Question.................. for the LIHOP / MIHOP believers?

[cthrumatrix]

Several of you shared that the 911 report (or other lies surfaced) certainly has reinforced your thoughts on the LIHOP/MIHOP theory's.


My question to you...if this is true...then WHO was behind this? The reach of the "MIHOP/LILHOP tentacles" would be quite broad across CIA/FBI and political for this to be pulled off the way it was.

Many of you have shared PNAC as a desired objective. Again, the question is who is large enough to do this?

Everyone has an opinion...so let me share.

1) The more I read about Bilderberg, CFR & Trilateral the more I think wars are created on purpose and perhaps many of the wars for "profit". So can IRAQ fall into this category? It looks that way.

2) We have created/supported dictatorships for national interests. Are they national interests...or corporate interests?

3) Too much has happened in the US the past three years : Bush "selection", corporate fraud rampant, Market swoon, continued job loss, individual and US debt levels, Patriot Act....etc.

4) Could it be that we have seen the writing on the wall with the amount of OIL left on this planet...and have decided to make our claim becuase we have 30-40 years remaining? Is it that crude?

I think it's interesting that corporate jobs are leaving the US and going abroad for other than $$$ reasons. The "dumbing down" of America is evident every minute on TV...it's sad.

Is this by design...? By who....? And if so....for what reason?

[rman]

1. "a bureacratic elite"..."the earth shall become their inheritance"

We have been warned. Time and time again.

1787 - President Thomas Jefferson
"All the perplexities, confusion and distress in America rise, not from defects in their Constitution or Confederation, not from want of honor or virtue, so much as from downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit and circulation."
...
"Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies."

1881 - President James Abram Garfield (ASSASINATED)
"Whoever controls the volume of money in any country is absolute master of all industry and commerce."

1829 - President Andrew Jackson
"You (the bankers) are a den of vipers and thieves. I intend to rout you out, and by the grace of the eternal God, will rout you out."
"If Congress has the right under the Constitution to issue paper money, it was given to be used by themselves, not to be delegated to individuals or corporations."

1864 - President Abraham Lincoln (ASSASINATED)
"I see in the near future a crisis approaching. It unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. Corporations have been enthroned, an era of corruption will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people, until the wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."

~188? - Chancelor Otto Von Bismarck
"I fear that foreign bankers with their craftiness and tortuous tricks will entirely control the exuberant riches of America and use it to systematically corrupt modern civilization. They will not hesitate to plunge the whole of (humanity) into war and chaos in order that the earth shall become their inheritance."

1920 - Sir Josiah Stamp, President of The Bank of England
"Banking was conceived in iniquity, and was born in sin. The Bankers own the Earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create deposits, and with the flick of the pen, they will create enough deposits, to buy it back again. However, take it (the power to create deposits) away from them, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear, and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But if you wish to remain the slaves of Bankers, and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create deposits."

1920 - writer Maynard Keynes
"By a continuous process of inflation, governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens. By this method, they not only confiscate, but they confiscate arbitrarily; and while the process impoverishes many, it actually enriches some. The process engages all of the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner that not one man in a million can diagnose." (Economic Consequences of the Peace)

1933 - President Franklin D. Roosevelt
The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government ever since the days of Andrew Jackson. History depicts Andrew Jackson as the last truly honorable and incorruptible American president."

1953 - journalist John Swinton
"The business of the journalist is to destroy the truth, to lie outright, to pervert, to vilify, to fawn at the feet of mammon, and to sell the country for his daily bread. You know it and I know it, and what folly is this toasting an independent press. We are the jumping jacks, they pull the strings and we dance. Our talents, our possibilities and our lives are all the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes."

1954 - Senator William Jenner
"We have operating within our government and political system, another body representing another form of government, a bureacratic elite which believes our Constitution is outmoded and is sure that it is the winning side. All the strange developments in foreign policy agreements may be traced to this group who are going to make us over to suit their pleasure. This political action group has its own local political support organizations, its own pressure groups, its own vested interests, its foothold within our government, and its own propaganda apparatus."

1960 - Alan Greenspan, Chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank
"Deficit spending is simply a scheme for confiscation of wealth."

1963 - President John Fitzgerald Kennedy (ASSASINATED)
"The high office of the President has been used to foment a plot to destroy the American's freedom and before I leave office, I must inform the citizen of this plight."

~199? - Rubin Frank, former president NBC News:
"News is what someone wants to suppress.
Everything else is advertising."

[cthrumatrix]

2. so who are the "elitist's"....can we do anything?

I'm for disclosure...what can be done?

[rman]

3. henchmen of Bildenbergs etc, i'd guess

where the Bildenbergs etcetera represent the interests of the 'financial elements in the large centers'. Bildenberg is one of the unofficial international organisations, WTO, IMF etc are official, but it comes down to the same thing.

You know what they say: "follow the money". the money doesn't end with big business, that's not a secret.

Disclosure is effective only if many people see and understand what is being disclosed. I think we'd first need more evidence.

What we can do, theoretically (and only after succesfull disclosure), is take away "the power to create deposits" from the bankers. So, that's not going to happen any time soon.

Seriously, I think probably the single biggest mistake was to make a deal with some guys who offered to take care of our money (no doubt making it worth their while for those who they made the agreement with).
It already had happened in Europe when the deal was made in the US by a skeleton government most of who were absent at the time (sounds like a familiar kind of political trickery doesn't it).

The only thing we can do for now is talk about it, hoping a few more people will pick it up. many will say we are as crazy as LaRouche, Trotsky, the Global Justice movement (aka anti-globalisation).

[Tinoire]

4. Bilderbergers, CFR, Trilateral Commission

Ditto w/th Rman post # 3 . I can't re-type my posts. There are several of them in these threads. I haven't a doubt in my mind. I know it sounds kooky at first but they more you did- the more you find and the more the conclusion is inescapable. There were too many confirmations before Bush even appeared on the scene. Some of my research into stuff happening under Clinton led me to that. Everything happening now was predicted on sites I thought were too "conspiracy prone" at least 6 years ago- things I thought were way too outlandish but now that they've happened/are happening, I'm literally stunned. These are not pretty people and I am sorry we don't have an archive for these stories at DU.

Look how people dismissed PNAC when it first came up!


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=23111#33422

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=29173#29319 (starting w/ 36)

On edit: And let me add Carlyle- not as a group in itself because Carlyle is just their investment house. Several of the board members are bigwigs in the Bilderberg and CFR .

I'm tired of hearing people dismiss these guys so easily as it they were just more good old boys clubs. When CFR is working directly with our Congress and made up of sextremely powerful people BECKING world leaders to come brief them and take instruction- what do people think? That Bill Clinton as President of the US had nothing better to do than to attend CFR and Bilderberg meetings? That Chirac has nothing better to do with his time than to attend? That they have to barricade themselves under high security for their meetings because they're playing pool? WOuld that it were so. Would that James Baker's energy paper not have been written for the CFR! Same as Wolfowitz. Cheney... The Bush cabinet is almost 100% CFR- the ridiculous exception is Bush himself because he's too stupid for him to trust them- but poppy Bush is CFR and we all know who's really running this show.

[PATRICK]

5. or rather a "mob syndicate"?

We need evidence. Until then doggedly reasonable pursuit of the truth need be neither deferential(in reference to high power and responsibility it should be all the more critical! the opposite of the pushed prevalent pose) nor wildly imaginative with undue faith.

A football stadium of conspirators tasking a brutal takeoverof the world
during some conference is untrue. leaks, trust, stupiidity doom enough nefarious efforts as it is. A common broad conservative philosophy protecting smaller groups is eoungh. Now everyone in a crime syndicate sees the whole operation or plans the murders. When things fgo wrong the top is removed or the organization falls apart.

The cabal sitting on top of the most powerful nation on earth is small, its base of fellow capitalist elites much larger. As when they trusted Hitler for the Big Picture, the top is again unwraveling, overreaching, too personally greedy(the nature of the beast), the stakes and methoids immeasurably more complex and greater. Bluff, blitz and diversifying of the attack is meant to overwhelm the majority of the world.

Eeveryone of these goons has a 1000 Year Reich and Five Year Plan in their PR package. Secret cults have always used a lore of ancient traditions(fictions) and suggested "powers" for their PR. People needing that kind of hogwash are hiding their actual weakness. When they go public the fantasy veneer switches to the lie of "public service". Our immediate problem is the goofy cabals David Brock clearly delineates, who also bolster themselves with fantasy and intractability. The corporate aristocrats are not so malign or organized outside of their cartels for profit. Regulated by reality and democracy, civil governments, that problem is not so loony. Generally the nations have to know how to control one track minds only concerned with bottom lines and self importance.

What we seeing is that by not facing down ANY internal threat to democracy the whole world is threatened, regardless of the specific individuals working alone or in tandem or at cross purposes against humanity.

"Limited" wars are created out of greed and frustration and ignorance.
They always turn out not to be so limited even when all the results can be spun to look good for the perpetrators. It is a sign of failure of business sense and incipient madness. That kind of evil cannot be rational or an answer to their desires. They may indeed have dark alternatives to dealing with large human crises and competition on the globe. They cannot be allowed to drive the agenda down this one path.

You don't need to identify or prove this to oppose the actions and plan a better world. I am not in awe or wonder at pretentious suicides.

[PATRICK]

6. But specifically

Grab oil then switch to water and food etc. A century of imperial dominance not a federation of nations. Who needs the details? Regardless of how and who that is what is developing and it is counter to everyone's best interest. Some in power should go to jail forever.

People should know they don't have to join in the Dance of Death. We can stop this as no other generation could. No other generation was ever faced with the absolute life or death necessity of stopping the nonsense.

[PATRICK]

7. more specifically

911 at least looks like the prospect of exploitation of an "incident" crowded out any hope or desire of preventing it, if they were not so preoccupied already with other goals that their whole focus was(as IS NOW) all cast outward to conquering the source countries(with oil).

The questions on specific like NORAD's behavior, lousty crisis handling and intel deadends must be answered better and none of those have been adequately resolved above the field level.