Freaking Kerry

[Cleetus]

Where was this passionate man during the campain? During the campain he looked so "formal" and "uptight" for lack of better words. It's like everything he said was "My Fellow Americans, let me make one thing perfectly clear...".

I like Kerry. I believed him. I still do. But just look at him now. Full of fire, passionate, alive.

Where was *this* Kerry a year ago?

[quiet.american]

1. I think this has come to be known as "The Gore Syndrome." n/t

[Cleetus]

8. Gore Syndrome?

I haven't heard that one before, but I get it.

What a shame. Kerry is a strong, passionate man. So was Gore.

[quiet.american]

18. Actually, maybe it should be called the "Gore Unleashed Syndrome."

Erring on the side of campaign caution effectively muzzled both men -- and I agree, both are passionate and brilliant in their own ways. Once they were both out from under the shackle of "so-and-so-doesn't-speak-for-me" cautious Democratic advisers -- watch out! They're funny, they're bold, they're loose.

Too bad we just couldn't see more of that on the campaign trail.

[Uncle Joe]

27. This is the actual Gore Syndrome. Click on link for full details.

http://dailyhowler.com/

http://dailyhowler.com/dh021105.shtml

ALL SANG FROM ONE HYMNAL: The fakers and frauds all knew what to tell you. Russert/Klein’s amazing discussion continued; for more excerpts from their one-sided trashing, see THE DAILY HOWLER, 2/11/05. But then, everyone knew what the talking-points were. Al Gore was being too nasty and negative! With Gore, it was just “attack attack attack!” How scripted were the press corps’ magpies? In the spring of 2000, as Social Security came under discussion, all the pious fakers and frauds sang from one sweet hymnal:

The Beltway Boys, Fox News Channel, April 30, 2000:
MORT KONDRACKE (4/30/00): Look, the dynamic here is perfectly obvious. Gore is behind in all the polls, so he's doing what worked with Bill Bradley, attack attack attack, and, you know, and he's hoping that it'll work on George W. Bush. The difference is that George W. Bush is not going to take it forever. I mean, George W. knows how to counterpunch, and I predict soon that he'll start doing it.
FRED BARNES: Yes, he's not going to be the guy on the ropes just getting punched. No rope-a-dope for him. But look, Gore was attack attack attacking, and he's—in the beginning, and now he's been going down as a result of that attack attack attacking. He doesn't—I don't think he knows how to deal with Bush, who doesn't want to really get—engage him in a back-and-forth, wisely.

Hardball, MSNBC, May 5, 2000:
CHRIS MATTHEWS: Norah, let’s start in talking about this amazing campaign. Who would have believed that George W. Bush would have looked so clean and so good right now after that bruising fight with John McCain? He’s up five points in a number of polls this week, and yet you see Al Gore picking away at him with these left jabs of his…It’s the same thing he did to Bill Bradley—attack, attack, attack.

Russert, CNBC, May 6, 2000:
KLEIN: The concern I have about the Gore campaign is that he has learned one lesson and he’s kind of becoming a one-trick pony.
RUSSERT: Attack. Attack. Attack.
KLEIN: Attack. Attack.
RUSSERT: Governor Bush put forward a Social Security plan calling for a partial privatizing, and he attacks, saying that is risky…Why, why—why does Gore just, almost knee-jerk, attack, attack, attack?

Inside Politics, CNN, May 17, 2000:
CHARLES COOK: For Governor Bush, it’s a chance to show sort of bold leadership…But at the same time, getting into that area is certainly a risky thing and it’s going to test all of George Bush’s abilities of persuasion to sell this, because Al Gore is very good at the attack, just look at what he did to Bill Bradley on health care…
BERNARD SHAW: What comes to mind, Stu?
STUART ROTHENBERG: Well, in general, he has been attacking for months now and there’s been a lot of criticism that he’s been overly negative. Once again, here, attack, attack.

[quiet.american]

31. Thanks for the links, will read in-depth. n/t

[Uncle Joe]

36. You are more than welcome quiet.american. n/t

[Cleetus]

39. excellent

Thanks for the link.

Cheers

[Uncle Joe]

41. Cheers right back at you Cleetus.

:toast:

[SoFlaJet]

2. Same guy

same message-minus the advisors.I saw him in West Palm during the campaign and he was giving it to them then.The press,unfortunately only wanted to focus on Swift Boat crap.

[LSK]

3. thats funny, because it seems the same old Kerry to me

He ALWAYS speaks like that.

[BobRossi]

4. Will the real John Kerry please stand up! nt

[bunkerbuster1]

5. cmon. He was out there. If you didn't watch CSPAN you didn't see it.

The shitty little soundbites on the evening news always made Chimpy McFuckstain sound more elegant than he was, and made Kerry look uncomfortable. But if you actually watched Kerry's stump speeches, you knew that he could deliver the goods.

But our corporate media wouldn't let America see that. Have to be "balanced." With their fingers on Chimpy's side of the scale, of course.

[LSK]

10. exactly, many of his campaign events are in the CSPAN archives

[Cleetus]

25. CSPAN

I did watch Kerry on the Stump. He was like Kostner in "The Bodyguard". Made of cardboard. He is much more passionate on the floor of the Senate then he was when he was stumping.

Juniors act of being an "Average guy you can have a beer with" was brialliantly scripted. This really sucks, because we all knew junior wa full of shit and Kerry had the goods. Wasn't worth shit. The attention span of the typical American is very, very short. Only room enough for an initial impression. Don't believe me? Look at a Toyota commercial, 17 edits in 30 seconds.

The ironic part? Kerry is still at it. Watching him a few moments ago on the floor of the Senate, I could almost cry. And junior is still at it, too.

I don't blame Kerry, and I'm not mad at the chimp. I'm mad at the American public for buying goods that were obviously defective. What is wrong with people?

Kerry should have won in a landslide. So much of a landslide that all the Diebold machines and Karl Roves and Ken Melhmens wouldn't have made the slightest difference.

God, I'm pissed. Chimpy on TV again? First thing in the morning I turn on the tube and I'w welcomed by the idiot son? I'm sick of it. Sseeing that smirky bastard. I hope he keeps doing what he's doing. The more he works at it the lower he sinks in the polls. Come '06, these assholes better be toast, because, after all the fuck ups, lies, corruption and stupidity, if things don't change then there is no hope left for the United States.

[loudsue]

35. Cleetus, I don't think you "get it" about computerized vote counting:

"Kerry should have won in a landslide. So much of a landslide that all the Diebold machines and Karl Roves and Ken Melhmens wouldn't have made the slightest difference."

See, the thing about computers is this: You only have to program a computer to "flip" votes. For instance, if I vote for Kerry, the tabulator will count it for bush. In this way, it doesn't matter HOW MANY votes Kerry gets, they all go to bush. So the greater the landslide for Kerry, the greater the number of votes that are counted ....FOR BUSH.

Those DUers that keep harping on this "landslide" business, don't GET IT that all the computers do is make it APPEAR the "landslide" went for bush.

:kick::kick::kick:

[Cleetus]

42. question

Was any research ever done comparing states that use the Diebold machines to those that don't? I'm not defending O'Dell or Diebold. I know what they did. It's just that what you suggest sounds so bold and brazen.

One thing, what you suggest would explain why what happened with the exit polls was almost statistically impossible.

A vote for Kerry turned into a vote for Bush? Man, that takes a big set of balls. I thought they changed the numbers *just enough* once they knew just what they needed to win.

Are you saying that the vote tampering happened at the machine at the time the vote was cast?

I would like to know more about how they got away with this. Considering nobody has stepped forward and admitted it, speculation based on what we do know will be more than enough.

[loudsue]

50. Yep. There are tons of threads on DU about it, and there is a whole

forum dedicated to election fraud.

There was a LOT of machine flipping that was witnessed by many, many voters, in most states. They'd press the screen for Kerry, and a check would appear by bush's name.

But the REAL problems happen at the central tabulators.

Check out the election forum....there's a world of research offered there.

:kick::kick::kick:

[Robert Oak]

6. no more "advisors"

Damn advisors get a candidate so messed up they don't know if they are coming or going.

This demographic, that PR reaction, this image, that geographical local market focus study yada yada.

No wonder we get corporate front men as our representatives.

[POAS]

7. For what it's worth, I asked myself

the same question. In fact I posted it at another board that I frequent.

[bigtree]

9. months out of cancer surgery, he still lit up the campaign

too bad the press didn't bother to bring those images to you. I saw them. This is the man I voted for.

[rd_kent]

11. I made a comment like that and got flamed!!!!!

A couple of weeks ago, I made a comment like that, saying I wish Kerry had said things like that in the campaign and I got flamed!!!!!

[LSK]

14. did you watch any of his entire campaign events on CSPAN?

[rd_kent]

43. Yes

I watched alot of them.

[Cleetus]

30. flamed?

Why would you get flamed?

[LSK]

33. Kerry topics often turn into flame wars

I guess people dont pay attention enough and are still mad at him for conceding so fast.

[rd_kent]

45. I dont know?

I stated my opinion and I was jumped on.

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

Did you see him speak live?

He was this passionate during the campaign.
I saw his rally the Thursday before the Election, and he was amazing.
Then I switched on the 10pm local news, and they covered less than 10 seconds of his speech. Most of the report consistedn of
editorializing by the news anchors and the reporter, not acutal reporting on the speech itself.
The media didn't cover Kerry's speeches as well as they should have.

[Cleetus]

37. never saw him live

I did catch a few events on CSPAN, though. He was mostly uptight. Teleprompter eyes, reading prepared material. I believed him, but I didn't think he was doing enough to connect with the average Joe

He was this passionate during the campaign.
I saw his rally the Thursday before the Election, and he was amazing.
Then I switched on the 10pm local news, and they covered less than 10 seconds of his speech. Most of the report consistedn of
editorializing by the news anchors and the reporter, not acutal reporting on the speech itself.
The media didn't cover Kerry's speeches as well as they should have.

No, I never caught him live. I agree with you about the media. Bush looked great with his sleeves rolled up, slapping Joe Six=Pack on the back. In the eyes of the undecided voter I think 10 seconds of Bush was more effective than 10 seconds of Kerry.

It's a shame that it has to be this way, but this is the way it is. The unwashed masses have an attention span of maybe 15 seconds, so the networks play it safe and feed the public 10 second video clips. Nobody watches CSPAN, except me and whoever is reading this. The average schmuck couldn't give 2 shits. They make decisions using their gut, based on 10 second video clips. They don't give a shit about facts. They voted on who they would rather have a beer with. That, and FUD. Combine that with the skullduggery of Wally O'Dell and you end up with 4 more years of the chimp.

Fucking shame.

Besides, the CD is never as good as the live show. Being there, being in the moment, surrounded by kindred souls is a more powerful experience than watching the event on CSPAN at 3 in the morning.

[emulatorloo]

12. on CNN's cutting room floor: showed best Bush quotes, Worst Kerry ones

they cherry picked the best Bush quotes and the worst Kerry ones.

Or they showed footage of Kerry speaking w/o audio while the Cable Talking Head "summarized" what he was saying

(not just CNN)

[StoryTeller]

13. Same guy, as I understand it...

Everything I've seen and studied about him indicates that what you saw in his speech today is who he really is--and who he has been his whole life. I think that the media really shaped an inaccurate picture of him and made sure we didn't see much of this part of his nature and abilities.

Welcome to DU, Cleetus. :hi:

[Generator]

15. All of these responses are good

We all see different things, I can see a little of all of this.

Me: I STILL haven't given up on Kerry. Even though he's damn slow, methodical, and late to the game I know he's on the case. He may come through with something stunning yet. Anyway, he's a damn good Senator and that's a rarity right there.

[Sydnie]

21. Absolutely Generator!

He is the same guy I have been voting for for the Senate for years! This is who he is.

You want to see a real on fire speech check out the speech he gave with the families of 9/11. Can't remember who the sponsor was, but it was during the campaign and that was the most annimated I have ever seen him. He is patient ... he has truth on his side. Eventually, the sheeple will wake up and he will take his rightful place in history. Balanced against the moran in chief, what a glorious read that will be.

[AntiCoup2K4]

16. "Where was *this* Kerry a year ago?"

Buried under a campaign terribly mismanaged by the Delusional Lying Cancer that is killing this party.

It's clear that the DLC's intention was to "take a dive" all along. The only thing debatable is to what degree Kerry complied with their intentions. His premature concession of Ohio certainly doesn't look good, nor does his inexplicable lack of response to the Swift Boat Shitheads.

[Cleetus]

29. I know it

Buried under a campaign terribly mismanaged by the Delusional Lying Cancer that is killing this party.

I don't get it either

It's clear that the DLC's intention was to "take a dive" all along. The only thing debatable is to what degree Kerry complied with their intentions. His premature concession of Ohio certainly doesn't look good, nor does his inexplicable lack of response to the Swift Boat Shitheads.

You're right. Where was the fight? Looking at Kerry on the Senate floor today you would never know this was the same guy who laid down and played dead while he waws being swift-boated and votes were being tavulated on Diebold machines. He let himself get fucked. At least, at the end, Gore put up a fight.

[emulatorloo]

34. kerry responded to swifties - other Dems did not and sat idly

kerry demanded it stop in several speeches, sent max cleland to crawford, put out a commercial w his real swiftboat mates talking about his heroism. Media buried it all.

a few dems stood up for him, but most sat idly by and let it happen

[DemonFighterLives]

53. The Skull and Boners ruled that dubby would be king now and

that Kerry would have to wait. The thing about dubco is that they lie. They will not give Kerry a chance, boner or not.
Kerry's worst mistake was striving for a non existent middle ground. There was no one in the center, the vibrant majority was to the left and against the war and crony capitalism.

[blm]

17. The news networks' editting room floors.

.

[LisaM]

19. Yeah, the media did everything to make him look bad

I saw him speak live, in Seattle, in the pouring rain, and he was great. He had a great speech that was not a stump speech, but that was very focused on Puget Sound issues. But what did local media cover? That it was his wedding anniversary and that he and Teresa went to Canlis for dinner.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

20. Watching the polls and fundraising. Like any politician.

[MemphisTiger]

22. Look what happened to Dean when he was unleashed

they still play the yelling clip on right-wing talk shows. It can be a catch 22.

[patrice]

23. They really should think more in terms of talking one-on-one

to voters, instead of talking to "demographics". They should ask themselves what they would do when addressing an individual person who disagrees with the candidate, what he would do to attract and persuade that voter.

[insane_cratic_gal]

24. I missed it! By the time I got it on dumbass

was speaking.. or one of the many dumb-asses Jeff Sessions.

Does he have no original thought separate from the IV of BushCO?

I missed it, I wish I had seen it!

[LSK]

28. it was a great speech - the Senate didnt seem worthy of it

[Marnieworld]

26. He was there.

I saw him in rally after rally. Perhaps you weren't paying attention.

[Warpy]

32. Thank the DLC

because they hanged a bunch of lobbyists turned presidential candidate handlers around his neck like an albatross.

It's not exclusive to them. Dole was ruined by the same bunch. They took a prochoice moderate Eisenhower GOPer and turned him into that mean old man down the street who yells at kids to keep off his lawn.

Anybody who wants to know where Kerry is really at needs to start reading about the BCCI mess.

He did more with that expose to slow the terrorists down than anybody before or since.

[seabeyond]

38. a lot of shit has happened in a year to be passionate about

that he didnt have a year ago. much of it the media sat on it unto after bush was elected. and i beg to differ, i found him to be passionate in the past. and he gave in his campaign what the people demanded, non attack politics,....... and the people fickle that they are, responded to attack politics.

[Tsiyu]

40. He was listening to the cowards in our own party

too afraid to speak up for themselves.

He was listening to all the fraidy-cat shmucks who didn't want to "alienate the mainstream" by TELLING THE TRUTH.

He was listening to all the public relations folks telling him to put on a "flat affect" because look what the media did to a passionate Howard Dean....

Sometimes you need to be reserved and thoughtful.

When you're fighting for your country, you damned well need some fire in your belly.

[WI_DEM]

44. these guys are putty in the hands of their handlers and then

when they don't make it to the WH--they realize that they should have gone by their own instincts and not by the strategists and pollsters.

[politicasista]

46. it's the corporate media, stupid. but....

I do agree about the handlers. Gore was tight when he was upset, so is Kerry!

[sandnsea]

47. Is Feingold on the teevee tonight?

I hear he was absolutely on fire today. I see a seaplane crash on MSNBC. What's on CNN?

One of these days the gullible grassroots will get it.

[LittleClarkie]

48. Same place the old Gore was during his campaign

I reckon.

I like the "after" version of both men better than the "before."

Losing to the Shrub does something to ya, I guess.

[RagingInMiami]

49. He suffers from the Al Gore syndrome

[eridani]

51. I think it's called "getting away from campaign handlers" n/t

[Vinca]

52. Kerry's even better when he's totally spontaneous.

I think he was overmanaged (and poorly managed) during the campaign. If he had only been himself - passionate, committed, funny at times. In the end I still think it was stolen from him anyway.