Good & Evil - Politics & Conscience (+Star Wars +Spoilers)

[everythingsxen]

After having seen Star Wars Episode III, I am having a crisis of morality.

I have always considered myself a relatively good person; I mean it's not like I go out and fuck people over. I give money to people in need when I can and I keep my loved ones safe.

I realized however, like Anakin, I would do anything to save my true love. There is no limit to my anger simmering just beneath the surface. I am filled with hatred at the evils of the world. If someone came to me and convinced me that with their help, I could save my loves life --- but the catch was that I had to kill "just a few people"; I would do it. Without hesitation or mercy.

By the same token should she be hurt or killed, there is no end to the torrent of violent destruction I would unleash in the name of revenge. I would fill the streets with blood, all for an ideal of love that would have beccome so distant that it no longer carried any meaning.

All of that scares me. It scares me that inside, I am Darth Vader. What am I to do though? Like Anakin I am trapped by fate; the decisions I make are not mine to make --- they are essentially made for me and simply happen. By then there is no choice, only reaction.

It also puts me in a moral quandry regarding Government.

The general theme of the Sagas is that when your democracy turns to dictatorship, rebellion is the answer. However, in Episode III, Obi-Wan and Yoda go into hiding, rather than trying to organize a rebellion. Is the answer then to sit and "wait it out" until a popular uprising is inevitable?

I am conflicted right now. I want to be on the Light side; but the power of the Dark side is overwhelming.

[melissinha]

1. Don't feel too bad

I can understand your sentiments.... the whole plot line was very interesting, his turning to the dark side is more understandable now. But I think that you are identifying with the feelings that were protrayed on screen, but if push came to shove would you really do it? I mean really.... truly? Would you kill innocent people? Probably not. Just shows how compelling the story was.

As for Yoda and Obi-Wan, it turns out that they wait until Luke is old enough so that they can make sure that he is trained properly and possibly Leia. Now I think that it was particularly wise to bide their time....we all know it takes time to let unjust political situation to sink in to the minds of the population... Also remember that they both admitted failure, both felt responsible for what had happened.

[everythingsxen]

4. I had mentally debated this even before Ep. III; before Ep. I even

It is hard to admit it, but yes. Yes I would kill. I would kill anyone I had to, if it would save my friends and family and loved ones.

[cprise]

7. So can you see how conservatives feel the same way

...at least some of them.

They feel threatened, and have always wanted the rest of America to feel the same way.

Address that sense of fear at its roots, and truly you CONVERT them outright.

[atreides1]

2. I haven't seen the movie yet(read the book though)

But I have felt what you described for the last few years, we are all
capable of becoming Darth Vader.

As for the path taken by Yoda and Obi-Wan, they went into hiding not just to "wait it out", but because they knew where the hope for the future would come from.

Alas, we don't. We are our hope, and if we "wait it out", it may be
too late to do anything at all.

[everythingsxen]

5. I only pray that enough people can see the movie...

and perhaps realize that what is happening in America is what has happened to all Empires before the fall of democracy and the rise of fascism.

I think it is impossible for most Americans to look back in history and see the parallel between Nazi Germany and Neocon America. However, I think it is far easier for them to look at the Republic/Empire of Star Wars and draw parallels to their own lives.

[cprise]

3. Well, as a cheap rip-off of Eastern philosophy

...perhaps I should use the real thing as the source of my reply:

Each person is a microcosm of different individuals, with the potential to express any of them. When we look at the strangeness of others, we see a reflection of what is hiding in us.

If we do not see our greatest heroes within ourselves, we self-discriminate and diminish the potential of our own lives.

If we cannot recognize even Adolf Hitler as truly human and acknowledge that part of us, then that utter seperateness in our minds becomes a sort of blindness to what he represents. Then we cannot detect that evil when it creeps into our behavior.

[cprise]

6. I think in Vader's specific case

He was trained to use power in the service of good like all Jedi, but at some point his personal pain closed his soul off to the considerations of others. The evil he had hated could never be reconciled, so no matter what he did his mind could not perceive that evil transferring to himself. He could not return to the mirror in humble self-examination to re-evaluate his path. Being less self-aware, he became progressively less alive. He fell from mindfulness.

The universe is always trying to surprise us, introducing many things and people who truly are just as important as we are. If pain has closed our hearts, we cannot relate to these new people and circumstances and we may fall into a pattern of callous, even lethal, disregard toward them. We may constantly try to re-cast them into the mold of our first enemies, our first battles.

[everythingsxen]

8. You have made some very excellent points in this thread cprise

I understand what you are saying from a certain point, my difficulty is I feel trapped in my role. It is hard to explain, but I am not sure who or what I am now.

I feel lost.

[AlienGirl]

9. Luckily you are not in that situation

And you have knowledge that Anakin did not: you know that killing a bunch of people won't *solve* anything, it'll just put things off for a few decades. Plus, you will never be in the position of having to kill an innocent to save a loved one: the only time you might have to kill to save someone would be open combat, which is different.

And if you ever killed someone innocent to save me, I would kick your ass.

Tucker

[AlienGirl]

10. kicking...