Hybrid car advice

[LostinVA]

Okay, I'm in the market for a hybrid. I'll be buying between July-September. I can't afford a Honda Accord, a Prius may also be too much, but that's moot -- I don't have $1,200 to get on a waiting list; a Honda Insight doesn't have the room I need; and the VW place told me yesterday they won't be getting anymore manual TDI Golfs in until late Fall. So... that leaves me with the Honda Civic hybrid. Is it a decent car? I know the Civic is the low end of the Honda line, with nothing really fancy, and the hybrid adds about $5,000 to the price. Any comments/reviews/rants/advice? Thanks!

[Nite Owl]

1. The Honda Civic

is a great little car. Lots of my sons friends own them, love to work on them and they seem to just keep on going.

Honda is 100% blue too!

[LostinVA]

2. Great! I don't

Make alot of money, and the payment will hurt a little bit, but I'm moving and will have a bit of a commute, so would like to burn less gas. And not really to save gas money, I just don't want to literally burn more gas.

Thanks!

[Nite Owl]

4. Good luck

You could even be safe with a used one. Let someone else take the first year loss!

Consumer Report gave it a solid red, highest rating, for '03,'04.

[dflprincess]

40. I'm on my second Civic

I had the first one for 11 years and I've had the current one for 8 and I'd buy another one.

I get about 33 mpg in the city with this one and I'd love to get one of the hybrids, but I just can't afford a new car now. As I understand things, the only difference between the hybrid and standard Civic is that the rear seat does not fold down in the hybrid. (I would miss that feature).

[LostinVA]

44. OOOH... I would miss that, but it's not a deal breaker

There are many IKEA things that can fit into a sedan with fold-down back seats!

[CarefullyLiberal]

3. If you like the Pirus

Check out Ebay Motors

Prius Stuff on Ebay

By the way, what does it mean to say that "Honda is 100% blue?". I have no idea.

-Fergus

[Nite Owl]

5. They contribute

solely to the Dems.

[ananda]

7. Go Honda!

I'm so happy to hear that Honda is blue.

I own a Honda CR-V. It's a great compact SUV. It really likes to run.

The next car I buy will be a hybrid.

Sue

[NV Whino]

6. There was a discussion about the new Honda

on DU about a month ago. Be sure and check the gas mileage. The reported mileage for the new Honda hybrid was about 25 mpg, which is not good mileage for a hybrid. I can't remember is it was the Civic that was being discussed or not, but definitely a Honda.

[uberotto]

13. Must have been an Accord...

because I average around 45 mpg in my Civic Hybrid. Also, you have to remember, it takes a couple of months to learn the right way to drive a hybrid. If you see a "journalist" writing a report about a hybrid after spending a weekend driving one, any problems they report are more than likely due to their ignorance than with the car's technology.

[NV Whino]

35. I think you're right.

It was the Accord. Also, hybrids are great for stop and go city driving. For my kind of driving, long stretches of of country driving and going up and down mountains, they don't get that much better mileage than my 4-cylinder, 5-speed Celica.

[uberotto]

49. Not sure about mountains...

You are right about the Hybrid technology not providing much benefit to open hiway driving, but that's where all the other fuel efficient features come in to play.

The long stretches of country hiway driving is where the Civic Hybrid and probably the Prius really show off what they can do. The Civic Hybrid has a very small, low horsepower, 1.3L fuel efficient engine. The electric motor is there only to provide boost during acceleration, so that the car accelerates like a "real" car.

When driving 55 mph on an open hiway, I usually average a little over 60 mpg.

[unhappycamper]

8. How many miles do you drive a year?

Granted, the cost of gas can only go one way. But is a $5,000 premium for a hybrid Civic worth while? PM me with your email & I'll send an XL spreadsheet that calculates the cost of gas for 5k thru 20k miles per year in 2.5k increments.

FYI, the Civic is a pretty good car.

on edit: typo

[LostinVA]

26. I don't really care about the money I'd save

I just want to cut down on the amount of gas I burn. I'm going from a RTP work commute of 5 miles to one of 40 miles in about six weeks. Too much fossil fuel for me to waste, you know? But thanks for the info!

[hecate77]

9. Some people are selling their Prius' for about what they paid, as they get

new ones. So, you might be able to get a used one (some even bought two and are selling one) for about what a new one would cost without the waiting list. The base price of the 2004 model was about 20,000, which is less than the current base price. Our model cost 25,000, since we got all the bells and whistles, but the base was about the same as a Saturn that year.

Prius resale prices are staying at or above original purchase price, so even if you decided it wasn't for you, or you couldn't afford payments, or whatever, you could sell it for as much as you paid.

We managed a no down payment deal when we bought ours. I bet they are still doing that to keep selling cars in a soft market.

[SouthernDem2004]

10. Question about long distance driving:

My wife and I thought about buying one 2 years ago but the dealer said they were not worth it for the distances we drive. We drive around 100 miles per day on the Interstate. He said they were mainly for city type driving. Is this true?

[unhappycamper]

12. What's the MPG on the car you currently own?

[SouthernDem2004]

16. 30/38

[unhappycamper]

22. 100 miles per day * 5 days a week * 50 weeks a years = 25,000 miles per yr

At 38 MPG, $2.30/gallon, your annual commute cost is $1,513.16.
At 47 MPG, $2.30/gallon, your annual commute cost is $1,223.40.

At 38 MPG, $2.80/gallon, your annual commute cost is $1,842.11.
At 47 MPG, $2.80/gallon, your annual commute cost is $1,489.36.

At 38 MPG, $3.20/gallon, your annual commute cost is $2,105.26.
At 47 MPG, $3.20/gallon, your annual commute cost is $1,702.13.

The 47/MPG for the Civic comes from Edmunds. See:
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2005/honda/civic/sedan/compact/index.html

[IChing]

15. what dealer? A GM dealer no doubt

the toyota primus goes 600 miles on a tank, my neighbor has one and has gotten up to 80 miles a gallon on long trips.

[SouthernDem2004]

17. It was Toyota actually.

[uberotto]

20. They do better in the city...

They do really good on the interstate until you start to get above 65 mph. Between 60 to 65 I can average between 45 and 50 mpg driving on the interstate. When I start pushing it to between 70 to 75 mph, my gas milage falls down to between 40 and 45 mpg. Above 75, and my mpg falls below 40 unless I am following closely behind a large truck (H2's are good to follow, they do a good job of blocking the wind, allowing you to maximize your gas milage while having a good laugh at the idiot in front of you).

My wife and I have made several trips between Melbourne and Tampa in my Civic Hybrid, with no problems. The trip is just under 350 miles round trip. It's a good feeling to make the trip and arrive home with over a third of a tank of gas left, or enough to drive to work and back for a week before having to fill up again.

But the dealer is right in one respect. You aren't going to be saving any money driving a hybrid because you will pay more up front for the technology. I guess it just depends on who you would rather give your money to, Honda or Exxon. If you are really interested in getting the most for your money, I suggest you stick to old and well used.

[SouthernDem2004]

23. Thanks, answers alot.

[uberotto]

11. I own a 2004 Civic Hybrid...

and I love it. I live in a mid-sized city in Florida (don't ask me how it handles mountain areas) and average around 45 mpg. I've had it for around a year and a half and have had no problems with it. It looks and drives just like a regular Honda Civic. I often drive on I-95 and have no problems getting onto the Interstate, even in heavy traffic. The only real problem that you will have with the Civic hybrid is that no one will know it is a hybrid unless they get close enough to see the Hybrid name on the back.

If you are really looking for a good deal, I would suggest you wait until the 2005's start arriving around September-October. When I went looking at the 2004 Civic in October 2003, the Honda dealers were really pushing me to get a 2003 instead. The body styles were very similar, and they offered the 2003 at around $3,000 less than the 2004. They were more interested in getting them off of the lot to make room for new arrivals.

I'm a little surprised that a Prius cost's more than a Civic Hybrid. The base price for the two are about the same, but then again, the Prius is outselling the Civic hybrid by 2 to 1 so they are harder to find and the car dealers aren't going to be giving any incentives to buy the car.

[KlatooBNikto]

19. The Toyota hybrids are different from the Honda hybrids.The Toyota

hybrids are the true hybrids which can run on battery power alone.The Honda hybrids always require the gasoline engine to be running in tandem with the battery pack-electric motor.

[uberotto]

24. You are correct...

the Prius has the electric motor running in parallel with the gas engine so it can use either the electric motor or the gas engine or both. When you are travelling less than 15 mph the Prius will use only the electric motor, when you get above 15 then the Prius will use either the gas engine or both the gas and electric engine together.

The Civic hybrid mounts the electric motor to the gas engine in a serial configuration. The gas engine is always used to power the car and the electric motor is used to supply extra horse power during periods of acceleration.

The Prius technology will allow you to get better gas milage in heavy traffic while the Civic utilizes a simpler technology that is cheaper to implement In normal traffic driving, you don't spend much time going below 15 mph, so the advantages of the Prius technology is not significant. I have a friend who has a 2004 Prius and he and I get similar mpg. He will, from time to time beat me by about 1 mpg (I've been averaging between 46 and 47 mpg lately and he's been averaging a solid 47 mpg).

[LostinVA]

27. You answered one of my questions!

I was thinking about waiting until September or so. The Prius base price is about the same as the Civic, but EVERY dealer (about 8) I've talked to, plus people I know who bought one, are paying more like $24-26k for a new Prius... even used ones are going for 21-23k. The Civic, however, has no waiting list, and the dealers are willing to deal. I guess the Prius has more "statute" since it looks like a hybrid, and gets a little bit better gas mileage.

Great answers from all! Thanks!

[Peregrine]

14. There is also a Ford Escape hybrid

as well as a Toyota Highlander hybrid. The latter with a $7K premium over the V6 Highlander. Also it looks like diesel is an option for you (remember it may ge better gas mileage but is not green in any stretch of the imagination) the Jeep Liberty now comes with a diesel.

[IChing]

18. the ford hybrid only gets

29 miles to the gallon,
Speaking of costs, hybrid Escape was delivered with an eye-bulging $32,450 price tag

from car and driver mag.
http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=8777

[LostinVA]

28. There's a biodiesel station not too far from me

So TDI IS an option.

[Chemical Bill]

36. Biodiesel is green

I get about 350 miles per gallon of petroleum, only because I have to mix petroleum in with my biodiesel in the winter. Biodiesel is made from veggie oil, it smells clean and is American grown/made. I'm sorry, but I don't get the hybrid thing, didn't Honda make 50 mpg Civics years ago?

Bill

[spanone]

21. I've had my civic hybrid almost 3 years. It's a good car.

Right now I'm averaging 49.2 MPG. It gives you a constant readout. When I got it the 'hybrid' added about $2,000.00 to the price but I got a $2,000.00 Green Car tax credit from the feds, which by the way our brilliant chimp is doing away with next year.

[LostinVA]

29. Re: tax credit

I can't claim it on my 2005 taxes, right? Bush is such a jerk.

[LostinVA]

30. Does anyone drive a hybrid in smaller mountains?

I live in Central VA, and I don't often go to the mountains, but I do go onto the Skyline Drive sometimes. It's kinda flat once you get up there, but not getting up there! Is acceleration would be an issue?

[tishaLA]

37. I've driven a Prius

in the mountains in Southern California--my friend's, not mine--and it was fine. It doesn't have the pickup I got from my car, but I attributed that more to the fact that I'm accustomed to a manual transmission than to the engine's power. They are really more or less like any 4-cylinder car you might own, but the Prius is absolutely silent when you stop.

[LostinVA]

45. That answered my question, thanks.

I figured it would probably run up a mountain like any 4-cylinder car.

[Technowitch]

42. We live in the mountains, and power is not a problem with our Prius

The electric motors have really good torque.

[spanone]

31. The $2,000.00 is thru 2005.

[LostinVA]

32. Yes, I heard a Humvee was coming out with NEGATIVE

Mileage. I believe I'll get a $10k credit for that!

[LostinVA]

25. I run out to get whipped cream and I come back to 23 replies

Thanks for all of the answers, opinions, etc., everyone. I knew Duers would be informed... and opinionated!

[KlatooBNikto]

43. You just reduced your gas mileage by twenty percent due to weight gain!

[LostinVA]

46. Maybe more, because it was for strawberry shortcake!

[KlatooBNikto]

48. I will ask you to airfreight it to me except I am diabetic! Sounds great!

[lady lib]

33. I bought a new Prius 2 months ago.

I LOVE it. 43-45 mpg city, 51 mpg highway, plenty of power, almost no exhaust, and incredibly quiet. Toyota is also a blue company like Honda. Have you considered getting a used Prius?

[lady lib]

34. Oops. Never mind. I just read through the other posts.

:)

[Ernesto]

38. My wife gets her new Prius tomorrow

I've never bought a new foreign car before, but I think I ain't gonna have much in the way of a guilt problem on this one! According to Toyota's site, they provide many, many manufacturing jobs right here in the USA. At least I didn't buy it @ wal-mart.

[lady lib]

41. Yippie!!

:woohoo:
Let us know how it turns out for her. Hope she loves it!

Oh, one word of advice that another DUer passed on to me: Make sure the tire pressure is correct or you'll lose mpg's.

[harpo]

39. I have one (05 Honda Civic Hybrid)...its GREAT!!

[rjbny62]

47. Another hybrid to consider

Why not buy a TDI diesel and do a veggie oil conversion? A VW Jetta for example gets nearly 50 mpg. You can get used veggie oil at almost zero cost, so your true cost per mile is very low. There is no degradation of performance either, and vegetable oil is a renewable resource. Plus you help with the recycling of oil. I have a number of friends who have done this and it is a great feeling to flip the switch and drive knowing that your money isn't pouring into the big oils companies wallets.