Higher education is a racket...

[BuelahWitch]

Expanding on the "I paid X for these textbooks thread," I think that many of the requirements needed to graduate are full of crap. Why does a pre-med student need to take history? Why does an English major need biology? And what good does algebra do for a film studies major? Yes, yes, I know, it gives you a well rounded education, but shouldn't we have gotten that in high school? With school costs rising and student aid evaporating, I think academia needs an overhaul....

BTW. I'm a good student and I really love school, I just hate wasting time and racking up student loan debt.

[philosophie_en_rose]

1. I'm with you. Higher ed is such a racket.

I actually don't mind taking a variety of classes.

But I hate are textbooks that come out with a new edition every quarter, so that you can neither buy a used book or sell your book at the end of the quarter.

I hate going to pointless "Intro to such and such" required seminars in Internet Searches, etc.

I hate having to pay for gym and activity fees that I'll never use.

[BuelahWitch]

7. Textbooks are bad

There's one class that's required for everyone at my school. The book is over $100 (not bad, I know, but if you're broke, it is). When I tried to sell it back at the end of the semester I was told that they don't ever sell used ones for THAT ONE REQUIRED CLASS. I got $3 back for the book I paid $100 for.

[philosophie_en_rose]

10. Amazon.com and Ebay are great for used textbooks.

I refuse to sell books back to the textbook mafia. $100 is a terrible price for a book that you can never use again.

[hfojvt]

42. because you are lazy!!!!

Put up a notice on a bulletin board in a dorm or student union or something and sell it directly to another student for $50.

Sheesh, what do they teach you in college? Anyway? :evilgrin:

[Telly Savalas]

34. The rapid advances in introductory Calculus necessitate new editions

of the texts to be published every couple of years.

[XemaSab]

45. Right....

:eyes:

[StellaBlue]

2. I agree

While I wouldn't trade the time and knowledge for anything, I agree, it's a racket. For those of us not getting medical, law, IT, or engineering degrees and the like. I could've learned as much for free at the public library if I was so inclined (I have a BA and MA in English).

I will NOT save money toward my kids' college education; I will have them think it all out very carefully before embarking on the path to lifetime debt that I am on. I will encourage them to take a year or so off to travel and volunteer and work in dead-end jobs to get a feel for what the world is really like, as many Europeans do. Also, the Europeans typically take only three years to do a bachelors degree, and only take classes related to their 'subject', or major.

[BuelahWitch]

11. I remember someone telling me about the schools in Europe

and how they don't require all that.

[JVS]

41. They require that you actually know the stuff well coming out of HS

European (or at least German) universities generally have starting-courses that would look like courses within the major for juniors and seniors. For example, the math department at the German university that I attended did not offer any courses in calculus. That is because college bound students in Germany are expected to know calculus.

[Kellanved]

43. Hardly comparable

To even attend an university, one has to go through three years of pre-academic HS. That period is supposed to cover most of the basics.
But even so: it might be possible to get a degree without venturing far beyond the chosen field, but it is not encouraged. HR people expect a solid and wide education nowadays.

[hfojvt]

44. ironically enough

there I was sitting in the woods, doing this and that. Then I found out that I was admitted to graduate school and the next week I was on my bike going to the local campus and checking out books on economics. It was a motivator.

As far as narrowing things. I would hate to see people not taking history classes and such, although I cannot remember alot of requirements like that. I probably did not have a math requirement because I had so much of it in High School. I tested out of the one semester of English comp I was required to take, and that was probably a mistake (and the normal requirement was 2 tri-mesters).

Europeans are also typically "tracked" so that very few of them are going to college, and the rest of them are satisfied in their "dead end" jobs. I have degrees in math and economics and have had a series of dead end grunt jobs since I quit working for the war machine. Such is life. I had a bookstore for seven years and know more about books than many librarians, but can never get a job at one a) because I am not female, and b) because I do not have a library degree.

[Kellanved]

47. I'd question that

First, it is questionable to speak about "the Europeans" - education varies a lot throughout Europe.
Second, the claim about the low number of college attendance is not solid; continental Europe did not have the concept of undergraduate studies until recently - they were considered to be school and not higher education. As a result, the "low" number (about 36%) of people going to college is almost entirely composed of graduate students.
That does not even factor in that fields like nursing are considered a trade and are not present at universities.

[supernova]

3. Because taking the time

to more broadly consider other disciplines makes you more informed about your eventual chosen field.

The English major who takes biology, not only knows how to express him or herself, s/he knows the contributions that science makes to language and how scientists think.

It's not just about your field. We don't exist in a vacuum. If we only studied our specialties, we eventually would not be able to understand each other. We'd all be very specialized with blinders on about what other people do. That's not a good way to build a society.

[ChoralScholar]

8. the term is fachidiot

someone who knows a lot about their own discipline but nothing about anything else.

I wish I had been able to have more Gen Ed classes in History and Anthropology. It would give me a greater understanding of the music and cultures that I teach.

[supernova]

You teach music now?

I was glad to learn a little about everything.

But then again, my focus was always on learning, and acquiring new knowleged, not just absorb enough just long enough to pass a test.

edit: Nice to know there's a word for that! :thumbsup:

[ChoralScholar]

28. Yes... have been for quite some time.

[BuelahWitch]

12. I'm sorry, but I don't think it's working

Look at our society now...

[supernova]

16. What?

That it appears to be going to hell in a handbasket?

Not really.

The true mark of a society is not that it sometimes starts down the wrong path, but its ability to right itself. Despite all that appears to be going on right now, I don't think we've bottomed out yet. We haven't approached civil war levels of vitriol and hatred, for instance. It doesn't even feel as bad as the civil strife in the 60s.... yet. I don't know if we will go there or not.

[Reverend_Smitty]

4. I enjoy a liberal arts education

I think it's important to expose students to a range of topics. I really liked some of my electives and they would have been classes I never would have taken if I just focused on my major. But with that said the cost of the education has become outrageous, it's quite unfair for a 23 year old to have 50,000 dollar debt right out of school.

[supernova]

5. I do agree with that

I don't understand asking 18-20 year olds to be thousands of dollars in debt. That's appalling to me.

[Reverend_Smitty]

6. You are essentially forcing young people to take the first job...

that comes along. That 6 month grace period flies by quickly so who knows how many of them get sucked into dead end jobs just to pay off their massive debt. Hooray for the American Dream!

[supernova]

9. Well you take that first dead-end job anyway

because of not having much work experience in your field. So you just take something to pay the bills. I don't know many people, except nurses and engineers who are able to get a job in the field they studied fresh out of school. I certainly didn't.

I'm that much maligned English major, btw.

[BuelahWitch]

26. What about Tech writing?

When I used to work for a software company most of the English majors were tech writers. Or have those jobs gone overseas too?

[supernova]

29. That's what I do now

I'm a technical editor in fact. (Though you'd never know it by my posting sloppiness. :P :rofl: )

But when I was in college, no one had ever heard of tech writing. It wasn't something you could study for around here. That has since changed. The only thing I knew I could do was be an English teacher, the thought of which I hated.

The point is, it took me years to transition into something that a) suits my talents b) pays pretty decently.

Funny you should mention outsourcing of tech writing. We are having this arugment in my company right this minute. The beancounter wants to outsoursce the tech editors. BUT I think we are about to make the case that you can't have ESL editors for writers who are also ESL. There are still too many mistakes in the material we publish for this to work.

[fudge stripe cookays]

49. Most of them.

There are a few of us left. Everyone now is going to "contract" tech writers so they don't have to give them benefits.

fsc

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

52. Expect "All your base are belong to us" in Chemistry books soon.

And "for great justice" in Law books.
And "move zig" in Physics books.
And "there's no chance to survive take your time" in Biology books.
And "main screen turn on" in Electronics books.
And "we have signal" in Telecom books.

[StellaBlue]

13. For the record, I am 26 and owe (drumroll)...

$41,000 - having paid off $2,000 in the three years I have been making payments of $210/mo.

:nuke: :nuke: :nuke:

[BuelahWitch]

21. It irks me that I spent 3 semesters in algebra

that I'll NEVER, EVER USE, but I had to because it was required (and I spent three semesters because I'm a math dumbass who only tested into Algebra I; you have to have College Algebra to graduate). The time and expense would have been put to better use in a language, which ISN'T a requirement for my degree.

[JVS]

40. But that's not their fault. That material is not hard to accomplish by...

the end of High School. It isn't the fault of your college that you needed to take courses to learn material that you could have learned for free back then.

[Bill McBlueState]

74. well...

I would hate to think anyone would be allowed to walk around with a college degree -- supposedly the mark of an educated person -- without knowing how to do basic math.

[eyesroll]

90. Problem comes when you're 30, trying to go back to college, and the

"basic math" just isn't coming back to you. You bomb the placement test (because it's been 12 years since you looked at the quadratic equasion -- see, it's been so long I'm not even sure I spelled it properly) and are stuck paying for non-credit "college math" in order to place into the regular math course needed for graduation in an unrelated field.

Unfortunately, it doesn't test "basic math" -- I see "basic math" as figuring out how much the toothpaste costs per ounce, and how much that credit card's going to cost you over time. Practical stuff. On the placement tests, there's advanced algebra and geometry in there, stuff recent HS grads would probably know but returning students have long forgotten.

[Nikia]

83. You wouldn't have even got into my college

Which required 3 years of high school math. They required math, statistics or calculus. They did not offer college algebra because they considered that a remedial subject.
My old high school now requires three years of math, including algebra and geometry. These are subjects that you should have mastered in high school. You can always use algebra. You'd be suprised at the situations where knowing it can be useful.
Perhaps you are going to your college for a particuliar reason, like location or a specific degree program, but I checked out the degree requirements even before applying to colleges. If I didn't like the requirements, I didn't even apply to the school.

[StellaBlue]

14. check this out

http://www.unconventionalideas.com/educatn.html

[BuelahWitch]

20. This one looks especially interesting

"Is There a Correlation Between Student Loan Debt and Unquestioning Conformity in the Workplace?"

[WindRavenX]

15. disagree

When people don't get exposed to ideas or things they normally wouldn't, it lessons the education experienc.If you want to learn only one area, go to a specialty school or vocation school.

This is ESPECIALLY important because people aren't exposed to advanced science--and then we get brain dead yahoos advocated ID...

[Floogeldy]

17. Agree

"Well-rounded" is more than it sounds. I understand the world as a whole a lot better having taken economics, biology, etc. . . . .

:)

[StellaBlue]

18. I think the point is that I shouldn't have left school $24,000 in debt

Even though I got some scholarships and worked 20 hours a week the entire four years.

It's great - it's just ridiculously overpriced. Like most everything else in *'s America.

[WindRavenX]

19. that is the point

The other part is sort of irrelevant..

Education is becoming only for the elite, and shame be upon America for it.

[ChoralScholar]

33. becoming? Who could afford college 100 years ago?

I rest my case. It's more accessible today in this country than it has ever been.

[WindRavenX]

35. 100 years ago only the rich even went to college in the first place

Your statement is partially true, though. While it may be more *accessible* today, it is becoming nearly impossible for anyone but the wealthy to afford school, even public college.

[fishwax]

76. I agree with that, but I don't blame it on gen ed requirements

[swag]

22. and life is a killer.

[GirlinContempt]

36. !

[swag]

48. Damn, you're good.

Never forget: Better an old demon than a new god.

[Rabrrrrrr]

23. Because if you didn't take that extra stuff, you'd be a republican

If all you want is to learn a job skill that won't take you very far, go to tech school.

If you want an education that goes far beyond the mere bullshit of job skills, go to college.

[BuelahWitch]

25. Honey, I'm in a community college right now

And they require all of that stuff for me to get an Associates. So there! :P

[Rabrrrrrr]

27. Yes, I know you are in college! That's what you complained about.

And I am glad that you are there, and that you are learning.

best wishes!

[fishwax]

78. colleges are becoming more and more like tech schools

well, more and more like vocational schools, i should say, it's just that the vocation now is business. Students need much more exposure to other disciplines, not less.

[elshiva]

24. The most useless course that I HAD to take to graduate

was health, basically you're don't get stressed and eat right stuff.

But why the hell does the biology text book cost $76?

[supernova]

30. For me it was PE

We had to take two hours of PE to get our teaching certificates. The aerobics course I took was fine. But the bowling class I took; well lets just say, I'm glad there was a written final and our entire grade was not a complete average of our bowling scores over the term.

[elshiva]

31. Yup. It was either health or PE.

I chose health cos I have to many bad physical ed memories.

[XemaSab]

46. Your biology book only cost $76????

I think mine was closer to 120...

[bicentennial_baby]

56. I had a Zoology text that was....

$175 :wow:

[alarimer]

32. I was having this exact argument with people at work

Not long ago. My point was that education was an end in itself. They argued that if they are paying for their kids' education, they damn well better have a job at the end of it. So college is just to get a well-paying job now I guess??? Their point was that you are there to learn a skill set that can then be applied in the real world. But some majors (biology, and the sciences in general) do NOT in fact prepare you for a job. There are almost no good jobs available in those fields without advanced degrees. I know. I found out the hard way. But I am grateful for the fact that I have knowledge about many different fields. Classes I thought I would never use have surprisingly been of use now. For example, I recently needed to figure out how to determine distances betwen two pairs of latitude and longitude points. You need trig for that, believe it or not.

[Bill McBlueState]

75. *spherical* trig, no less

yay, spherical trigonometry...

[alarimer]

103. well I had Excel do the heavy lifting

But I had to look up the formula!! Seriously. thank God for computers and the internet(s). I didn't actually have to figure it our for myself. It is a new world we are living in so maybe the skills students need are different than the ones colleges actually give them.

[jobycom]

37. College isn't meant to be a trade school

No law says you have to earn a degree. In may schools you can take only the course you want and not graduate. You will have learned only what you want to know, not what the university feels you should know.

However, your career search could be hindered. Employers who require a college degree don't do so because they expect you to learn your craft at college. In fact, they know they will have to teach you your job, and they could often just as easily teach someone from a tech school. They want to know two things: One, that you are able to learn about a variety of subjects, because high paying jobs rarely require only that you can do the basic job description. They also require you to think, be creative, handle multiple tasks, and meet deadlines--all of which a broad curriculum helps to prepare you to do. And two, they want their employees to demonstrate some depth of character, not just the ability to do a trade. They want a person who can understand government, history and literature, for example, because these fields show open-ended thinking, and show that a person is able to communicate within and understand a complex entity such as a corporation. if all you can do, for instance, is diagram digital circuits, will you understand your place in the corporate structure, will you be able to communicate with your bosses, and they with you, will you have a basic understanding of how large groups of people work? If not, you will be less adabtable to their needs, and therefore less valuable.

So you can skip all the extra stuff, and just learn a trade. But that's not the same as a college degree, and must employers won't consider it the same. I have an advanced degree in a field completely unrelated to what I do for a living, but my boss wouldn't have hired me without the degree. The degree means more than that you've learned a simple skill.

There is also a social element to a degree. Colleges and universities believe that in addition to preparing you for a job, they should prepare you for citizenship. Government, English, history, all do that. And this enters into an employer's decision, too. A degree marks you as a more informed and balanced individual. That's what they are looking for.

[lukasahero]

54. jobycom, will you marry me?

Your posts are so insightful - I always look forward to reading them.

So many people these days seem to think college is a place where you go to learn how to do something. I think of it as a place where you go to learn how to learn. And that's a huge commodity in just about any career field.

[jobycom]

55. Maybe

But whether I do or not, I really, really needed the confidence boost you just gave me!! Thanks!!

:hug:

[lukasahero]

57. :) Glad I could do that.

Just for the record, I'm afraid I'm already happily married. And he's just as insightful as you are. Hmmm... I see a pattern developing here.

I just thought your post was excellent and wanted to bring some attention to it so others might read it too.

:)

[jobycom]

58. That's okay

I'm still technically married, too. Dangerous game, though... What if I'd been the male equivalent of the female psycho characters in old movies? "You proposed to me! You must marry me! I will stuff your cat in the microwave if you don't!"

Actually, I'm an animal lover, so that's unlikely. :-)

[lukasahero]

61. Ok, now you're scaring me.

:scared:

[jobycom]

100. It's the creepy side of Jobycom

I didn't know it existed, either! :yoiks:

[alarcojon]

59. Hear hear!

Good response to all the haters in this post.

When you think about some of the REAL rackets out there, higher ed pales in significance. No it isn't perfect, and I agree it is overpriced, but if you work at it, you will come out a better rounded individual with a variety of critical thinking and people skills.

[OldEurope]

79. It´s a rocket.

A rocket, that brings you to the outer limits of your mind.

[fishwax]

82. that's cheezy

:thumbsup:

:)

[OldEurope]

86. ok,

I don´t know anything about your education systems.
:toast:
But I always thought, that knowledge is the only thing that no one can steal from me.

[fishwax]

91. I agree with that

(and I agreed with your original sentiment too, I was just having fun :)

:toast:

[OldEurope]

92. actually,

I don´t know what "cheesy" meant . My English knowledge is oldfashioned, and I never learned that world
:-)

[fishwax]

97. I see

the online dictionary says "shoddy or poor quality," but that's harsher than what I actually meant. Cheezy, as slang, usually refers to something that might be contrived and yet retains an ironic appeal to humor. Your slogan reminded me of the tag line in a "stay-in-school" poster from a junior high school english classroom, and yet in its manipulation of the OP Subject Line it made me laugh. :) :thumbsup:

:hi:

[OldEurope]

98. surely I hoped,

somebody would laugh!

[jobycom]

99. Well, I laughed, too, so that's at least two people

Way to go! :woohoo:

[OldEurope]

101. So here

best wishes from Munich:

:toast:

[Starlight]

65. The ability to think critically doesn't get the respect it deserves.

College (and high school & elementary school) should prepare people for LIFE not just provide job training. In spite of what corporations would have you believe, there's more to life than work. :thumbsup:

[fishwax]

80. Damn! Very well said.

:applause:

[Hello_Kitty]

102. That seems terrific. It really does. But...

How many college graduates do you know who truly possess the attributes and breadth of knowledge you described? I mean, really? Most of the ones I encounter in work and life got through by the skin of their teeth, partying in the frat house the whole time. I'm frequently astonished at the ignorance of people with degrees from prestigious private and state universities. I definitely think you are right in that someone who truly applies herself to the academic experience will benefit immeasurably from it. However, for most students it's merely a function of getting your ticket punched so that you are appropriately upper middle class-y enough to hire. Obviously the vast majority of regular DU posters are not in that category but I know you've seen what I'm talking about.

[alarcojon]

104. Good point

and the next question would then be "is this the fault of higher education itself, or of larger forces"?

You're absolutely right that some dim bulbs can and do graduate from college - exhibit A is His Chimperial Highness himself. But I see this as more a function of the prevailing societal view of education - that it is merely a ticket into middle-class respectability and the accompanying well-paying job - than as the true goal of higher ed.

If education were more intrinsically valued in this society (apart from the kind of job it can land you) we would have less of the types of idiots with college degrees you refer to.

[jobycom]

105. I described the purpose of college, not the infallible outcome.

I'm sure a lot of graduates don't fully use what they learn. I don't. But the entire system exists as it does to turn out well-rounded citizens. It does that. It fails on some, it succeeds beyond expectations on some, and most come out somewhere in the middle. And of course there are those who don't go to college and still become well-rounded people.

But none of that is an argument for scrapping the system or turning it into a series of high-tech vo-tech campuses. Colleges, as they exist, serve a purpose. The fact that not everyone is made perfect by the process is no more reason to criticize it than the fact that elected governments can still be corrupt is a reason to scrap democracy.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

38. My crappy college experience...

I went to a conservatory program for theater design straight out of HS. It was too intense, so I freaked out and left, even though I was doing really well. If I waited a couple years and got more experience, I would have been fine with it.

So I transferred to a small conservative private college in NW NJ, because they offered me a really good financial aid package. I wanted to go to Drew University but they didn't offer much help to transfer students and cost like $35,000/yr. So I ended up in an honors program at the "cheap for me" school. Then a year and a half later, my dad dies. They look at the life insurance money and decide that I can now pay $28,000/yr.

I leave and go to William Patterson University. They look at my transcript and say, "hey that's really great you were in an honors program and your major is nearly taken care of. Now we just need you to go back and take our 60 general education credits, because you took advanced classes instead of the basic classes."

The last thing you want to do to a really smart kid with ADD is put them in an easy class. Needless to say, I practically failed my semester there despite my former good grades. The last class I had to take to finish my major was Intro to theatre, taught by a woman I worked with professionally and she was justifiably almost fired. I left and took a year off from school to work.

Now, I'm taking a few classes at county college to raise my GPA because I want to transfer to Naropa University. I won't have to take dumbed-down intro classes there and it's liberal as all hell.

[JVS]

39. Well since HS is a bowl of steaming feces, you have to take it in colllege

So deal

[BuelahWitch]

60. Not all high schools

At least the one I went to in the '70s in New Wilmington, PA was damn good. :hi:

[JVS]

62. It isn't about the school all the time. It's often about students and ...

what they think is the way they should be using their time. You can be at a fine school, but if you spend all day smoking joints in the bathroom, you'll be none the wiser.

[BuelahWitch]

64. Are you making a judgement about me?

Because I think algebra is useless you think I was "smoking joints" in the bathroom all day every day during my high school years?

[JVS]

66. No. But people have a choice with how they are going to use the...

opportunity given them in the form of a free high-school education. Algebra is one of the many things that can be learned in HS whether one thinks it's interesting or not. In fact, I'm surprised that colleges even accept students who have not completed Algebra. Most college bound students that I knew took calculus before going to college.

[BuelahWitch]

67. I took two years of algebra in high school

not that it's any of your business. And three years of French. But since life and family committments got in the way, I didn't go back to school (a Community College) until I hit my late 30s. By then most of my high school credit wasn't of much use.

[JVS]

69. But the skills learned should take you through the placement tests.

I stand by my original statement. Colleges need to pile on gen-ed requirements because students do not come out of highschool sufficiently educated.

[BuelahWitch]

85. Do you remember EVERYTHING you learned 20 yrs ago?

Even the things you weren't interested in? I sure as hell don't!

[JVS]

88. I'd be able to pass a placement test covering what I learned 20 years ago.

[ProfessorGAC]

50. Sheesh!

So, you want higher education to be a trade school? The purpose of undergraduate education is to expose one to as many ideas, concepts, and modes of thought as possible. That's why pre-meds should take history.

It's not a waste of time! It just isn't. If you can't see that for yourself, you might want to think about finding a school that teaches welding and pursue that for a career. UNIVERSITIES ARE NOT TRADE SCHOOLS!
The Professor

[jmowreader]

71. You mean like this welding school?

http://www-iwse.eng.ohio-state.edu/we/graduate/gradndx.htm

There are people in the United States who hold doctorates in welding.

[ProfessorGAC]

72. You Think Every Course They Took Was In Welding?

I doubt it. Lots of metallurgy. Elements of plasma physics. But, when they got their bachelor's, i can guarantee you they took those same liberal arts classes. And anyone who cared enough about a field to get PhD in welding didn't complain about having to take history.
The Professor

[BuelahWitch]

84. I didn't say have it be a trade school

But why not give people a CHOICE in the type of math, science, or humanities/social studies course they take? Why couldn't I have taken another math instead of algebra? Why is algebra a requirement?

I'm not advocating getting rid of general ed, just give people more of a choice.

[Nikia]

87. My college offered choices for most distribution requirements

As stated above, for the math requirement, you pretty much had to take calculus or statistics. I think that even statistics would be hard for you if you did not pass out of algebra.
There were two course that were required.
Other than that, I got a choice amongst many classes for the distribution requirements. Soem departments offered classes for non majors but you could take classes that majors did and have them apply to the distribution requirement.
I did not apply to colleges that had degree requirements that I did not like.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

51. Can't speak much about humanities / liberal arts - but

exact-sciences college (and further) education is MOST definitely NOT a racket.

Edit: What Rev. Smitty said at post #4.

[Deja Q]

53. Read the link in my sig line for techrepublic

'nuff said

http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-11181-0.html?forumID=6&threadID=179848&start=0
(* just in case we get to level1 again *)

[BuelahWitch]

63. That's really interesting...

[Midlodemocrat]

68. I don't feel that way at all.

And I went to school for a very long time, 4 years for my BA and another 4 for my MA and PhD.

I had to take a wide variety of classes, but I think it made me appreciative of things that I wasn't before.

I had to take Art History because Art Therapy is one avenue that is used in treating autistic children, and prior to that I had no interest at all. I really enjoyed what I got out of it.

I also had to take statistics :scared: and other related math type things.

[Left_Winger]

70. Is higher education a racket? - It's all in the eye of the beholder...

However, the textbook portion of it most definitely is.

My higher education is in history and I never could have understood half of what we were studying if it had not been for the survey classes in economics, political science, psychology, geography, et al.

I admit the tuition today is out of sight! I can remember my first semester's tuition from September 1981: $212 (in state, 15 credit hours). When I returned to grad school in 1991 my tuition was $800 per credit hour (in state). That put my tuition anywhere from $4800-$5400 per semester.

I am lucky in two respects: The GI Bill paid for my undergrad education (debt-free). I am currently a public school teacher and in my state a percentage my student loan debt is forgiven for each year I teach. I'm almost free from those blood-suckers.

[Jamison]

73. In Bush's economy, it is a racket.

35 years years ago, a BS or BA degree in just about any field was your ticket to a good and reasonably (middle class) paying job.

Now, kids graduate with their BS or BA and have to resort to waiting tables or working in retail.

[Nikia]

89. I agree

There are not good jobs for college graduates. I graduated 5 years ago and do not even make $30,000 a year. I want a different job, but there are jobs requiring a 4 year science degree in my area that are only paying $10-$12/hour that they are able to find people for.
In a way, promising students from working class backgrounds had a better chance at succeeding when fewer people went to college. Now the only people who are guarenteed good jobs after college are students in certain specific fields or upper and upper middle class students who already have connections to get good jobs.

[DS1]

77. I was going to use my php skills to write a website that allowed

students to coordinate book-trading and selling among each other

but then I just started signing up for classes that didn't require books :D

[OldEurope]

81. It´s a rocket.

A rocket, that could bring you to the outer limits of yout mind.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

93. You can't predict what you will need in the future

If you assume the attitude typical of business majors in the 1980s ("Oh, I have an elective slot? Let's see if I can find another business course to take") you end up trained, not educated. Even if you plan to be a middle management drone all your life or the most narrowly focused type of engineer, you may end up getting sent to some foreign country, and then you'll be glad that you took history, geography, art history, and anthropology. You may get so sick of business or engineering or law, or demand in the field might utterly collapse so that you just have to get out, and if you've learned how to learn a variety of subjects, you're not going to be able to cope.

As a liberal arts major, I found that my once-hated science and math courses stood me in good stead when my academic career ended and I had to become a free-lance translator. Now some translators have a technical skill and spend eight hours a day translating electronics or drug patents, but I don't have that depth of scientific training or the patience to do the same thing all day. Luckily, my liberal arts background and my habit of reading widely have prepared me well to translate general-interest pieces in science and math (the type of thing you might find in Discover) as well as in the humanities and social sciences.

Finally, even if you get a good job right out of college, love it, and manage to stay in the field till retirement, you're going to have some leisure hours. What are you going to do with them? Get satellite TV and sit zoned out in front of sports channels all day? That's what some people end up doing, because there's literally nothing in their heads but work and sports. If you have a broad background, your non-working life will be richer, because you'll have a lot of reading interests, you'll appreciate a wide variety of performing arts, you'll understand nature, and when you travel, you'll actually appreciate what you're looking at.

[Nikia]

94. I'd suggest that all students review before taking placement tests

Especially if like the OP they have been out of school for a while. Last year, I helped a friend place out of college algebra at a community college. We reviewed all the basic concepts so that she could remember how to solve all the different types of problems that might be on the test. Public libraries often have math textbooks, some with answers in the back.
If I would go back to college for chemical engineering, I'd be studying calculus so that I wouldn't have to take calculus I again. If they required more foreign langauage, I'd be reviewing one of my languages too.
You can study for these things on your own without having to shell out money for a class.

[JVS]

95. Good suggestion

[Ramsey]

96. Higher education opens doors

I went to an Ivy League university and was admitted to medical school without even applying. To this day, over a decade later, people still hold my college degree out as a sign of my accomplishments, and it opens doors for me still.

I was a pre-med and studied molecular biology in college, but I also took every extra interesting liberal arts class I could squeeze in, from comparative literature to political science to dance/music/theater to computer science to, yes, even history. Why? Because it sounded interesting and I was spending a lot of money to be there, so I decided to take full advantage. I also think it was very good for me to learn about other disciplines outside of my major. It taught me a greater appreciation for a wider world. It helped teach me how to think and to think about the world outside of science.

The English major takes a lab class to learn about scientific design. The Film major takes algebra so he can understand finances and analysis. The pre-med takes history so she knows about things like the Nuremberg trials, Tuskegee and the origins of ethical and moral thought. The breadth of offerings in college is usually much deeper than what is available in a high school curriculum.

I interview for the medical school and run my department's residency program, and as such I see a lot of applications from pre-meds and medical students. I don't want to see anyone too focused on just one thing. They don't tend to be good doctors if their experiences are too narrow. I like to see research, volunteer work and a healthy life outside of academics. My advice to you is to identify your interests and pursue them in your academic program. Take advantage of the offerings instead of whining about "requirements".