Are people like Howard Stern Liberals? Or parasites of the liberal party?

[The Backlash Cometh]

The Righties are beginning to see the light, only they're not yet ready to admit that the Liberal party is the answer. In quick discussions, they bring up Howard Stern as an example of why Liberals make lousy role models for the kind of family values that they want to live their lives by.

I have to agree that Howard Stern is no role model for family values. Frankly, I tuned him out a long time ago. But, then I wonder what constitutes a Liberal? And is there an image of Liberalism which will be allowed to lead again in this country?

What I like the most about Liberalism is its level of tolerance. Perhaps that was also its downfall. Liberalism tolerated a free style of living which society could not maintain without tragic consequences. On the other hand, because of their tolerance, Liberals were slow to recognize that they were being marginalized by the Right.

I'd like to see Liberalism once again come to the forefront and lead, but I don't know how it's going to do it without some kind of reform. People like Howard Stern should be allowed to continue to do what they do, because that's part of our American freedoms, but at what point do you recognize that people like Howard exist because of Liberal support, but do not really advance its objectives?

I don't have the answer, but I do wonder how many people are thinking along the same lines and hope to test the waters with this poll.

[OrlandoGator]

1. Sadly, Stern is the only one who stands up to BushCo on a regular basis.

Love him or hate him, he is firmly planted on our side when it comes to the Evil Empire.

[soothsayer]

2. Stern rocks!

[LynneSin]

6. and then he sucks up to Pataki, Guiliani and Arh-nuld the next moment

he's not that big of an ally for us.

[BlueCaliDem]

15. So Does Bill Maher--Except for that "Rooting for Success in Iraq" bit...

...which I can understand, although disagree with.

Bill Maher's position is trying to make lemonade out of Iraqi lemons in this illegal war, which is a wrong position to take.

Now that the entire world knows that * got the United States into war using lies, it's time we get out quick.

Like Al Sharpton once famously said {paraphrasing}: "If the war in Iraq is wrong, staying the course don't make it right."

Howard Stern just loves controversy, and gets handsomely paid for doing what he loves best, although anyone getting the spotlight who's against * and on our side is deeply welcome since we're outnumbered in broadcast, radio and print media these days!

[Bushknew]

3. Howard is a careerist not a liberal.

It's all about him.

[blm]

4. Howard Stern is NOT a liberal - he was a Libertarian who leaned Republican

for years. He even supported Pataki for some time and was probably responsible for Pataki winning in the first place.

It wasn't until Bush2 that he turned against the GOP. He got sick of the religious right, did some research on Bush and now knows what a fraud Bush has been perpetrating on the country.

[LynneSin]

5. Last I checked Stern was Libertarian who tends to vote democrat

and mind you he's a big fan of Pataki, Guiliani and Ahr-nuld, who are still regular guests on his show.

If Stern is some sort of liberal then I guess I'll be the Penthouse Pet for October!

[The Backlash Cometh]

8. Then maybe it's time we start dispelling the myth, because your

average, ordinary run-of-the-mill church lady thinks that Howard Stern embodies the image of a Liberal.

Maybe we should start doing something about portraying people like Jon Stewart as a good example of a Liberal, and do something about showing that Stern is all about the money.

[meegbear]

7. I do believe he is not concerned with being a role-model ...

But I don't think "He's in it for the money". He doesn't like bush QED and he says so on his show QED.

[DS1]

9. Simple. Use the right-wing/Oreilly defense

IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, CHANGE THE CHANNEL!

:-)

[The Backlash Cometh]

10. I tuned him out years ago.

I just want to get some ideas on how to explain him to the church ladies.

[NoodleBoy]

13. just say he's an anarcho-libertarian, or whatever the no-rules group call

themselves these days.

[DS1]

14. It's his right to say things like that

counter with some especially dumb Rushbo things - or tell them that the entire point of free speech and liberalism is about keeping your nose out of other people's business.

edit: Unless your name is Tipper Gore :eyes:

[Marnieworld]

28. You can tell them that...

He was married to one woman for over 20 years with 3 daughters. He is actively involved with all of his daughters lives. He after only being single for 6 months is in another committed relationship for 5 years. He has never been arrested. Has never been sighted for an unprofessional behavior. He has an extremely strong work ethic for almost 30 years.

His job has been to provide laughter to people as they are trapped in their cars going to work in the rat race. He does this job well and should be rewarded for it.

He appreciates female anatomy and this appreciation is also a big part of his show but you can also point out his obvious comfort with women as business colaborators and partners.

Most importantly he has fought censorship and the federal government for 20 years and that is a fight that we all benefit from. He has spken truth to power and actually educated a lot of people about politics during the last election.

I really think though you shouldn't take the time to explain him to anyone because you obviously do not really know him so how could you possibly explain him?

[mongo]

32. Wow....

Nicely said.

[Marnieworld]

35. Thanks

Proud defender of fart jokes for 20 years. ;-)

[The Backlash Cometh]

36. I'm sorry. I don't think they'll buy it.

We're known as the Osbourne Family to some of these people because I might occasionally use the word "ass," as in get your "ass" over here. There is just no way that Stern is going to pass the stink test around here.

But, good try.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

66. you really spend time trying to change the minds of old ladies?

wow. that's really depressing. trying to justify Howard Stern to old woman is perhaps the singlemost fruitless endeavour I think I've ever heard anybody embark upon. Good luck!

[Carni]

41. I agree with you it's all about entertaining a trapped motorist

OK, granted there are times when yes, as a woman I roll my eyes and change the channel regarding some of the over the top stuff they do in the studio...

But if it's him ranting about issues I am always highly entertained and I typically agree with him.

I think Robyn does a better job with the news than the news does btw

Last year I spent an hour trapped in my car every morning and The Stern show was a welcome diversion from hearing the same clear channel *hit* played on every station every five minutes!

[Carni]

40. Howard Stern I think DOES embody some liberal principles

Free speech being the first and foremost but I would definitely classify him as a Liberatarian.

In fact I think he says he's one?

I would just tell the old church ladies to change the channel they don't need to be listening to Howard Stern.

[The Backlash Cometh]

42. The point is, that these church ladies are about to lose faith in their

man Bush. How do we fill the void? You can turn your back on them if you like, but would it be fair to liberalism?

[Carni]

65. I guess I would resort to saying Liberals like to follow the bible

And not judge their neighbor...OK so it's lame but I am not a Christian (per say)

I guess I would tell them that if they as good church going women condone censorship and welcome the bush reich into their church that the bush reich will also want to tell THEM what they can and can't say.

I am tired and am not articulating this very well but basically in a nut shell if you accept and adopt government censorship--it's a double edged sword because the government can interject themselves into your houses of worship (their brand of religion only etc)

On Edit: Meant to add -- do they really want the federal government vetting every event they have and imputting what can and cannot be said from their pulpit? There is no way to define what is approved and what isn't by the feds, *God* isn't available so they would be at the mercy of some human with a political bent dictating what is or isn't approved.

[LoZoccolo]

11. I think it would be a mistake to think in the following ways...

- Thinking that people embrace liberalism or they don't. Howard Stern, if I recall correctly, ran for some political office as a libertarian, which as far as I know is usually socially liberal and fiscally conservative. But even that would probably not fit him.
- Thinking that it matters whether or not people embrace liberalism fully as you see it when they are doing well in advancing even just one of the things you support. So what if he doesn't? What would we do about that? And would it get us what we want?

[Beetwasher]

12. Howard Is Howard

What else needs to be said? :shrug:

[blm]

16. Howard Stern is NOT a liberal - he was a Libertarian who leaned Republican

for years. He even supported Pataki for some time and was probably responsible for Pataki winning in the first place.

It wasn't until Bush2 that he turned against the GOP. He got sick of the religious right, did some research on Bush and now knows what a fraud Bush has been perpetrating on the country.

[Cats Against Frist]

17. I think Stern is what one might call a "libertine,"

which arouses the ire of the conservatives, for sure. One half of me hates Stern, and thinks that he's set the womens' movement back about a million years, and the other half of me just, simply, thinks it's my job to ignore him, and defend his right to be gross.

I don't care what the right-wing things, because this is a free country -- and if you're going to pick on Howard Stern, you should also pick on Shania Twain, that ho-bag Gretchen Wilson, corporations, and any number of "heartland" favorites that use sex to sell their shoddy wares. Howard just doesn't have a pretense about it.

[soothsayer]

18. I don't see him doing anything that hurts the women's

movement. What do you think he does that's hurtful?

[noahmijo]

21. exactly those floozies he gets on his show aren't exactly held at gunpoint

I prefer his radio show far far over his tv show, and I admittably miss the 80's when he would have guests like Kinison and Dice as regulars, but nonetheless Stern still rocks in my book.

[Cats Against Frist]

31. Pardon me, but you're going to have to give me a "fucking break"

I'm not, nor especially fond of the third-wavers, who claim that human objectivism and the beauty myth are "just fine," so long as no one rapes you.

I used to listen to Stern, when I was jogging everyday, and, I enjoy him from time to time -- but the OBVIOUS chauvanism, objectification and parade of titillation turns me off. I'm not a prude, either -- I love Frank Zappa, and it took me a while to understand the artistic merit (irony, absurdity, etc.) in say, "I was wheelin' and dealin'," and overcome what only appears, on the surface, to be brutal sexism -- but, I finally did. Yet, try as I may, I cannot extrapolate that same artistic standard to Stern. If someone wants to make an argument, I'll listen, but I just can't do it.

[Carni]

43. That's funny because I always see that stripper stuff as sort of ironic

Five years ago I would have been aghast and would have also thought he was the biggest chauvanist on the planet...maybe it's alzheimers setting in, but I actually get the vibe that he thinks they are dumb to market themselves the way they do and I often actually think that in reality he wishes they would get a clue and do something more useful with their time.

I don't know the show has kind of a Springer vibe to it - it is what it is, maybe my own thoughts are that they should find something more useful to do with their time.

[JohnnyBoots]

19. Howard is similar to many average Americans in their political

leanings. Somewhat informed on issues and candidates, but still tend to vote a la carte if at all. He is not a political animal by any means, he simply reacts to situations that effect him. Like many Americans he finally woke up to W and his cronies and is pissed about it. While not politically correct by any means, at the core I believe he is Liberal in his values, though they may not be party specific. Since when has Liberalism become an exclusive country club trying to bar people from membership, wtf is up with that? Can't wait till he gets to eh-eh-eh.

[LuCifer]

20. The REAL reason for all this CENSORSHIP is...

...due to Stern coming out AGAINST BUSHitler in early 2004, after he read Al Franken's book. The scumbags at the FCC used Tit-gate as the EXUCSE to take up that ASSHOLE NO LIFE DORK Jack Thompson of Coral Gables and his dusty old complaints. Now you can't say BUTT on the air without risking a half a million dollar fine. How American!

Lu Cifer, see ya on Douche 101 on Sirius baby! FUKU FCC! Nazi piece of crap.

[Go Eagles]

22. He is

a libertarian with Republican leanings and has supported Pataki, Giuliani, Whitman, and D’Amato in the past. He also despises the religious right and has been opposed to Republican candidates in presidential elections (Bush I and II and Dole). He actually supported GWB after the 9/11 and was a strong supporter of the Iraq war in 2003. Not until the fallout from the Janet Jackson incident affected him did he turn on GWB.

[Bridget Burke]

23. A Liberal Party? Why didn't I get an invite?

Howard Stern does what he does & is what he is. He's not my cup of tea, but he's been on the case of various Right Wing Idiots.

Grownups don't need "role models."

[mongo]

24. What waters are you testing?

You say this -
People like Howard Stern should be allowed to continue to do what they do, because that's part of our American freedoms,

But in between the lines, is the message more like this?

Howard Stern as an example of why Liberals make lousy role models for the kind of family values that they want to live their lives by...

What I like the most about Liberalism is its level of tolerance. Perhaps that was also its downfall...

at what point do you recognize that people like Howard exist because of Liberal support...

Hmmmm. So what is the point, exactly? That it would be good if we "let" the right censor him? That we should just back off of free speech and freedom of expression and let the right impose their "family values" on all of us?

Sorry, but your post sounds like a veiled call for censorship.

Personally, I think Howard Stern is an ass. But I will defend his right to say whatever idiotic, mysoginist, juvenile thing he wants to on the radio, or TV.

Try not to forget that the first law against "obscenity" (The Comstock law) was used against Margarete Sanger and her pamphlet on Birth Control.

[MsUnderstood]

25. Howard stern is strange

He is an entertainer, first and foremost so it isn't the money he is looking for it is the attention (He is after all the original shock jock).

Make him mad, as Bush as done, and feel his wrath over the airwaves so liberals should be happy with him. . .

But listen to the crap he spews about gays, women, disabled other minorities and you can see he doesnt have the moral compass of a liberal. And by moral compass I mean that he doesn't see minorities as groups who don't need shock talk they need to be treated respectfully, with dignity and with equal rights ((I don't care what you say, he is mocking these groups with his actions not treating them with respect or with equal rights by giving them airtime).

So my opinion is that Howard Stern is a self serving xenophobe who happens to agree on some issues with me--but I tolerate him because I believe in freedom of speech and the power of the OFF button.

[The Backlash Cometh]

37. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

If I were giving a prize, you'd get it.

[Marnieworld]

26. Howard is an entertainer not a politician

He works to create entertaining content and be paid for it. That's it. Occassionally he speaks truth to power and responds to the world around him like anyone else. He was great during the campaign of 2004. He criticizes Bush as an American but not as an activist.

Howard is very smart and perceptive and is really in tune with all of the bullshit propaganda out there. Mainly though his work is talking about boobies and fart jokes and for that we should all fight for his constitutional rights to do so.

[Ron Green]

27. Amoral. Totally market-driven.

He knows that titties are what young men (and older men, and lately, even women) want to see and talk about. Free speech suits him because it pays, and plays to the lower Chakras.

[Marnieworld]

29. How is that amoral?

Breasts are immoral? Please!

[Ron Green]

39. "Amoral" is different from "immoral."

"Immoral" means "against some kind of moral standard," while "amoral" simply means "not making a moral statement." I personally like titties very much, and don't consider them immoral. Howard Stern seems to feel the same way, but he uses keen interest in tits to make lots of money. I'm not sure about the morality of that; what do you think?

[alcibiades_mystery]

45. He makes a lot of money while entertaining and bringing laughter

into people's lives. It's not a mistake that the man got rich pushing a very entertaining brand of comedy to people on their way to the drudgery of another day's work. Yes, he makes money. But dammit, he also makes people's days a bit more tolerable.

[Ron Green]

51. There's nothing wrong with feeding a need in a free market.

It's up to the drudges to decide whether to respond to Howard and his headlight show or to seek something beyond simple distraction. I find myself looking at the titties from time to time, so I'm in no position to preach. (sigh)... it just seems like such a waste.

(yeah, and not bad hips, too!)

:smoke:

[alcibiades_mystery]

54. It's not all tits, though

That's mainly the TV show. The radio show is different.

[Marnieworld]

74. I am perfectly ok with the morality of that

I truly am.

[Mutley]

30. I don't think Stern is concerned with politics at all.

He does not like Bush; he's made that clear on his show, and he's also against the war, AND, though I can't recall a specific instance of when he said it, I believe he votes democratic. He'll talk about politics on his show, but for the most part he stays away from it. I think beyond free speech issues and FCC type stuff Stern is not really involved publicly. Now for all I know in his personal life he's as obsessed with politics as I am.

I don't think it is his goal to advance liberal beliefs, beyond, of course, free speech issues as they pertain to him. If that were his goal his show would be much more politically oriented.

For the record, I love Stern, I listen almost every morning, and I plan to get Sirius to continue listening to him next year.

[Freddie Stubbs]

33. He eactually ran for Governor of NY briefly in 1994 as a Libertarian

He eventually supported George Pataki over Mario Cuomo.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

34. Who gives a fuck. So now liberal voters have to be pure of heart?

Fuck that noise.

[The Backlash Cometh]

38. Well, it's only important if you want to take back the middle without

compromising with the DLC.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

67. old women aren't the "middle".

I don't think that Howard Stern is unappealing to the middle.

[alcibiades_mystery]

44. Howard Stern strikes me as a libertarian

People who dislike Howard Stern, on the other hand, strike me as prudish losers with sticks up their asses.

[The Backlash Cometh]

57. Prudish, maybe, but not losers. Now, now. That's sour grapes on your part

Show some class.

[sendero]

46. This poll is silly..

... Stern is practically apolitical. He is pissed at the fundies their government minions because they attack free speech.

I've listened to Stern for years. He's never claimed to be liberal, in fact he's said the opposite many times. I really don't know why anyone would think he's a "liberal".

That said, he's spoken out against the idiocy of this administration more than 99% of radio folks, so he deserves some credit regardless of his motivation.

[The Backlash Cometh]

58. I don't have a problem with this.

Nothing would make me happier if Stern could put up a poster that says, "I am not a Liberal."

[sendero]

61. He has said ..

... exactly that, more than once.

Oh and BTW, he doesn't do/allow posters, t-shirts, coffee mugs, etc - he has always said it's just ripping off the fans and he won't do it.

[The Backlash Cometh]

64. There are some 300,000,000 Americans in this country.

Maybe he'll have to say it more than once before it gets through?

[sendero]

68. Dude..

... for the life of me I fucking do not understand just where you got the idea that Howard Stern is a "liberal".

You made it up and now you are annoyed that you've been called on it.

I've been listening to Stern off and on for a long time. Yes, his show is stupid some times. Yes, he was initially very much for the Iraq war, and basically when he starting yapping about it, I turned off the radio.

But during the lead-up to the 2004 election he was adamant in his support for Kerry and how much he despised the Bush administration. Yes, he had his own ax to grind, although as he CORRECTLY said many times, the Democrats are no better on free-speech/indecency regulations than the Republicans. It just so happened that he recognized that the fucking twit running the FCC (Powell, who he chided mercilessly) was the main source of his problems.

I could give two shits if you like Stern or not, but please don't go around acting like he's a self-proclaimed "liberal", because it just isn't so.

[The Backlash Cometh]

69. I'm a dudette, not a dude.

The entire reason for this thread came about because I had a conversation with a Tennessee resident and when I told her that Rush Limbaugh is a loon, I got trumped when she said that Howard Stern was his left-wing liberal counter-part.

I know now that Howard Stern is not a liberal and will use that in future conversations, but it would be better if he could make that clear to his audience so that Liberals, who I hope now have an opening to make a comeback, don't have to carry the extra baggage.

[sendero]

71. Dudette :)

... sorry for the assumption of gender.

Ok, I don't mean to be strident or harsh, but your friend is a moron.

Stern was an avid supporter of Guiliani and of Pataki. Some liberal :)

[BlueStateGirl]

47. Stern''s not a Liberal or a Conservative. He is just anti-Bush.

H

[jim3775]

48. Howard Stern wholeheartedly supported Jane Fonda and Cindy Sheehan

About Fonda; he said that the Viet Nam war was such a terrible thing for the country that Jane Fonda had the right idea by shocking people into listening to her, he fully supported her. He has also supported Cindy Sheehan and mentioned her several times.

He has attacked Rush Limbaugh, Bill Bennett and other conservative talkshow hosts.

He is pro-libertarian, anti-taxes and a big Guliani supporter, i know, not the sharpest knife in the drawer but he is constantly liberal, he campaigned for Kerry daily on his show, he constantly rails against this administration and said on friday he was a "Spitzer guy".

Yes I'm a big fan of the show.

[bloom]

49. Does he call himself a liberal?

Not that that necessarily matters.

Like O'Reilly saying he's not a Republican - he just shills for them.

[peacebaby3]

50. I can't stand Howard Stern and he's not even remotely funny.

I find much of the trash on his show completely boring. I certainly don't consider him a Liberal.

I don't know any Liberal who would have said after the Columbine school shooting that the trenchcoat mafia guys should have had sex with the girls in the school while they had the chance.

To quote him:
“There were some really good-looking girls running out with their hands over their heads. Did those kids try to have sex with any of the good-looking girls? They didn’t even do that? At least if you’re going kill yourself and kill all the kids, why wouldn’t you have some sex?”

Sorry, I don't find that funny at all. I find it disgusting.

I support free speech so even scum like Stern can be on the air. I just hope one day the American people quit listening to his crap so he has to go off the air from poor ratings.

If he is considered Liberal by mainstream America,then yes, he is definitely a problem for real Liberals.

[The Backlash Cometh]

59. Your last sentence echos my concerns.

[notadmblnd]

52. if I remember correctly, Howard was a bush supporter

Howard only turned against the admin when Colon Powels son Mikey of FCC fame started going after him. If someone knows different, please correct me.

[faithfulcitizen]

53. I call him disgusting, whatever the hell he calls himself.

Since when does liberalism have to equal raunchy, vile behavior? And who says we should tolerate it?

[LSK]

55. dont play the black and white game

Just because Howard hates Bush does not mean he is a liberal. Dont play the right's simplistic game of you are either a conservative or a liberal. He is neither. He just doesnt like Bush and the fascism that he brings.

[natrat]

56. i like big wet juicy FARTS

[yankeedem]

60. Howard Stern is no liberal

Which makes him even more valuable- he has credibility with his audience because he's not exclusively associated with one ideology.

He supported Bush in the past, up until 2002 at least.

He also supported Christie Whitman, George Pataki, Al D'Amato (puke), and Rick Lazio.

As far as family values, he has 3 relatively normal kids, and is 2 divorces short of Rush's record.

[Greyhound]

62. Howard is just, like this guy, ya know? n/t

[Greyhound]

63. Bur seriously, he is a media whore just like everybody in the media. n/t

[BuyingThyme]

70. Liberal by heart, conservative by hate.

[fujiyama]

72. He's just an entertariner

There's nothing more to this. Atleast he has the sense to oppose the religious right and those that seek to promote censorship, which is a far greater threat than any silly fart jokes or interviews with strippers or playboy models.

Also who ever said that free speech must further our objectives? The ACLU recognizes that even though KKK/neo Nazi marches don't further goals of social equality in any way (and the ACLU has fought for affirmative action and proper school funding so it's not about just free speech in the traditional sense), but they defend their right to do so on principle.

Now I'm not comparing Stern with neo Nazis, but offensive speech is protected. Also I don't think Stern has ever considered himself a liberal. He was a libertarian but realizes that Bush was a disaster and needed to go. Bill Maher also says things some may consider offensive and sexist. So, obviously these are not the spokespeople you use when you talk to prudish church ladies. And they never tried to be either.

After all, some claim Michael Moore hurts liberal causes. Perhaps, but he also plays an important role in speaking the truth about the administration and the right in general. He too is an entertainer, though he tries to get people to think in the process (though it's hard to consider F 9/11 'entertaining').

You take the good with the bad. No one person is perfect. Sometimes they say things you agree with. Other times you won't. Gotta live with that.

[readmoreoften]

73. He's not in it for the money on this one.

He is actually being financially brutalized by the FCC for speaking out against *. His fines have gone through the roof, but still he speaks out against *. For awhile, his show became a bush-bash festival in the 'joe-six-pack' market that everyone is so desperate to court. He's not a liberal, but he is concerned primarily about issues of social liberty.