Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Bush weak, fascist, treasonous re: intimigate

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 10:26 PM
Original message
Bush weak, fascist, treasonous re: intimigate
Three recent posts on the Plame issue, Bush, and his thugs. Make sure you go to Orincus' site, for the last post, and follow all the links within the entry. Also lots of other good stuff there.


http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/editorials/articles/2003/10/18/dont_ask_dont_know/

Don't ask, don't know
10/18/2003

AT A TIME when President Bush ought to be doing everything he can to show that he is an engaged commander in chief, he is acting as though there is nothing he can or should do to discover and punish the officials who leaked to columnist Robert Novak the identity of the CIA's Valerie Plame Wilson. Bush's passivity in response to a political dirty trick that harms US intelligence operations and demoralizes intelligence officers is an abdication of responsibility.

Bush has left the work of locating the leakers to the Justice Department and the FBI, while he plays the role of a detached observer. This stance makes him look like a weak leader presiding over a band of unruly subordinates who feud with each other, betraying patriotic Americans like Ms. Wilson, with no fear of being brought to hand by the president.

If he wished to do so, Bush could summon the likely suspects from the vice president's office, the Pentagon, and the National Security Council to the Oval Office and tell them that, as their president, he is ordering the officials who gave away Valerie Plame's cover to confess their role and resign.

What the leakers did was not a merely technical violation of the law. By revealing her identity, the dirty tricksters in the administration sacrificed all the informants and sources who had ever, wittingly or unwittingly, given Wilson intelligence information. Perhaps even more destructive was the leakers' apparent attempt to show the CIA there is a price to pay for refusing to tailor the agency's analyses to the wishes of policy makers.

http://www.popmatters.com/columns/sirota/031015.shtml

In the last two years, those who were honest about Iraq have been fired, disparaged and defamed by the Bush Administration's attack machine. While Bush's spokesman Scott McClellan claims in a 7 October Whitehouse press briefing, "It is absurd to suggest that this White House would seek to punish someone for speaking out with a different view", the facts show that truth-tellers face "slime and defend" treatment, as one Republican aide told the New York Times. When White House economist Lawrence Lindsey said the war would cost at least $100-200 billion (which has proven to be accurate), he was fired because the White House was trying to blur the cost estimates. When Mideast envoy Gen. Anthony Zinni said that the Administration had more important national security concerns than Iraq, he too was fired. When Gen. Eric Shinseki (accurately) refuted the Administration by admitting an Iraq occupation would require "several hundred thousand troops." Shinseki was publicly disparaged by the Pentagon. When US soldiers told ABC News they were misled about the length of their tours in Iraq, they were threatened with court martials, and the Administration told other reporters the ABC correspondent was a gay Canadian (as if that mattered).

While these purges/smears were going on, the White House was promoting the most dishonest in its ranks. Vice President Dick Cheney repeatedly ignored intelligence by telling the American people that Iraq had nuclear weapons. For his efforts, he was rewarded with huge influence over Iraq policymaking — so much so that US News and World Report now calls him the "the most powerful vice president in history" (13 October 2003). Similarly, National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice said the decision to go to war was based on "new evidence" of an Iraqi threat that came to light after 2001. She said this knowing that most pre-war intelligence came from before 1998 Washington Post 27 September 2003), knowing that Colin Powell admitted in 2001 that Saddam was not a threat and knowing that Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld acknowledged that the war decision was not made "because we had discovered dramatic new evidence." For her dishonesty, she was recently named head of a new panel that will oversee rebuilding in Iraq.

So now we have a government that places value on lies and treats honesty like a crime. It doesn't matter that outing a CIA agent endangers agents in the field and weakens American security. It doesn't matter that intelligence was distorted to mislead the American people into a war. What matters above everything is loyalty to the White House. Anything else — national security, integrity — is secondary.

There is a term for this kind of thing in the dictionary, and it is not "democracy". An administration that "forcibly suppresses opposition" and shows a "tendency toward strong autocratic control" like the one in power is called facism. And, as former White House counsel and Watergate figure John Dean notes, we are only glimpsing the abyss. "I thought I had seen political dirty tricks as foul as they could get, but I was wrong," he recently wrote. "Bush's people have out-Nixoned Nixon's people. And my former colleagues were not amateurs by any means." (Salon.com 3 October 2003). The only thing surprising about Dean's comments is that they were not made far earlier by more people when America had the chance to change course.


http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2003_10_12_dneiwert_archive.html#106650181266608156

The Plame affair matters.

The New York Times explained: Ms. Plame, a specialist in nonconventional weapons who worked overseas, had "nonofficial cover," and was what in C.I.A. parlance is called a Noc, the most difficult kind of false identity for the agency to create. While most undercover agency officers disguise their real profession by pretending to be American embassy diplomats or other United States government employees, Ms. Plame passed herself off as a private energy expert. Intelligence experts said that Nocs have especially dangerous jobs."Nocs are the holiest of holies," said Kenneth M. Pollack, a former agency officer who is now director of research at the Saban Center for Middle East Policy at the Brookings Institution.

It matters because the deliberate exposure of an undercover agent's identity in a way that grotesquely compromises national security and the potential deaths of agents abroad constitutes outright treason.
And no, we're not talking about Ann Coulter's nearly hallucinogenic version of treason, but the Aldrich Ames kind of treason. The real thing that earns people prison terms.

It matters because the culpability for the leak goes right to the heart of the Oval Office. The sources of the leak appear to be within the inner circle of the Bush White House, including chief of staff Karl Rove, who has been identified by Jospeh Wilson, Plame's husband, and reporters as one of the administration officials who contacted them after the Novak column's appearance and exacerbated the effects of Plame's original exposure by explicitly encouraging its further spread.

The fact that these matters reach the highest levels of government is underscored by the reports that the White House, according to the Boston Globe, is reserving the option of resorting to "executive privilege" claims to shield some of its documents from the Justice Department investigation:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. Can somebody please tell me
Can somebody please tell me what Bushco. made into law when he was first appointed about presidential papers? I remember thinking it had something to do with making it harder or taking longer to see classified documents from PAST presidents. I am just thinking if that is the case it might be years before we ever find out the truth of how utterly evil this misadministration is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ewagner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. By Executive Order
Sealed the papers of Presidents going back to his Dad's term. Can't be release for 50 years (?) You know, Natiional Security and all that (crap).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Thank you, I knew he did something that seemed odd and
protective of his dad. Those papers seem alot more interesting to me now with all of the people in the administration having once served for bush1. Hmmm...can that be changed by the next president I wonder?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
smagar Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 10:49 PM
Response to Original message
3. RainDog's Near Hysteria on the Plame Affair
RainDog, unfortunately, it appears the Bush administration official who leaked Ms. Plame's identity didn't break the law. The applicable law says that covert agents who'd been out from under their cover for five years aren't covered by the law. The news accounts I've read indicate Ms. Plame falls in this category. Also, she worked at the agency at the time her cover was "blown" to Bob Novak. How sensitive could her position have been. Any half-competent US-based agent from a foreign intelligence service could simply have waited outside her house, followed her down the GW Parkway, and confirmed his suspicions once she exited at CIA headquarters. Finally, if her cover was so sensitive, why is her husband writing editorials for the NY Times slamming the President? Covert agents, and their families, know not to draw attention to themselves, and especially not to anger the partisan dogs of war in the White House.

It's important to pick the hills you fight on. Seems to me this battle position is a weak one. Recommend moving to another, easier-to-defend topic--such as, why Rumsfeld peevishly smacks the Army around, or why the Defense Department prepared so shoddily for the postwar phase in Iraq.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
9215 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. The reason why Wilson is going to the Press
is because the treasonous bastards that outed his wife don't give a damn about him or his safety and the cat is already out of the bag. That the FBI is investigating this criminal act is enough said on the importance of Plame.

What branch of the intelligence community do you work for?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Buh-bye!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. "didn't break the law"
There may have been violation of several statutes and regulations with the force of law. And even if no bill is returned, the investigation itself could be quite revelatory and damning.

Not to mention the civil side.

IANAL, just what I hear.

:)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SilasSoule Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. New Accounts??
The news accounts I've read indicate Ms. Plame falls in this category.

Please provide links to these new accounts that you refer to.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 07:07 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Hi smagar!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Malva Zebrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #3
11. --you need to think a little deeper
than that-Even if it is not illegal, of which I am not sure and probably would have to be decided in a court-it puts everything this woman did during her entire career into jeopardy--even her life--no matter when she did it---her entire career has been ruined not to mention her life and the lives of her two very small toddlers. It puts everyone she ever had contact with in jeopardy--whether one day ago, or ten years ago. No CIA agent admits to being an agent--I understand that is the very strict unwritten rule. Please show me where Valerie Plame admits to being CIA NOC--and where for that matter does Wilson. That she "worked" for the agency falls into the catagory of doing work she was qualified for--I assume lots of people walk through the doors of the agency who work there who are not NOC or not operatives.

I am grateful that Wilson exposed the whole Bush White House as the buinch of petty little cowardly orchiectomized slimeballs
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #3
12. Funny. "my" near-hysteria" is a series of quotes
from newspapers and journalists who have followed this issue since July...which, if you read the quotes, were all there in the order that they were written by those journalists.

Weak, fascist, treasonous.

I suppose they're all less informed than you are.

But I like that you try to smear me with name-calling. That puts me in such honored company, such as Ambassador Wilson and Ms Plame, and Generals Shinseki and Zinni.

However, the Plame issue isn't necessary for me to know that Bush is a weak, fascist, treasonous bastard, because I have been paying attention to his actions since he took the office of the presidency.

He is, no doubt, the least qualified man to ever take the office, and that he is the talking head for a bunch of extremists puts this country in great danger. I know that many in positions of power know this as well. therefore my hope is that their love of country outweighs any fear of retribution from the Bush thugs.

That is the sign of a true patriot, not some entitled little awol prick running around in a flight suit.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
coda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
18. You obviously agree with Rove, that "she's fair game.".
Many former and current CIA, including those who voted for Bush, disagree.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cliss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-18-03 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
6. Hi, Smagar
Welcome to the DU :pals:

You mentioned that this story seems weak. I'm not sure I agree. Think of the story from Wilson's side. He did an assignment for Cheney, brought the results back, only to have them flushed and a blatant lie used in its place. He must have been fuming since then. Next, he appears on TV to tell his side of the story; that it was never an issue. Subsequently, his wife's identity gets revealed as retribution for what he did.

Wouldn't you be thirsting for revenge? I know I would. And I'd give it my absolutely best shot. If my intention was to blackball the Bushmeisters, I would be scrounging for any scrap of damning evidence.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
13. "as required by law"
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/05/national/nationalspecial3/05TENE.html?ex=1066708800&en=794ac09611af0690&ei=5070

As required by law, the agency notified the Justice Department in late July that there had been a release of classified information; it is a felony for any official with access to such information to disclose the identity of a covert American officer. It is unclear when Mr. Tenet became aware of the referral, but when he did, he supported it, the C.I.A. official said, even though it was clearly going to cause problems for the White House. "I don't think he lost any sleep over it," the official said.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 09:18 AM
Response to Original message
14. "leak may have damaged national security much greater than..
from Warren Strobel, Knight-Ridder news

http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/6984705.htm

It's just a 12-letter name - Valerie Plame - but the leak by Bush administration officials of that CIA officer's identity may have damaged U.S. national security to a much greater extent than generally realized, current and former agency officials say.


Plame, the wife of former ambassador and Bush critic Joseph Wilson, was a member of a small elite-within-an-elite, a CIA employee operating under "nonofficial cover," in her case as an energy analyst, with little or no protection from the U.S. government if she got caught.


Training agents such as Plame, 40, costs millions of dollars and requires the time-consuming establishment of elaborate fictions, called "legends," including in this case the creation of a CIA front company that helped lend plausibility to her trips overseas.


Compounding the damage, the front company, Brewster-Jennings & Associates, whose name has been reported previously, apparently also was used by other CIA officers whose work now could be at risk, according to Vince Cannistraro, formerly the agency's chief of counterterrorism operations and analysis.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. still waiting to see those links
backing up that "near hysteria" statement...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
9215 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Your talking to yourself dude.
Edited on Sun Oct-19-03 01:38 PM by 9215
:evilgrin:

The hysteria is taking over! :bounce:

I'd guess smagar is a one post member. :eyes:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. that's dudette
:)

funny thing was, the article from Knight-Ridder talked about the very same spin that person was trying, and how it was another example of republicans seeming to think the law applies to everyone but them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-19-03 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
17. Treason is Treason and bush should be impeached
:grr:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat May 04th 2024, 03:57 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC