Can anybody find one thing that they LIKE about the DLC?

[Dob Bole]

I'm personally not fond of Gore or Lieberman. But those are just two members of the DLC. To reverse some of our negativity and become HAPPY people, name something that you like about the DLC. (Remember, we have to live with them, because 39% of Dems are moderate and 17% are conservative. The DLC outnumbers us, regardless of whether a single person on this board would vote for Lieberman. I don't think that's really going to be a problem, though.)

[Fixated]

1. ...

Yeah, they're actually aware that centrists win elections. A lot of prominent leftists support the DLC because that's the basic strategy of both parties: shift to the center, at least for the election.

[w4rma]

7. The DLC knows how to fundraise from granting favors to big corporations

Big corporations want regulations that protect the environment, consumers and their smaller competitors watered down or revoked. The DLC helps do this for campaign funds.

This is their version of moderation. It's they aren't taking the moderate voters' position, they are moderating between what the voters want and what their big buisness contributors want.

[Clete]

11. So according to you

we are supposed to abandon the DEM party and all it stands for because centrists win elections? No wonder the ammoral Repukes have outmaneuvered us.

[Fixated]

14. ...

Oh please. First of all, liberal economic policies are generally easy to push (excluding tax raises, which will be all but necessary after Bush's term). If you want to run outspoken liberals like Kucinich who will never win elections, have fun. But eventually, after the Republicans have their fourth or fifth straight president in office, you'll move to the center again. Stick by your values all you want, but I'd rather win elections.

[Clete]

45. Well, I favor Dean,

but I'd like to see Kucinich as VP candidate. Then he will have a chance in 2012.

[JohnKleeb]

51. You know what I would have loved Clete

but it wont ever happen unless its October 25th 2002 and I am noob DUer and I am dreaming. Wellstone/Kucinich only in dreams though I would love to see Kucinich become president.

[DagmarK]

17. The DLC is NOT the Democratic Party......

It's a little club (of corporatists, btw) that emerged in the last 10 years as a buddy to the republican corporatist crowd.

Abandoning the DLC is NOT abandoning the democratic party. And anyone foolish enough not to make the distinction needs to do some homework.

[dolstein]

21. The DU is NOT the Democratic Party . . .

It's a little club (of socialists, btw) that emerged in the last five years as a buddy of the socialist Naderite crowd.

Abandoning the DU is NOT abandoning the democratic party. And anyone foolish enough not to make the distinction needs to do some homework.


I can understand how making wildy inaccurate generalizations might make you feel better, but how about trying the truth sometime?

[CWebster]

18. Not when they attack moderate centrists

and advocate for Repuke imitators.

That's too extreme. You don't triangulate or compromise with radical ideologues.

[MissouriTeacher]

2. I could be wrong, but...

I don't think even the DLC want Lieberman as president, do you?

[vi5]

3. I like that they want to see democrats elected.....

Despite what many people on here say.
They wanted to see Bill Clinton elected. So did I.
They wanted to see Al Gore elected. So do I.
They want a democrat to win in '04. So do I.
All the rest is just chatter and noise.

[CWebster]

20. They think lieberman can win?

Right, they want to win...

[GreenArrow]

41. Downbound Train

Was glad to see Clinton defeat Bush, but I didn't vote for him. Didn't and wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.

Preferred Gore to Bush, but since I was in a safe Bush state, I was able to vote for Nader, whom I prefered to both of the above.

In 2004, I want someone who is not beholden to the noxious corporate oligarchy that is squeezing the life out of us all. I'm tired of charismatic liars of both parties. I could rant on for pages, but why bother... When the day is done, we'll get the same namby pamby, pandering, hoodwinking swindlers from both parties, with the same oily smiles, the same empty promises...Sure, if it comes down to it, I'll vote for the Democratic candidate, even Lieberman, but we'll still be riding the same train, heading down the same track, and hurting towards the same destination; the only thing different is a rather sickly hope that the Democrat will put on the breaks when heading around the curves.

[DagmarK]

4. I like that the fact that they didn't used to be in existence........

and are a rather new entity and we therefore have a better chance to shut their asses down.

And, no, they don't seem too interested in getting REAL dems elected.

[Clete]

5. Not me.

However unlike the Republicans, they haven't signed the pact with Satan yet.

I wish I could find the article I read in the newspaper about three weeks ago written by a member of the DLC. (The author's name, which escapes me, was noted as being a chairman of the DLC.) It was a big love fest on how wonderful Arial Sharon is and why everything he is doing to the Palestinians is because he really is working for peace. :puke:

[kayell]

6. hmmmmm

thinking
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
thinking
.
.
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.
.
still thinking

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

8. The name?

:shrug:

[Aidoneus]

9. same thing I like about W

actively uniting the Left against them with their destructive bumbling.

[BurtWorm]

10. In all seriousness: Bill Clinton

He wasn't the great progressive president Sidney Blumenthal makes him out to be, and he made numerous mistakes in foreign policy in particular, and capitulated too much to Republicans and corporations on domestic policy. But he is a brilliant politician and a reassuringly intelligent man. And I would much rather have Clinton betraying the left now and again from the White House than Bush betraying the Constitution all the time.

[Doctor_J]

12. They tend

to vote Democratic, and have lots of money. Those two are a nice combination to help our cause.

They are pushing their candidates now, but will support Wes Clark when the time comes.

[dolstein]

13. Yeah - DLC members can get elected in areas that aren't solidly Democratic

How many liberal Democrats do you know who could get elected to statewide office in Indiana? No liberal has represented Indiana in the Senate since Birch Bayh was defeated in 1980. Who'd you rather have in the Senate -- Dan Quayle or Evan Bayh?

How many liberal Democrats do you know who could get elected governor of Virginia? It took a moderate like Mark Warner to break the Republican winning streak.

The fact is, outside of the Northeast, the Northwest and urban Congressional districts, the choice typically comes down to between a right-wing Republican and a moderate Democrat. You can whine all you want, but whining isn't going to change the facts.

[Doctor_J]

26. Ah...some sanity in a DLC thread

dolstein comes through with some actual realistic analysis of the situation. Replacing Evan Bayh, Holy Joe, Zell, Pryor, Daschle, Graham, and Baucus with 7 Kucinich's isn't an option. It's either them or Repubs, period, at least for now. They are what stands between Smirk and a filibuster-proof GOP majority in the Senate. Stop wishing they would go away.

The Other Jeff

[LynneSin]

28. Tom Daschle has never been a member of the DLC

The rest of the list is and your point was quite accurate when saying that in some parts of the country moderate democrats seem to be the only way we can get a "D" to win in those states.

However (and this is a pet peeve of mine), Dashle has never been a member of the DLC. He, along with Joe Biden, tend to get lumped in there and bitched out as a DLC sellout. If you want to bitch about the DLC members from SD or DE folks will have to whine either about Tim Johnson or Tom Carper.

[LynneSin]

33. Ok, something good about the DLC

First, all those DLCers will vote for a democrat to be the Majority leader. And as I mentioned earlier in a post, Tom Daschle is NOT a member of the DLC.

Second, (as mentioned in an earlier post), many times a moderate is the only way we can beat these neo-cons in some of the middle states in our country. When we had the majority back in 2001-2002, we did accomplishment many things. Sure, that whole War issue sucked (and there were DLCers that voted against the war), but we WERE able to keep those horrible judicial nominees off of the senate floor since all the Dems in the Judicial committee (including DLCers like Kerry and Feinstein) stuck together and voted against the hard core nominees.

Sure, Zell Miller sucks at being a democrat, but Zell will still count for a "D" in our column and can usually be Xed out by some super moderate republican like Lincoln Chafee.

I would love to move this party to the left, but to be honest, it'll be a hell of alot easier if we had a Dem in the White House and even a dem like Joe Lieberman will make it easier.

The republicans created a smart plan to take back the country and all this nitpicking within our party isn't going to help us reverse this trend. The repukes (neo-con ones that is) first ran local neo-cons for every office out there they could find like School Board, County Commisioner, City Board, Insurance Board, you name it. Next thing you know, your next door neighbor is an elected politicians and since you know your neighbor you figure the party can't be THAT bad. Second thing the republicans did is just ignore anyone who didn't follow their neo-con ideologies. It still is a hoot that 5-term senior senator Arlen Specter of PA gets no respect because of his moderate voting record. But in comes neo-con Rick Sanatarium and in a few years BEFORE his first re-election his given a leadership position in the republican party. Then they found themselves a presidental candidate with name recognition. Since there was no one from the Reagan family that was feasible (Ron & Patti were too critical of the family's politics, Maureen had health problems and Michael well, he was just too loopy - would have been like running Rush Porkbaugh), they went to the Bush family and found two OTHER brothers (believe me they weren't considering Neil) and got them governor positions in hopes of lining them up for presidential runs. Of course the plan was Jeb would run and Texas would be fixed, cept Jeb lost in 1994 and that idiot didn't.

Anyhow, personally the DLC does not phase me. They have some good ideas and some real crappy ones. They use a think tank that has someone who signed PNAC (which wasn't the leader of the think tank, just someone who wrote some policy papers) and although I'm bugged by that, the PNAC guy is NOT DLC and I'm sure many DLC Dems want to distance themselves from this one guy.

But there are bigger fish to fry in this sea and that fish is Bush. When he's out of office I'll worry about cleaning up the senate.

[StandWatie]

52. not so fast..

Joe won his seat by running to the rightof the incumbent, not a little right either, you would have thought you were in bizzaro world given the issues and positions they took.

He won because democrats traded the hope that they could win that damn election no matter what it cost for people smart enough to abandon a candidate for ideology. It wasn't that it was some conservative hotspot, it just had the equivalent of Joe residing there as a Republican so in the end it's a loss.

[alfredo]

15. snappy dressers and

they know the best caterers.

[RandomKoolzip]

16. That they aren't ACTUALLY nazis?!

Best I could come up with. Maybe they all have nice, minty breath, who knows?

[Liberal Veteran]

19. They don't eat kittens for breakfast.

There. I said something nice about the DLC.

[Walt Starr]

22. No n/t

[Beacho]

23. outnumber us?

"The DLC outnumbers us, regardless of whether a single person on this board would vote for Lieberman."


I don't think so. The DLC represents the upper crust of the party and is a conduit for selling said leadership to the highest bidder for corporate sponsorship.

They only outnumber us 'hoi polloi' in dollars, not bodies.


P.S.(on edit) No, I have nothing nice to say about the DLC. Might as well ask for my endorsement of the Vichy government.

[kayell]

34. Vichy Democrats

the PERFECT name for the DLC. Thank you Beacho.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

46. Perfect!

And, of course, their initials would be "V.D.".

[bluestateguy]

24. pro-gun

But that is about it. I actually consider myself an ex-DLCer. Their problem tends to be that they get the willies at the idea of populism. Instead, they like blow dried, boring candidates that are groomed for the dingbat soccer Mom at home. Bill Clinton was not that type of candidate, and he could appeal to the DLC and the liberals at the same time. The DLC in the post Clinton era has done nothing but piss me off, however.

[robcon]

25. The DLC is the best way for Democrats to win in '04.

I agree with their emphasis on winning, and their ideological flexibility to insure that a Democrat wins.

[LynneSin]

27. Debbie Stabenow, Maria Cantwell, and Mary Landrieu

Just to name a few of the US Senators that I like and are also DLC. Sen. Stabenow has a great liberal voting record and personally all three are great when it comes to Women's issues.

Also not listed but I'm somewhat of a fan of is of course my own DLC senator Tom Carper. He's not as liberal as Biden, but he's always voted with the filibusters on the bad judges so for now he's not on my shit lists. Ironically I can't tell you how many times I'll see folks bitch out Biden and call him a DLCer: Joe has never been a member of the DLC. In fact, it's a little irritating when I see bitchings about democratic senators we tend to call them DLC even if they aren't.

http://www.ndol.org/new_dem_dir.cfm

For a list of the DLC members - you have to do a search

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

40. Maria's my senator

and I was happy to help her get elected. I sent her a letter after her pro-bush war vote and informed her that she could kiss my support goodbye. Fortunately, we do have one good senator in Patty Murray.

Think again about Cantwell, just another go-along sellout.

[Capn Sunshine]

29. THEY HAVE A PLAN BEYOND " LET'S RAIL AGAINST THOSE GUYS!"

The 2004 election isn't just a choice between two parties; it's a choice between two centuries. The outcome next year will tell us whether the 21st century will be another American Century, blessed with broad prosperity and an expanding middle class at home, and the projection of American strength and democratic values abroad. Or it will tell us we're returning to an America of privilege and exploitation like the latter part of the 19th century.

Some Democrats have echoed Ralph Nader's argument that there is little difference between the two parties -- Bush and Bush Lite. They could not be more wrong. The differences between the parties are not just their programs; they are profound differences of principle and purpose.
<snip>

At a recent DLC meeting, Bill Clinton -- the last Democrat to beat an incumbent president -- outlined a three-part strategy for how a candidate could do it again: 1) reassure voters that he'll keep what they like about George W. Bush's policies; 2) tell them some things they don't know about George W. Bush -- and wouldn't like if they did; and 3) show that he'll give them what a second Bush administration won't.

Clinton remarked, "This is not rocket science. In 1992, I said: 'Look, I'll have a strong America, we'll represent your values, we'll be strong on crime, we'll be for preferring work over welfare. By the way, we'll bring the American economy back, we'll do it in a way that preserves the environment, we'll move more poor people into the middle class. ' The message was, we'll give you what you like about the other guys, and we'll give you these things that they won't give you. This is not complicated."

STEP # 1: Match Bush's Strength on National Security
STEP #2: Make Bush Run on His Record -- It's Worse Than People Think
STEP # 3: Tell America What We'll Do Better
STEP # 4: Be Patient -- A Year Is a Lifetime in Politics
STEP # 5: Let Hunger for a Better President Trump Anger Toward This One

This is directly from www.ndol.com

Please note these are not "marching orders"
these are not "requirements"
It's just a plan. its one of many plans. Its the DLC's plan.

But it's a PLAN.

Does it sound EVIL to you?

[charlie]

31. Plan beyond railing against which guys?

The Bushites or Howard Dean supporters?

[Capn Sunshine]

32. READ the article!

as a Dean supporter I take no umbrage to the we need to be cenntrist comments.

I figure they were meant for the Greens.

( just wanted to start a flame war)

[CWebster]

35. Then listen to Deans take

rather than Clinton's.

The point is that Dean is capable of attracting voters from all over the political spectrum--except the widely publicized leadership of a narrow reformist organization that weilds undue influence in the party.

If you want to use it as a vehicle, fine, but just make sure it isn't running over your objective.

[charlie]

39. Dean IS a centrist

And somehow he's managed to attract the vociferous support of some of the most liberal of Democrats (AND non-Democrats), the sort of thing the DLC considers magical about Bill Clinton. Yet, they've steadfastly been gunning down his candidacy. They're not just offering advice, and it's not directed at the Greens (or Democrats sympathetic to Green issues), it's directed at Howard Dean. They want your man outta the race. Browse the site, read the articles, and remember that a number of them weren't just printed in the DLC's little corner of the web, but in national publications.

[Walt Starr]

44. EXACTLY!!!!

Hey, I'm a very liberal guy. I knew Clinton was not a liberal and I know Dean is not a liberal, but I supported Clinton and I currently support Dean.

Fuck the DLC if they want to go hard right, which is where they are trying to position the party.

[Walt Starr]

36. Actions speak louder than words

Slamming Dean has moved me away from ever supporting a DLC candidate.

[whoYaCallinAlib]

37. I completely support their plan.

Bush-bashing is fun but we have to do much, much more to gain the support of those middle class and suburban voters we need to win the WH.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

43. Sounds like a "Plan to destroy the Democratic Party"

"Match Bush's strength(?) on national security"

More for the defense(?) department is a Democratic ideal?

Right. Their "plan" is to make Democrats even more like the republicans than they are now.

Does it sound evil to me? Yes. Wanting to make our party a clone of the republiclowns is evil.

[stickdog]

53. This leaves Bush with his only card, his War on Terror trump card.

Since he's lost this "war" miserably and make Americans far LESS SAFE and SECURE worldwide, he hasn't earned and should not be given a free ride on this issue just because the "patriotic" media and the "rally 'round the flag" phenomenon has so far fooled many less informed Americans into supporting an ATROCIOUS foreign policy based on graft, greed and the national security of Israel.

[Forkboy]

30. DLC...it's easy to pronounce

:)

[FubarFly]

38. They'll blink first.

DLC'ers will be in Howard Dean's camp a lot quicker than Dean supporters
will ever be in the DLC's.

When the will of the people becomes strong enough, they will bend rather than break.

[Freddie Stubbs]

42. One of their members got elected President twice

Anybody remember him?

[whoYaCallinAlib]

47. Amen brother!

How quickly we forget. Greatest president in history.

[ulysses]

48. yup

The premier politician of our age got elected to the presidency twice. Color me impressed.

[robbedvoter]

49. Unlike some of their attackers, they want bush out

Some of their stands on the economy are valid. That concludes my reasons to like them. I am however in the strange position to defend them sometimes, because of the utterly unhinged attacks from some here. For me, the enemy is in the WH

[stickdog]

50. Their idiocy backfires on them a lot. (NM)

[Gringo]

54. NO.

And disliking the DLC, or the Republican Party desn't make me "negative" or "unhappy".

I'm sick of being told that I should like/accept things that I know to be bad.

I would vote DLC candidate if he got the nomination (except for Lieberman), but don't ask me to praise the DLC. THeir only victory was Clinton's election, and I truly believe that was 90% Clinton and his massive charims & competence, NOT his conservative leanings.

[drdigi420]

55. They don't have a Bush on the membership list

That's about it.

Otherwise, they are more of the same corruption. THey just hide it a little better than the Bushies.