Why Did Senator Byrd -- and the others -- Sell Out?

[napkinz]

Peace in our time! The Senate is back in business!

But at what COST? Was such reconciliation -- appeasement -- worth the price of liberty? Are we not merely deLaying the inevitable? Is this not merely a Pyrrhic victory?







:nuke:

[saltpoint]

1. Byrd is the Senate's First Parliamentarian and Constitutionalist.

He and the 13 others wrapped Frist in fishwrap and tossed his ass out the back window.

[Renew Deal]

2. That's a good way to put it.

I still think Byrd is a big winner here. You could feel the tide turn with his speech.

[saltpoint]

4. Agreed. I wish Byrd were more progressive -- but by god I sure don't --

-- want to debate the man.

[pinkpops]

3. They needed to give the 7 Republicans some cover

so that both sides could claim some measure of victory. There is rancor to come and hopefully the action of the 7 represents a commitment to principle regarding Senate rules and what is required to change them. I was sort of looking forward to a confrontation too, but if you can't trust Byrd at this point, who can you trust?

[Frances]

5. The Dems didn't have the votes to block the Repubs'

attempt to do away with the filibuster. They persuaded some Repubs to join them in keeping the filibuster but they had to pay a price.

It was the best the Dems could do under the present circumstances. Warner (R) signed on because he honestly believed that this compromise was best for the country and the Senate. The Maine senators (R) signed on because the people of Maine would punish them at the polls if they didn't. Salazar (D) signed on because he wanted to allow the up or down vote, but he didn't want to do away with the filibuster. Nelson of Nebraska (D) signed on because the people of his state will like the compromise. Byrd (D) signed on because of what he said at the beginning of every meeting: country, Senate, and last us.

[pinkpops]

6. Graham?

[Frances]

12. Graham

is interesting. Both my brothers and my mother live in South Carolina. They are all Republicans because that's what white people in their social class are. They are also church goers, but they look down on fundamentalists and evangelicals.

They will definitely support Graham on this issue. To them he will look adult and mature and reasonable.

By the way, I thought Graham was OK for a Republican when the Abu Ghraib scandal was being investigated. However, I was disappointed that there was no follow through.

Of course, I did not approve of Graham's position on Clinton's impeachment.

And, of course, I would support a Dem opponent of his, but frankly I expect he's in the Senate for life.

[oasis]

27. Graham and McCain are longtime allies. Graham backed McCain over Bush in

2000. They both know how nasty things got in South Carolina that year.

[Renew Deal]

13. How am I the only person that knew about Graham?

I heard him say on a show a few weeks ago that he wanted to avoid this fight and no one noticed it.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

7. Nelson signed on because he is a DINO

The moderate Repubs signed on because they did not want the wrath of their leadership..this is NOT a deal...it will be broken in no time at all..Repubs do not keep deals..they didn't on welfare reform or anything else..they know the public has no legislative memory so today there is a deal and tomorrow they will break it.

[Telly Savalas]

26. So if they break the deal...

we can adopt the foolproof plan that critics of the deal have that will prevent Bush from getting any rightwing judges appointed.

[demokatgurrl]

8. Because, alas, the "leaders" in our party are

all a bunch of spineless weenies (except Barbara Boxer and Hillary Clinton). I knew it would only be a matter of time before they bent over.

[saltpoint]

10. Call me old-fashioned, but I like the current crop of Democratic leaders.

I like Byrd's eloquent and forceful opposition to Bush on Iraq.

I like Boxer's stand against John Bolton.

I like Reid's outflanking of his GOP counterpart in the Senate.

I like Leahy's continued clarity on judicial nominees.

I like Pelosi's hard work and fire.

I like Kennedy and Kerry, arguably the best 1-2 punch of all Senate delegations. I like Durbin and Obama for the same reason.

I like Obama's speech at the convention, having been born in a time when no black person enjoyed national prominence of that level.

I like John Edwards speaking of One America instead of class-war Republican America, which is divided and bitter.

I like the way the Democrats are more unified now than they have been in a long time.

I like how Clinton towers over Dole and Bush, Sr. in embodying how ex-presidents can and should be.

I like the no-bullshit progressive compassion Jimmy Carter shows.

I like how things are turning around so encouragingly in Montana.

I don't see anything in the last 24 hours to make me change my mind, either.

Go, Democrats.

[sadiesworld]

9. Because he's being targeted in '06.

He folded on the bankruptcy bill as well. Presumably, he promised to help the junta out and they promised to go easy on him. It makes me ill.

[donsu]

11. this is not a victory - the bushgang got what it wanted

don't the dems always fold?

[ArkDem]

15. Well, at least, it's a modest repub victory.

[napkinz]

16. This is Gore/Bush 2000 all over again

Wasn't the lesson of 2000: You don't give up, you don't give in ... because you pay an even higher price LATER ON.

Such compromises only postpone, they don't stop anything.

And so the saga continues ...

[0007]

14. junior knew the Repukes didn't have the votes for a filibuster

and saved faced, while the Dem's fell through the open crack again.

And even if it did go through the the repukes were committing political suicide which would have taken junior down for good and he knows it.

[napkinz]

17. On MSNBC right now

John Hinderaker of Powerline is claiming the Democrats won because the GOP got only three of five judges in the deal.

But those three were the most extreme of the bunch.

[wiggs]

18. Patience. Wait until judicial nomination votes are all in. nt

[ComerPerro]

19. Because they have the misguided belief

that Republicans with ties to the Bush administration can be trusted to keep their word.

I will believe it when I see it.

[napkinz]

20. Bush's word is worth *****

[napkinz]

21. Doomsday has merely been postponed

:nuke:

[Swamp Rat]

22. HA! You beat me to it!

:D

[napkinz]

23. that's a cool one

You have any others?

[Swamp Rat]

24. A few

[napkinz]

25. Scary pic ... how could those mothers yesterday allow their kids

to be kissed by him?


Never compromise with the devil.

[napkinz]

29. Your response from another thread is very fitting

"You said it girlfriend! ... Your insight is needed and much appreciated! Never make deals with fascists!"

Oi Pachamama!

[GreenPartyVoter]

28. For what.. 2 weeks?

[napkinz]

30. From 2001 ... did anyone listen?

This op-ed appeared in the New York Times on May 27, 2001


A Battle Plan for the Democrats
by James Carville and Paul Begala

"But if Mr. Bush continues to push his radical agenda, offering right-wing judicial nominees and environmental policies that threaten our air and water -Senate Democrats may have no option other than to obstruct. They should not shrink from that duty. Stop signs save lives."

http://www.democracycorps.com/op_eds/nyt_5_27_01.html

[ggppink]

31. Doesn't this belong in the Politics forum?

[napkinz]

32. Was anyone paying attention in 2001?

Sorry for the dupe, please remove

This op-ed appeared in the New York Times on May 27, 2001

[napkinz]

33. from the Christian Left

Senator Frist, the most afflicted senator to ever catch a case of delusions of grandeur (he actually believes he can be president), did his best to make the case for the conservatives' latest crusade yesterday.... Freedom of religion is supposed to also mean from religion, which still matters to some of us liberty minded, liberal Christian folk. Because one person's religion can be another person's prison, or better yet, poison.

http://www.taylormarsh.com/articles_view.php?id=756










:nuke: