Can we win in 2004?

[IranianDemocrat]

.

[_Jumper_]

1. Yes, if we nominate someone who will appeal to middle-class moderates

n/t

[Renew Deal]

2. and someone

that makes people feel safe.

[Mattforclark]

3. Someone

like Wesley Clark.

[Woodstock]

5. Someone

like a Democrat.

To hell with all this divisiveness about whose candidate is top dog. Back the Democrat. I'm really turned off by all this treating it like a competative game here. This is serious stuff.

Have positive thinking about the Democrat. Make it happen. We can win. Whoever is the nominee.

[_Jumper_]

6. Most of our candidates can't win

n/t

[Woodstock]

8. The power of negative thinking

How about trying it the other way around?

Whoever gets the nom will have had the backing of a lot of motivated Dems. I fail to see why the nom will not be able to win, if we all do our darndest to make it happen.

[_Jumper_]

13. Even our top candidate trails Bush by a significant margin

We are clearly behind the 8 ball right now.

[Woodstock]

21. The unnamed Democrat beat Bush in the latest Newsweek poll

Most people don't know who our candidates are, lack of name recognition is what is the factor of those numbers being less when the specific Dem is named.

[Mattforclark]

14. Pessimism is for the wise

Optimism gets you killed.

Prepare for the worst case scenario and be surprised when something goes right.

If something can go wrong, it will go wrong.

Murphy's law.

Being optimistic without justification does not make one's problems disappear.

IMHO.

[Ecotopian]

17. Let the fat elephants be as optimistic as they want.

Feed their hubris. Let the Sicilians destroy their Athenian boats!

[Mattforclark]

23. No, don't you worry about that

Syracuse will fall sooner or later...

[Woodstock]

24. Pessimism without justification makes one's problems greater than they are

Fact: we want Bush out

Fact: we are likely looking at only these 9 candidates

Fact: the one of those 9 who wins is probably going to be the one who has the backing of a lot of Dems

Fact: the unnamed Dem just beat Bush in Newsweek's latest poll

Fact: the unnamed Dem has been at least on average even in the polls for quite a while

Fact: a lot of Americans, Dems included, still don't know who are candidates are, and this is factoring in the differences in named vs. unnamed polls

Fact: any one of our top candidates are appealing, good guys, with excellent credentials, and with enough energy expended on our part, the eventual nominee become that "unnamed Dem" for the people

Fact: fake turkey or Sadaam capture temporary boost in the polls notwithstanding, we've got a fighting chance

Fact: we can accomplish things if we have a positive attitude; and the alternative is giving up (which is what it sounds like you want to do if Clark is not the nominee)

[Mattforclark]

27. No, I do not wish to give up if Clark is not nominated

I will vote for and support whoever. I just don't think that we will have a particularly good chance at winning. That is not sysnonymous with giving up.

[arewethereyet]

10. agreed

but we all have a different idea of who falls into that camp

I think three could win, two probably could win and one would win.

but I expect everyone else has that played out too.

[Mattforclark]

12. Don't freak out

I will support whoever the nominee is, but I think it is acceptable to say which one has the best chance of winning. I think there is justification for thinking that various candidates have better chances than various other candidates.

[Renew Deal]

25. I partly agree.

I agree that this is serious stuff and I will support any candidate. I will have trouble getting excited about campaigning for Lieberman but whatever. I do not aagree that any candidate can win. Sharpton, and CMB have 0% chance. Some of the other vary in electability.

[webkev]

4. if we nominate someone who can win

[arewethereyet]

7. Absolutely with Edwards

n/t

[Rooktoven]

30. second that --nt

[Sparkle]

9. Yes, Dammit!

n/t

[IronLionZion]

11. Who the hell said NO?!!!

Do not even think about it or you will believe it. Then the Rove mind machine has hoodwinked you. If you want it, you have to BELIEVE you can get it.

Don't underestimate the power of positive thinking.

[Mattforclark]

15. Don't underestimate the power of

negative thinking either.

And I voted yes.

[Woodstock]

26. I don't understand his attitude either

Thankfully someone with that kind of attitude will not be leading up any "get out the vote" efforts in the general election.

"Well, my guy didn't get the nomination, so we have a snowball's chance in hell of winning, but hey, go vote."

Dean, Kerry, Clark, ... all the top guys are going to do well among Dems. And I know swing voters who have come up to me and expressed interest in one or more of these guys. We've only just begun. Let's not put up the white flag yet. I could understand some pessimism if we were doing worse than we are in the polls, but for God's sake, we are EVEN with an incumbent in wartime. There's a lot to be optimistic about. I have never heard a high achiever say pessimism is wise or helped them to achieve their goals. Without exception they have a can do attitude and don't even think about failure.

[Ecotopian]

16. Screw the numbers!

I'm tired of hearing my fellow liberals complain, whine, and moan about how we won't win in 2004. First of all, Bush is even against an unknown Democratic challenger. As of right now, the parties are highly polarized at 45% each, and what we're fighting over right now is the 10% undecided.

As for our win in capturing Saddam... great. We caught the guy and will now see the Shi'ite majority get into a battle with the Sunni minority (Saddam's party). If they win, Iraq will become more politically and culturally aligned to Iran. Two other big questions is the trial itself which will more than likely be in Iraq by the Coalition Government (viewed by many to be a US Gov't puppet) and not by the World Court (since GWB doesn't trust the international community) which will hurt our relations with other nations even more. So either GWB creates a false trial that will be viewed as illegitimate or subjects his ideology to international scrutiny. In short, now that he has Saddam, he's out of the frying pan and into the fire, in between the Two Horns of Dilemma.

As for the incumbency factor, no President who ever won a narrow election ever came back for a second term. If we can stay message that GWB's policies are counter-productive, illegitimate, and contrary to the cause of international justice; which will more than likely be echoed by the world community, then we can win the undecided and dethrone our own dictator.

The best thing to do is to make sure that as many of your friends as possible vote against Bush next year and don't listen to the naysayers. As for Bush's supporters, tell them the election will on Wednesday.

[in_cog_ni_to]

18. Yes.

If Clark is the nominee.

[in_cog_ni_to]

19. Yes.

If Clark is the nominee.

[Clark Can WIN]

20. With Clark/Edwards

What a good looking ticket. Very tasty:evilgrin:

[Rooktoven]

31. Or Edwards/Clark

[DFLforever]

22. Yes, we can win with someone who can turn out the base

bring in new voters and has an organization capable of delivering their vote on election day. Paging Dr. Dean!!

Note: these are political, not military, talents!

[sasquatch]

28. What is this defeatist bullshit?

El loco cokehead has our troop that he's screwed blue and tatood. Catch a Joe Stallon(I hope that's how you spell his name) wannbe, tinpot dictator to announce that "the war is over". Then to make matters worse you people put your tails between your legs and feel sorry for yourself:grr: GET UP DAMMIT, THIS IS

FAR

FROM OVER. Do you remember when that goofy ass bronze statue was taken down in Bagdad and too stupid to be Houston dog catcher said "The war is over". Then do you remember when he landed on the deck of the USS LIncoln and struted around the aircraft carrier deck with his scrotum up around his adams apple because he was too damned dumb to release the parachute harness. Just to say "MIssion Accomplished". Was it over then? NO! Is it over now? HELL NO!! This war is going to get worse now because it's green lights for all of the ethnic groups to start their own nation. The only thing in their way is our troops(unfortunetly) occupying their country so Dick Cheney can steal their oil. It's flightsuit all over again trust me:)

[Woodstock]

29. el loco cokehead WILL be defeated!

I like your positive attitude.

[sasquatch]

32. Sasquatch says "Go down, sucker!"

We all need this attitude. Espically you DLC people you guys are already taking off your equipment and heading to the locker room. El loco cokehead has already fumbled the ball by giving that "Prepare for this message from the ministry of truth" speach he gave at noon Sunday before the football games. That will bite him in the ass real hard when the "sheeple" find out that the only way the troops are coming home is in bodybags. The "sheeple" wil turn back into the American people and put his ass out of office:evilgrin: Then it's off to the Hague to play with his new friend Milosovich.