Presidential radio address. God's purpose is justice. WTF?

[spanone]

Bush just said that "God's purpose is justice" Where the f*ck did this convoluted idea of God come from???? I've never heard this kind of crap before. We are no better than those we would kill for their religious beliefs.

[Military Brat]

1. At least he didn't say "God's purpose is revenge"

bush is such an idiot. Now all the critical thinkers will be reaching for their biblical references, researching the best way to refute him. All the fundies will be dancing in their living rooms, celebrating their false prophet.

[Fovea]

13. Sadly, he did.

Bush cannot differentiate between revenge and justice.
Both words describe the family predilection for screwing anyone who has proved to be less than servile, or useful.

Next in line-- 'Bandar Bush'.

[vanityfair]

2. Amen spanone!

* sounds just as fanatical as some of the groups he is targeting. Obviously, he doesn't know the same God that I do.

[Jazzgirl]

3. He must've talked to Graham right before the speech.

:evilgrin:

[kalian]

4. So...he's doing "god's work" here in earth....?

Is that it? OK, if he likes religion so friggin much, why doesn't
he go and become a monk or something. :mad:

[aquart]

5. Just proves Bush and God have never met.

[spanone]

6. God must be crying.

[BeatleBoot]

7. Don't you know that God speaks to him?

Sure as shit.

God, the Almighty, speaks to the un-elected, AWOL fraud and told him that.

I guarantee!

[Torrey Pines]

34. I wonder if he really thinks that,

because if he did, wouldn't he have to wonder why he always feels so confused? I mean, really, if you thought God was giving you some inside info, wouldn't you feel more confident about your awareness than Bush appears to feel? LOL. I don't know.

[soothsayer]

8. well, let's hope he gives dumbya the ultimate justice

isn't that jr's euphemism for...something or other?

heh heh heh heh heh

c'mon, God, do your thing!

[creativelcro]

9. Bush is a parallelian :)

[opihimoimoi]

12. I was told God gets real pissed when some one has the audacity to speak

for HIM.

In addition, HE don talk to liars, cheaters, and theives. He Also looks down on the money changers, the false prophets(Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, and ilk), and those who go AWOL.

[leftofthedial]

10. were that true

God's finger would have long ago flicked Bush off the planet like a booger.

[Rose Siding]

11. Another mystery of the universe solved.....

ostentatious pipsqueak

[patricia92243]

14. Scary when a person thinks GOD has appointed them to be in charge....

be it a preacher with a cult following, Muslim who are God's anointed, or whatever.

[rman]

15. Bus = self proclaimed high priest

so he knows what god wants. we don't.

people used to fall for this - many thousands of years ago.

[jsw_81]

16. Bush is (or pretends to be) a fundamentalist Christian

In that bizarre, violent worldview, the fundamentalist Christians are God's chosen people and constantly at war with Satan and the forces of Darkness. And everyone who isn't a fundamentalist Christian is bound for eternal torture in the flames of hell unless they repent. This is how millions of people in the Republican base actually think, so it's not surprising that Bush would make such comments.

[forgethell]

17. Maybe * is a moron,

but that doesn't mean that he can't be right, occassionally. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. Justice is definitely one of God's objectives. Start with Genesis18:25, "sha;; not the Judge of all the earth do right?"

You can argue whether * is pursuing justice, or not, but the statement that "God's purpose is justice" pretty much sums up the facts, IMO.

Why is it that we Democrats have to pick every word this man says apart, have to de-construct his every action? Sure, he stole the election, but that does not make him wrong if it would have been rigth for President Gore. I despair of 2004, we make ourselves look petty, vengeful, and foolish; in other words, like losers. Give the man credit when he does the right thing, even if for the wrong reason. He does plenty, PLENTY of wrong things we can point out.

Somebody explain it to me. I DO NOT understand.

[jsw_81]

18. The deity Bush believes in is a violent, conservative monster

That's what Bush really means when he talks about "God's justice." It's all about hellfire, brimstone, and killing people who don't bow down to Murka.

Governor Dean, on the other hand, would mean feeding the hungry, caring for the sick, and helping the poor if he mentioned God's justice. That's the difference.

[mourningdove92]

21. Time to get out a new cloak.

Bush has stayed wrapped in the flag for so long, it is beginning to wear and the holes are getting bigger. So now it is time to throw on a new mantle, to cover his name. So he wraps himself in the Mantle of right wing, cheap labor, fundamentalism. Expect to see more of this. He knows his actions have shaken his base and those with eyes to see and ears to hear, are beginning to question his holiness. Time to position himself as the last bastion of hope protecting the Homeland from dangerous, free thinking Liberals who want to destroy religion in this land, desecrate marriage and set Terrorists free. Get ready DU. This is gonna be a wild ride. We will need nerves of steel to keep us sane.

:kick:

[jsw_81]

22. Agreed

Regardless of who we nominate, this is going to be a really nasty campaign.

[forgethell]

23. I did say

that maybe the meaning of justice could be argued, I believe. the statement, "god's pupose is justice", is unexceptionable, as it stands.

[DS1]

27. I thought it was forgiveness and compassion

:shrug:

God's purpose is nothing but a giant contradiction formed specifically to allow manipulation and debate over interpretations.

The man is full of shit, and even in this case, this 'fact' of yours could easily be refuted by other parts of the same book.

[forgethell]

33. I think not.

but then that's just my opinion. so you don't think god is interested in justice?

[DS1]

37. zoom!

That's the sound of logic flying over your head :hi:

Is not God interested in forgiveness? What say you?

[forgethell]

62. Actually,

I was referring to this statement: "and even in this case, this 'fact' of yours could easily be refuted by other parts of the same book.".

Of course, God is interested in forgiveness. But a person can be forgiven by his victims, yet still have to face justice here on earth. I do not see the two as mutually exclusive.

The first requirement for forgiveness is that only God, and the victims of the wrong have the right to give it. If you were murdered, say, neither I, nor *, nor anyone else has the right to forgive the murderer. and you can't. God can, of course.

the second thing is that it must be asked for. I am willing to forgive those that have wronged me, but they have to ask for it. This doesn't mean that I will be seeking revenge, but it does mean that I will remember.

Saddam has not asked for forgiveness, and his many murders mean that he can't receive it from his victims.

[Malva Zebrina]

24. He does not know what the "right" thing is

and I give him NO room at all. He stole the election and has practically destroyed this country--he is a liar that is repsonsible for the deaths of thousands of innocent people and he is a greedy liar. I don't care if he did everything right from now on--he deserves to be ousted, and if possible impeached for his treason. Let the next guy, the intelligent guy, the compassionate guy get all sorts of leeway--I refuse to give this little snot an inch.

[cosmicdot]

25. God is love. Please explain what would have been right for Gore?

as used here: "...that does not make him wrong if it would have been right for President Gore"???

I don't understand. What would have been right for a President Gore?

One cannot take a few words out ... and, say, what's with that .. there is truth there in those words ... that's taking things out of context. It's the whole concept ... the whole onslaught of the lying and the 'Big Picture' of the agenda they've set in motion.

Saying God is justice while destroying justice in our system and/or changing our Nation for the worse by building a Corporate America which causes suffering and pain on citizens of the real Nation ... doesn't jive.

"Give the man credit when he does the right thing, even if for the wrong reason."

I don't understand that either.

"...we make ourselves look petty, vengeful, and foolish; in other words, like losers."

Once again, I need an explanation. This has been part of the post-biggest political crime in my lifetime: the whole Sore-Loserman lie.

It's fairly well documented that * delivers daily lies and misleads through false pretenses, tricky legislation, backdrops with subliminal messages, etc. ... in speeches, in policies, etc. That's called, in Corporate America, 'the talk' ... then, there's 'the walk', which is the reality of the disconnect of what is said and what is actually done. It's a 24/7 occupation of this White House to perpetuate the lies ... some are sent through the Media ... some through surrogates of * ... some through his limited abilities to stand before other than a controlled, ticketed, prepared audience.

Everything that he utters is a perpetuation of this. All his words are subtext of 'the Big Picture'.

It's fairly simple to understand.

[DS1]

28. Indeed, if God's purpose is justice, both of them are doing a shitty job

:bounce:

[forgethell]

35. I could write a thesis, but

I'll just go with the "loser" part, for now. Look, I was as upset as anyone about the way the 2000 election played out. but Gore lost. Now please don't flame me with "500k voters more voted for Gore", or "selected, not elected", or "unlawful purging of voters in Florida", or anything else. I know all that. But * is still in the WH, isn't he. President Gore is making no appointments, signing no bills. Gore lost. Legally, or not, that's the way the game reads in the record books.

So, here on this board, we are passionate about it, well most of us, anyway. I've moved on, myself, because there isn't ONE god damned thing that can be done about it, now. But we still have 2004. You know, "Wait till next year"? But most American, don't give a rat's tail for the election anymore. If we look back, constantly, and more importantly, publicly, we look like, and are perceived as, losers. And, here is the real nub: Perception often shapes reality. So we need to keep our eyes on the prize.

Now, if we have the goods on * & Co., well & good. Get the information out there. But they have to be real goods, something substantial, not minor mistakes, misstatements, or even lies by low-level functionaries. Not complaints because * acts like other politicians and gives business to his friends. Our hands are not that clean ourselves. And working for legislation that we, as progressives, might not like, is NOT treason. Undoing the New Deal, as Hilary claimed, is NOT treason. Even going to war under wrong assumptions, is NOT treason. Unwise, incompetent, perhaps, work that angle. But you will never convince Americans that Bush is a traitor, or a war criminal. They APPROVE, check the polls. Get the real goods on him.

What is your objective, our objective? To vent against Bush, or to win in 2004? Conservatives read DU, and every foolish statement we make is broadcast. We need to get the people on our side, and some of the comments that we make are calculated to offend them, and it is needless.

We are at serious disadvantages in the coming election. It is only by remembering our goals, by unity, and discipline that we have a chance to win. think of the consequences if we don't. they are serious enough without our thinking Armageddon, or Ragnarok, will arrive.

Anyway, that is my opinion about what we need to do..

[neebob]

32. He did the right thing?! When?

I'd be happy to give him credit, but he's never done the right thing to my knowledge. He's a greedy lying criminal scumbag, and he's hit upon an effective way to fool the non-thinkers and is getting really brazen about it. Now he's God's mouthpiece. God's purpose is justice. If that were true, George W. Bush would be in prison right now.

[forgethell]

36. Well, I like

his tax-cut. But that is because I got a nice kick out of it, due to having children. I do undeerstand that not everybody approves of the tax cut, and it could be better, perhaps fairer, still, I approve of it.

[neebob]

50. I'm sure a few hundred or a few thousand dollars was welcome relief

for a lot of people, but I only have one child and I know a cheap trick when I see one. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable on the so-called tax cut will come along and explain what really happened.

[0rganism]

56. Those who celebrate the tax cut only due to their childcount are dupes

Yeah, they get some money back, but the real breaks are for the folks raking in the investment dollars.

The "average tax cut" was touted as being slightly over $1000, IIRC. That makes sense: if the overall cut is about $95 billion, and there are around 90 million taxpayers who receive the cut, then you divide the first number by the second, and get $1000/taxpayer.

The MEDIAN tax cut, of which half the population receives less and half receives more, was about $100. Understand what this means, please, when the average is an order of magnitude greater than the median. The tax break is skewed, and skewed hard, to a very few people.

It's called the Bill Gates effect: when Bill Gates walks into a bar, the average drinker becomes a billionaire.

From CTJ:

“The President has given numerous speeches implying that most people stand to gain $1,000 or more from his latest tax bill, but that’s not true,” said Robert S. McIntyre, director of Citizens for Tax Justice. “In fact, over the next two years, the median tax reduction will be only about $120. After 2004, the median tax cut drops to zero.”

http://www.ctj.org/pdf/2003statecut.pdf

(check out the table from the article, too)

[forgethell]

63. I'm not really concerned if

other people get more than me. Envy is a very ugly emotion. I just know that it came at a time when I needed it. This DOES NOT mean, however, that there are not a number of things that * has done that I very much disagree with.

[Blue_Roses]

41. Democrats pick his words apart because

he says the most MORONIC things. Haven't you heard in the New Testament, "judge not, lest ye be judged," well Bush is NOT judge and jury. He would like nothing more than to see Saddam just "disappear" so he didn't have to worry about all the dirty little secrets coming out--whatever they may be.

Bush knows NOTHING of what being a Christian is all about. His comments scare me, 'cause they are merely an approach to pull at the emotions of those who support him. He knows what he's doing and it's not for the good of the American people. He hides behind the cloak of Christianity in order to push his agenda and it works.

Yes, I do believe God wants justice, but only when it is implemented by him.

[SpiralHawk]

19. Oh oh - am I adding 1 + 1 correctly? It makes for a mighty ugly 2

Kommander Chimpy is invoking diViNe jUsTice as his sWorD aNd sHiEld...WTF?

mEanwHile, the krisTian korPs is moBiLiZed and iNvaDing bAbYloN with Bibles clutched fiercely in hand. ! (see below and link).

mE tHinKs aRmAgeDdon is uPon uS (at least in the minds of True Believers Worldwide).

May peace prevail, SH
----------------------------------------

Missionaries set out on a 'war for souls' in Iraq

American Christian missionaries have declared a "war for souls" in Iraq, telling supporters that the formal end of the US-led occupation next June will close an historic "window of opportunity".

Organising in secrecy, and emphasising their humanitarian aid work, Christian groups are pouring into the country, which is 97 per cent Muslim, bearing Arabic Bibles, videos and religious tracts designed to "save" Muslims from their "false" religion.
The International Mission Board, the missionary arm of the Southern Baptists, is one of those leading the charge.

John Brady, the IMB's head for the Middle East and North Africa, this month appealed to the 16 million members of his church, the largest Protestant denomination in America.
"Southern Baptists have prayed for years that Iraq would somehow be opened to the gospel," his appeal began. That "open door" for Christians may soon close.

more…

http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/12/27/wirq27.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/12/27/ixhome.html 

[Skidmore]

20. Bush is laying the basis for delivering his version of justice

to Saddam. Wait and see. He wants Saddam dead.

[Malva Zebrina]

26. interesting take on it

since he declared the the god talks to him, and others, some of whome are actually preachers, say that indeed, he is a leader favored by the god, you may be right. All he has to do is declare that the god declared justice on SAddam when Saddam suddently drops dead from some substance he has been given.

[cliss]

29. There's no dispute.

Bush is using God, in the same way that he spoke of Al-Qaida last year, who "hijacked" a religion. It takes one to know one.

He seems to feel he is a spokesman for God, since he says that God's purpose is justice. By justice here I assume that Bush means God wants to see reckoning, as far as punishing those who do evil things, and conversely rewarding those who do good deeds. That's what JUSTICE means, right? It's not just punishing.

So if I were Bush, I'd be really nervous right now. These laws that he so solemnly proclaim include him, as well. Unless he thinks he's exempt, because he has a Pipeline To God.

Whenever I read really outrageous stuff about Bush, I always remember a saying supposedly by Jesus, "By his actions you will know him". Think about that. Bush stands up in front of millions, supposedly with the backing of God Himself.

And yet, we've seen how he can't even control his emotions. I've seen him clearly angry on a number of occasions. I've read quotes about his "F*** Saddam" statement, and many others. Once, I actually heard him say "Shut this guy up", Bush said about some blabber, and the microphone was supposed to be turned off.

By his actions you will know him. A man who misled us, lied (lies) on a regular basis, cheats and shortchanges the "little guy" and greases the palms of his rich backers.

Does this sound like a pious man to you?

[LeftPeopleFinishFirst]

30. His "God" is obviously not my god. nt

[LeahMira]

31. How would * know that?

Where the f*ck did this convoluted idea of God come from????

Justice is good, Spanone. Real justice would have had * choke on a pretzel and die. There must be also mercy though.

Seen on a holy card:
G-d's justice reaches to the clouds, but G-d's mercy reaches to the heavens.

[Grover]

39. As an Atheist who has studied the Bible intently

He probably gets it from the Bible itself.

One of the main themes of both the OT and NT is justice. "I, the Lord, love justice." Is. 61:8

[Malva Zebrina]

45. as another atheist

I can probably find ten more verses that would refute that one. :-)

[DS1]

57. Oh SHIT! Mercy is the word I was looking for!

There must be justice, and mercy, and an eye for an eye, and forgiveness.

It's a trap!

[FDRrocks]

38. I thought God's formal policy was violence and pro-business leg.

Oh wait, I was thinking of the Religious Right.

[Ksec]

40. Bushs God isnt my God

My God is compassion and love. His is warring killing and hatred of enemies.

[Grover]

42. Can you not see how all of these reactions makes us look stupid?

I can sympathize with those that may worship another God different from the God of Abraham, but the whole Bible is based on the ultimate justice of God. Good versus Evil. Ultimate judgement, and ultimate justice is left in the hands of God. That is the whole theme.


It is baffling how some go out of their way to disgaree with * to the point of absurditiy. It would be one thing if he was incorrectly stating something about the Bible. But in this case he is correct, and all of this just makes us look worse.

At least be right on the point.

[shanti]

43. us??

us????? who you talking 'bout, willis?

[Zorra]

44. We have seen these "correct" religious lunatics throughout

history. They think that they are correct and under "divine guidance" when they kill and torture other innocent human beings that do not agree with their insane misunderstanding of the philosophy that they profess to believe in.
Witch trials and burnings, crusades, inquisitions, and yes, even wars. All done by fanatical religious lunatics. And * has given evidence that he is one of these wackos. Like this:

According to Abbas, immediately thereafter Bush said: "God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."

http://www.unknownnews.net/insanity7.html

So, apparently, it was not WMD or the fact that Saddam was a ruthless dictator that caused us to invade Iraq. Apparently it was because God told * to go to war. And now tens of thousands of human beings are dead and/or maimed and crippled for life. This is the very same dogmatic madness which has caused untold suffering and death throughout human history. Whatever this thing that apparently talks to * and tells him what to do is, it is certainly not God.

[Malva Zebrina]

46. well many that I have read

have a good argument--for every bit of so called "justice" of the god, there is an equal amount of injustice!! and that, my friend, is the truth!!!

[CJCRANE]

52. Politicians have no place

telling us what God does or doesn't want.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

58. If Bush really wants "justice", he'd better grow an asbestos ass.

'Cuz the fundamentalist, angry, God that he claims to believe in is warming up the barbecue.

[JohnKleeb]

47. I thought God was love

:shrug: Which god is he talking to, I think hes been talking to the wrong guy.

[snippy]

48. What Bush said is "God's purpose is justice, and His plan is peace."

Bush is an Old Testament Christian who equates justice to vengeance. However, leaving the philosophical meaning of justice aside, Bush contradicts himself with the second part of his statement.

At the Aqaba summit Bush told then Palestinian Prime Minister Mahmoud Abbas:

"God told me to strike at al Qaida and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=310788&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

If God's plan was peace, why would He tell Bush to work on peace only until it was time to focus on the elections?

[laruemtt]

49. i know God is

grateful that our sh*t-for-brains shrublet has deemed to give Him/Her/It a purpose :wtf:

[chookie]

51. Justice means different things to different people

His Chimperial Highness, in this election year, has got to "wink wink nudge nudge" his "base" i.e.wackos, while pretending to reach out to moderate people who have not been paying attention to what he has really been up to and who very well might be foolable again.

When he says "justice," sane people believe he is talking about "fairness."

But his base i.e. wackos believe he is talking about "punishment."

His Chimperial Highness, and Ashcroft, believe they are the Wrath of God. His followers want to see everyone that they feel superior to to be smited, to be humiliated, to be enslaved.

We MUST help people who fall for these tricks to understand what he really means. I don't think decent Americans would go along with what he really means. That's why he has to lie about everything!

[loudnclear]

53. To Bush, "justice" means "just us"

Bush is no more a Christian than Osama...and that goes for most of the funddies out there, including Pat and Jerry!

[devilgrrl]

54. Bush prays to the Church of Sauron

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

55. God is to Bush what "backpain" is to Rush.

An excuse for criminality. And, both believe their own excuses.

[otohara]

59. Just Us

God only cares about American's, not the French, not the Germans, not the Russians, Arabs, Asians, -- Just us

[starroute]

60. "I fear for my country when I reflect that God is just"

Thomas Jefferson

[Cat Atomic]

61. I'm so glad that my government can interpret scripture for me.

But this is just a little stroking of the religious right. A little pat on the head for the campaign season, I'd say.

[Clyde39]

64. The "true" Christians will eat this up!

I'm constantly reading letters in the newspaper about how awful it is that God has been taken out of the schools or the lack of morals because the 10 Commandments are not in every building, etc. There are bumper stickers that say----WE STILL PRAY. They just love Bush for bringing God back to our Godless country----and there are web pages with one mission---Pray For President Bush (a real eye-opener if you haven't already seen one)..........VERY scary!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

65. Since Muslims, Jews and Christians pray to the same God

and all 3 claim to have *Him* on their side, which is it? Bush, Osama, and Sharon all seem to feel that they are doing "God's Will".

As an agnostic, I'm glad that I don't have a God whose name is invoked to justify slaughter.

"The bible is a book with some beautiful poetry, a bloodstained history, a wealth of obscenity, and upwards of ten-thousand lies" - Mark Twain

[Moderator]

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