We are the only industrialized nation with a death penalty!

[Raydawg1234]

Shame

[jbnow]

1. It's our way to

be one with the axis of evil.

[Raydawg1234]

4. the only difference is that over there, they behead the "infidels"

[BlueEyedSon]

2. And no health insurance.

[Jim Sagle]

3. That makes us SPESHul.

[Warren Stupidity]

5. Sorry. Wrong. Japan.

[Raydawg1234]

6. They do?

[Warren Stupidity]

8. Yes and they carry out one or two executions a year.

I believe there may be others that fit the label 'industrialized'.

[Raydawg1234]

16. We may not be the only ones, but we execute waaaaay more,

and that is disgusting.

[Warren Stupidity]

24. OK -but

China executes bunches of people and they are industrializing us out of industrialization.

The point is that this particular line of argument against the DP ends up with you revising your position to accomodate uncomfortable facts. It is better to start out with the hedged 'one of the few', which works and avoids all the digressions. Better yet, the death penalty is wrong in and of itself and would be wrong even if every other nation on earth used it and used it with greater frequency and less certainty than we do. Your argument is a fallacy to begin with. The popularity of an idea does not determine its validity, and certainly does not prove it ethical.

[Raydawg1234]

26. What I meant is that we have not kept up with our peers as leaders in

human rights.

[Warren Stupidity]

28. we gave up on that as the europeans abandoned slavery

Like 1830 or so for GB. We had legal segregation here until the 60's. Women still do not have equal rights and about half the voters would like to take rights away from homosexuals.

The myth of America as LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD CHAMPION OF FREEDOM blah blah blah, is just that. We are the leader of the anti-communist side of the cold war because we took over the military leadership of the 'allies' after the collapse of GB ability to do so. It has been a long long time since we were the leaders in human rights and what was once referred to as the enlightenment.

[Raydawg1234]

29. I agree

:kick:
:toast:

[Tom Bombadil]

35. Not sure that China is industrialized.

Isn't something like 2/3 of the country still agricultural, not industrial?

[Spider Jerusalem]

27. China.

Either #2 or #3 manufacturing nation in the world (not sure if they've passed Germany on the list yet or not).

And maybe Russia (if Russia counts as "industrialised".

[Art_from_Ark]

32. I have heard that Japan has imposed a moratorium

on executions, which was discussed here a month or so ago, but I can't find anything about it in the on-line Japanese press. At any rate, the new Japanese Justice Minister has come out against the death penalty:

http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content=news&id=354075

[HEyHEY]

10. Fuck, they kill you there for hitting on 19

[Richard D]

7. Japan also

2-4 executions a year. Quite brutal as well.

[Richard D]

11. The Death Club

Countries That Permit the Death Penalty:

Afghanistan, Antigua and Barbuda, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belize, Botswana, Burundi, Cameroon, Chad, China (People's Republic), Comoros, Congo (Democratic Republic), Cuba, Dominica, Egypt, Equatorial Guinea, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Ghana, Guatemala, Guinea, Guyana, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan,
Korea/North, Korea/South, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Laos, Lebanon, Lesotho, Liberia, Libya, Malawi, Malaysia, Mongolia, Nigeria, Oman, Pakistan, Palestinian Authority, Philippines, Qatar, Rwanda, St. Kitts and Nevis, St. Lucia, St. Vincent and the Grenadines, Saudi Arabia, Sierra Leone, Singapore, Somalia, Sudan, Swaziland, Syria, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Tanzania, Thailand, Trinidad and Tobago, Uganda, United Arab Emirates, United States, Uzbekistan, Vietnam, Yemen, Zambia, Zimbabwe.

[Raydawg1234]

17. Maybe I should have said the only Western nation?

[Art_from_Ark]

33. This year there apparently have been two executions in Japan

including the man who stabbed a couple of dozen kids in an elementary school in Osaka (killing 8), and some mobster in Fukuoka who killed 3 people. Both were apparently hanged.

[gulfcoastliberal]

9. Pancurium Bromide & Potassium Chloride

The internets say they're so painful that they are banned for use in animal euthanasia. So much for lethal injection not being cruel and unusual.

Doctors have described pancurium bromide as a “chemical veil,” which means that the instrument of death “makes the patient look serene because of its paralytic effect on the muscles.”(Phillips, 2003)The patient’s facial muscles can neither move nor contract to show pain and suffering.So, as this man was slowly erased from existence, he experienced excruciating pain but no one could tell.Pancurium bromide is not only used to kill humans, it has also been used to euthanize cats and dogs, however years ago the American Veterinary Association condemned its use as inhumane.In 2003, the Texas state legislature took a similar position and passed a bill that made it illegal for animal shelters to put down animals using pancurium bromide, but the bill failed to mention people.(Phillips, 2003)Ergo, in Texas cats and dogs are now spared the horrors of death from pancurium bromide, yet this “inhumane” chemical is still used to take the lives of humans in the name of capital punishment.

http://www.xanga.com/item.aspx?user=mwelch989&tab=weblogs&uid=243093192

[Clarkie1]

12. The Death Penalty Worldwide...

The Death Penalty Worldwide
According to Amnesty International, during 2004 more than 3,797 people were executed in 25 countries, and more than 7,395 people were sentenced to death in 64 countries. See also U.S. Figures.

Death Penalty Outlawed (year)1
Andorra (1990)
Angola (1992)
Armenia (2003)
Australia (1984)
Austria (1950)
Azerbaijan (1998)
Belgium (1996)
Bermuda (1999)
Bhutan (2004)
Bosnia-Herzegovina (1997)
Bulgaria (1998)
Cambodia (1989)
Canada (1976)
Cape Verde (1981)
Colombia (1910)
Costa Rica (1877)
Côte d'Ivoire (2000)
Croatia (1990)
Cyprus (1983)
Czech Republic (1990)
Denmark (1933)
Djibouti (1995)
Dominican Republic (1966)
East Timor (1999)
Ecuador (1906)
Estonia (1998)
Finland (1949)
France (1981)
Georgia (1997)
Germany (1987)
Greece (1993)
Guinea-Bissau (1993)
Haiti (1987)
Honduras (1956)
Hungary (1990)
Iceland (1928)
Ireland (1990)
Italy (1947)
Kiribati (1979)
Liechtenstein (1987)
Lithuania (1998)
Luxembourg (1979)
Macedonia (1991)
Malta (1971)
Marshall Islands (1986)
Mauritius (1995)
Mexico (2005)
Micronesia (1986)
Moldova (1995)
Monaco (1962)
Mozambique (1990)
Namibia (1990)
Nepal (1990)
Netherlands (1870)
New Zealand (1961)
Nicaragua (1979)
Niue (n.a.)
Norway (1905)
Palau (n.a.)
Panama (1903)
Paraguay (1992)
Poland (1997)
Portugal (1867)
Romania (1989)
Samoa (2004)
San Marino (1848)
São Tomé and Príncipe (1990)
Senegal (2004)
Serbia and Montenegro (2002)
Seychelles (1993)
Slovak Republic (1990)
Slovenia (1989)
Solomon Islands (1966)
South Africa (1995)
Spain (1978)
Sweden (1921)
Switzerland (1942)
Turkey (2002)
Turkmenistan (1999)
Tuvalu (1978)
Ukraine (1999)
United Kingdom (1973)
Uruguay (1907)
Vanuatu (1980)
Vatican City (1969)
Venezuela (1863)

Death Penalty Outlawed for Ordinary Crimes2 (year)
Albania (2000)
Argentina (1984)
Bolivia (1997)
Brazil (1979)
Chile (2001)
Cook Islands (n.a.)
El Salvador (1983)
Fiji (1979)
Israel (1954)
Latvia (1999)
Peru (1979)

De Facto Ban on Death Penalty3 (year)4
Algeria (1993)
Benin (1987)
Brunei Darussalam (1957)
Burkina Faso (1988)
Central African Republic (1981)
Congo (Republic) (1982)
Gambia (1981)
Grenada (1978)
Kenya (n.a.)
Madagascar (1958)
Maldives (1952)
Mali (1980)
Mauritania (1987)
Morocco (1993)
Myanmar (1993)
Nauru (1968)
Niger (1976)
Papua New Guinea (1950)
Russia (1999)
Sri Lanka (1976)
Suriname (1982)
Togo (n.a.)
Tonga (1982)
Tunisia (1990)

Death Penalty Permitted
Afghanistan
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mongolia
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe

Edit: link...http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0777460.html

[Raydawg1234]

19. Yah, and we claim to be leaders in human rights

[Tom Bombadil]

37. Esteemed company

for the USA in that list...
North Korea, Iran, Sudan, Saudi, Zimbabwe, such bastions of human rights and civilization.

[Avalux]

13. Unfortunately, in the grand scheme of things,

the US is just like an adolescent teenager with raging hormones.

[beyurslf]

14. In my death penalty class, we studied countries with and without

the death penalty. The more religious a nation, the more likely they were to have the death penalty.

[spindrifter]

15. Depends on what you call industrialized--

Singapore recently executed a drug smuggler and China executes people pretty frequently.

[Raydawg1234]

21. A better term would have been Western Nation

[BuyingThyme]

36. ...or democracy.

[proud2BlibKansan]

18. There's a map at this link

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5583308&mesg_id=5583308

[TreasonousBastard]

34. For the full list....

http://web.amnesty.org/pages/deathpenalty-countries-eng

The list needs some more footmotes-- for instance, Brazil has the death penalty only for certain types of treason, and hasn't executed anyone for over a hundred years. Israel retains the death penalty only for Holocaust war criminals. A few others with it on the books have similar restrictions and rarely, if ever, hold capital trials.

[meti57b]

20. Are we still industrialized? What industries do we still have, anymore?

[Warren Stupidity]

30. Hmm well lets see...

We have the military industrial complex industry and we have the crime/drugs/law enforcement/prison industry and we make a really poor selection of cars nobody wants to buy anymore. Oh and we used to have a high tech industry but we lost it someplace.


We do sell a lot of real estate to each other though. I always wonder where the money comes from for all those macmansions. Drugs? Wars? or Prisons?

[Fescue4u]

22. Is Industrialization a positive indicator of morality now?

I know many folks who would argue that corporate industrialization is anything but moral.

[marmar]

23. Just another sad and glaring indictment...

of the hypocrasies of the U.S. of A., which sadly are on display for the world to see. The Shining City on the Hill is looking like a busted up tenement these days.

:cry:

[Raydawg1234]

25. True

But lots of people don't give a crap about what "Foreigners" think. They think we are better than everyone else.

[ladjf]

31. I Nation has disgraced itself in every way imaginable. I never

thought I'd see the day that I was ashamed of my government.

[FreedomAngel82]

38. And without health care

[Monkey see Monkey Do]

39. Not quite (Japan), but you do execute child offenders

& people who are demonstrably mentally ill (despite that being ruled unconstitutional) & that puts you in really esteemed company.

Eight countries since 1990 are known to have executed prisoners who were under 18 years old at the time of the crime ? China, Congo (Democratic Republic), Iran, Nigeria, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, USA and Yemen. China, Pakistan and Yemen have raised the minimum age to 18 in law, and Iran is reportedly in the process of doing so. The USA executed more child offenders than any other country (19 between 1990 and 2003).

http://web.amnesty.org/pages/deathpenalty-facts-eng

http://www.amnestyusa.org/abolish/mental_illness.html