Sound familiar? " . . . the education of Women 'has been too exclusively

[patrice]

directed to fit them for displaying to advantage the charms of youth and beauty.' The problem, she said, was that 'the taste (opinion and desires) of men, whatever it might happen to be, has been made into a standard for the formation of the female character.' Reason and religion teach us, she said, that 'we too are primary existences . . . not the satellites of men." Emma Willard's testimony to a legislature circa 1840 in H. Zinn's People's History of U.S.

Many generations of Women know that this is true. Though a lot of us still act exclusively as satellites of men.

[StellaBlue]

1. ...

You've inspired me to reread some Mary Wollstonecraft!

But why did you post this? Was taht first quote contemporary?

[patrice]

4. I should do that too.

Any recommendations?

[Toots]

2. I believe women are geared to think a certain way about appearance from

other women and not men. I think it is women that are driving women to starve themselves and wear clothing (shoes etc) so tight as to cut off circulation. Most men I know like women that are healthy and fun to be around not women who are vain and constantly worried about their looks. I believe the drive to be super thin is a woman"s idea of how they think men want them to appear and it is driving women crazy. Most men just like gals. All gals and appearance is not nearly as important to them as it is to other women. Just my $.02 worth

[patrice]

3. Yes.

I was also thinking about the more psychological, or personality, dimensions of what/who a woman is.

I am thinking about how abortion should be understood as a symptom of a more general, underlying, malady, Women's In-equality, not their being identical to men in any sense, but not discriminated against because they are different. Issues around abortion seem to impact woemn disproportionally to their role in any pregnancy-(ies).

[StellaBlue]

5. whom do you prefer?

OR

[Digit]

6. I would rather look like Marilyn Monroe n/t

[Toots]

7. I like them all but my point was who or what do other women prefer

Most men I know like all women. short, tall, fat, skinny, black, white, or whatever. It is women's perception of what they think men like is the problem. They place an unfair burdon upon women to try and look like one of those gals you showed instead of just being themselves. Most all the glamour magazines are run by women for women.

[StellaBlue]

8. yes

I meant that question to be addressed to anyone reading this thread, not just to men.

I prefer the second group by FAR. I, personally, would rather be up to 20 pounds overweight (I am only 5'!) than skinny with no ass like most of these 'beautiful' Hollywood types. ick.