Please sign the Conyer's letter!

[Mnemosyne]

http://www.johnconyers.com /

Caution: signing this letter may help bring about the impeachment of gw bush, sociopath extraordinaire and his entire cabal!

:woohoo: :applause:

Thanks to all DUer's!


I have emailed Conyer's to find out where this stands now. It will be interesting to see the results! Will post when I get an answer.

:hi:

[cdb]

1. Done! n/t

[ClassWarrior]

2. kicking...

(And - just because I'm a stickler for proper punctuation - please remove the apostrophe from Rep. Conyers' name, vick...)

NGU>

[Mnemosyne]

23. Sorry Class, keep thinking his name is Conyer!!

[ClassWarrior]

42. n/p vick...

:kick:

NGU.

[dweller]

3. read on DKos some concern

as to whether one had to reply to the confirmation email to make sure one's name is added.

just to be sure i guess you should confirm? :shrug:


hope you get an update and #'s

:thumbsup:

dp

[FreedomAngel82]

6. I don't know about that

I don't remember getting a confirmation Email. I read on Conyers blog someone said he was going to reveal the numbers today? I don't know though. :shrug:

[dweller]

8. i got one

and it said it was for further emails from Conyers to reply/verify, etc.

then read Kos and went back to email and replied.

just making sure.

dp

[Mnemosyne]

24. I've never recieved a confirmation email.. Anyone know? n/t

[spindoctor]

44. No, the email address is even optional. Confirming just puts you in the ..

... mailing list.

If you don't receive an email confirmation (post below) you may have typed the addie wrong.

[Up2Late]

4. done

and done:evilgrin:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

5. sorry

signing this letter may help bring about the impeachment of gw bush, sociopath extraordinaire and his entire cabal!


Unfortunately, no it won't.

[ClassWarrior]

7. Thanks for that bit of Progressive hope.

And even if it doesn't, what excuse do you have for NOT putting pressure on Bush** - regardless of the outcome?

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

9. For one thing, I don't think it puts pressure on Bush.

And, I think it distracts from real pressing issues like social security, the Supreme Court, etc - actual issues where we've made (or realistically could make) inroads.

If Conyers has a case for impeachment, he doesn't need signatures. Impeachment isn't a recall refferendum.

[ClassWarrior]

10. Read Lakoff. We're not going to win on "issues."

I'm tired of playing catch-up. It's time to start breaking plates.

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

11. But this accomplishes nothing, as far as I can see.

Conyers gets signature
Conyers sends letter to Bush
Conyers calls for impeachment
Conyers is ignored.

I see no other possible outcome. This strikes me as a poorly-constructed stunt, not that I disagree with his sentiments.

[ClassWarrior]

12. Okay, so give up.

I refuse to do so. Doing something is better than doing nothing.

Funny, I thought the one thing that defined all Progressives was hope. Even in the face of overwhelming odds.

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

14. Who said anything about giving up?

Personally, I'd prefer not to have the Democratic party implode and lose 2006 because it tried to impeach Bush. That course of action would be utter, self-destructive, self-righteous madness for our party.

[ClassWarrior]

16. Yeah, let's not ruin that winning streak we're on, huh??

:rofl:

Read Lakoff.

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

17. Sure, why not?

I mean, it worked for Newt Gingrich. :eyes:

[ClassWarrior]

19. Oh yeah, I forgot how his party "imploded and lost."

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

20. Maybe what our party really needs is a little...

..."utter, self-destructive, self-righteous madness." Or at least the spine to risk it. Do you prefer pink tutus?

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

46. No, but I'd prefer not to lose social security or the supreme court...

...because my congressional representation was dicking around with silly buy-the-world-a-coke stuff like this.

[ClassWarrior]

49. So do you believe Bush** should be impeached?

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

51. It's not as simple as that.

Do I think Bush has committed crimes worthy of impeachment? Most likely, yes.

Does that mean I think he should be impeached? NO.

I don't think you clearly understand the consequences of what you're proposing. Attempting to impeach Bush would completely derail any chance we have of making gains in the 2006 elections. It would serve as a huge distraction which would let the Republicans in Congress run roughshod over the opposition, using the impeachment as cover. They would essentially be able to pass any legislation they want. They would also be able to paint any such effort as a partisan power-grab. Perhaps you underestimate the loathing Americans have for consitutional crises, but I just don't see the kind of wide-spread support for this move that you would have had for, say, impeaching Nixon. It just isn't there.

Furthermore, there isn't a snowball's chance in hell that Bush would be convicted if impeached. I can't even visualise a world in which he'd be impeached, but convicted? Not a chance. Tell me where those votes would come from? Can you make any sort of rational analysis of the situation in which this would be possible? Look at the numbers - it isn't possible. You'd have to assume that a substantial number of moderate and conservative democrats wouldn't go for it, and I can just about guarantee that no Republicans would cross the line on such a divisive issue - much safer to sit it out, even if they oppose Bush personally. So you're left with a situation wherein the actual result of this push will be a failure to convict (and most likely a failure to impeach.) In other words, nothing will be accomplished with respect to the actual act of removing Bush.

Conyers is grandstanding. This is silly.

[ClassWarrior]

55. Hmmm... Conyers is being silly.

Okay. Answers my question.

NGU.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

48. I'm not giving up.

I never thought impeaching Bush was a good idea, and I still don't. This is not to say that he doesn't deserve to be impeached. The difference between doing what is "right" and what is politically beneficial is often times shaky and weird.

I haven't given up anything. I simply have a different attitude towards what constitutes the most likely win scenario in our current situation, and I refuse to be baited with these silly either/or with-us/against-us arguments. In my opinion, this is *exactly* the kind of ideological purism that we're supposed to be arguing against.

[ClassWarrior]

56. It's ideological purism to ask people to sign on to a letter?

:crazy:

Is it ideological purism to ask someone who's supposed to be my ally to read a book? Because you really should read Lakoff.

NGU.

[Mnemosyne]

26. Agree whole-heartedly Class! n/t

:hi:

[ClassWarrior]

40. Hey vick!

:hi:

NGU.

[Mnemosyne]

43. Hey Class!

:hi: :kick:

[BigBearJohn]

18. Anything that brings the illegitimacy of this President to light is valid

[Mnemosyne]

27. Amen, my brother.

:hi:

[0rganism]

13. Right now it won't. But if the House were to tip in 2006...

I don't see any cause as more worth working for than a Democratic House in 2006. If we had that, then Conyers' "stunt" would start to carry some real weight.

[ClassWarrior]

15. Hey!! Now quit thinking in the long-term like that!!

We want INSTANT gratification!! INSTANT!! And if we don't get it we're going to quit the Democratic Party and hold our breath till we turn purple!!

<this solo performance courtesy of the DUDQ>

NGU.

[BigBearJohn]

22. Wrong! A repug friend I sent the Downing memo to said he'll vote Democrat

next time for sure!

[Mnemosyne]

29. That's great news...

Now how to reach even more?:woohoo:

We know the MSM will not help, voluntarily. AAR and other's may touch some wingers listening to find "evidence of unpatriotic speech"( or whatever they are looking for).

I wonder if we can get Conyers to go on the road. Could the MSM keep ignoring it if there are huge gatherings??

Just a thought.

I want to paste it all over my car, think I will as a matter of fact. Clear decals in windows?:hi:

[BigBearJohn]

34. TO CONYERS: HOW ABOUT THIS FOR A BUMPER STICKER?????

[Mnemosyne]

36. Gorgeous John,

I think I have some bumper sticker material left.

:yourock: :pals:

[Mnemosyne]

31. However long it takes is my motto!

:hi:

[Mnemosyne]

25. We've got to try whatever comes our way.

If people keep that kind of apathy/defeatist attitude we may never see the end of this cabal.

It may or may not stop them, but without trying we will never know if it would have made a difference.

I will not stop fighting these freakazoids, ever!

Who knows what may bring about regime change.:hi:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

47. I'm not a defeatist.

I just don't think it's a good idea for the Democratic party to try to impeach Bush, even though he definitely fucking deserves it. It's a matter of political calculation, and has nothing whatsoever to do with defeatism. Calling me a defeatist is just as silly as me telling you to "get over" the election. Both are wrong. I just have a different approach than you, and in my view the Democratic party can best serve us by holding back the Bush assault on the legitimacy of government social/environmental programs and the independence judiciary branch. So far our efforts in those areas seem to be succeeding, and I want them to succeed. I don't want to see the Dems get sidetracked by a crusade that will most certainly fail and leave the party weaker for 2006 and 2008.

Regardless of how much Bush deserves to be impeached, I fail to see what good it would do, even if it were to succeed. How is President Cheney or President Hastert any better? The same people are still pulling the strings, and you can't impeach all of them.

[Mnemosyne]

54. Sorry about the defeatist comment,

it just is difficult to pick the right words sometimes.

But if they continue unabated things will only get worse and we may lose the chance to do anything at all. Elections did not go so well and it may not be a fair election ever again, IMO.

An investigation could bring out those behind the smoke and mirrors. It may be a long shot, but well worth it, IMO and others much smarter than I.

He needs to be sent to the Hague and so do his co-horts. An election will not change their crimes against humanity. Do we let those slide on the chance that we can elect better next year? 2008? That's just not acceptable in any way. How many more lives lost are acceptable on a chance over a year away? None.

I personally do not want to wait until he's dropped more radiation on civilization in the form of a massive nuke. He now has more power in that area also.

It just can not wait until 2006 or 2008.

[ClassWarrior]

59. If he deserves it...if it's the right thing to do...then it's the BEST...

...political calculation we could ever make. Read Lakoff.

NGU.

[goclark]

21. Kick Please! nt

[Mnemosyne]

32. Thanks go!

:hi:

[elehhhhna]

28. Done. Thx for the link.

[Mnemosyne]

30. You're welcome el!

:hi:

[Mnemosyne]

33. UPDATE. from Conyers -

I just received this from Conyers:

"Thank you for all your efforts. I truly, truly appreciate the work you have put in over the weekend. Please continue to spread the word and gather signatures--and let us know if there is anything that we can do for you.
The good news is that thousands of citizens have signed on to the Downing Street letter over the weekend. The bad news is that it will take our technicians a few days to make a final count. Rest assured, when we do gather the 100,000 names, you will hear about it.
Thank you again,
JC "

So, it will be a couple days at least before we know any figures.
It tells us that we have all done a great job gathering signatures! But we must keep it up! If there is even the slimmest chance that this will help put * and his cabal behind bars, we must not waver.


If you have questions:
[e-mail]

If you haven't signed or passed it on yet:
http://www.johnconyers.com /

DUers :yourock:
:hi: :grouphug:

[Sapphire Blue]

35. Related...

Impeach Central: http://impeachcentral.com /

Urgent!! Write your Representative to demand the truth about why the Bush Administration invaded Iraq; Urge Congress to Investigate Bush's Iraq War Lies: http://www.democrats.com/peoplesemailnetwork/39

[Mnemosyne]

37. Great link Sapphire, thank you much!

:hi:

[UdoKier]

38. Dupe - delete

NT

[UdoKier]

39. I signed it - sort of

I put my initials, then under address, I put "I'm afraid to put my address due to possible retaliation by the ruthless Bush government."

And it's true, I am sort of afraid. If they can jail anybody indefinitely with no charges and no access to an attorney, what's stopping them from doing it to me - or you?

Feel free to call me a pathetic coward. I have 2 small kids to think of.

[Mnemosyne]

41. I understand, there are many

afraid to sign for fear of repercussions. There are plenty of us older folks without young children to get this fully signed.

The fact that people are afraid to sign it says much about this regime. :grr: :nuke:

Thanks for trying and for sharing your fears. :hug: :hi:
I don't really want my daughter to sign either, believe it or not.


also> I know it's a dupe, but they all will add up. And many may miss earlier threads. Thus posting it over for the latest will help. I'll be posting it at regular intervals this week and however long it takes.

[BigBearJohn]

45. I'm with you!!!! (kick)

:kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick:
:kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick: :kick:

[Mnemosyne]

50. You are too sweet!

[BigBearJohn]

52. Hey! Conyers wrote me a letter too! Two sentences, but hey!

He asked for my understanding and patience on the count.

[Mnemosyne]

53. He has my understanding and patience! Save the email for posterity!

I've learned much patience over the years, it can pay off!

I'm emailing his office every few days until we get the count. Do you think Friday and Monday are too soon? Are you going to check back with him soon? I don't want to distract him, but want to keep up the support. He has possibly taken his life in his hands. Wellstone, et al, enough said.

I was thinking, yes it's dangerous but, anyway, if people in all areas of the country sent the minutes to their Congress person return receipt/signature required, how could they keep denying it's existence?

We send Conyers our return cards or do something like? I think we must make sure there is proof they have heard about it.Their denial of knowledge of it is a major PIA, but to find a way to prove they know and haven't acted, ah what a ploy if we could do it! But I'm not sure how to do it, loudly.

:shrug:

[ClassWarrior]

57. I spent some time on the phone explaining it to my Rep's aide.

I'll be doing it again tomorrow. I like the idea of mailing with return receipt too.

NGU.

[Mnemosyne]

70. I've been calling

English's office. :puke: I try to annoy him regularly, but I've only just begun on this!

I'm sending off the minutes today or tomorrow. I'm thoroughly tired of him and his lock-stepping to *'s drum. I wonder if I should send it to his local office or DC? What do you think Class?

Morning!:hi:

:kick:

[BigBearJohn]

61. It's kind of hard to come after 100,000 Americans

[RedstDem]

63. Make That 100,001 ! n/t

[BigBearJohn]

64. Welcome to DU and THANKSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

:yourock:

[goclark]

58. Don't Forget to Have All The Voters In Your House

submit their letter to Conyers.

My mom just entered her info too.
Another Done!

[BigBearJohn]

60. You betcha! Every friend of mine is HOUNDED by me on this.

[goclark]

62. Each one reach one -- please!

[BigBearJohn]

65. Great idea GoClark! How about starting a thread to that effect?

If everyone here gets ONE additional person to sign the letter,
consider what we can accomplish. Then they can report by adding
+1 to your thread. Make it fun. Let's do it. How hard is that?

[goclark]

66. Done BigBearJohn ..let's roll!

New Thread is On the Way

[steely]

67. I just signed it.

[BigBearJohn]

68. Wonderful. Now get 1 friend to sign too!

[Wilms]

69. kick n/t