What's with all the outrage about "defacing the flag"?

[latebloomer]

here at DU? Thought I was on a freeper site for a minute.

No, I couldn't care less about the SuperBowl nor Kid Rock, but why all the outrage about him wearing a flag? BFD.

[afraid_of_the_dark]

1. It was a violation of flag code...

cutting a hole in the middle of the flag for one's head, strutting on stage wearing it, and then tossing it on the ground halfway through his set - I could see it as being perceived disrespectful.

[arwalden]

4. Flag Worshippers Just Wreck My Nerves...

It's just a piece of cloth. It's not actually "alive". It has no magical power. It's not as though he had raided the Smithsonian and was using the ACTUAL ORIGINAL HISTORICAL "Star Spangled Banner".

-- Allen

P.S. I have to laugh at all the flag-worshippers who have tattered shreds of the American flag flying from their automobiles. Sun-faded and ratted-down edges... worn all the way back to the blue field. "Long may she wave!"

[afraid_of_the_dark]

6. Worship - no. Respect - yes.

There's definitely a difference.

BTW... I agree that you have to laugh at those outspoken defenders of the sacredness of the American flag who have the cheapy Wal-Mart car window flags that are all ratted and faded. To me, THAT's disrespectful. I'm offended. :P

[CO Liberal]

10. I Agree!!!!!

All the attention is going to Janet Jackson's boob, while ignoring the boob who desecrated the flag.

[afraid_of_the_dark]

12. Kid Rock was lucky...

I figured the flag stunt would have been the most-talked about event of the Super Bowl (because it sure wasn't going to be the team that actually won it) - until the whole Janet incident. Looks like he got away with one...

[DemLikr]

20. The flag never touched the ground. A backup musician caught it in the air

and passed it to the rear of the stage.

Not that actual FACTS should enter into a flag-abuse rant.

[CO Liberal]

22. Where it Was Dropped On the Stage Floor

Flag Desecration Part II.

[afraid_of_the_dark]

26. My bad...

I guess I missed that. I thought I saw him chuck it on the floor.

[beyurslf]

21. He didn't throw it on the ground. Someone was behind him and caught it.

[bowens43]

2. Hardly surprising considering

the number of people here who feel it's a good idea to turn the leadership of our civilian government over to a general.

[Bertha Venation]

7. How's that?

First, how are the two related?

Second, is Wes Clark the first general to run for president? No? Okay, then: What happened to the United States when other former generals became presidents?

[Richardo]

8. Yeah, that George Washington guy was a real washout...

Eisenhower - no ability there either.

:eyes:

[CO Liberal]

13. Then There Was Andrew Jackson and Ulysses S. Grant...

And wasn't Teddy Roosevelt a military man?

[Richardo]

19. Yes - but not a General...

Bully!

[Loonman]

3. Bad form

That sort of stuff is frowned upon.

I also thought it was innapropriate.

[HereSince1628]

5. So like, was someone playing football yesterday?

I guess I missed that.

[TheMightyFavog]

9. I have a question...

Are the flag worshipers themselves shitting cinder blocks over this?

[Aristus]

11. God, no!

Nowadays, wearing the flag, sporting a tattered, filthy flag on your SUV, wearing a flag do-rag, using the flag to advertise shit like Wal-Mart...that's patriotism, man! It's only the people who don't shamelessly wave the flag to cover misdeeds who are unpatriotic.

<sarcasm off>

[afraid_of_the_dark]

14. I haven't seen a single article on it...

heard anything about it on the radio OR on TV. However, the Janet-boob "un-"coverage was on this morning's news (censored, of course).

[arwalden]

15. What's Wrong With Me?? I'm Not Outraged...

really... it doesn't bother me at all. Am I any less patriotic because it doesn't anger me to the very core of my being?

-- Allen

[ugarte]

16. I'm with you

It's just a piece of cloth, not a religious icon, although there do seem to be a lot of people who worship it.

[lovedems]

18. I am with you too.

I think the republicans desecrate the flag when they wear them on their jacket lapels and then lie to send 130,000 troops to fight a war.

What Kid Rock did is not desecration, what the republicans do is.

[DemLikr]

17. couldn't agree more, latebloomer. The older I get, the more I enjoy

ANYTHING that shakes up folks' gut reactions to things.

For instance, what if Kid Rock's "flag" had just been a piece of cloth which he carefully colored to "resemble" a "real" flag?

Does a flag have to be made in a John Ashcroft-approved flag factory in order to qualify as a "real" flag worthy of federal regulation to protect it from abuse? :eyes:

[arwalden]

23. Instead of stars it could be white dots on a blue field...

And the stripes could have started off as "white-red/white-red" instead of "red-white/red-white". And they could have been at an angle.

When draped over a head, or hung loosely from a pole, the differences would be barely discernible to the eye that ONLY FOCUSED on the sheer HORROR of seeing it go up in flames.

Do these folks also believe that burning an effigy of Bush* is the "same thing" as actually burning Bush*? The Catholics have a word for that... it escapes me right now... trans-something.

[TheMightyFavog]

25. The word you are looking for is

Transubstantiation.

[arwalden]

28. Yes. Thank you!

[afraid_of_the_dark]

30. And that's not technically accurate metaphor (but I'm just being nitpicky)

In transubstantiation, the Host becomes not a mere symbol but actually the Body of Christ while retaining its original wafer-like form.

Whether or not you actually believe that is up to you, but your other examples seem to indicate more of a symbolic relationship to the original object than an actual embodiment of the new object by the original.

[Hubert Flottz]

24. No it just has to be made in Red China to be legit!

Worship NO! Respect HELL YES!

[TheMightyFavog]

27. Anybody up for

checking the websites of the flag worshipers to see if they are saying anything about this?

I'd do it myself, But I have class in 10 min.

[rasputin1952]

29. Re-Rant...

As for "Kid Rock" and the flag; I found it utterly tasteless.

I am not a "flag worshiper", but I have seen far too many men and women carried to their graves under that banner, to see it be used as a cheap trick by a flash-in-the-pan huckster with no talent!

I served under that flag; I have always been proud of what it stands for: LIBERTY! I have fought under it, I have fought for it. Every time I see it, I think of how much further we have to go before true equality is the norm, as opposed to what we have now.

I have come in from the field to see the colors flying high and proud, and I have fought for the rights of others to burn it in protest. It is a powerful symbol, and I do not take it lightly.

Begrudgingly, I must say "Kid Rock" had the right to wear it, but that sure as hell doesn't mean I have to accept it!


My father, and my stepfather both were carried to their graves draped by the Colors. Someday, my son will receive the flag that will take me to my grave.

Flame me if you will.....but I have great respect for that 'piece of cloth"; it stands for everything I believe in; LIBERTY, FREEDOM, HOPE, and a better world where people can come together and be treated humanely!

Rant over!

O8)

[afraid_of_the_dark]

31. Well said.

I think you've hit on the difference that I think is causing the discomfort: it doesn't seem that Kid Rock was wearing the flag to protest, or to be particularly patriotic, but rather as a publicity stunt and/or part of his act. Perhaps that is more disturbing than the actual "wearing" of it.

[latebloomer]

32. That sounds about right!

Personally I'm all for defacing the flag as an act of protest.

But it sounds like this Kid Rock character is a dipshit. looking for attention.

[olacan]

34. Good

comments rasputin1952, I served 23 in the Air Force, and the way I see the flag displayed and used sometimes makes me sick. I have the one I was presented when I retired hanging among other items from my career.
I am not a football fan so I did not hear about this until I was reading notes on-line today. If someone wants to burn the flag I have come to the point in my life where I accept the fact that they have the right. However if they are trying to get me to listen to their point of view it WILL NOT happen. I have a lot respect the flag and no I do not worship it but when I look at with any thought at all I know that a great many men and women have given a lot to ensure it continues to fly.
We do a special service at my church for the 4th of July and all of the veterans come to the front of the church as their service anthem is played. I tell you to be standing there with veterans from WW II, Korea, VN and have over a thousand people give a standing ovation, well let me say I choke back tears to be there. So yes it is a piece of cloth but what it represents is what I showing respect and honor for.

[trof]

33. If it's OK for George*...

While inspecting a military base in Michigan on July 23, U.S. President George W. Bush* signs with his favorite Sharpie signing pen on a mini-national flag waved by a fervent supporter.

[afraid_of_the_dark]

35. I thought that was disgusting as well...

I remember when that happened, and I wasn't exactly thrilled about it at the time. What a wonderful example he set for the rest of us! :eyes:

[Hubert Flottz]

36. Bush has no respect for the flag, the country, or the people!

His Mom and Dad were too stupid and greedy to teach him respect!