Would it be unethical to lie about religion when running for office?

[SGBL]

Let's say that a person who was an atheist wanted to run for congress in an area in which his being an atheist would lead to prejudice that would likely by its self destroy his chances for winning office.

Would it be unethical to lie and say something along the lines of "I'm a moderate a christian" and no more about it just to eliminate that prejudice from the playing field?

[lenidog]

1. It would be and also if you got caught in the lie I would wonder

what else you lied about.

[MazeRat7]

2. Its never acceptable to lie...(n/t)

[jsw_81]

13. Nonsense

There are many, many situations where lying might be the best course of action. Saving someone's life, for example. Or commenting on your spouse's new less than flattering haircut. Or running for congress as a non-believer in a hotbed of fundamentalism.

[MazeRat7]

20. No... lying is always wrong. No exceptions in "my" book...

You can bend however you like....

MZr7

[jsw_81]

33. Well that's just absurd

n/t

[Wapsie B]

3. repugs do it all the time

to appease the conservative fundy base. This country just isn't ready for an atheist or agnostic in office at that level.

[NAO]

4. They all do that

I suspect that most people in the "elite ruling" class - by that I simply those who run for public office - do not take the claims of organized religion seriously. They are at heart secular, and any talk of religiosity is merely in deference to convention.

[blogbear]

7. amen!

[MuseRider]

5. I agree with

post number 1, not that I care if you are an atheist. I would be suspicious of your honesty. Also, seriously, how would one be able to deal with the prayers that are a part of everything? You would have to be seen going to church. I can't imagine having to do all of that and I am not exactly an atheist.

[Rush1184]

6. I would say something like...

I am a spiritual person and I try to embody the teachings of christ...

or try and something along that manner that implies you support the religious community while avoiding labeling yourself as a member of any religion.

[Swamp Rat]

8. Ethical concerns certainly haven't stopped republicans

[WillowTree]

9. Lying is never ethical. I'm surprised you have to ask.

[jsw_81]

10. No

Because by being honest about your atheism you would almost certainly open yourself up to a storm of hate mail and threats sent by "ethical" Christians, and your notoriety as the "atheist candidate" would almost certainly doom your otherwise decent chances.

Should I ever seek public office, this atheist is going to say that religion is a private matter that I would rather not discuss, but I wouldn't blame anyone who decided to go the "I'm a moderate/liberal Christian" route. I suspect that there are more than a few closeted atheist congressmen and senators who have done just that.

[Gelliebeans]

15. We atheists wouldn't have to lie

if religion and politics weren't being commingled.

I agree with you that many people that hold office are closet atheists but until the public decides that the lines need to be drawn, many will be forced to subscribe to "don't ask don't tell"

[beam me up scottie]

34. Love the picture

of your kids!
Although one of my damn cats saw that one of them is laying on the table and now he wants to know why HE isn't allowed to do the same.
:evilgrin:

[Gelliebeans]

36. sorry BMUS

I forgot about trying to set a good example but I eat at my table about once or twice a year the rest of the time it belongs to the "girls"
They are horribly spoiled. My fault completely :evilgrin: :blush:

[beam me up scottie]

37. My boys are spoiled as well.

Hell, they eat better than I do.
You'd think they would appreciate it when they see how hard life is for the strays and ferals that I feed.

[beam me up scottie]

22. Unfortunately for those

of us who have already proudly proclaimed our lack of faith in public, not only would we be burned at the stake by the press, but we would also be ineligible to run for office in some states.

[Psephos]

11. Yes

Once you start lying you never stop. Look at the liars you know in your own life.

It would, however, be perfectly ethical to not answer the question.

Peace.

[LSU_Subversive]

12. yes it's unethical, but i understand the temptation.

with few exceptions, admitting to being an atheist or even an agnostic seems akin to committing political suicide.

it seems as if those of us who will not lie or mislead others regarding our lack of faith eventually fall out of the running. until things change that is.

[Warpy]

14. "I was raised as a ____" would be the truth, as would

saying that being raised as a ___ gave you a firm moral foundation but that you aren't particularly religious today.

If you are seriously considering a run for office, this is the way to weasel around the religious question. The fundies won't buy it, but they won't buy anything that isn't controlled by the Texas mafia, so they're totally expendable.

[beam me up scottie]

16. Wouldn't work for me,

I was raised an atheist.

[Warpy]

17. Oh, well.

Lucky bugger.

I was packed off to Catholic school. I rebelled at ten. Later I found out my mother'd been kicked out of a convent school at twelve. I asked her why she'd done that to me, and the reply was "Why, I just wanted you to grow up with all the disadvantages I had."

I still think the main purpose of Catholic schools is to convert children to atheism. I know so many survivors who are atheists.

[beam me up scottie]

19. HA! Your mom sounds like a riot!

"I still think the main purpose of Catholic schools is to convert children to atheism"
:spray:
Can I use that?
:rofl:

Funny you mention that, my dad was also raised catholic.
He bolted at about the same age. Said instead of having his questions answered, they basically told him to shut up and believe.
He refused to return and nothing his parents did could make him go back.

[Warpy]

28. Everything here is in the public domain

so feel free to pinch any of my verbiage. I'll feel flattered as hell to see it out there.

[beam me up scottie]

32. If nothing else,

my dad will appreciate the hell out of it!
:hi:

[yella_dawg]

18. Let me simplify this a bit.

"Would it be unethical to lie"

Answer that question, and ya got your answer. The rest is just rationalization.

[dsc]

27. So when the person lied to get Andy into Johns Hopkins

that was unethical? See the thread on the GD front page

[dsc]

21. Honestly, I think it wouldn't be unethical

but it would be stupid. There are many better ways to deal with this. Simply not discussing religion at all would be the best. I think this would be analygous to a gay politician who remained in the closet but was liberal toward gay rights (such as Barney Frank in his early career and McGreevey). Frank never lied about being gay he merely kept his mouth shut and allowed people to assume. McGreevey did lie and look where that got him. I would just keep my mouth shut and allow people to assume I was religious.

[mailotto]

23. How does the "So help me god" part of the swearing in work?

If you are an atheist, does it do any good to say it

[PurityOfEssence]

30. That's not in the Constitution

It's a weird artifact of George Washington having said it. Pretty odd for a non-Christian, isn't it?

The Constitution asks one to swear or affirm. The latter is a sop to the Quakers, but the legal act is to give one's public word to an agreement.

The presidential oath is: "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of the President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

The original oath for members of both houses of Congress was this: "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States."

The new language with the "so help me god" crap was introduced during the Civil War.

Ya know what? The Civil War did some great things, but it fucked us in the religion issue: that's when we got "in god we trust" on money, and that's when we got the expanded oaths for Senators and Congresspeople.

The Constitution is crisply consistent about religion: it has NO PLACE IN GOVERNMENT. There is no mention of a supreme being in the document, and it's made resoundingly clear that there are to be NO MEANS TESTS FOR HOLDING OFFICE.

[spindoctor]

24. It would be unethical to lie about your eating habits...

...but ethical politicians are rare and far between.

Lying is unethical for any man. The subject of the lie determines the gradation. If it is in any way, shape or form a subject that affects voters, it is highly unethical. Since religion is a political hot potato at this time, it would be classified as highly unethical, as opposed to...eating habits.

[FreedomAngel82]

25. No way I would lie

You can see clearly what happens to the republicans when they lie. The truth has a way of coming out. And who gives a damn about someone's personal beliefs? If you're an atheist and that's what you believe be proud of it and don't let anybody shame you.

[PurityOfEssence]

26. ABSOLUTELY NOT

I'm an agnostic, and I value truth and one's personal word above everything. When a mugger asks you for all your money, though, and you have a wallet with ten bucks in it and a grand in your belt, give him the wallet; you've lied, but you've lied to an asshole.

Unfortunately, even with some reasonable professional credentials, I can't run for anything due to a long and documented history of non-belief. This is serious now: the stakes are the future of the biosphere itself. If you're in a position to dodge the issue, do as the greats have always done and duck and weave.

I guarantee you that many hardcore "believers" are cynical asshole atheists playing a calculated game. Many evangelists are laughing all the way to the gated community. It's sick, and yet it's true.

Focus on the real threat: those who truly believe in the big daddy who will reward for acts of xenophobic destruction. It's scary. It's important. If viable, you should run, but NEVER run without a fealty to some version of the big Witchy Man.

The U.S. is the most religious of all industrialized nations, with somewhere between 85% to 90% claiming a belief in a supreme being. Even so, there should be 10 to 15 non-believers in the Senate, and as many as 65 non-believers in the House of Representatives. How many are there? ZERO. None. Not one. There won't be for the foreseeable future, either. There are people of many avowed non-mainstream stances (homosexuals, a socialist, libertarians) but there ISN'T EVEN ONE who won't stand up in public and swear with certainty that there's a supernatural controller. Does that tell you something? Do believers play fair? It's scary.

If I can help, PM me, but remember: this is the great controlling and ugliness of mankind and always has been. Feel free.

Unethical people tend to be very adept at neutering moral people by calling their honesty to account.

[Stinky The Clown]

29. Well, let's see ... Bush did it ... so ... yeah ... Unethical

[mikedevilsfan]

31. good question

I have a feeling if you lied it would come out somehow. And considering that we have only had one non WASP in the last 100 years.....
Michael

[sonicx]

35. don't lie. if it ever comes up, say your religion is a personal matter

and you're not going to discuss it.