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Finally! Religious/spiritual liberal/progressive DUers unite!

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IrateCitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 03:56 PM
Original message
Finally! Religious/spiritual liberal/progressive DUers unite!
Finally! Progressive religious leaders are becoming fed up with the hijacking of our banner of faith by the religious right!

For those of you who didn't see it, there was an amazing piece on last week's NOW in which Bill Moyers interviewed Joseph C. Hough, head of the Union Theological Seminary at Columbia University. Hough spoke on current issues from the point of view of a man of faith who expresses righteous outrage at what he perceives to be actions in opposition to basic "Abrahamic" religious traditions (referring to Judaism, Christianity and Islam) by figures on the religious right.

In my opinion, what Hough says is what ALL of the religious/spiritual community that doesn't agree with what the right wing is doing needs to be saying. It is also a prime example of how enlightened people of faith are not just allies, but important members of the progressive community. For those who do not believe, please note that at no point during the interview does Hough make any condemnation of any other religion (or lack thereof), but rather presents his religion as his moral basis for his beliefs -- and calls upon other people of faith to come to the same realization.

Bill Moyers talks to Joseph C. Hough on the intersection of politics and religion, and why he thinks it is the duty of Christians, Jews and Muslims to join to fight growing economic inequality, why he’s critical of how some political pundits are using Christianity to justify their actions, and why he suspects that the time for a non-destructive, civil disobedience may be near.

Some choice excerpts:

It appears also in the Sermon on the Mount. It appears indirectly in the feeding of the five thousand or four thousand, whichever you want. It's reported four times in the Gospel, more than any other single event in the life of Jesus. In every case, and it also, in a way, it foreshadows the Eucharist. Because the Eucharistic meal was first a meal for the people who were the followers of Jesus. And if you look it Acts 3, you will see that those followers of Jesus saw to it that people who didn't have enough to eat could come to that table and get enough to eat. That was the radical model they put out there. Nobody likes to talk about that very much. But there it is. Right in the middle of Acts.

And they continued to worship in the temple. This is a continuity with the best in the Jewish tradition, and it is also no accident that there's some strong similarities in the Koran. And that is why I think all of us in the Abrahamic traditions who share this conviction about care for the least fortunate should simply make some kind of public declaration that enough is enough. We've gone far enough.


SNIP...

But, you know, the Lord Jesus said, "By their fruits, you shall know them." And speaking as a humble fruit inspector of the Lord, I'd say that if this person is a Born Again Christian, there's a mixed signal somewhere." I feel the same way.

If Tom Delay is acting out of his Born Again Christian convictions in pushing legislation that disadvantages the poor every time he opens his mouth, I'm not saying he's not a Born Again Christian, but as a the Lord's humble fruit inspector, it sure looks suspicious to me. And anybody who claims in the name of God they're gonna run over people of other nations, and just willy-nilly, by your own free will, reshape the world in your own image, and claim that you're acting on behalf of God, that sounds a lot like Caesar to me.


These are just two short snips, but I implore you to read the entire piece. It is THAT good. And it presents a compelling case of the need of religious/spiritual progressives to spread this message through their religious communities. The time of allowing the Christian Right to hijack the spirit of religion needs to come to an end, and WE religious/spiritual progressives need to gather the righteous indignation necessary to take our mantle of faith BACK!
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
1. Hough was incredible!!
He was so angry, yet dignified, that I was thinking "If this guy were any more passionate, his head will explode right here on PBS". I loved his comments about DeLay, and was surprised that he named names.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
2. just don't show up on my doorstep
please
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IrateCitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. The only thing I'll be showing up on your doorstep for, Skittles...
Edited on Tue Oct-28-03 04:07 PM by IrateCitizen
... is to invite you outside to join in the peaceful revolution. :D

Please note my post, and the entire piece I linked. At no time does it place any emphasis on the need to "recruit new members". It simply talks of the need for people of a religious/spiritual bent to get about the business of setting right the inequities in our society, and to loudly and clearly condemn the actions of those who seek to increase those inequities.

ON EDIT: And of course, we welcome the efforts of our friends from other religious communities (or none at all) in undertaking this worthy endeavor! Yes, that means you, Skittles! :D
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
3. "As the Lord's humble fruit inspector"
Spot on! Last Sunday's message at Peace Church of the Brethren prominently featured extensive citations to the Hough appearance, and came out of Jesus' first public utterance at Nazareth, where he read from Isaiah (Luke 4:16-22). It was a corker!
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info being Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
4. I saw that...
excellent piece.
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Qutzupalotl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
5. This was excellent.
Saw it Friday. Thanks for the link! Plenty of good ammunition here.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:04 PM
Response to Original message
7. Change the Catholic Church? - or move on to Episcopal?
righteous indignation - even when humble, as in the Voice of the Faithfull in the Catholic Church - rarely change a biased conservative Bishop or Minister who is certain his read of God is the correct read.

But you are correct - we need to keep our voices heard - and to keep praying - for to do otherwise would be to accept the conservative views that come with some "born again" beliefs.
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:05 PM
Original message
Not about any churches
His message was to the lay people:

"Bill Moyers talks to Joseph C. Hough on the intersection of politics and religion, and why he thinks it is the duty of Christians, Jews and Muslims to join to fight growing economic inequality, why he’s critical of how some political pundits are using Christianity to justify their actions, and why he suspects that the time for a non-destructive, civil disobedience may be near."
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xray s Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
8. count me in
thanks for the post
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Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
9. I remember watching a meeting
a while ago when Clinton was President (feels like ages ago) between Clinton, Hillary and Eli Weisel. I cannot remember the program or where it took place, but it was televised and I think onstage. Toward the end Bill asked Weisel what was to be done about the radical religious extremists that were taking hold in this country--Weisel's answer was that any resistance to these groups had to come from the Christian community itself.
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UrbScotty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
10. Altogether now...
Edited on Tue Oct-28-03 04:20 PM by ih8thegop
AMEN!

HALLELUJAH!

The Fundamentalists are going down with Bush in 2004!

AYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY-MMMMEEEENNNNN!!!

<Upbeat gospel music>
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IrateCitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Not unless we are ready to do the work before us.
Inaction on our part will not bring down the fundamentalists who have hijacked the banner of progressive people of faith. It will, rather, take a great deal of action on our part, to spread not only the message of ending these inequalities in our society, but to spur others on toward doing the same.

It isn't going to be easy. And it's about a helluva lot more than just getting Bush replaced by some Democrat to be named later in 2004. In fact, I would cite the Presidential election as a rather small thing in comparison to the greater goal, which is to get society to a state in which some people are not left to wonder if they'll be able to eat or have a roof over their head.
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IrateCitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
12. KICK!
Back up to the front page so hopefully more people will read this.

:kick:
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Selwynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
13. This was beautiful - there are many people of faith like this....
And yes, we are trying hard to counter and overcome the loud and hateful voices of fanatical fundamentalism; no we don't apologize for them. Its the same fight that liberal voices of reason fight against the far conservative right.

What frustrates me about people who "hate" all religious people and speak bitterly and angrily about all people of faith is this: I could turn around and say "all Americans are idiots and morons, and hold extreme fanatically conservative positions, etc." And you would say "hey! I resent that! Not all Americans believe this far-right bull crap! I am a proud democrat and American so please don’t associate me with these people."

Well guess what... the same is true of people of faith. I have spiritual beliefs, and guess what - I am not a bad person. :)

Anyway, this was a beautiful example of principles I believe in very much!

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youngred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-03 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. Thanks
that's a comparison i've been trying to make for a long time. They always rebutt that you choose a religion not nationality. Fact is you choose both.

Peace between believers and non of all races and creeds
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sangha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
14. kick
for the night crew
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
15. As a moderate Pagan
I'm glad to see this shift. Christianity has a lot of potential, but so many seem to take it in the wrong direction.
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Padraig18 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-03 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
16. I'm already on the same page!
Our diocese is headed by a fantastic bishop who organized and led the first anti-war demonstration in central Illinois! :thumbsup:
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IrateCitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-03 09:30 AM
Response to Original message
17. One more kick for the morning crowd...
:hangover: :kick:
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-03 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. And I'll help kick that one
That segment was my favorite in an overall excellent program.

As a former Baptist minister, Moyers surely knows that not all religious people are raving fundies.

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Liberator_Rev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-03 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
19. Are Hough & Moyers "Liberals Like Christ" ?
Edited on Wed Oct-29-03 03:06 PM by Liberator_Rev
forgot I could edit the title.
They may not know it yet, but I consider them "Liberals Like Christ" and have written to tell Rev. Hough that we have been engaged in this mission since 1997, and with the help people like himself, it might actually succeed.

Although several DUers are unhappy that Alan Colmes isn't as dynamic a Liberal as we might like, he at least is ON THE AIR, and ON SCREEN, while more aggressive Liberals like Jim Hightower & Gov. Mario Cuomo (whom I love) have been relegated to the sidelines. Alan at least is getting SOME of our message heard, while hardly anyone hears our more outspoken favorites.

In his new book,"Red, White and Liberal", Alan devotes a whole chapter to the theme of "Liberals Like Christ", i.e. that "Christ was a Liberal" and refers his readers(on page 233) to "Ray Dubuque's fabulous web site, http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org".

As a result of this chapter being the one generating the most response so far, Alan invited me to spend an hour discussing the topic on his radio show last Thursday.
Ray Dubuque

at http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org.

See what Christ might say about the "Christian Coalition" & "Religious Right" imposters.
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