybe there might be some hope for the place.

[Bertha Venation]

35. Maybe I'll check it out again, then, over the weekend.

Thanks for the update, mouse & all.

[supernova]

45. Sounds promising

We'll see.

[Bertha Venation]

28. I agree. DU should stop allowing AF

to advertise here unless its mods get neutral.

This is one of the reasons I haven't been back there. I've lost all hope for it being a safe place for both "sides" to discuss things without all the rancor.

[Blue-Jay]

41. Honestly, I'd like the guy that posted the invitation to respond.

Keep this kicked. I was getting around to joining, but if their moderators don't know the meaning of the root word in their title, I'll just pass.

[Breezy du Nord]

43. They've fired all mods

Until further notice. (see my post above)

[Blue-Jay]

44. Ah. Good.

/needs to read the entire thread next time.

[Kamika]

46. Well I registred

That place is a bomb waiting to go off

[Kathy in Cambridge]

48. That place isn't nearly as fun as DU

seems like there's a lot of right-wing blowhards there. It's bad enough their kind is on the media outlets everyday without having to read their crap.

[HuckleB]

50. True, but it's also very new.

The population could change. The "proprietor" responded to Mouse's concerns quite well today. So there is hope for the place.

[PVnRT]

51. That is exactly why

liberals need to start participating on boards like that, brand-new, so that they won't just be right-wing dittofests like freerepublic.

[HuckleB]

52. Yes, we have a chance to create a culture there that might be different.

I tell you, though, it's difficult staying on task. The debate is so dull right now. So many posters are so uninformed. They can't mount a debate to save their lives. Ugh.

[PVnRT]

53. I know it's boring...

But we have to try.

I get tired of liberals whining about "freepers" but don't want to even try to go after them. It seems way too many would rather just go stand in a group in the corner and argue amongst themselves.

[HuckleB]

54. I'm trying.

I'm Athos... over there, by the way.

[PVnRT]

55. Guess who I am

n/t

[Touchdown]

57. I'm doing my best over there.

Notice that only one of the dozen or so Libertarians posted on my Libertarian thread?

I saw a few posts from these guys, before signing up (as Borneo) felt a little percieved intelligence there, but when I started engaging them, perception went way out the window. Not a one substantiated remark by any right winger there. Come on people...These guys are all bark, not one bite amongst them.

It's a brand new site. There's going to be growing pains. I say give it a chance. I've already gotten of respectful speaking terms with "Republitarian" over there. It's the off2cDaWiz is the real dipshit freeper there. I slam him every time without even breaking a sweat.

[Touchdown]

58. 2 new bans for your pleasure Mouse...

All comparisons to posters and Nazis are banned.

And...off2cDaWiz can't use his trademark "Dummycrats" line anymore. Of course, we can't use Rethuglicans either, but that's a small price to pay.

Chin up. Give it a chance. Every site goes through growing pains, and this new Admin seems to really want to make good. See ya over there. It's good to have a tag teamer like you.