Daily Democrat: A positive discussion about Joe Lieberman

[Skinner]

In an effort to provide for some enlightening discussion, rather than partisan flaming, the administrators have decided to post regular threads about the candidates for the Democratic nomination which are reserved for positive discussion only. These threads will be called the "Daily Democrat".

Currently, we intend to post two Daily Democrat discussion threads per day. If a particular thread becomes too long, then the moderators will open additional threads as necessary. These discussion threads will be allowed to stay open until the next two Daily Democrat threads are opened at some point the following day.

THE RULES

The rules for these Daily Democrat candidate threads are as follows. (For the purposes of these rules, the candidate who is the subject of the thread is referred to as the "Daily Democrat".)

1. You are welcome to post anything positive about the Daily Democrat. You can explain why you support that person. You can dispel myths about that candidate. You can discuss that person's positions on various issues. Whatever.

2. You are allowed to favorably compare the Daily Democrat to other candidates, provided that you are not unnecessarily inflammatory or antagonistic to the other candidates.

3. You may not post attacks of any kind against the Daily Democrat. Furthermore, you cannot post criticism and try to pass it off as a compliment ("I enthusiastically support candidate X because he ruined his state's economy!")

4. You may not discuss the supporters of any candidate (that goes for the the Daily Democrat, or any other candidate).

5. Undecided voters are encouraged to ask questions about the Daily Democrat in order to better inform their choice. Note that criticism disguised as a question will not be allowed.

6. You may not start another discussion thread for the purposes of responding to comments made in the "Daily Democrat" thread. Sorry -- you just have to suck it up and let the positive discussion continue uninterrupted.

7. I will not babysit the Daily Democrat thread, because I believe it will not be necessary. It is the responsibility of every member to know and follow the rules. Deliberate disruption of the Daily Democrat thread, or efforts by opponents to influence the Daily Democrat thread, will result in the banning of the individual(s) responsible.

8. I reserve the right to change the rules as necessary to make this work.

TIMING

We will discuss two Daily Democrats per day, and cycle through the list of presidential candidates in modified alphabetical order.

12/13 - Wesley Clark ...... and ... Dennis Kucinich
12/14 - NO DAILY DEMOCRAT THREAD
12/15 - Howard Dean ....... and ... Joe Lieberman
12/16 - John Edwards ...... and ... Carol Moseley Braun
12/17 - Dick Gephardt ..... and ... Al Sharpton
12/18 - John Kerry ........ and ... Wesley Clark
12/19 - Dennis Kucinich ... and ... Howard Dean
12/20 - Joe Lieberman ..... and ... John Edwards
12/21 - Carol Moseley Braun and ... Dick Gephardt
12/22 - Al Sharpton ....... and ... John Kerry
12/23 - Wesley Clark ...... and ... Dennis Kucinich
12/24 - Etc...

LET'S GET STARTED

Here's your chance for some positive discussion of Joe Lieberman! Who wants to start it off?

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[UrbScotty]

2. Seven words come to mind

ELECTED VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES!

[PunkinPi]

11. I'll second that.

[Padraig18]

15. And I will third it!

:)

[CMT]

3. faint praise, but

consistent in his support for the war unlike some who have backtracked and tried to have it both ways.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

21. I thought we weren't supposed to use these threads as criticism

you broke rule 2.

[Jacobin]

40. I didn't read it that way. The compliment is that he is "consistent"

I haven't heard that that word is an epithet. We might disagree with his consistency on that issue, but that's another matter.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

44. "backtracked and tried to have it both ways"

sounds like criticism to me. I wonder why the post wasn't deleted.

[MGKrebs]

4. Something positive about Joe;

He may have the best sense of humor of the candidates. Haven't seen much of it lately, but he has been pretty funny at times in the past.

[G_j]

5. his environmental record

is pretty good..

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Padraig18]

7. Despite his hawkishness, Joe has *many* progressive qualities.

I'll vote for him, if he's the nominee, and will work my fingers to the bone to see that he's elected. :)

[demnan]

8. Joe Lieberman is pro-choice

[JohnKleeb]

9. Hes the vice president by law

[_Jumper_]

10. He has a great record on civil rights

n/t

[bobbieinok]

20. didn't he take part in one of the 'freedom (bus) rides' in 61???

That took a lot of courage, since the riders were met in Jackson, or Atlanta, or Birmingham, or ... by anti-civil rights types with bats and lead pipes.

Outside of Anniston AL (?), the antis set a bus on fire and tried to keep the freedom riders inside. Antis then followed the riders to and then into the hospital, hoping to get more chances to beat them up.

[LuLu550]

12. He would make a much finer president

than the current occupant of the White house. ANY of the nine Democratic candidates would. And we must not forget that!

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

13. He isn't B*sh.

[Gman]

14. Lieberman is a good man

He and I aren't on the same page on a lot of things. He is as populist as they come. I think Lieberman sincerely feels his job is to better the lives of regular every day people and I think he does a pretty good job overall. I'm not in agreement with Lieberman on his war stance, but I completely understand why he feels as he does. His positions on the war are well reasoned. I just don't necessarily agree with everything he says.

And as someone mentioned above, he is the elected vice president of the country.

[Freddie Stubbs]

16. He had a more liberal voting record last year that John Edwards

[retread]

26. Link?

*

[Freddie Stubbs]

30. Americans for Democratic Action

http://www.adaction.org/SenateVR2002.htm

[Freddie Stubbs]

17. His voting record last year was just as liberal as John Kerry's

[retread]

25. Link?

*

[Freddie Stubbs]

29. Americans for Democratic Action

http://www.adaction.org/SenateVR2002.htm

[retread]

43. Thanks for the informative link. However if you look at lifetime

voting records, Lieberman 76%, Edwards 88% and Kerry 93%.

[Northwind]

18. Regardless of wether you agree with him

He maintains his outlook, sticking by his words even when he knows without a doubt that they are extremely unpopular.

[Old and In the Way]

19. If nominated, I'll support.

[goobergunch]

22. His environmental record is outstanding. (n/t)

[Hoppin_Mad]

23. Pretty good head of hair for a man his age

Nuff said ;-)

[Renew Deal]

24. He has a poor rating according to the American Conservative Union

Which means he has a good Dem voting record.

http://acuratings.com/acu.cgi?ACT=1&USER_ID=319&YEAR=2002

[Moderator]

27. kick

:kick:

[Blitz]

28. Senator Lieberman got it absolutely right on Meet The Press

When he had the following exchange re: Saddam:

Russert: Now, Senator, your opponent for the Democratic nomination, Howard Dean, the former governor of Vermont, said last week that he wasn't certain where a trial of Saddam should take place; perhaps even the international court in the Netherlands. What's your thinking about a trial?


Lieberman: This man, Saddam Hussein, this evil man, has to face the death penalty. The International Tribunal in The Hague cannot order the death penalty. So my first question about where he's going to be tried will be answered by whether that tribunal can execute him, which is what he surely deserves, and if it can be done by the Iraqi military tribunal, fine. But if it cannot, he should be brought before an American military tribunal and face the death that he's brought to hundreds of thousands of his own people and 460-plus Americans.

He is genuinely thoughtful about his positions and does not equivocate based upon the political winds. He is, along with Edwards and perhaps Gephardt and Kerry, one of the Democrat that Bush would least like to face in the General election since he is just as strong on defense, has moral gravitas, has a long and distinguished record of service to his country and is more socially progressive (and more in tume with America's domestic mood) than Bush. Lieberman's general election campaign would look like his primary campaign. He wouldn't have to sprint to the center after winning the nomination since he's already where he will be. He will not need to respond to charges of inconsistancy and dishonesty that may plague candidates that are desperately wooing the far left "base" to win the primary but will do the 40 yard dash to the right the day after the primary to secure the all important center and the swing voters who come with it. Lieberman is a centrist appealing to the swing voters now.

Finally, Lieberman is the one Democratic candidate who will not be politically hurt if Osama is captured, if Mullah Omar is captured or if WMDs are found. None of Bush's potential aces work against Joe.

Joe lieberman can win against Bush. Not all of the people running can have that honestly said about them.

[DrFunkenstein]

31. He Has A 92% Rating From LCV

Whatever his faults, the environment is not one of them. He's also a surprisingly strong advocate of reproductive rights.

[IndianaGreen]

32. Joe Lieberman is one of the sponsors of S. 1705, ENDA 2003

S.1705

Employment Non-Discrimination Act of 2003 (Introduced in Senate)

SEC. 2. PURPOSES.

The purposes of this Act are--

(1) to provide a comprehensive Federal prohibition of employment discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation;

(2) to provide meaningful and effective remedies for employment discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation; and

(3) to invoke congressional powers, including the powers to enforce the 14th amendment to the Constitution, and to regulate interstate commerce and provide for the general welfare pursuant to section 8 of article I of the Constitution, in order to prohibit employment discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.

http://thomas.loc.gov/ (Search criteria: S.1705)

MAJOR PROVISIONS

The purpose of ENDA is to prohibit employment on the basis of sexual orientation. ENDA defines sexual orientation as "homosexuality, bisexuality, or heterosexuality, whether the orientation is real or perceived."

ENDA exempts employers having less than 15 employees, bona fide private membership clubs, and religious organizations. ENDA does not apply to the Armed Forces or to Veteran's Preferences.

ENDA prohibits the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) from collecting, or compelling collection, of statistics on sexual orientation. from covered entities, or compel the collection of such statistics by covered entities.

ENDA prohibits quotas and preferential treatment on the basis of sexual orientation.

ISSUES

Supporters of ENDA say that sexual orientation discrimination in the workplace is well documented and widespread. Title VII prohibits discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex and national origin; but the term "sex" has never been defined by Congress, or interpreted by the Courts, as including sexual orientation. As a result of that, in many parts of America, people are fired or refused to employment because they are seen as, or perceived to be, gay or lesbian. ENDA does not create special rights for gays, but it merely provides for equality under the law when it comes to employment. ENDA supporters claim that polling data shows that ENDA enjoys broad public support, and that its provisions have been endorsed by some of the nation's most successful corporations.

Detractors of ENDA say that sexual orientation is a choice of lifestyle unlike an immutable characteristic such as race. ENDA would grant gays special rights and protections in the workplace, and it would legitimatize behavior that a majority of Americans disapprove of on the basis of their religious faith and family values. ENDA's definition of sexual orientation is too broad, will lead to excessive litigation, and it could preempt some State laws involving criminal conduct. ENDA is not needed because gays are only 2% of the population and statistics show that only a negligible number of gays have experienced discrimination in the workplace.

Latest Major Action (THOMAS): 10/2/2003 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions.

[Freddie Stubbs]

33. He has experience as a prosecutor

He was Connecticut's Attorney General before being elected to the Sentate.

[IronLionZion]

34. He is a good man

and a good Senator and a good Democrat. He is still on our side unlike that traitor Zell Miller, so please don't bash Joe for being moderate. He is a stand up guy and stood up for what is right many times in the past especially in the fight for civil rights.

A good honest politician who does not flip-flop or try to be something he's not is hard to find, but Joe Lieberman is that man. We should be honored to have him in the US Senate and I would gladly vote for him if he won the nomination. His attitude and integrity should be a lesson to us all, whether we agree with his platform or not.

[Blitz]

35. Lieberman

will get rid of the disaster that is "don't ask, don't tell." Moreover, he will take better care of our veterans. He has shown a commitment to national defense and homeland security that is not only vital in practice, but which is essential if one is going to seriously challenge George W. Bush.

[stevedeshazer]

36. Joe is a very likeable guy

This is something often said about GWBush, but Joe is the guy I'd rather have a beer with.

Joe Lieberman has principles that he consistently adheres to, even if it makes him unpopular among some here. I really respect him for that, even though I disagree with him often.

Joseph Lieberman would be a much better President than Bush. His record speaks for itself.

[Blitz]

37. Lieberman's plan to help all immigrants learn English

is a step in the right direction towards a more united America.

[GOPBasher]

38. Environment

He's incredibly strong on environmental issues. He's dedicated to leaving the world in good shape for our children and their children.

[Jacobin]

39. He has a good record on civil rights issues.

He should get credit for that.

[VOX]

41. On domestic matters, Joe has a very good record...

Civil and human rights, women's issues, the environment, etc. And he *is* the VP candidate who got the most votes in 2000.

If the 2004 election squared Lieberman off against *, of course I would vote for Joe.

ABB.

[Moderator]

42. kick