my report on the latest WLOS story (Waynesville Church)

[G_j]

any 'locals' out there?

edit: my report on the new WLOS story is posted below.

[G_j]

1. report:

preacher (on tape): anyone who votes for Kerry must repent or resign


9 members have filed a complaint with the IRS
(no comment from IRS)

(Western?) NC Democratic Party has issued a statement questioning tax status of the church, statement includes a quote from Jesus.

WLOS tried repeatedly to find the preacher -nowhere to be found

spoke with preacher's father in law (supports his actions because of abortion)

more good interviews with ousted members

[leftchick]

2. how did they find out how the people voted?

I did not read the original story and I am curious how that happened.

ChomskysRight is from that town.

:hi:

[G_j]

3. I don't know

I guess the ousted ones were candid with their fellow church members.
:shrug:

[FreedomAngel82]

21. That's scary

:scared: Reminds you of something doesn't it?

[WorseBeforeBetter]

4. That's good to hear.

I called the IRS to let them know that we are out here AND paying attention. To report suspected tax fraud, the number is 1-800-829-0433. The number for tax-exempt inquiries is 877-829-5500.

That mega-church from Justice Sunday needs to be on the IRS's hit list as well.

[FreedomAngel82]

22. I think so too

All they talked about was politics and it was going over the line.

[Stone_Spirits]

5. the story should be repeated at 11:00 btw - nt

[G_j]

13. will tape it this time n/t

[G_j]

6. Satement from Ralph Neas of People For the American Way

originally found at:http://waynesvillelive.com/waynesvillenews.html
--------

http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=18697
http://www.commondreams.org/news2005/0506-13.htm

Not GOP? You're Excommunicated!

Statement from Ralph G. Neas

Following the report that nine members of the East Waynesville Baptist Church in western North Carolina were excommunicated because they did not support President Bush in the election, Ralph G. Neas, President of People For the American Way Foundation, had the following statement:

“What have we come to when the doors of a church are closed to longtime members because of their political beliefs? When a pastor equates political support for the ‘wrong’ candidate with a sin before God?

“I would say to Senator Frist and Karl Rove that this is what comes of attempts to manipulate religion for political gain. Americans simply will not accept the claim that ‘unless you accept my political beliefs, you cannot be a good Christian.’

“This nation was founded on respect for religious belief, and tolerance for religious diversity. Men and women of faith have every right to advocate for their political beliefs. While churches, of course, can set their own membership standards, no one should punish people of faith for their political beliefs.

“This is terribly sad. I urge the President to express his opposition to all attempts to manipulate faith for political gain.”
---

[Stone_Spirits]

20. "I urge the President to express his opposition to all

attempts to manipulate faith for political gain.”

ditto

[FreedomAngel82]

24. You know he won't

I highly doubt he'd say anything about it. If he does he'll just breeze through it.

[Yellow_Dog]

49. If this should happen...

"This is terribly sad. I urge the President to express his opposition to all attempts to manipulate faith for political gain."

I would probably soil my tidy-whities is sheer shock.

If you could ask Bush without his handlers coaching him he would probably jump up and yell "YES", however his handlers will try and get him to act more appropriately.

If you remember a day or so after 9/11 GW referred to America's response as a 'Crusade'. I'm sure his handlers took him out behind the woodshed to make it clear he could never use that word again.

[radfringe]

56. ....attempts to manipulate faith for political gain

in the bush* "press conference" - he was asked about this and very carefully sat in the middle of the fence.

I fear we are seeing the birth of a theocracy. the repugs are beholden to a narrow segment/version of christianity. They have made promises upon promises and risk losing support (money and votes) if they are unable to deliver or at least make a big show of trying to deliver.

Beginning with Reagan - they unfurled the "values" banner, claiming moral high ground. It continued with Gingrich and his "contract on America" and the Clinton impeachment which left Clinton still in office, and many repugs fell by the moral highway while confessing "sins"

bush* took up the banner again - beginning with his "faith-based" initiatives. 9-11 diverted attention away from the bible-babble and the repugs wrapped themselves in the flag. If you disagreed - then you "hate America"

Now we have come full circle -- repugs have strapped on a bible-belt and if you disagree then you "hate christians". Won't be long before this is all neatly tied together with the war on terra and it becomes the war to save christianity. Crusades part 2? 3?

[RebelOne]

7. It was reported on CNN this afternoon.

So the story is in the mainstream media now.

[Roland99]

46. But we can't get them talking about how * fabricated intel to invade Iraq

[Gothmog]

8. here is a link

http://www.citizen-times.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050506/NEWS/50506020/1001

[G_j]

10. thanks!

(the story may be expanded by the morning, we'll see)

Church members say they were kicked out for being Democrats

By Andre A. Rodriguez
STAFF WRITER
published: May 6, 2005 6:08 pm

WAYNESVILLE – Nine members of a local church had their membership revoked and 40 others left in protest after tension over political views recently came to a head, church members say.

Some members of East Waynesville Baptist Church voted the nine members out at a recent scheduled deacon meeting, which turned into an impromptu business meeting, according to congregants.

Chan Chandler, pastor of East Waynesville, had been exhorting his congregation since October to support his political views or leave the church, said Selma Morris, a 30-year member of the church.

“He preached a sermon on abortion and homosexuality, then said if anyone there was planning on voting for John Kerry, they should leave,” she said. “That’s the first time I’ve ever heard something like that. Ministers are supposed to bring people in.”

..more..
http://www.citizen-times.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050506/NEWS/50506020/1001

[blondeatlast]

9. Nice work--can we get another nomination, gang? nt

[DistressedAmerican]

12. Yes You Can. Done And Done!

So many symtoms of the greater disease in this country. Europe is laughing at us. As well they should!

[G_j]

14. --:

thanks! :toast:

[G_j]

11. can anyone find the statement issued by the NC Democratic Party?

I am having no luck finding it.

[leftchick]

15. their web site...

http://www.ncdp.org/newsroom

nothing yet. Are they asleep for cripes sakes? :banghead:

[G_j]

17. according to WLOS they issued a statement

the question is: where? :shrug:

nothing at the Buncombe County Democratic website either:
http://www.buncombedems.org/news.html

[babylonsister]

18. Will this work? From Jerry Meek...

Please check out this diary by Jerry Meeks on MyDD

http://www.mydd.com/story/2005/5/6/182625/7920

"Hey, Jerry Meek here. I'm the new Chair of the North Carolina State Democratic Party. You saw what happened today in my state. Everyone knows it's wrong to be kicked out of church for one's political preferences."
...
I put out the following statement responding to press reports about the shameful activities in the Waynesville church.

"One of the Bible's most repeated commands is to 'Love your neighbor.' If these reports are true, this minister is not only acting extremely inappropriately by injecting partisan politics into a house of worship, but he is also potentially breaking the law and threatening the church's 501(c)(3) non-profit status."

Ok, so we put out a statement. That's great for the press. But what about everyone else? What else should we be doing? Give me your ideas about how North Carolina Democrats and citizens can free our churches.

Post comments in this thread. And if you just want to show solidarity, link to this post or the North Carolina State Democratic Party site from your own blog. Wouldn't it be amazing if the internet spoke loudly and clearly about this? "

Oh yeah, when he says "this thread" you need to go here:
http://www.mydd.com/story/2005/5/6/182625/7920

[G_j]

19. that seems to be it

as it includes the quote from the bible mentioned.

thanks you!

[Eloriel]

33. If anyone signs up to add their comments

please add this one (or something like it) for me -- under your name, mine, doesn't matter:

We need to also start calling this kind of thing what it is: UNAMERICAN. The U.S. was initially populated and then founded in a quest for religious freedom, which definitely includes not mixing politics with religion. Most of the conservative churches have been OVER the line for several decades now, but for any church to actually excommunicate people or make membership rules based on political leanings is UNAMERICAN. We do NOT live in a theocracy and we do not WANT a theocracy.

[Kat45]

16. Ed Schultz was talking about it on his show today, and he interviewed

a 78-year-old woman who was one of the Democrats in that church. She said the pastor had been there for 2 1/2 years. She said most of those who he 'kicked out' were older folks who had been going to that church for years. He was talking about voting for bush around election time, and he's continued to talk politics from the pulpit. He's been bringing in younger people who think like him (or who he's convinced to think like him) and pushing the older folks out. The Dems are going to be talking to a lawyer and they're going to see if they can find a way to fire the pastor.

[FreedomAngel82]

26. Good

I'm glad they're taking some action. How wrong of that guy. He's surely not a preacher if all he talks about is politics. People, at least me anyways, go to church for spritual uplifting and studying and not politics.

[blondeatlast]

35. DUer libnnc (who broke the story here) says she thinks she went

to HS with the pastor!

I heard that interview--I can't imagine the hurt she and they must feel.

I don't believe in a vengeful God, really, I don't, I believe in the loving one.

But sometimes, I have these decidely un-Christian thoughts...

Kudos to the 40 that stood with the 9!

[Pirate Smile]

41. I wonder what all he has done with the RNC or some of their

wacko groups. How exactly is the Rove/RNC indoctrinating all these church's, Pastors, etc.? We know this is a big part of their strategy but we need to research and find out more - connect all the dots.

After the Gannon/Guckert fiasco we found out there were graduating people from a 2 day "journalism" program and acting like that made them reporters.

[knitter4democracy]

65. Hmmm--he wants a mega-church.

My mom's old church got a pastor like that. He started alienating the older folks who'd been there way longer, and then he started working on getting new members in who agreed with him. That guy wants a mega-church, not a regular, good-sized church, and he really hurt my mom and all of her friends with his actions. She can't even really talk about it anymore and just shakes her head. I'm sure that is what is behind all of this.

[snowbear]

23. Turn on Olbermann QUICK !!

It's his top story ~~ :bounce:

[libnnc]

25. yeeeeeaaaaerrrrrrrrhhhh!!!

I'm taping it!!

libnnc

[FreedomAngel82]

27. Wow

This story spread really fast!

[G_j]

28. in many ways we can thank libnnc for that

:toast: :yourock:

[libnnc]

29. aw shucks y'all...

I was just communicating with my Maw

Yous guys and gals are the ones with the connections and the know how..:hugs:

[Pithy Cherub]

30. Your post was one of the most important ever on DU.

Just think if you had hesitated... Thanks for being brave! :yourock:

[blondeatlast]

36. Indeed--and I called for a confirmation. Next time, I'll keep my fingers

still! :hi:

Good on ya, libnnc!

[Pirate Smile]

42. Don't! Your instincts were right. Always confirm.

[libnnc]

43. exactly, always always always confirm

this was unique in that the media in western NC is really reeeeaaalllly slow so linking stuff is difficult. They keep frigging banking hours--no kidding.

[Pithy Cherub]

50. You displayed necessary courage too!

:hug: :hi:

[Catherine Vincent]

31. No, if it wasn't for you and your mom I don't think it would have

been mentioned on CNN or MSNBC.

[G_j]

32. yep big thanks to Mom too! n/t

[HeeBGBz]

57. Scoop of the week and Be The Media Award goes to...

libnnc

WTG!

[Eloriel]

34. SOMEbody on Keith's staff -- or perhaps Keith himself

reads DU. I'm positive.

[G_j]

37. if that is the case

then thanks ya'll! Not for being on "our side", but for reporting important stories that others won't. That is what is called good journalism.

[blondeatlast]

38. Someone at Ed Schultz is, too, I'm pretty sure.

But again, no hard info. I know one of his techs, the ones he has nicknames for, is a DailyKoser; he's said so on the air.

We must never think what we do here is a waste--the word is getting out there!

[Kat45]

45. Today Ed said that someone had emailed him about this story.

That's how he found out about it. He said they go through all their email, at least skim it, so it's not a waste to email stories/info to him.

[sharman]

69. DailyKos got the story from here

Credit to DailyKos, they have a lot of visibility and credibility, so not surprising that Olbermann et al. would pick up the story from them (and credited them).

But IMO, DailyKos should have been much louder in giving the credit back to DU.

In any event, a great team effort.

[babylonsister]

39. Absolutely! There's a daily KO thread on DU, and a

bunch of DUers sent him a tie. He's way well aware, and he often gets info from here, I'm certain!

[BeFree]

40. My take, or 2 cents

These are some of the same people who held Rudolph the Redneck Bomber in such high regard. Their twisted idea of Christ and his teachings can't help but lead one to the conclusion that the anti-Christ has a foothold in that church.

Surely anyone can see their actions are anti-Christian. Christ welcomed all people into his arms. The only ones thrown out of the church by him were the money changers.

I hope the good people of that church see the light and cast out that wanna-be devil from the pulpit.

[G_j]

44. and it just happens that Rudolph

was hiding out in WNC.

The "We Still Pray" (trying to inject prayer into HS football games etc.) movement which got national attention, started here also.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

47. i have often wondered about the "we still pray" stickers

i live in asheville and see these all the time, do you know the story behind them?

thanks!

[G_j]

48. "We Still Pray"

:puke: alert


We Still Pray
This site is designed to encourage Christians to continue to pray. We must no
longer be silent and allow law makers to act in ways that are contrary to the ...
www.westillpray.org/
======
'We Still Pray' aims to go national with rallies, prayer at ...
Gridlock struck Asheville, NC, when thousands gathered for a.
www.worthynews.com/news-features/we-still-pray-2.html

=======
"We Still Pray" Rally Blocks Highways into North Carolina City
In 1969, Arlo Guthrie stood before thousands of hippies attending the famed
Woodstock music festival to proudly announce that, due to them, the highways had ...
www.worthynews.com/news-features/we-still-pray.html

***(what really pissed me off about this, is that the police directed traffic to the high school for them)

[Yellow_Dog]

51. WE STILL PREY

When that first occurred with the rally at AC Reynolds HS, and it seemed every 5th car had a "we still pray" bumper sticker, I saw a few that said WE STILL PREY... oh how true!

[blondeatlast]

62. If only it had had a picture of Robertson/Falwell/Dobson on it.

Mind that I'm a Christian.

I'd buy one of those in a NY minute.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

52. ahh thanks for this

i didn't realise it was such a big deal.

oh and the http://www.westillpray.org/monitoring.asp page is crazy.

[Shallah Kali]

53. article | pastor wanted signatures saying members support his politics

There are so many threads on this already I didn't want to start a new one. Hope it is OK to stick this here!

Church removes members for political views, deacon says
http://www.biblicalrecorder.org/content/news/2005/5_6_2005/ne060505achurch.shtml


The controversy at the church reached a high point the Monday night, May 2, when the pastor invited all church members to a deacons' meeting. Lowe said at the beginning of the meeting, the pastor said anyone who didn't agree with his political views should leave.

Lowe said he, his wife, Thelma and seven others left. The pastor then called the church into conference and congregation voted to terminate the membership of those who left, Lowe said.

SNIP

The remaining members decided that if another church wrote for the letters of those who left, East Waynesville would reply saying they had left in bad standing. Members also discussed changing the church bylaws to state that all members had to sign a statement saying they supported the pastor's political views, Rash said.

SNIP

Lowe said he and his wife have been invited to other churches since the meeting. He expects they'll start attending somewhere else, but wouldn't rule out an effort to "retake" the church.

[G_j]

55. more details to

fill in the picture. This guy is a serious tyrant.
A real Coward too, where is he?

[HeeBGBz]

58. "Retake the church"

Coup d'etat.

Throw the fuggers out.

[knitter4democracy]

66. That is freakin' evil!

I used to be a Nazarene (very conservative evangelical Christian), and I can't even imagine what-all that guy's done to his flock. How could he get those votes? What has he done to his people?

You know, he'd going to be held accountable for that. Just wait: God cannot be mocked.

[im10ashus]

67. This unfreaking believable!

THIS is why they should tax the damn churches.

[Lars39]

68. What vindictive little shits this preacher and his cohorts are!

"The remaining members decided that if another church wrote for the letters of those who left, East Waynesville would reply saying they had left in bad standing."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
So it wasn't enough to run these people out of this church, they wanted to make it so that another southern baptist church wouldn't let them join either! :grr:

[immoderate]

54. Is Bush stupid enough to ignore this?

I know he is, but think a second. It's a slam dunk for any president to denounce this roundly. Any of the ones in recent memory would slap this bullshit down. It's a no lose position. Right?:shrug:

Will chimpy see it?

--IMM

[radfringe]

59. Will chimpy see it?

nope, by his own admission - he doesn't read the newspapers or pay attention to polls either

[blondeatlast]

61. Even if he does, it doesn't matter anymore. This is all about '06

and SCOTUS.

And the Heritage Foundation is behind the curtain...

[Shallah Kali]

64. He is a self-made mushroom. He likes being kept in the dark and fed

manure. It is easier for his people to predigest the news for him and make sure he doesn't find out that there are actual human beings out here who disagree with him. He probably honestly believes that it is only 'a few bad apples' out here who don't believe everything bush co. says.

[blondeatlast]

60. It's no longer about George Bush, it's about 2006 (he can't be re-elected)

It's about the Republicans gaining even more power.

Make no mistake--there's a man behind the curtain in this story; but ignore him.

Think about Cheney's reference to "the other faith" when referring to Democrats, and then take a look at this:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:HR00235:@@@N

That pastor was played by the Heritage Foundation, I'm willing to bet.

[Yellow_Dog]

63. Can you say JEB!