Guys, apparently I caused us the election.

[terrya]

Apparently there's a school of thought here at Democratic Underground tonight that I, as a gay man, caused us the election. I just don't know what to say.

I'm tired of being angry tonight. Good night.

[bigwillq]

1. I thought you were going to bed 2 hrs. ago

Have a good sleep.

And please don't ever blame your self cause if your to blame, then I am too!:hug:

[Bjornsdotter]

2. NOT TRUE!

No, nej, non!

Absolutely not! 59 million stupid, small minded people cost us the election.

I will stand shoulder to shoulder with you in this fight....equal rights for all..no exceptions.

Hugs,
Kim :hug:

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

6. NOT TRUE EITHER!

Warren O'Dell cost you the election! And he TOLD he was going to do it!

[truhavoc]

3. Kerry cost us the election by not standing up for you

I would much rather have a candidate that stands up for what he truly believes, instead of trying to pander to the "undecideds"! This is exactly what the right does and we need to fight back...good night, tomorrow is another day!~

[Lefta Dissenter]

4. sorry, terrya

you don't get to take credit for that.

The homophobic assholes do.

Have a sweet sleep. :hug:

[JimmyJazz]

5. no no no no no - you will not let the opinions of a few closed minded

ass clowns dictate your life. I will not let you do this. I swear. There are 50,000 plus people here Terry and I will not let you group all of us in with a two or three assholes who don't know any better. I know you are angry and upset, but we are, too. Fuck it. Don't insult 50,0000 of us because one or two are wearing tin foil hats. Please. You know us better than that!

[freetobegay]

7. I have to share the blame with you also!

[terrya]

15. No, my friend. You most certainly do NOT.

I'm more pissed at myself for getting down last night.

[johnnie]

8. BS

You did no such thing. And if it takes losing an election because we all believe in equal rights for every single person in the Country, then I will lose every fucking election till I die.

[sundog]

9. fuck it terrya, don't let em get you down...

No one is to blame, yet everyone has a finger to point. We did our absolute best under the circumstances and YES we made progress (as much as some would like to deny it).

Now we have to reorganize & move on. Gay Democrats are not going away. We are here to stay.

I just hope we don't spend the next month finger pointing when we could be tackling issues. Take it easy, get some rest. Tomorrow will be better :hi:

[Politicub]

10. You need to get off that cross, because somebody else needs the wood.

Geez.

Get some thicker skin. People are venting. The vast majority of folks here are great. The flames of bigotry have been stoked by the right -- don't play into their designs.

[freetobegay]

11. Trust me we would love nothing better but to get off that cross!

[terrya]

14. I should NEVER have bailed last night. The bigots here can..

go fuck themselves.

I've fucking had it with these people on Democratic Underground who are scapegoating gay people right now. If they do NOT believe unequivocally for full equality for ALL Americans, then they are bigots. And that most definitely includes gay marriage. I'm getting fucking sick and tired of the appeasers out there who would deny us our right to legally marry. I like Barack Obama, but Barack Obama will deny us our right to legally marry. Well, guess fucking what....FUCK BARACK OBAMA. If he opposes gay marriage and he would deny us our legal rights to marry, well then he is a hateful bigot. Pure and fucking simple. And that includes everyone else in this country and everyone else here.

[Politicub]

33. This isn't an abstract logic problem

This is real, and real people's lives are involved.

My partner and I would treasure some of the rights we would get with civil unions. Of course I support full marriage rights for gays and lesbians. I think that is what we eventually will get.

I refuse to throw the baby out with the bathwater, though.

[Skittles]

12. STOP IT TERRYA

STICK AROUND AND FIGHT THOSE STUPID ASSHOLES. WE WILL KICK THEIR ASS.

[terrya]

23. Skittles, I signed that beautiful "My Name Is' post on here.

I'm not going anywhere, my friend. I WILL fight them.

A fitful night of sleep last night has only made me PISSED.

[Skittles]

26. well OK then

ya know, I just cannot sign that thread. I know I'm being a coward but I am in republican hell here and there is only ONE person with my last name in all of Texas. I feel bad but I cannot do it.

Terrya, real, true Democrats would never even CONSIDER some of the things I am seing suggested here. We have got to ride this out and get stronger - it's our only choice.

Skittles
standing with her gay and lesbian brothers and sisters - always have, always will

[Kber]

13. A party that doesn't stand up for equal rights for all

if worthless to all. I'm a straight, suburban, white, middle class mom and I promise that if the party walk away from you, I walk away from them. Winning would be empty if it means loosing our soul in the process. (Couldn't compete with the fundies on that score anyway.)

[Spider Jerusalem]

16. Don't you mean "cost"?

And it's not true, anyway. What cost us the election was the abject stupidity and ignorance of a tremendous percentage of the populace. Personally, I'm of the opinion that if these people have a problem with the American principle of equal rights under the law for all, they should move somewhere more congenial. Like, say, Saudi Arabia or China.

[terrya]

17. I said that when I was tired and dejected last night, Spider.

And sleep didn't do anything but get me pissed off at the homophobic bullshit I saw last night at DU.

[Spider Jerusalem]

18. I'm sorry, man.

I know it's hard to ignore, but just try not to pay attention to it. People are going to be attacking everyone they think might be responsible for the election results in the coming days. The old circular firing squad. Just try to remember that these people are not worthy of your notice, and if they can honestly blame the way the election turned out on gays, then they should be beneath your contempt as well. Such ignorance is to be pitied more than anything.

[Deja Q]

19. I hear ya. It's stinging to be betrayed like this.

:hug: :pals:

[ScreamingMeemie]

21. No betrayal...Hypno. Not from me, not from most of us. Hang in there.

I've got your back...for realsies. :hug: This is killing me. I cannot imagine how you must feel right now.

[ScreamingMeemie]

20. No, Terry, you have more than ever before, given us something worth

fighting for. We're not going to let you down. We'll see this through. We'll irradicate the ignorance of this country and some of our fellow DUers. You deserve every darned right that I have has a straight, married woman...and I intend to see that you get that. Don't give up sweetie, okay? :hug:

[terrya]

22. Thank you, my kind, good friend.

I fear for this country, Mrs. Grumpy. I am scared to death and angry and just unbelivably saddened at what will happen in these next 4 years.

I won't give up, sweetie. I won't.

:hug: and thank you.

Terry

[AlienGirl]

24. I FOR ONE WILL NOT CATER TO BIGOTRY!

I am fed up with the attitude that we should cater to bigotry so our party can win. I will not abandon the progressive cause, and I will not shut up so that bigots can feel more comfortable.

Tucker

[Aunt Anti-bush]

25. I certainly don't feel that way.

Don't let them get you down. People are just angry as hell and don't know where to point their feelings right now. We luv ya.

[Iris]

27. Fuck them. I've said it before and I'll say it again,

the day the Dems seriously leave the glbt community out to dry is the day I'm through with the Dems.

I'l write in votes if I have to.

[Magrittes Pipe]

28. Bigots cost us this election.

Bigoted Republicans who came out in droves to vote for hate-laws (and voted for Bush while they were at it), as well as bigoted Democrats who didn't do enough to stop them (and in too many cases voted with them).

There are bigots and idiots in both parties. But you know what? We don't need the bigots on our side. We don't need them to win. All we need is for all Americans who are NOT hateful litte sacks of shit to get out and vote.

I'm sure this article has already been posted today, but it's worth another read: http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2004/11/05/gay_marriage/index.html

[Jersey Devil]

29. You probably did - if you work for Diebold

We cannot allow hate and bigotry to rule and must constantly stand and fight it. Someone, can't remember who, said "I would rather be right than President" and though that may not console many here right now, when time passes and they step back and think about it, it is the right thing.

[guitar man]

30. screw that

You did no such thing. The election is the result of frightened cowards who can't think for themselves. They are frightened by terra, frightened by liberals and frightened by gay people. Just generally frightened by anything that doesn't fit into the agenda that AM radio and Fox Snooze thinks up for them to consume.

I am an Oklahoman. I drive a big pickup truck, wear flannel shirts, own guns and hunt and fish etc. Guess what? When they put their damn "Jim Crow" anti-gay marriage amendment on our ballot, I walked into the voting booth and voted NO on the damn thing. If a redneck like me from the reddest state on the map can stand with you, there is hope for this nation yet. Just hang on, stay strong and don't let the bastards get you down.

[LisaLynne]

31. BS

People always want to blame something. You know, it's the same thing that happened with women's suffrage. Instead of including rights for people of color, the white women's suffrage movement broke off, thinking it would be easier to win without bringing race into it. Well, that was wrong and history has judged it so. I, for one, am not willing to let the progressive movement make the same mistake again. Until we are all equal and have the legal rights to back us up, none of us are equal or free. I mean that.

[Bertha Venation]

32. I did, too, Terry. It's my fault. How fucking dare I demand equality.

end of fucking message.

[redqueen]

34. NO YOU DIDN'T

GOD I'm sick of this stupid fucking centrist BULLSHIT.

:argh:

[tjwash]

35. It's bullshit that people even THINK that way my friend.

The blame rests solely on the feet of a weak kneed Democratic party that has failed us constantly the past four years, the least of their travesties being trotting out as candidates in the last two elections, two career ass kissing yes men who would not turn around and fight if they were getting beaten over the head with their own missing spines.

[amandae]

36. You didn't cost us the election ...

Kerry ran a great campaign, although people will pick him apart, too. Maybe there were things that could have been done differently, but he didn't do a horrible job.

The big problem is with the Democratic party in general. We need to figure out our weaknesses and work on them before 2006 elections.

Gay men did not cost us this election. I agree with the others who posted that bigotry definately did.

:hug:

[tjwash]

38. Like HELL he ran a great campaign...

...that was the sorriest damn campaign I have ever seen. The guy went Mike Dukakis on everyone, posing for those stupid pictures and acting like a stoned teenager in a Mountain Dew commercial, refusing to nip the Catholic Church thing off in the bud, refusing to answer the swift boat lies, shamelessly pandering to his group of corporations and special interest groups, and on, and on, and on...

The main reason we lost the election, is that the American people are comprised mostly of rural religiously intolerant flag waving jingoistic anti-environment homophobic racists, and just flat out selfish. The shrub campaign tapped into that, and rode it to the finish line. I voted for Kerry, not because I respect, or admire him, but because he was NOT the representative of all of that. Lets face it, he hasn't put up a fight on ANYTHING in the four years that dubya and his cohorts have been raping and pillaging the country, so did anyone honestly expect him to start now?

[amandae]

41. I'll agree with some of what you wrote

but I seriously doubt Kerry's campaign is the "sorriest" campaign. He didn't do a horrible job! We can't blame him entirely for the loss, because he really didn't screw up in ways that were fatal to his winning the election.

I agree with you completely that Dems lost because of religion in rural parts of America. I believe the reports about "values" being a large part of what this election was about. And for some reason, more people share values with a crack-loving, drunk-driving lush than with someone who has a remarkable history of service to this country. I do think that the Democrat party needs to reexamine itself though, too. People don't want to be associated with being Democrat (even if they're on the fence), especially in rural areas. Why is that? Could it have something to do with Dems publically putting them down instead of "courting" them like Clinton did? I don't know ... but I honestly DON'T think we can blame the loss of the election entirely on Kerry and his campaign when I think the Dem party in general needs to really reexamine itself and pull together more before the next election.

Maybe we have a hard time doing that because we don't follow blindly like the repugs, which really is great that we're not a bunch of sheep ... it's just not going to help us win any elections anytime soon. We need to figure out a different strategy that will work for this party.

[niwi]

37. omg

YOU SON OF A BITCH!


Just kidding. Ignore those people, seriously. *hug*

[NoPasaran]

39. You mean you're Mary Beth Cahill?

Damn you! Damn you to Hell!
SARCASM

[demigoddess]

40. you cost us the election or you caused us to lose the election?

which is it?

[terrya]

42. Neither It was a reaction to what was going on at GD Bloodletting...

last night. Some hellacious stuff. I overreacted last night.

[demigoddess]

44. oh boy

Have you graduated high school yet. My post was sarcasm at your lack of spelling and writing skill.Compared to that orientation is a small thing.

[redqueen]

45. WTF?

:eyes:

[terrya]

46. Excuse me, but what the fuck is this?

How about punctuation, dear? Question marks are our friends. And spaces between words work, also.

End of talking to you, dear. I've had enough bullshit for one day.

[Lerkfish]

43. why blame homosexuals for homophobic hatred? that's odd, and WRONG.

That's like blaming Jews for Hitler's anti-semitism.

the real thing is this was a victory for homophobia, intolerance and hatred, pure and simple, masqueraded as "moral values".

they're sick fucks, these religious right zombies. Don't take THEIR sins, or blame, nor allow others to do so.

If anything, I think people MEAN to say that this issue caused rightwingers who MIGHT NOT have come out to vote for Bush, to come out with a vengeance. That's all.

It was orchestrated Rovian hatemongering. You had no part of it.