60 deaths and Bush wants right to use military if bird flu hits. Feck him!

[NNN0LHI]

http://www.swissinfo.org/sen/swissinfo.html?siteSect=143&sid=6138186&cKey=1128452724000&ticker=true

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush asked Congress on Tuesday to consider giving him powers to use the military to enforce quarantines in case of an avian influenza epidemic.

He said the military, and perhaps the National Guard, might be needed to take such a role if the feared H5N1 bird flu virus changes enough to cause widespread human infection.

"If we had an outbreak somewhere in the United States, do we not then quarantine that part of the country? And how do you, then, enforce a quarantine?" Bush asked at a news conference.

"It's one thing to shut down airplanes. It's another thing to prevent people from coming in to get exposed to the avian flu. And who best to be able to effect a quarantine?" Bush added.

"One option is the use of a military that's able to plan and move. So that's why I put it on the table. I think it's an important debate for Congress to have."

Bird flu has killed more than 60 people in four Asian nations since late 2003 and has been found in birds in Russia and Europe.

[DoYouEverWonder]

1. He is desperate for any excuse

to get us under military control.

[LuckyTheDog]

15. Fear and paranoia

Fear and paranoia are the hallmarks of the right wing. Without them, they have no support.

[dusty64]

30. Thats it in

a nutshell. The "opposition" better be ALL over this one or thats it, game over.

[Walt Starr]

2. And Freepers claimed Clinton would eliminate Posse Comatatus

and here we have their boy completely ignoring it.

[Agnomen]

3. I have a sickening premonition

that the avian flu outbreak will occur in blue states necessitating military-enforced "quarantine"

[malmapus]

4. lol we have a military left at home to do this anyway???

When the flu hits they'll all be on rotation in Mess'o'potamia for some other big step in the process of bringing democracy to Iraq

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[shadowknows69]

9. Under the blanket of National Security

Legal is just a five letter word meaning: if the Constitution existed

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. they did in 1918

and the number of troops used was very limited by the way, they were unaarmed and helped NHS workers, who were under the control of local heatlh officers

[opihimoimoi]

6. The would be Emperor is drooling at the thought of SUSTAINED POWER BEYOND

his Term....

We would end up with a Stalin, a Hitler, Idi Amin, Castro...once in, very diff to get rid of....

prolly would MIHOP

[Angry Girl]

7. How convenient. Does this guy want to BE Hitler or what?

14 Characteristics of Fascism
http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=britt_23_2

[HeeBGBz]

8. So are they going to unleash this upon us anytime soon?

There's quite a few people sick at work right now. It's gonna be a rough winter.

[rocktivity]

10. And why are vaccines, if not antidotes, not an option?

The military can't stop a virus the way you can stop a looter or curfew breaker.

:shrug:
rocknation

[Cha]

What all murder and pestilence

has happened since bush stole office? Now a fucking epidemic?

[tanyev]

11. Time to re-read The Handmaid's Tale.

[jody]

12. * claimed tax-cuts would cure constipation and diarrhea and now

he claims martial law is the cure-all.

* is the biggest threat to democracy we've ever had in the Oval Orifice.

He looks more like the anti-Christ every day. :puke:

[Skink]

13. She hasn't even been confirmed yet.

Slow down W. :toast:

[flyarm]

14. SO DID CONGRESS APPROVE MILITARY FOR THE PRESIDENTS OPTION

for polio??> rubella?? measles , mumps..tb?? asian flu?? whooping cough?

fly

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. In 1918 NG troops were indeed used

to quarantine certain areas of the country... they were in support of the National Heath service workers, who ironically worked under local authority....

So yes there is a precedent. the difference, bush wants to use this to impose permanent martial law.

[stillcool]

20. Isn't there a hugh difference....

between Ntl Guard and the armed forces? I mean, didn't we just take this test with Katrina? and, what about all these private security people? Is that our military, or National Guard?

[flyarm]

34. ng is one thing..calling for military inside the usa ..

is just not acceptable...we use the national guard..for many things..riots ( think rodney king in L.A.) most national disasters..its what they are for...but not the full military!!

that is marshall law..big difference

fly

[EFerrari]

18. It sounds like he considers our armed forces

his personal clean up crew. And, like he thinks we're just the potential mess.

We're dealing with an intellect that has no idea that people are people.

Be afraid. And be ready. :(

[jody]

19. "Be afraid. And be ready. " And be armed. Oliver Cromwell said,

"Put your trust in God; but mind to keep your powder dry!"

[Ksec]

21. He'd use the military to mow his grass if he could

Damn. The military is for protecting us from attacks. Not disease/

[ladjf]

22. Passing a law the would give Bush the authority to take over

the country in the event of an avian flue epidemic would be the best possible way to assure that there will be an avian flue epidemic. Everytime we turn around, Bush is looking for some way to take over America with the military. My prediction is that shortly before the Presidential elections, avian flue would break out in several "blue"
states canceling their elections, perhaps the election Nationwide.

[shadowknows69]

23. see taht's why you're not ambitious enough to be a neo-con

I predict this is designed to stop the 2006 elections first.

[ladjf]

27. You may well be correct on this.After all, if the Republicans

were to lose control of the House and Senate in 2006, it would be all over for them.

[LisaL]

24. What is Bush planning to do with birds? Bomb them?

[HereSince1628]

25. The military is all that's left that doesn't fit in Norquist's bathtub.

By default it's become the government's all purpose action arm.

I suspect that the current domestic militarism began less by design and more by accident. But, the reality on the ground is now being formalized by proposed changes in posse comitatus, and stated intention to rely on the military for domestic purposes.

They said it couldn't happen here.

[Kailassa]

26. Avian flu is the perfect cover

Post-Katrina New Orleans was used to test their ability to:
(a) keep people confined in an area,
(b) cut communication coming out of an area,
(c) keep aid-workers out of an area,
(d) acclimatize the nation to the idea of large numbers of blacks dying,
(e) convince a nation of the need to use the military on american soil and
(f) practice the disposal of bodies in a manner which prevents accurate diagnosis of cause of death.

The protest march was used to test the dispersal and contagion rates of Francisella Tullarensis, using a weakened form of the bacillus.

It would be possible to seal off a community, drop lightbulbs of aerosol from helicopters, and tell the world the inhabitants had died of Avian Influenza.

Fact: Testing the spread of Tularemia by dropping lightbulbs containing an aerosol of the (presumably weakened) bacteria onto the ventilation holes of an American subway has been done.
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:U037IZirHLYJ:www.columbia.edu/cu/biology/courses/g4158/presentations/2003/3-Tularemia/Tularemia.ppt+Francisella+Tullarensis&hl=en&lr=lang_en

Fact: Pneumonic (inhaled) Tularemia is indistinguishable from Avian Influenza without proper testing.

Fact: The documents I was looking at on the net about Pneumonic Tularemia which gave the death-rates became unavailable through Google on the 1st to 2nd of this month.

Now none of this proves anything, it is merely tin-hat speculation. However I do think it would be wise for everyone to do what they can to strengthen their immune systems and to stock up on both surgical masks and their chosen method of surviving infections. Mine are cod-liver oil capsules and ascorbic acid powder and ginger to stir into juice; that will always come in handy. I'm not suggesting we should take this seriously enough to start hoarding antibiotics.

[Bridget Burke]

28. The scientists should be fighting that battle.

What about concerted funding to study the Avian Flu? When might it make the jump to human vectors? What about vaccines? (What about more general research into influenza?) There's a lot of scientific work to be done NOW!

But Bush's government is into hiding scientific data to protect commercial interests.

Latest reports indicate that we aren't sure there will be enough "regular" flu vaccine again this season. After last year's fiasco, there's no excuse.

[Kailassa]

32. Excuse? We'll be lucky if we get that much.

"The scientists" can't do a thing unless someone pays them to do it.
This is a very expensive high-security undertaking that can only be managed by a big drug company.

Apparently there is one drug company working on it, and the CDC is withholding vital information so that no other drug company join in the effort. They state a need to safeguard the profits of the company concerned.
http://www.ajc.com/news/content/news/stories/1005/03natcdc.html

One thing we can be sure of, if a good Avian Influenza vaccine is made and needed, there will never be enough to go round. With luck though it won't happen, it is not yet contageous person to person.

Just in case, it wouldn't hurt to build up a group amongst the people you know to support each other, keep a week's supplies in the cupboard, and a supply of your chosen do-it-yourself treatments on hand.

As for how it happens, Bridget, viruses mutate and combine with other types all the time. If a human influenza virus crosses over to an infected bird, or if a human with the flu contracts avian influenza, there is a chance of the 2 viruses combining to form one as virulent as avian flu, but as contagious as human flu.

[Bridget Burke]

36. I did include "funding" as a necessity.

Government & academic scientists are as capable of doing research as a "Big Drug Company." But they need the money; government has cut funding for most research outside the Military Industrial Complex.

"Hiding scientific data to protect commercial interests" referred to the CDC's withholding information. I read that story earlier this week.

I already have supplies for a week. We have hurricanes down here.

And I understand the "Virology Made Simple" explanation of how viruses mutate. But I would hope that more advanced knowledge is being sought by those capable. If they could get the funding, that is.

[tlsmith1963]

29. Only 60 Deaths?!!

I thought this bird flu thing was supposed to be this big threat! There goes Bush, scaring us again.

Tammy

[DemonFighterLives]

31. Chirp Chirp, Code Red!

I don't know how dangerous this bird flu will be, but without a doubt dubby is very dangerous. Move Blackwater in there, but pay no mind to doctors and researchers.
:freak:

[jmatthan]

33. Bird flu is in Finland

As I posted on mMandatory Malloy this morning, Bird Flu has reached the Arctic in Finland. You can see photographs taken by me when i found dead birds on my walks in Oulu.

http://jmatthan.blogspot.com/2005/09/dead-birds-in-oulu.html

Dead Birds in Oulu

The claim is that this variety has not yet mutated to affect humans.

With the uproar that citizens have raised, you can see what the steps the Finnish Government has had to take:

Instead of talking about bringing martial law (as Bush is doing covertly for his own purpose), the Finnish Government is ordering vaccine sufficient for all the people living in Finland, over 5 million doses. As the vaccine is not readily available, they are also paying a reservation fee to stay up in the queue. More details are in the article below, but I highlight some salient points:

http://www.helsinginsanomat.fi/english/article/No+precision+bird+flu+vaccine+available+yet+%0D%0A/1101981152836

"Finland is prepared to order enough vaccine to inoculate the entire population against the disease. However, no vaccine against the mutated virus can be produced until after the mutation has taken place."

"Finland is stocking up on the model vaccine, because it is believed to give some protection against a mutated virus."

""If Finns are not vaccinated in the face of a pandemic, at least one thousand - or several thousands - of Finns would be likely to die of it", warns Ville Valtonen, head physician of infectious diseases at the Helsinki University Central Hospital (HYKS)."

"The reservation would be for the supply of five million doses of the precision vaccine, and Finland would pay a fixed annual fee for its place in the queue. When the vaccine is ready, it would be delivered to the various countries according to where they are in the queue.
As not enough of the main vaccine is likely to be immediately available for the whole population, plans are already being drawn up for which groups would be given priority"

"Hospitals are also drawing up contingency plans for a bird flu pandemic.".

I ask again - "Why are Americans, especially your Democratic politicians, behaving as ostriches with their heads buried in the sand?"

[NNN0LHI]

35. What took so long? Had it in a couple chicken farms in Delaware last year

http://english.people.com.cn/200402/11/eng20040211_134484.shtml

Bird flu virus has been found on a second farm in US state of Delaware, state agriculture officials announced Tuesday.

Bird flu virus has been found on a second farm in US state of Delaware, state agriculture officials announced Tuesday.

The new case was discovered in a commercial flock of roaster-type chicken in the state's northern Sussex County, at least five miles (8 kilometers) away from the farm in southern Kent County where bird flu was first detected last week.

Following the latest finding, state authority has banned the sale of live poultry in Delaware. In addition, sales or auctions of farm equipment, meetings involving farmers and growers have all been canceled.

State officials said they will also kill 72,000 birds in three chicken houses on the Sussex County farm to stop further spread of the virus. The state destroyed 12,000 chickens after the first case was found.

[jmatthan]

37. There is a very big difference

in transmission if the birds are migratory birds as sea gulls, unlike chickens.

Chickens can be contained in an area and destroyed. You can quarantine an area!

But not migratory birds and that is why it is troubling.

It is not contained to a region, state or country.

That is why i put up pictures of sea gulls which I found dead in Oulu on my website.

That is why we have had rapid action by the Finnish authorities.

So Bush's logic of calling in the army to solve this problem shoiws that he is a stupid a***hole!!

Areas with bird flu brought by migratory birds cannot be contained by quarantine as Bush thinks unless you start to shoot all birds that are flying into the country!!

[MetaTrope]

38. Have any online polls been conducted yet regarding this question?

I'd like to see the general population's response to Bush's desire to use troops as domestic law enforcement...whether they've even taken notice of it, for that matter.