No-haggling car prices: are they worth it?

[JVS]

I know people who swear by cars like Saturn and Scion because they love the one price policy. They say they like not having to worry about having to get a good deal. I'm not so sure. Do you guys think they are getting any better a deal than if they were to get another brand and bring it down to slightly below the sticker price?

[imenja]

1. It's not so much that it's a better deal

but that you save yourself the hassle of having to haggle with a slimy car salesperson. My father had a Saturn and he loved it. He has since gotten an Accura. I would think you probably want to base your decision on the car itself, unless you find comforting the idea of buying a car without negotiating. I doubt the deal is any better, unless you don't negotiate well and are likely to get taken by another car dealer.

[ProfessorGAC]

8. It Really Is A Better Deal For Most

My dad used to sell new cars. He was honest as the day is long, but he would never offer the least he could take first. That'd be kind of stupid.

He estimated that at least 2 out of 3 people accepted an offer somewhere between where he started and the floor. So, those 2 out of 3 paid somewhere between a little and a lot more for the car than they had to. (When i say a lot i'm talking around a grand. My dad sold mostly luxury cars.)

For the third of us who understand how to negotiate and understand the mark-ups and margins (thanks dad!), it doesn't offer much benefit, but it is good for lots of people.

Also, it depends on how much value one places on one's personal time. If i have to go to more than one dealership looking for the best deal, and it takes me an extra 3 or 4 hours to save $200, my free time better be worth less than $50 or $60 an hour. So, it kind of depends on what value one places on the time it takes to shop, dicker and settle.

Lastly, some folks just get way overwrapped when they are faced with negotiating. Avoiding that is worth something, financially, i would think.

So, for some folks it is a bargain.

BTW: Watch the slimy car salesmen stuff! My dad was not a slimy guy! Your brush is pretty wide.
The Professor

[trogdor]

10. Car Salesmen should be spayed or neutered.

Why should someone who has that kind of money to spend on something have to tolerate the kind of bullshit that goes on at a typical car dealership. I prefer my car salesmen on very short leashes, thank you very much.

[ProfessorGAC]

12. Another One Insulting My Dad

My dad was a very good man and an extremely honest car salesman. The broad brush is pissing me off!
The Professor

[SammyWinstonJack]

14. As is my husband

I don't like it either! :grr:

[ProfessorGAC]

16. Yeah, And My Dad's Dead! He Can't Defend Himself

So, i'll do it for him.
The Professor

[SammyWinstonJack]

18. No one is twisting your arm to buy and there are plenty of dealership

too choose from. Don't like the deal from one dealership, go to another. Pretty simple. I guess that car salesmen aren't allowed to make money? Most are paid minis on new car deals and what commissions they do make are back loaded, ie, warranties, after market add ons and such. You choose the deal you get. Again, no one is twisting your arm to buy. :eyes:

[JVS]

24. I'm pretty cool with car dealer salespeople

I don't care much if they want to try and sell me on a car, I think that I make up for it by occasionally going on test-drives when I really have no intention of buying a car.

[JVS]

2. Oops. I meant to post this in the lounge. Sorry folks

[YNGW]

3. Personally, I enjoy dickering over the price

That's half the fun of buying a new car. It's just like when you go to Mexico and you buy things at the open markets and stuff. It's fun to walk away and have them run after you to try and get you to stay.

[Bethany Rockafella]

6. Negotiating the price of a car is not fun to me.

It's too bad you don't live near me, when I buy my next car I'd take you with me. What I want to know is how much do you offer from the sticker price? Like if a car's sticker price is say $25,000, do you start off with offering them $22,000? There is one thing I know is, you negotiate better when you pay in cash and when you have perfect credit.

[YNGW]

11. Here's an easy solution.

If you have a particular model car you know you want, or even a couple you're trying to choose from, you can contact "Consumer Reports" and for a small fee you can obtain their review of the model and the price it cost the dealership for the car.

See, you have a base price, and then all the standard features, and then the options. Well, this sheet from CR tells you the base price from the factory, what is standard (no extra cost), and what the options cost the dealership. So, by knowing these prices, you can figure out what the car cost the dealership and then negotiate up. And the CR info tells you what to expect.

For a car that's priced at $25K, you offer cost + $200/$300. That's all. The dealership gets a 3% (or something like that) kickback from the manufacturer for ever car they sell. So, on a $25K car, they'll make in total around $1000, which is pretty normal. Dealerships make the bulk of their money in the service dept.

[woodsprite]

19. You do best when

you pay in cash if you can, have no trade, find your own financing if needed (unless they're offering a REALLY sweet deal that you can't pass up). Also, shop in the off season. Different types of cars have different off seasons (i.e don't buy a 4wd in winter). I have seen experiences where late day sales, end of month sales and messy weather sales have negotiated good deals. Especially if there has been a string of bad weather and it has slowed sales considerably. Alot of times in our area, when there is a string of slow sales, the sales people will be "drawing" on future sales inorder to get a paycheck and they are much more likely to negotiate or "throw in" some lower cost options to get you to sign.

[JVS]

26. I have heard that women and minorities often have a hard time with the...

process of negotiation. I've heard stories of people feeling that they were being steered away from cars that the dealer didn't think was right for them, or that the dealers would resist attempts to lower the price because they assumed that a female customer didn't know better.

[Bethany Rockafella]

4. I actually like that idea but you still wonder if it's not a rip off.

[terryg11]

5. everything is negotiable

I've heard the same about Saturn and Scion but the only way I would pay the sticker price sans negotiation is if I know the car would devalue at a lower rate than others in it's range and one hell of a service record ( car model history almost impeccable or a very good reputation of taking care of the car in the frst two years).

[imenja]

13. they don't negotiate

My father paid cash and still paid sticker price. My understanding is that it is like walking into a grocery store and buying a gallon of milk. The price is the price.

[ClassicDem]

7. I found the easiest way to buy a car is via fax.

In the fax I put down the specific make model and year of the vehicle that I am looking for along with each feature that I want. I then list two columns one for what the dealer's price was and one for what the manufacturers suggested retail price is and I go through listing every detailed price for every option I want. I do this to show the dealer that I know what I am talking about and I will not stand for any hidden fees.

I then fax this list too all the dealers within a 120 mile radius of where I live, in the fax I notify them that they along with all the other dealerships are receiving this fax and I will buy from the dealership who gives me the lowest price. I require them to fax back their prices no phone calls and no, "come on down and lets talk about it."

Once all the dealers fax me back I select the cheapest one, call them up letting them know I will be there the next day and to have the paperwork all ready for me so I can buy the car, I have not been at a dealership more than 30 minutes using this method.

[shoelace414]

9. Interesting method

[Bethany Rockafella]

20. I like that method. Thanks for the tip.

[woodsprite]

15. We just bought a trailer

$36800 MSRP. Got a quote from a web wholesaler who gets his units direct from factory, delivers it wherever you want (or you can pick it up at the factory), has a 2yr warranty, and is serviceable at any authorized service center. Price was quoted as $23000. We took both figures to a local dealer and said "high price, low price -- come in somewhere in between". Guess they were afraid because they came in at $25000. You know they would still have been making money if they came in at the $23000, but we didn't feel like haggling AND the salesperson was really nice.

Sticker prices mean diddly-squat!!! I worked in two car dealerships previously (title clerk and accounting clerk) and I am familiar with some of the underhanded price inflation that goes on. I quit because the one dealership was using my parents names on warranty claims and they had never dealt with that dealer and never owned that type of car. Some salesmen actually laugh about how much they take the customer for after the customer leaves. After dealing with MOST car sales people, I feel like I have to go home and disinfect myself. If I found a good saleperson I liked, I would definitely stick with him, even if it meant changing dealerships.

Last time we purchased a car, I went in almost aggressively (I'm not aggressive, but I was authoritative - meaning "deal with me, not my husband") said "We want a Gold Stratus, extended warranty, 60 month financing, no fabric coat, rustproofing or soundproofing (90% of the vehicles are done when they're unloaded - you're just paying for the warranty paperwork - at the time that was an additional $1500), and we want it for $xxx per month. (we had done our research on line and in the newspaper ads) One dealer wouldn't let us see him figure the price/monthly payment and said it had to be financed thru their special finance program. Did that once and ended up paying approx 17% interest for a used car. We walked out of that dealer. Went to the next dealer, told him exactly what we wanted and they laughed at us. I said "OK, we can be at XXX dealer in 20 min. Let's go." So we did. Walked into that dealership. They took us out to their lot with a flashlight to find a gold one, they said "Get out your checkbook". Not only did we get what we wanted, but they knocked $3000 off the price of the car and gave us 2% financing for the 60 months, and the bumper to bumper warranty was for 72 months.

Just wanted to share my experience --- I *HATE* most of the car dealers I've dealt with with a passion. As in all things, there are good and bad apples.


*******
Edited to reiterate that I'm talking about my area, and the car dealers I've dealt with, and the fact I didn't just pick a price out of thin air.

[movie_girl99]

17. we looked at a saturn SUV

and wanted the base that we saw on the Saturn website. We went to the local dealer and test drove one and loved it. It came time to talk numbers and we just wanted the basic one with power etc..but not the bells and whistles ie low jack, pinstriping etc...the dealer said that they dont let them off the lot like that. We said fuck you very much and bought a VW instead.

[Bozita]

21. Try an auto broker for the best prices

They have the connections with a variety of dealerships.

I'm a haggler, and it's tough to beat the deal from my broker.

[patcox2]

22. If you want to give up your right to negotiate a better deal, its OK.

The way it is now, if you go in knowing what you want and what it costs, you can get a good deal and make sure you don't pay too much. You can find out dealer cost on any vehicle in 10 minutes on the internet. Everyone is allowed to make a profit, so bargain for $500 more than cost. They'll take it. On a 20,000 car thats a markup of 2.5%. Compare that to any other high-ticket item, like jewelry or furs or even houses.

On the other hand, if you are kinda dumb and wander in not knowing what you want and get dazzled by some shiny car and you just want it, you might pay $3,000 or $4,000 more. Too bad, thats what you get for being dumb.

Because in the end, if you are going prohibit the bargaining just because its unplesant, it means you will pay more than you should, if you are smart, and less than you should if you are dumb. Because the reason a dealer can sell you a car at $300 over cost is because he is looking at his average profit, not the profit on any one deal, and for every person who gets a good deal, there will be someone else who pays more. So when you mandate one price, youa re rewarding the dumb and penalizing the smart.

Thats fine, if thats what you want. Its kinda like handicapping horses, putting more weight on the fast ones so they are more burdened. Hey, lets take it all the way, lobotomies for the over-intelligent, dumb everyone down to the least common denominator, that way the salespeople won't be sharp either, everyone will be on a level playing field. It would be an interesting world.

[TreasonousBastard]

23. Probably...

because the car companies aren't putting that much dealer profit into the sticker price any more, so there's less room to negotiate. Some foreign and luxury brands allot cars to dealers, so they have no incentive to haggle, knowing that they can't get replacements to sell at sticker. And, there are those popular models that have those "second stickers."

More to the point-- do you like the car, and how do you like it compared to other cars at the same purchase price?

Even Saturn has annual sales to get stuff off the floor. The local dealer had "$5,000 off" signs all over the lot last year.

[JVS]

25. I'm not shopping for a car, I'm just considering the system

I guess I'm really just wondering if there is a Chevy and a Saturn built on the same basic platform, whether the Saturn is going to be competitive with the Chevy