I could use some marriage advice.

[Allenberg]

Alright. Quick background - my wife and I have been married since May 2003, and dated since Feb 2001. I've been in the military since 1999, and met her while stationed at Ft Meade in 2000. We're both from Pittsburgh. I've been stationed here in Japan since July 2002, and she came to live with me after we get married. I get out of the military in two months, and am moving back to the Ft Meade area to take a job.

Now, for the issue. Before we got married, we talked about having kids, and I said that I was all for it. However, as I've gotten older (I turn 24 in July), I've began to realize how much growing up and having a life I've missed out on being in the military and married. This isn't to say that I want a divorce, I love my wife dearly. I just don't want children for at least maybe 5 or 6 years, and to be honest, I don't know if I ever want kids. However, my wife stated to me that she feels like she "was born to be a mother" and feels like we should start trying for kids as soon as I leave the military. I don't have the patience to deal with children, and I don't like the idea of giving up time that can be spent doing things with my wife. I also don't like the idea of being responsible for someone who can't take care of themselves. Am I being selfish? Yes, but I'd rather be selfish and smart, rather than bring a child into the world and come to resent it. I haven't told her how I really feel about having kids yet, as I know it will break her heart.

My wife has said that if I didn't give her a child, she'd find someone that would. :scared:

Does anyone have any advice on how to handle my situation? Thanks in advance.

[Dookus]

1. Sorry to say it

but it sounds pretty clear-cut.

If she's willing to "find someone who will give her children" and you don't want children, then you should let her do just that.

I can promise you that having children you don't want to appease her will be the biggest mistake you ever make.

Congratulations on knowing what you want and what you don't want. You should have it. And so should your wife. You need to have a real heart-to-heart with her. Good luck.

[Floogeldy]

2. You are breaking a promise

She married you, partly, on your agreement to have children.

[Allenberg]

3. I turn 24 in July.

[Skittles]

4. he is fixing to turn 24 in July

and fixing to make a huge mistake if he caves in and has children when he is not ready

[Dookus]

7. When it comes to

having children, it's better to break a promise than to carry through with one that will destroy a marriage and the children's lives.

[regnaD kciN]

13. True, but people DO change...

...and I'm talking about both parties in a marriage. Part of the work of building a lifelong relationship is being able to deal with the changes each person goes through.

Personally, I suspect that, if every couple made drawing up an explicit "marriage contract" part of their prenuptuals, rigidly specifying the explicit roles each of them were to play in their interactions with each other, as well as their plans (and how they were going to go about achieving them)...well, I would guess that if, thirty years later, you went to some of the couples who had stayed together (i.e. whose marriages had been "successful") and asked them whether they had strictly adhered to the terms of that contract, you'd get a lot of laughter in return.

[CanuckAmok]

17. That's nuts.

A marriage is a binding contract, like a business contract.

If either party decides it can't live under the terms of the contract, they have the right to break the contract by paying a penalty. They can't, and shouldn't be bound to honour the contract; neither party benefits from a coercive agreement.

She has plenty of time to find someone else to breed with, and he has plenty of time to find a more suitable mate. If child-bearing is the lynchpin of their marriage, it will end; if they have more in common than an interest in reproduction, they have to decide if they have enough to hold them together without having children before both are ready to do so.

It's insanity to insist someone completly ruin their life to honour some agreement made under the pretense of infinite compatibility.

[CanuckAmok]

5. Talk to your wife and to a marriage counselor about this.

This is a pretty serious issue to bounce off a bunch of unqualified strangers (even though it's true...we do rock).

My $0.02 is that you shouldn't have kids until you're ready. It's not as if you can send them back. Too many people get pressured into parenthood for reasons other than the desire to be a parent. "I'll find someone who will" being a classic example of this kind of pressure.

24 is pretty young, mister. I assume she's close to your age... you both have lots of time to discuss this. Enjoy getting to know eachother for a few years, without the burden of military life getting in the way.

[Allenberg]

10. That's exactly what I'm talking about

Being tied to the military has really hampered our ability to truly enjoy our marriage. Especially here in rural Japan being surrounded by rice paddies.

And yeah, she's 25.

[warrens]

32. Don't make any decisions til you get home

And frankly, most people don't have kids til their 30s these days anyway. But really, kids are the reason for marriage. I can't think of one other reason, can you? So if you decide you can't deal with kids, it would be best to just let her go. Because she will be miserable without children.

[fleabert]

6. get some couples counseling...an unbiased third party that

can hear both of your stories will be the best guide for this journey...

IMO- 24 is still very young. as a woman who was also 'born to be a mother' (I TOTALLY understand this comment) I am glad I have waited. I will make a much better mother now than I ever could have in my twenties. That's just me, some would disagree and tell you to go for it. I support the idea of waiting.

good luck!

[Dave Reynolds]

8. I can't really offer advice, but

I can relate a story. My son-in-law, who just turned 25, was one of the most selfish people I have ever met. He didn't really want children, but my stepdaughter did. He grudgingly went along. When the baby was born, he cried. He now happily changes diapers, does bottle feedings to give his wife some sleep, and generally doesn't like to let the baby out of his sight.

My point: sometimes feelings change when confronted with circumstance.

Best of luck to you, whatever happens.

[Dookus]

15. Your stepdaughter got lucky

I'm sure what you described happens fairly often, but I wouldn't bet a child's welfare on it happening every time.

[Dave Reynolds]

29. True,

which is why I hesitate to offer advice based on that. I think counseling would be best in this case. Much communication is key.

[A HERETIC I AM]

18. I can't offer advice either, but" ("I'll 2nd that)

I'm 45 and never married. I spent the last 3 years in a relationship that was doomed from the start but it had this caveat; She had 3 kids, (when we met) 12 year old boy, a 15 year old Girl and a 17 year old boy. I was a "Walk on Father" as my brother put it. I FELL IN LOVE WITH HER AND HER KIDS and, as the above poster relates, circumstances change things.

If you don't want to have kids then you shouldn't. Simple as that.

If you aren't ready to be a father then you AREN'T! The Other side of this coin is that YOU MARRIED THIS WOMAN! She wants kids now. You do not. You have to come to an agreement. Are kids in the future of this marriage? If it is your opinion that the answer is yes (It is apparently hers,) then a timetable must be agreed upon that is logical and MAKES FINANCIAL SENSE! If there will be serious struggles financially to have a baby now then you must convince her that it is in the child's best interest that you wait a few years. ( Or however long it might be)


If she insists the she "will find someone who will"...and wont listen to a well reasoned argument from someone she has suggested she loves "till death do us part" (or whatever).....well..........you are with the wrong woman.



my 2 cents

[REP]

9. Run

You don't have to be a father, but if she has a baby-rabies, you may end up being one.

Tell her how you feel. If she's set on being a mother and you're set on not being a father, go your own ways - but go before she's pregnant, as you any child she conceives during the marriage (whether or not it is biologically yours) is considered yours to support for 18 years.

[shawcomm]

11. Marriage counselor, brother.

Personally, I would talk to her about waiting a couple of years to give us time to be together and get a home ready for kids. Something along those lines would be a good compromise for me were I in your shoes. But, the only advice I can offer another is to go see a professional counselor.

[regnaD kciN]

12. 24 is NOT "older"...!

My youngest daughter was born when I was 42, and my wife 34.

There comes a strange time in the early-mid 20s when people seem to go through an early midlife crisis -- when all of a sudden people "feel old," and want to change direction in their life. In fact, it isn't really "changing direction" as much as it is how to continue your life's path.

It sounds to me like you (and possibly your wife as well) are at that stage right now. You, because of what you wrote. Your wife? I'm not sure, but I've known women of around that age who decide that they need to have kids right now, because they see themselves as starting to get "older" as well. (Not to mention that there are some women who determinedly want to take on the job of "mommy," because they don't know what other job they would want instead.)

So, what to do? First of all, from my vantage point of being around twice your age, I can strongly advise that people should attempt only one major change in their lives at a time. Otherwise, the stress of trying to juggle several major changes (even if they are positive in nature) can throw their lives into an upheaval in which a lot that was valuable may get broken.

It sounds to me like your "one change at a time" is leaving the military for civilian life. In fact, if you were asking me, even if you really wanted children right away, I would counsel you to get settled in your civilian world for at least a year before trying for a baby. You need that time to get adjusted to the new world you're going to be experiencing.

If I would advise that of a couple where both parties wanted children, I would especially recommend that in a case like yours, where one partner is uncertain. Take a year, get settled, and see where you are at that point. You may decide, after all, that you want kids right away. Or you may decide you never want them. Or you may find yourself right where you are today. But at least you'll know that you're there because it's the right place for you, not just because you're seeing all sorts of changes overwhelming you in the next few months.

So, I'd strongly recommend you talking this out with your wife, and trying to see if a one-year "moratorium" on parenting plans would be acceptable, if she has enough of a committment to you and to your marriage to wait for what would be, after all, a brief interval compared to the duration of a life together. If so, take it as it comes (it may even come to pass, a year from now, that you want kids, and she wants to wait). If, on the other hand, she won't accept that compromise, and demands that you either give her the child she wants right now or else let her go...well, in that case, you'll know that her self-image as a "wife and mother" in the abstract is far more of a driving force for her than building a marriage of caring and mutuality in the concrete. In which case, it's best to regretfully "set her free," knowing that it's better that this collision of abstract/concrete manifested itself now, rather than under different circumstances when you might, indeed, have children that would have to live through a split with you.

[fleabert]

20. awesome response.

perfect.

[orleans]

14. wow. too bad you didn't seriously talk this part of being married over

before you actually got married.

have you both finished college yet? you're still young (and i'm assuming she is too).

i think you need to figure out if you want kids or not. if it's a matter of just being a few years down the road then she needs to accept the fact that you are not ready for that heavy responsibility yet.

the ultimatum she gave you is interesting--if she finds someone else to give her a child is she planning on staying married to you and putting the responsibility on you to help raise the baby? or is she going off on her own?

marriage is a partnership. and when you're married, having a child is a shared responsibility. it's a decision both of you need to agree on.

i'm afraid this is going to sound stupid but is there something that could fill this need she has ("she was born to be a mother") in the interim--pets, hobbies, some type of creative outlet, some way for her to be nurturing (working with kids, teaching, daycare, starting a business that is child-oriented such as a kids bookstore, ice cream shop, birthday party service)? so you can give yourselves more time to live, be alone together, get a little older & wiser, and maybe more financially secure?

i have known a couple men who feel resentful and overly burdened by the stress and pressure of starting a family they were not ready for. and i've known their spouses who also feel resentful that their husbands are distant and can't be bothered with much of the day-to-day business of their kids. you both really need to be ready and accepting of this idea (maybe not logically--there's a hundred reasons to put off having children & a hundred reasons not to put it off; maybe not as far as your wallet is concerned--you'll never have enough money for everything anyway--but you've got to be ready in your heart. that's the key. when your heart is ready then you'll be able to make everything okay).

sorry for such a long blablabla.

[RagingInMiami]

16. Tell her to stop being so selfish, immature and manipulative

Selfish because she obviously only thinking about herself, not about the kids who are going to be brought into this world by a father who is not ready.

Immature because she was "born to be a mother". If that's her destiny, then why the desperation? If its meant to be, then it will happen. There's no need to rush.

And manipulative: "My wife has said that if I didn't give her a child, she'd find someone that would."

It's the manipulative part that bothers me. If I was in that situation, I would send her on her way and wish her good luck.

And yes, if I loved her I would feel horrible about it, but a statement like that is a slap in the face, a sign of disrespect.

[Dookus]

19. I gotta agree....

I was thinking about the "or I'll find someone who will" part, and that just set off all the alarms. That's an unimaginably mean thing to say to a spouse.

[A HERETIC I AM]

21. Couldn't have said it better

n/t

[JimmyJazz]

28. I hadn't thought of it that was when I first read this, but I tend to

agree with you. Plus, I see 24 and 25 as being very young.

[Flaxbee]

31. Yes, the statement is manipulative,

putting pressure on you when you're trying to make a good decision about the fate of another human being.

And I have to ask, though you don't have to answer: do you trust her? Even if you two talk, and she agrees to wait, do you trust her to not "accidentally get pregnant"? Forgot to take a pill, forgot the sponge, forgot whatever? Yes, you can use condoms, but they're certainly not 100% (nothing is but condoms aren't as reliable as the pill or condoms + sponge or whatever).

I realize it's a rude question, I do apologize. It's an angle to consider, though. I have decided not to have kids and my husband is in agreement, but it is much easier for me to abide by that decision, I can be perfectly sure I take the right precautions but if your wife is manipulating you about "finding someone who will" can you be sure she wouldn't get pregnant believing you'd love the little guy when he shows up nine months later?

[redqueen]

33. Well put.

That's a horrible thing to say, and her selfishness trumps his IMO because the kids will suffer if she gets her manipulative way.

[GaYellowDawg]

22. This is a real crossroads for you.

If it were me, I'd be nervous/excited about getting out of the military and into civilian life, but I'd also realize that it's going to take a little time to stabilize. You might decide on a career change a year out of the military and want to go back to school. Who knows?

You're going to want things to be as stable as you can make them before having kids. I'd tell her that, and ask her if you could table the discussion for 1 year after getting out of the military so that you'll have time to adjust to civilian life. Assure her that this is by no means a "no," but that you're thinking of the best for any kids that you'd have. And you might very well feel different in a year.

I'll also tell you as a single man that if you've got a good marriage, then you're not missing jack squat as far as "having a life" is concerned. I'd consider a good marriage a hell of a trade up from where I am now.

As far as children are concerned, I understand your feelings towards them. I had the same feelings right up until my sisters had their kids, and I will tell you that you have an incomplete picture of what love is until you hold a child of the next generation of your family in your arms. If I were through with school, married happily, and had a good job with a good future, I wouldn't be on here typing. I'd be offline trying to get a kid started.

[caledesi]

23. Compromise, compromise, compromise.

Instead of saying you want to wait 5 years, why not settle for 3 1/2 and see what she says. Be sure to cite your reasons and make sure they are cogent.

Case in point: My husband and I live in a l bedroom condo on the water. I wanted to move to a 2 bedroom when our land sells bec that's when we will get the $$$. My husband does not want to move, so we compromised. If I agree to stay here (it's a big condo), I am decorate til my heart's content. We are talking totally new kitchen with stainless fridge, range etc.

It worked and we are both at peace w/ it.

[Bunny]

24. Get a divorce.

Seriously. Get out while you are both young.

Her feelings about having babies will not change. Yours may, hers won't. Making her wait until you decide if you're ready, if ever, is cruel. As was prominsing her that you'd have kids, marrying her, taking her to live in a foreign country for two years, then suddenly saying *whoa, never mind, not interested*.

You are to be commended for recognizing your feelings before you actually brought an unwanted child into the world. Neither of you is going to "win" in this situation. Now cut her loose and let her go on to her future.

As a participant in a nearly identical situation some 20 years ago (okay, we didn't live in a foreign country, and we weren't in the military, but other than that it was pretty similar), I can assure you there is almost no other way out of this. Good luck to you both.

[retread]

25. You haven't told her how you feel. She has said if you don't give her

a child she'll find someone that would? Wow, sounds like she's a loving spouse and will make a fine mother!! Get professional help before bringing a child into this situation.

[Swamp Rat]

26. IF...

... you decide to divorce, go out into the world and explore. :) Learn other languages. Meet many many wonderful people... Make love with some of them. ;)

For me, having no children and getting a divorce after 5 years of marriage was the best decision I ever made. I immediately went to Barcelona and partied my ass off, then traveled throughout 4 continents (on very little money too). You will have a BLAST!!! :D

Let me know when you get to Brasil... tenho conselho pra você! ;)

[LadyLeo]

27. Heart to heart...

I would say that you two need to sit down and have a serious heart to heart discussion about your future. Try hard not to make rash decisions or let your decisions be made by "emotions", do your best to make rational, well thought out, and realistic plans. Your life plan should be in order, before kids are brought in to the picture.

That being said, if you did tell your wife that you wanted kids, Please try to see things from her point of view. Many women seriously hang their "worth" as a woman on motherhood. I think her saying that if you wouldn't that she would find someone who would, was her speaking out of hurt and her feelings of betrayal. If you two have a good solid marriage in every other way, I think you can both compromise, and come to a comfortable solution for you both.

I will stress one thing, though. To me you sound young, alive,vibrant and excited about your "new" life adventures and that is wonderful! But dont burn your bridges before you even get to them. You may feel differently in a year or two or four.

I really hope you two will seek help in dealing with your future together. I find it so sad that our society has become so "disposable". Marriage is a committment, a vow you both took, and should not be taken lightly.

If, however you find that your feelings do not change, and you truly do not want kids and feel that to have kids would change your feelings toward your wife, (resentment, anger, betrayal)then I believe that to bring children into this would be terribly cruel to the child, as well as your wife and yourself.

Search your heart, and most of all, turn TO each other, instead of away from each other. I truly believe from the bottom of my heart, that REAL love can conquer ANY problem. Yes, you must make compromises and concessions, but having and being a life partner who is 100% committed, no matter what, is a beautiful thing.

I wish you both luck, LL.

[American Tragedy]

36. I've never quite been able to relate to that.

It does seem that there are women who suspend their identities and self-worth on motherhood, but I've never really understood it. I've considered it occasionally, as one of many possibilities for my life, but it's never driven me the way it does some others. We're all different, I suppose.

[Allenberg]

30. To everyone who has responded...

thanks for the input. I just really need to sit down with my wife, and probably a counselor and get some issues on the table. The two good things I have going for me is that even though I am transitioning from miltiary to civillian life, financially, we're okay. I have a job waiting for me when I get out, and I'm going on leave in a week or so to sign some lease papers for an apartment.

Again, thanks guys for reminding me that I'm not the bad guy in this situation, and that it could be much worse. :)

[Jersey Devil]

34. Buy her a couple dogs

Tell her you want to practice on them for a while to find out if you'll be a good father. Then let them poop all over the house.

[HeyManThatsCool]

35. My opinion is

It's too bad that Scott Peterson never told his wife he didn't want kids.
If he had Laci would be alive today & probably out there finding her true soul mate... as opposed to lying in a grave with her unborn son.

I know you aren't some sociopathic freak who would rather kill his wife than have a child - but I think society puts too much pressure on having children.. even if you don't really WANT them. I wish more men (and women) could be honest about how they feel about parenthood & the decision to reproduce, as opposed to going along with what they think is expected of them. Thats part of the reason why child abuse is an epidemic in the world- along with the fact that the #1 killer of pregnant women is their significant other. Not to mention when one or the otherleaves BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T READY!!

Your 24 years old- not very old at all! Chances are at 29 or 30 you WILL want children... but if you don't, thats your choice! I have alot of respect for you that your coming out & saying how you feel instead of being railroaded into something you don't want. I don't think it is selfish- I think it's selfless. In the long run it would be the child who was hurt the most if you became a father simply to appease your wife.

If you love her, tell her how you feel. Better to have her go on & create the family that she wants than to get divorced later with a child in the picture because you hate each other.

Just my 2 cents.

Good Luck