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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:35 AM
Original message
"Espionage Act now front and center in Novak-Plame-gate"
Edited on Sun Oct-09-05 09:39 AM by G_j
http://bluemassgroup.typepad.com/blue_mass_group/2005/10/espionage_act_n.html

October 08, 2005

Espionage Act now front and center in Novak-Plame-gate

For the longest time, almost everyone, including people who know a whole lot about Novak-Plame-gate, were assuming that the only criminal statute that might have been violated by outing Valerie Plame as a CIA agent was the very-narrow-and-hard-to-prove Intelligence Identities Protection Act. The only people talking about the much broader Espionage Act in relation to Novak-Plame-gate were bloggers (most notably Mark Kleiman). Then, earlier this week, the Act snuck into the NY Times, though it was buried deep in an article focusing on other aspects of the case.

Today, though, the Espionage Act has made it to the headlines. "Prosecutor in Leak Case Is Exploring Range of Crimes," http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/08/politics/08leak.html?pagewanted=print the NY Times proclaims this morning (though not on the front page), and goes on to explain (1) that the Espionage Act is being explored by the special prosecutor and might well apply to this case, and (2) that the Act is alive and well, having been used recently to bring indictments in the AIPAC case among others, as we noted months ago.

Well, it's about time the media picked up on this. Karl Rove and the rest of his merry band are in real legal peril - as has been previously noted here and elsewhere, the Espionage Act applies with remarkable precision to what Rove is reliably reported to have done in this matter, and it appears that special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald is well aware of that fact. Fitzgerald is holding additional interviews with Rove, Judith Miller, and maybe others next week, after which he will have to move quickly to bring any indictments he's going to bring before his grand jury expires on October 28. All will be revealed soon.


++++++++++++++++++


previous post:

http://bluemassgroup.typepad.com/blue_mass_group/2005/10/the_espionage_a.html

October 06, 2005
The Espionage Act - at last!

This story in the NY Times is, for the most part, similar to a number of other reports indicating that Karl Rove has been summoned back to the Novak-Plame-gate grand jury, and that it's possible that Judith Miller, Scooter Libby, and heaven knows who else may also be making return trips. Speculation is running rampant that indictments are in the offing, though no one knows who or when.

But buried pretty far down in the story is this remarkable passage:

Recently lawyers said that they believed the prosecutor may be applying new legal theories to bring charges in the case. One new approach appears to involve the possible use of Chapter 37 of the federal espionage and censorship law, which makes it a crime for anyone who "willfully communicates, delivers, transfers or causes to be communicated" to someone "not entitled to receive it" classified information relating the national defense matters. Under this broad statute, a government official or a private citizen who passed classified information to anyone else in or outside the government could potentially be charged with a felony, if they transferred the information to someone without a security clearance to receive it.

AHA!! Finally, someone in the mainstream media has picked up on the possibility that the impossibly narrow Intelligence Identities Protection Act of 1982 might not be the only statute in play here. As has been widely noted, it's very difficult to convict anyone under the IIPA - so difficult, in fact, that it's only happened once. The Espionage Act, in contrast, is written in much broader language, and lacks the IIPA's very demanding requirements with respect to what the defendant had to know in order to be found guilty. As I and others have noted before, it seems pretty straightforward to conclude that Karl Rove's actions (as described by Time reporter Matt Cooper) fit comfortably within the Espionage Act.

<snip>
If the sources in the NYT report are right (there is, of course, no indication who these unnamed "lawyers" are or how close they are to the case), it's a huge development. It has long seemed unlikely that an IIPA indictment would be possible, so for a while it seemed that the best Fitzgerald could do would be an ancillary charge like perjury, or possibly conspiracy. But the Espionage Act is the real thing: it would mean charging Rove (or whoever) with the crime of illegally disclosing Valerie Plame's status as a covert CIA operative. Think about it: Karl Rove charged with espionage. Couldn't happen to a more deserving guy.



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bostonbabs Donating Member (465 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
1. thank you!!!!!!.....great post! n/t
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bmcatt Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:43 AM
Response to Original message
2. If the NYT is covering this...
I suspect it may be a good indication that the wheels are about to come off even more for the administration. As far as I can tell, even a confirmation that she was a CIA operative (with the implication that she was NOC) would have violated the confidentiality that was demanded by the classified nature of her work.

I think then the only thing to say then is, "I can neither confirm nor deny that Mrs. Wilson works for the government in any capacity."

I for one am *resoundingly* hopeful that Fitzgerald is going after everyone on violations of the Espionage Act. Especially since, if he is, we then also wind up with a discussion of whether or not this is a "time of war", at which point the treason (yes, let's call it what it is) is potentially punishable by death.
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CantGetFooledAgain Donating Member (635 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
3. This is some of the best news that I have heard
...in a long time. If Fitzgerald applies this law to even one person in the White House, it's game over. They will instantly be in the same elite club with people like Aldridge Ames. This will be completely unspinnable.

Go Fitz!
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
31. With Ya - Go Fitz & Grand Jury!
The suspense is driving me batty!

:popcorn:
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maine_raptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:58 AM
Response to Original message
4. You know, there seems to be something missing for all this.
How about any discussion of the possible human toll in this act (the outing itself)?

If, as we know, Plame was undercover and investigating WMD sales and development overseas, then she had contacts with foreign nationals and once the outing occurred, those folks were placed at some level of danger (I know, obvious, but it needs re-statement).

We know that the CIA, after a delay, asked the DOJ for investigation into the outing.

Could the CIA have used the delay between the outing and the request to conduct a damage assessment? Seems only natural and proper to do so. So here's the kicker:

Could the CIA, as of a result of it's "Damage Assessment", know that foreign nationals were killed as a result of the outing and thus their willingness to "buck" the Bush Administration by publicly asking for the start of what is now Plamegate?


Kinda makes you wonder just how "loved" our Dear Leader is over across the river!
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loudsue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. That's a good point...and whoever did this is complicit in MURDER
And there WAS, indeed, AT LEAST one person who lost their life due to this, as has been reported earlier (sorry, I don't have a CLUE where the link would be). Evidently, there was a "star" posted on the board at the CIA that indicated that a "person who couldn't be named" was killed after Plame's undercover organization's name had been disclosed.

The old, die-hard and patriotic CIA people, fired or marginalized by the bush cabal, need to make sure that the perp for this death does not go unpunished. They need to make the case without disclosing the victim's (or victims') name(s).

The crime that was committed by the bush cabal was most egregious and deadly....this wasn't just a school-yard bully scheme; this was our NATIONAL SECURITY, and people died for yet another administrative pay-back.

:kick::kick::kick:
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
23. IMO, there is a good chance that may be why Judy was jailed
Those redacted classified documents that the panel of judges based their decision to jail Judy had to contain some heavy info. It could very well be details of Brewster Jennings, the human cost, and the national security risk that the leak created.
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journalist3072 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
5. My prediction..
Rove and Libby out of office and in jail by Christmas; possibly impeachment proceedings against Bush & Cheney.

If Bush and Cheney are found at all to have participated in the outing, the Republican-controlled Congress will have no choice but to draft articles of impeachment and launch hearings.
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marylanddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Right on.

When their own political butts are on the line the Republicans will get behind impeachment.
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ginnyinWI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. I really hope you're right
As we have seen this week, the repubs in Congress have no shame. No shame at all. But for their own political futures--yeah, they'd move. Depends on how much the media can turn up the heat and get this news out to the average voter. One thing in our favor: not as many come out to vote for the mid-terms, meaning that only the more informed and motivated will.
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Pacifist Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #18
37. Sadly I agree. No shame.
Friday's vote is adequate proof of that.
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #5
16. Oh, Please God.... nt
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
30. Good Prediction!
Been sitting on the middle-of-the-roof on this, holding breath impatiently for the GJ decisions to come to light.

Well, the more I read in recent days, I too now believe we're going to see this all come to a head by, if not before Christmas.

Here's hoping for a wonderful Thanksgiving & Christmas. I'll be out on the porch banging my pots and pans if democracy and justice prevail!
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
7. I so hope this is true.......n/t
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
8. It is about PNAC and AIPAC, too --
It's not about Karl or Plame Outing: It is about WMDs, PNAC, AIPAC
<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2145445>
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Holy crap!
I completely missed that thread. Thank you for for putting that link up! I would have missed it otherwise.
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. You are welcome. I am still dizzy from reading it. (nt)
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. Here's another



August 8, 04
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converted_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. Thank you. I'm reading it now. n/t
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #8
25. yep
dots easily connected, but the media refuses.
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democrank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
11. Very informative. Thanks.
Media cheerleaders have been so busy chatting about Rove`s "genius" that they ignored what a crooked SOB he is.
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rateyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
12. What's so very good about this is the fact that...
regardless of whether or not you had the classified information leaked to you...if you share it with someone not authorized to have it...you are guilty under the statute as well.

This means that Miller, Novak, Cooper, Rove, Libby, Powell, Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld, Rice, Matalin, Bolton, Fleischer...anyone who saw the classified info and passed it on to an unauthorized person...Guilty.

Normally, the punishment for such crime is 10yrs. plus a fine. BUT, IF THE CLASSIFIED INFO CONCERNS WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, as it does here, the DEATH PENALTY can be given upon conviction.

If the GJ indicts all that are guilty here (remember the document shared on AF1 shut down a whole CIA operation, putting more than Plame in danger, and seriously hampering our intelligence capability) then we could be looking at a total change of administration.

IF THIS IS THE CRIME THAT IS ALLEGED--ESPIONAGE ACT--IT IS A BIGGER DEAL THAN MOST REALIZE.
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
14. Kick!
:kick:
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
15. Oh Goody! The Espionage Act sounds like a slam dunk nt
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
19. Great post!!!
Well done. And nominated, of course!

It is important that people read and understand important and accurate posts like this. It stands in sharp contrast to those artiles that express fantasies about charges of treason, or silly theories about Gannon.

More, it addresses the issues of espionage. There will be some who point out that the Plame scandal doesn't meet the standards of the "old" or the "new" Espionage Act, because it doesn't involve passing state secrets to foreign agents. It is, however, in every sense a counterintelligence case that involved leaking top secret information to those who had no business knowing it.

This post is by definition an example of the best one finds on DU!
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
20. Ben Franklin said, "Whatever is begun in anger, ends in shame."
Rove was very angry with Wilson, that he would dare to defy Little Boots. So angry that he stepped forward with all the arrogance he could muster and devised a scheme to play "gotcha" with Joe Wilson.

I hope Ben Franklin's words are still true today. There is no punishment severe enough for a traitor to our national security.
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TheCentepedeShoes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #20
41. Very Wise Words
Thank you for posting.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
21. EXCELLENT!
Thank you for finding and posting this G j!

:popcorn:
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texpatriot2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
24. Yes, Espionage...treason. nm
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
26. Yes! It's not IIPA, it is a clear case of ESPIONAGE!
Thank you for the links and for clarifying this for all DUers to see and hopefully understand. The corporate RW media loves harping on IIPA and how difficult it is to convict, but that's just a smokescreen for the real crimes.

Thanks G_j! Recommended and bookmarked!
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cassiepriam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
27. Oh Bush and pals will just change the law asap.
They will find a way. I have total confidence in the socipaths.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
28. kick
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
29. ~~
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Samantha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-09-05 09:57 PM
Response to Original message
32. The NYT should read DU more often
Edited on Sun Oct-09-05 10:00 PM by Samantha
We discussed that very act here on DU shortly after the case became high profile. I asked here in DC someone who is familiar with the prosecution of violations of intelligence laws about the probability of the participants to this crime being prosecuted for treason. The expert answer I received was that treason is very difficult to prove. The government usually opts to pursue prosecution under the terms of the passing of classified information restrictions inasmuch as the bar for proving guilt is much lower. Robert Hansen, for instance, was prosecuted for this crime. If you do a google search on simply this term, you will see others who apparently did commit treason but were prosecuted for the lesser crime for the advantage for raising the odds for getting a conviction.

In that vein, here's my prediction: all of the participants are in very, very deep trouble. I believe this is why Matlin left the White House. I believe this is why Karen Hughes left. I believe Judith Miller is not the only one negotiating a deal for herself. I believe there's been hot and heavy negotiating all the way around among a number of parties, but the tip of the iceberg will face the music. Additionally, I am in the camp that feels the possibility is strong that Cheney and Bush* might be named as unindicted co-conspirators.

It's going to be extremely interesting, but I am not at all sure the general public will ever know ALL of the details.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 04:21 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. I would

also, my guess is that none of us will ever know all of the details, but we will know a whole lot more.
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Cassius23 Donating Member (186 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 04:42 AM
Response to Original message
34. I said it several months ago and I'll say it yet again...
You just don't mess with the CIA. They're patient, mean, and have the morals of a pissed off cougar. They WILL get you in the end. Not may, or could, or might, they WILL. And I'd think they want Bush for a LONG TIME.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
35. kick
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
36. The Espionage Act has pucker power
The Intelligence Identities Protection Act is for wimps. A fine and a little time in a federal prison, during which everything can be made good with a pardon.

That Espionage Act though, whoa, that one can get ya hung. Ask Rosenberg if you doubt it.

Cheney and Bu$h and all those administration neocon, I bet if they get busted on the Espionage Act, their butts will pucker.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 01:41 PM
Response to Original message
38. ~~
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dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
39. is this relevant??
from some fed attorney named Citizren Spook

http://citizenspook.blogspot.com/2005/08/treasongate-total-media-black-out-of.html
"TREASONGATE: Total Media BLACK OUT of 18 USC 794, Federal Espionage Statute
In my two part series, TREASONGATE: The Controlling Law,
Part 1 Part 2 I discussed the fact that the Intelligence Identities Protection Act is virtually irrelevant as to the Valerie Plame CIA leak investigation. I focussed on the applicability to this fact pattern of 18 USC 793 and 794, the espionage statutes of the United States Code.

Let's go back now, back to the beginning of this affair. Ever since this thing hit the news with gusto only equalled by Monica's dress, we have seen, heard and been witness to a main stream media and main stream blogosphere feeding frenzy of pundits politically analyzing the irrelevant IIPA. What a time they were having until Citizen Spook came along and outed their ruse.

And what timing that the AIPAC indictments should come out a few days after Citizen Spook published this anaylsis, (see TREASONGATE: The Controlling Law, Part 2: THE DEATH PENALTY, 18 USC 794 and the shift from GWOT to GSAVE ). Those indictments were based on 18 USC 793.

But more interesting and more juicy for the media is the simple application of 18 USC 794(b) which provided for the death penalty or life in prison for perpetraitors of espionage "in time of war"."

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Holly_Hobby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-10-05 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. Yeah, somebody posted CS's article and it got locked
The mods asked for a reliable source. His source was the LAW. :eyes:

Here's Citizenspook's challenge to DU:

CHALLENGE TO DEMOCRATICUNDERGROUND.COM:

A thread at Democraticundergound.com was locked yesterday when the moderators challenged Citizen Spook to provide a "reliable source" for my reporting.

DU, I have given two reliable sources:

Source #1: Title 18 of our United States Code, 18 USC 794. See my analysis of it here

It's an impeccable source, but for some reason your site does not have any discussion or analysis on it. Why not?

Source #2: The District Court's decision in United States v. Morison (upheld by the US Supreme Court) http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=486&invol=1306

I suggest you read my sources carefully and then report back to your readership with your own analysis.

http://citizenspook.blogspot.com/2005/08/treasongate-challenge-of-18-usc-794.html

Citizenspook nailed it.
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