Keeping you and your family safe

[Horse with no Name]

Increasingly every day, we are hearing of drug-resistant superinfections in our environment. While these certainly have many causes, the question of how to keep your family safe is one that can be answered fairly easily.
Even though most people will not come into contact with these superinfections, this can help minimize the contact and spread of colds and flu as well.
While certainly your family would benefit greatly if you did all of the following, as many as you can do comfortably is an attainable goal.

1. Wash your hands with soap and water as frequently as possible.
2. Carry Purel (or alternate brand) in your pocket or purse. Use this anytime you have contact with a common surface—especially money.
3. Write checks for your small children’s school lunches and limit their exposure to hard currency.
4. Do not shake hands. While this is a time honored tradition, it certainly isn’t practical in today’s environment.
5. As a woman, I carry a roll of Clorox (or alternate brand) wipes in my purse and wipe off surfaces that I will come in contact with—such as a grocery cart. You can also carry a small can of Lysol (or alternate brand) to spray on the same surfaces as well as on public restroom surfaces.
6. Remove your shoes when entering your home. Encourage your guests to do the same.
7. Remove your street clothing as quickly as possible in your home and put them either in the laundry or into a common designated place until you take them to the dry cleaners. Environmental germs can attach to clothing and allow you to bring the “outside in”.
8. Change your sheets weekly—your pillowcases twice a week. If you are ill, change your sheets every other day and your pillow cases once a day to prevent reinfection and spreading. Spray your mattresses with Lysol (or alternate brand) when changing sheets.
9. Bathe or shower at night before going to bed.
10. Wash your hands before and after going to the bathroom. You ask, why before, the reason is that you don’t know what germs you have come into contact with before you go to the bathroom. You want to be sure that you do not infect your urinary tract with something you encountered.
11. Change your toothbrushes at least once a month.
12. Spray all surfaces with Lysol (or alternate brand).
13. Clean with Clorox (or alternate brand).
14. Wash your hands frequently with soap and water. This cannot be recommended enough and will be the single most important thing you can do.

[n2mark]

1. Thank Goodness

That goodness the supermarket where I shop have Purel at all the check out counters next the the credit card machines, there is also a machine at their main entrance where customers can pull out a wet wipe to clean the shopping cart handle. Bashas is a very customer friendly store, plus it is Democratic.

[Horse with no Name]

2. You must live in my next home

my place of birth and place that I really love,lol. I'll move there next year when my daughter graduates.
Phoenix. (Actually will live in Peoria).
:loveya:

[MsTryska]

3. I've got isses Purel and the other antibacterials

imo the overuse of antibiotics and antibacterials are what created these superbugs int he first place.


honestly - good old fashioned soap and water - and washing your hands properly and consistently will go much further than using the anti-bacterial, non-washing stuff. so i agree with #14!

[Horse with no Name]

4. It's a paradox

I believe they caused this too, but now that the superbugs are out there, we have to use what is available to combat the effects of overmedicating with antibiotics as well as the overuse of antibacterials and unfortunately when you can't wash your hands, this is what is available.:(

[havocmom]

5. Wash hands IMMEDIATELY upon returning home from being out in public

Having a hard time convincing my husband of this one but the people I know who do it all the time are not as likely to bring home bugs by touching things around the house after being out.

[shanti]

22. i have always done this

after i've been out shopping. if you just think for a minute about all of the things you've touched...*shudder*

[seabeyond]

6. i so disagree with this

and it is this talk and fear that has been taught to my oldest., by his well intentioned hypochondriac teachers that had me saying to him last nite. that is it. you are going to a psychiatrist

for real

the kid is washing hand raw

i had to buy a Vaseline to set on hands every nite to stop the bleeding. i lick my finger or anyone else, i have learned to run water on it, or keep finger out and away from all things. he catches everything in obsessive retarded unhealthy way

so as scary as these super germs are, that have been created from this paranoia ...........and fed to our children in such ridiculousness,

i say

no thank you,

i dont know what the answer is but being reasonable, but certainly not so damn fearful

[FSogol]

8. Me too

"i dont know what the answer is but being reasonable, but certainly not so damn fearful"

I agree. Its good for you to get germs. That's how your body learns to fight sickness.

[elehhhhna]

12. if I'm reading this right, he 's probably OCD, can't help, it,

and suffers terribly. He needs help now. ASAP.
It's not his fault.

[seabeyond]

17. it is too his fault, he totally created and fed it

i watched from first grade on. now, does he have a tendency to take the energies within and do these things in a self destructive mode. in many ways. i watch. we are working on it. would rather he sees he has the power, know what is going on within, than to bring it to drugs. but if need be we will do that. i see a cycle in him. tends to do these things way more, torwards end of school year. all the anxieties he has created and stuffed thru a year of kids and school brings him to this. get over this hump to summer, he mellows and figures out himself cause he works it in peace. energy not spinning him out of control. this is his world he will always live in. we all uniquely have our own. i prefer we figure out how to bring that energy to a stillness instead of needing a drug to bring to peace

his advantage, i so understand respect embrace allow..........he is able to do in a safety

we talk about it a lot.

he does for different reasons. i dont want the reasons covered up with drug

or maybe we will. as i said, last nite, i drew the line, of stepping over. who is to know

but thank you, i do hear what you are saying. he is add too. and odd in so many ways. also brilliant, wouldnt want to dull that lite of his

[elehhhhna]

26. Not advocating drugs, Sea,

But cognitive therapy (short-term, few sessions) and some relaxation techniques could help him. He sounds very smart and quirky--the most interesting kids are the hardest to raise--he may benefit from any technique that helps him control it.

[seabeyond]

27. very good yes

i have thought about this. this is what i was thinking when i said psychiatrist for you. he has a twenty something gay uncle living in new york city who is a psychiatrist. cant wait until son is old enough i can fly son out to him, to hang with uncle for a week, lol lol

but you are right. this summer i may look into seeing if i can find a good doctor to do just that. the kid loves talking and expressing, lol lol worth paying for it, and it would be an opportunity for a doctor to see a whole different world

thank you. appreciate it. so many go to drug. just dont believe

[MadHound]

7. Sorry friend, but what some of what you are recommending

Is actually contributing to the rise of superinfections. Americans have been lulled into a sense of false security by commercials and products claiming to be antibacterial, that kill 99.9% of all bacteria. The trouble is that while you may kill that 99.9%, the leftover 0.1% lives thrives and evolves into antibiotic resistant superinfections.

At first, this was limited to hospitals, where antibacterial cleansers first got their start. But now with the spread of these products into the home, superinfections are coming along for the ride.

Does this mean you should live in a pig sty, or leave off normal cleanliness habits? No, but you should limit your cleaning products to normal, old fashioned soap and water, and eliminate the products that are antibacterial. Otherwise you will unwittingly be leaving the door open for superinfections to come into your home.

I also think that you're being a bit over the top with your paranoia about not shaking hands or handling money. We have an immune system for a reason, and it is built up by simply actions such as these.

<http://www.colorado.edu/PWR/occasions/soap.html>
<http://www.vaccinationnews.com/DailyNews/November2001/WarBactLeaveDrugResistStrains.htm>
<http://www.nurseweek.com/cenw116a/cenw116a_print.html>

[seabeyond]

9. i think so too

and i have been a decade watching. also the way doctors give out the antibiotics, and the way the strength of them have compounded so, and in these little bodies. and wow, one son it takes down. i refuse. man i have been refusing antibiotics since my first was a baby

my oldest doesnt know all ways of preventing germs. if he saw that list he would go wild. i tell him, there are things he is/is not doing, that isnt removing the germ. and it is going into his body. i am allowing for two reasons

allow germ to get in so his body can learn, remember, be able to fight a germ. and if he saw this list, we would all die in this house with his nagging.

[Horse with no Name]

10. lol-okay-I am a nurse

Had a patient come in. She was a prostitute.
She was beaten, stabbed, and run over.
We had to put a catheter in her. Guess what we found rolled up in her vagina? A wad of money. This prostitute had active tuberculosis, several forms of venereal disease, and God knows what else.
Sorry-I don't think I am being paranoid about it. Do you want your kids touching that money and do you think she is the only prostitute that does that? What about the drug dealers?
I can only go by what I have seen.
Sorry I just don't shake hands-I'm not rude about it, I just say "Sorry I have just gotten over an illness and I don't want you to catch what I have".
The majority of people do NOT wash their hands after going to the bathroom and I would rather they not give me their germs.
I got in the habit of changing clothes when I came in from work because I brought RSV home to my kids from the hospital and now just do it generally.

[elehhhhna]

13. I WILL NEVER TOUCH MONEY AGAIN> EVER> barf.

[MadHound]

14. You are using an exceptional case to justify your behaviour

That's fine, if you feel you must do that. But meanwhile, you are ignoring all the evidence out there about how the use of antibacterials are contributing to the rise of superinfections(did you notice, I even included a link to the magazine Nurses Weekly). My mother was a nurse, my sister is a med tech, my father in law is a surgeon, and all of them agree, along with the vast majority of the medical profession, that the continued overuse of antibacterial products is going to kill us. Thanks for contributing to that problem:eyes:

And if the problem of dirty money, and dirty hands was such an epedimic as you claim, we would all be dead. Normal cleaning procedures are great and needed, wiping counters after food prep, washing ones' hands after going to the bathroom, etc. But you are taking these measure way too far, to the point of almost being obsessive complusive about it, and now you are passing that behaviour on to your children. I suggest that you calm down, stop being hysterical about this, read the literature, and lighten up. The problem of dirty money, dirty hands has been around forever, but gee, the human race keeps going on.

[Horse with no Name]

16. To start with

I'm a calm person. No hysteria. My kids are normal, and while our hospital is completely full with sickness, school attendance is down..we are all healthy.
I put these tips out there because I was asked to.
Should you also know that I have combined variable immunodeficiency and a simple little infection can kill me? I acquired this from a superinfection that was not treated appropriately and it basically "broke" my immune system.
I chose not to put that in there for a reason but maybe you should realize that every action of a person is not raging paranoia.
AS I DID STATE...that it is a paradox.
The act of doctors injudiciously handing out antibiotics for every cold when the children didn't need them because the parents demanded pink medicine every time the kids left the doctor certainly contributed to the rise of superinfection.
Hospitals have been dealing with superinfections for a very long time, and this was done by the measures I mentioned above--extensive cleaning with antibacterials, gowning, gloving, as little direct contact as possible, etc.
There was a time that superinfections were not in the public domain and isolated to carefully cleaned hospital units and at that time, if I posted this, then you could accuse me of contributing to some behavior that you feel justified. However, these superinfections are in the general population now and behaviors should be changed to compensate for that. Your "extensive medical knowledge" does not include reading the literature on what people can do to protect themselves in today's climate--not last year, not the year before, etc...
As far as your family's medical knowledge--they are welcome to use or abuse it in any way they wish--but the majority of people that I work with in major hospitals follow more precautions now than what they used to because they are seeing first hand what these bugs can do and they are aware that they are in the community now.
Because of insurance companies, we are not able to keep patients in healthcare facilities until they are no longer infectious and it is likely that we will start seeing VRE as well as MRSA in the general population--which is an enterococcus--which can be spread by not washing your hands after you go to the bathroom.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5140a3.htm
>>>>>>snip
The patient has been discharged from the hospital and is responding to antimicrobial treatment. The patient is receiving home-health care. PDH and CDC are assisting health-care providers investigating this case of VRSA. The goals of this investigation include assessment of infection-control practices in the hospital and home setting and the possibility of transmission of the organism to other patients, health-care providers, and family or social contacts. Previous investigations of VRSA and vancomycin-intermediate S. aureus in the home setting demonstrated no transmission among family or home health-care contacts (5,6).
>>>>>snip
The public health response to this VRSA occurrence is ongoing. Using proper infection-control practices and good antimicrobial agent management will help limit the emergence and spread of antimicrobial-resistant microorganisms, including VRSA. CDC recommends contact precautions when caring for patients with these infections, including placing the patient in a private room, wearing gloves and a gown during patient contact, washing hands after contact with the patient and infectious body tissues or fluids, and not sharing patient-care items with other patients. CDC guidelines for preventing spread of VRSA are available at http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/hip/10_20.pdf.

[MadHound]

23. I made no mention of the overuse of antibiotics,

However, as you rightly point out, that is part of the problem leading to the rise of superinfections.

It is your continued insistence, flying in the face of medical research, that people continue to use and abuse antibacterial soaps, cleaners etc. I find this dissemination of erroneous information reprehensible, especially coming from a person in the medical field.

As virtually all of the medical literature states, the rise of superinfections in hospitals was greatly aided by the staff's use of antibacterial cleaning agents. Sure, at first they were great, killing the fabled 99.9% of all bacteria. However that 0.1% that survived were able to thrive and survive, being resistant to normal means of killing them, and evolved into the superinfections that we see today in hospitals. Now that corporate America has sold the public on antibacterial agents in normal household products, thus spreading the threat from the hospital to the home.

From the article in Nurses' Weekly, that I linked to earlier:
"Antibacterial agents are an additional cause of bacterial resistance. Antibacterials can be found in every home, and, like antibiotics, they kill off susceptible bacteria, leaving only the resistant “super bugs” alive. These agents have been added to more than 700 household products including mattresses, pillows, sheets, slippers, towels, kitchen tools, cutting boards, toys, soaps, toothpaste, and cleansers. Antibacterials come in two forms, short-acting forms used as surface cleansers (alcohol, chlorine) and longer-lasting forms (triclosan, benzalkonium chloride) bonded/impregnated into the household products. The short-acting agents, because of their rapid killing effect, are not thought to cause bacterial resistance.1 However, studies suggest that longer-lasting antibacterial agents such as triclosan are capable of selecting for resistant bacteria.1 A few laboratory-based studies have suggested a possible link between the emergence of community-acquired methicillin-resistance S. aureus (cMRSA) and the use of antibacterial products.1"

Now, with your exceptional circumstances of a compromised immune system(which you hadn't mentioned until now), I understand why these procedures you mention are applicable to you. I also understand why hospitals, having unleashed the genie through their extensive use of antibacterial agents earlier, feel the need to take the steps they are taking now. But to urge the populace at large to start using antibacterials is irresponsible of you and only contributes to the problem of superinfections in the general population. This is a medical fact, and one that shouldn't be ignored lightly.

With your compromised immune system, what you are suggesting is an appropriate action for YOU to take. However to extrapolate it to being the correct procedure for the population at large is absolutely wrong. The vast majority of the population have normal immune systems, and urging them to increase their use of antibacterial agents flies in the face of medical science, increases the spread of superinfections, and is a completely, utter irresponsible action for you to take. And that you are a medical professional yourself, and are doing this only makes matters worse.

If you wish to, in your unique circumstances, to follow these procedures you recommend, fine, they work for you in YOUR situation. But don't recommend them to the public at large. It spreads hysteria and only increases the problem of superinfections in the home.

[Horse with no Name]

34. One of the problems I believe

Is that you do not know the statistics that are equated with these superbugs. It has risen to epidemic proportions. Our government does not want you to know, yet this is big news in the UK as well as Canada, and they are concerned because of the public health as well as the cost of healthcare. In our country, our government does not care whether we live or die, as long as the bottom line of the corporate insurance companies is maintained.
Our government does not want you to know that the direct cause of this potentially devastating epidemic has to do with the big insurance companies not allowing these patients to stay in the hospital until the bug is eradicated. All of the sudden, you believe the media's lack of coverage and our governments lack of disclosure as being gospel?
The hospitals continually make cuts in staffing because of decreased insurance and Medicare reimbursement--especially in housekeeping. Hospitals are not as clean today as they were 10 years ago. They don't even change the sheets every day as they used to. Most hospitals make nurses go through programs to learn to conserve linens and have changed policy that you DO NOT change the sheets every day (unless something is spilled).
They don't assure that the patients are bathed daily--it takes too much staff time.
In the old days, these were basic infection control precautions.
You kept the patient's environment clean with soap and water.
And it worked, but it is expensive in manpower and they don't have the money, so they take shortcuts.
Employees don't have time to wash your hands? You use the gel or foam provided. I have never agreed with that but I don't make the rules.
There should never be foam or gel put in a bathroom when there is soap and water available, yet there is.
There is NO ARGUMENT that the abuse of these antibacterials as well as antibiotics are responsible for this. But now the problem is that the same things that caused the problems are the only things that can protect you from what they caused.
The patients that have these superbugs are not segregated. They are in the general patient population, which means that at some point of a hospitalization that almost every patient, visitor and employee will come in contact with these germs.
I clean my house thoroughly once a week. I straighten and spot clean in the interim without going to extreme measures. If we are outside playing or working, then obviously I am not going to Lysol the house down, but when I am out in significant crowds, I am going to be a little more vigilant.
I take GREAT exception that you come in here telling me that I am irresponsible, when in fact I am just putting the information out there--it's up to anyone--including yourself--whether you decide to partake of it. I don't insult your knowledge and profession. You found one VERY general article in a nursing magazine and suddenly you are an expert. That is very offensive.
Nostamj just passed from of these superbugs he came in contact with. They are out there--you can believe anything you want that they aren't, but they are.

Community MRSA is re-emergence of 1950s pandemic, study suggests
01 Apr 2005
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=22106
>>>snip
An early type of antibiotic-resistant bacteria that caused a global epidemic of infections in the 1950s has re-emerged as one of the community-acquired MRSA ‘superbugs', according to a study published in this weeks issue of The Lancet.

This “re-equipping and re-emergence” of a clone that caused a pandemic 40-50 years ago could mean that community acquired MRSA will spread faster and be more widespread than previously expected, warns an international team of researchers who have been studying the bacteria

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=1067
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2572841.stm
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1446425,00.html

[MadHound]

41. Well first off I find it encouraging that you've finally come around

To admitting that yes indeed, antibacterials are part of the problem. However, I still find it amazing that you think the solution to this problem is more of the same, use of antibacterials. Don't you get it? All you are doing is continuing the process of making more and more anti-biotic superinfections:banghead:

Part of the solution is old fashioned cleaning, heat, steam, strong soaps, etc. Perhaps they don't do this in the hospital where you work, however they do just this at the hospitals in this area, and guess what, there haven't been any outbreaks of superinfections in any of the four hospitals in this city. One can apply these same principals to ones own home. I'm not advocating for not cleaning, simply don't use anti-bacterials. For you to advocate such usage is irresponsible, for you are advocating the development of super infections.

It also sounds like your hospital is quite lax in its cleaning, something that is quite uncommon in all of the hospitals that I'm familiar with. Perhaps this is a localized phenomenon, one that you should make more widely know to people on your accredidation board, or your state board of health. I guarantee you that if a hospital was knowingly performing such procedures in a hospital in my state, they would be fined and shut down in a heartbeat.

And I find it laughable how you dismiss a nationwide magazine of note in the nursing profession, and that you are calling a sourced, notated article "general" I also note that you haven't mentioned(possibly because you haven't read) the other two links I've provided you. If you would check, I think you would find that these are both respected authors and publications.

And you make take GREAT EXCEPTION, and be as offended as you want, but I'm still going to call BS when you are advocating that people contribute to the problem of super bugs by increasing their usage of antibacterial agents. You don't like that, TS, it's the truth. Your stand, while correct for you in your exceptional circumstances, is a danger to our society's health, and I do find it irresponsible and reprehensible that as a member of the medical proffession you are advocating such an outrageous, long discounted notion. If you are offended by my position, tell you what. Go to your local MD MPH, and present him or her with your "solution". Then come back here and PM me to tell me you got out of the office without being laughed out, or worse yet, getting your license yanked. I suspect that I won't be getting that mail.

I'm sorry that you're finding my comments harsh, but I just find it amazing that a person who is in the medical proffession is taking the stand that you are, and flying in the face of virtually the entire medical communities' findings and recommendations.

[Horse with no Name]

45. Okay

I've stated I'm a nurse.
What exactly is your profession?


On edit:
Would also be curious as to what city you are in so that I could debunk your theory of no superinfections. Maybe your practitioners ignore it or are so stupid they can't diagnose it?
Maybe thats why the epidemic?

[MadHound]

50. LOL friend, your attacks are now just going to show

How weak your position is. Tell you what, why don't you provide some links that back your position, you know, sources that state that the general use of antibacterials in the home is actually a good thing.

I won't disclose my city, I guard such personal information for a number of reasons. Let's just say that it is the city with the highest number of hospital beds per capita in the US.

I work in the radiopharmaceutical manufacturing business, at a research reactor. And you want to talk about clean, then let's talk about clean rooms shall we?

Now then, back to those sources of yours. . .

[Horse with no Name]

53. To start with

you are the one being a dick. You are the only one who has attacked up to this point.
With that being said--you aren't in the medical field so you have no "real" knowledge of what you speak.
If you only have 4 hospitals in your town, then I am not impressed with your anecdotal claims that your hospital has "no super infections" (which I do not believe either--source it or shut up). The city that I practice in has about 30 hospitals and has several nationally known and regarded medical centers--hardly anything to alert the media over, yet I am not claiming that they are the cleanest hospitals either nor am I denying that they couldn't be better.
I want to address another of your idiotic comments. I hardly think the state board would revoke my license for advocating caution and cleanliness. But it sounded good huh?
I've given you sources of the increased epidemic of super infections in our society. I've documented that antibacterials are what is used.
You have taken my point and hijacked the topic.
My point was how to avoid getting super infections in your home.
Much of the literature is over 2 years old--and 2 years ago we didn't have an epidemic of super infection in the communities so what we would do in light of that is different than what we would do in the absence of that information.

source on preventing staph
http://www.health.state.mn.us/divs/idepc/diseases/staph/prevention.html
source on hand washing and using antibacterials, bleaches and cleaning
http://www.pvhs.org/quality_reports/patient_safety_1104.pdf
source hand washing--dirtiest surfaces you will come in contact with
http://www.nclnet.org/publications/cleanhands.pdf

[conflictgirl]

30. I still don't agree with this

If I worked in a hospital, maybe I would be more germ-conscious than I am now simply by virtue of the higher likelihood of coming in contact with particularly powerful germs. I know very well what kind of germs are in the community. I'm actually a bit of a germaphobe because if anything I know too much about the germs that are out there. Nonetheless, I take normal precautions and try not to worry about the rest. I do carry Purell in case I have to change my 2 year old's diaper while we're out or to clean our hands before we eat when there's no sink nearby. We always wash our hands with NON-antibacterial soap before we eat. I am careful in what types of meat I buy and how I prepare it.

I also know that some government agencies (and product manufacturers) recommend that we all need to use antibacterial everything to respond to the existence of these new superbugs, I just don't agree. Bacteria is supposed to be in our environment; sometimes it will make us sick but mostly it will not. But the point of using everything antibacterial shouldn't be to keep you from getting sick - you're SUPPOSED TO get sick sometimes. There's a difference between complete lack of attendance to common-sense hygiene and trying to eliminate bacteria in your environment. It's simply not possible to ever avoid being sick, and everyone's immune system needs regular experience fighting off ordinary bugs.

I just don't agree that the right way to deal with the existence of these superbugs is heavy use of antibacterial products. Unless you have stats proving otherwise, as far as I know the existence of superbugs hasn't declined at all once since everything from hand soap to high chairs have been made with antibacterial chemicals like Triclosan. If my knowledge is correct, infections from the "superbugs" actually are continuing to increase with widespread antibacterial use. That's because bacteria will never go away, we are SUPPOSED TO co-exist with them. It's good that antibiotics exist for very severe bacterial infections. But we can't keep breeding ever more powerful bacteria and hoping to invent new antibiotics that will be strong enough to defeat the bacteria. It's a game we will lose.

[SiouxJ]

49. Doesn't seem like a particularly smart place for

a prostitute to hide her money.

I'm just sayin' :shrug:

I DO wash my hands after handling money. Always. Thank you for reinforcing that habit.

[Fifth of Five]

35. Alcohol v. triclosan

Didn't follow your links (sorry) but I have a quick question.

Is there a difference between using the antibiotic (triclosan, etc) products and the alcohol-based products?

Are they both responsible for the development of the so-called super-bugs?

Thanks

[MadHound]

42. Triclosan is more of the problem

Alcohol doesn't contribute to the superbug problem nearly as much as triclosans and other longer lasting agents. Still despite that, you can encourage development of a super bug using short acting agents such as alcohol, it is just a much rarer phenomenon.

[Fifth of Five]

43. Thanks n/t

[Horse with no Name]

44. Alcohol is more effective

http://www.portnet.k12.ny.us/subjects/ICE/lyice/Intro.html

Hand sanitizers are employed extensively in hospitals and other health care settings for topical use. They are essential in maintaining and helping prevent hospital infections. Increasing concerns over the potential for microbial contamination and infection risks in the food and general consumer markets have also led to increased use of sanitizers. Various studies have shown that compliance with effective handwashing and hand sanitation regimens can break this cycle. A wide range of biocides (chemical agents that inactivate microorganisms) are found in these products. However, which biocide is most effective is still yet to be determined. A study of hospital healthcare workers, compared an alcoholic solution with standard hygienic handwashing procedure and found that the average number of colony forming units recovered after the handwashing procedure showed a statistically significant difference in favor of the alcoholic solution (Zaragoza, 1999). In another study, nonantimicrobial lotion soap, antimicrobial soap, and alcohol gel sanitizer were compared. This study found that for hospital healthcare workers the combination of alcohol sanitizers with antimicrobial or a plain soap was most effective for both microorganism reduction and skin irritation (Paulson, 1999). Another study researched the effect of 4% chlorhexidine gluconate (Hibiclens) and 1% Triclosan (Novaderm) on hand bacteria of nursing and medical personnel. Novaderm reduced the amount of methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA) hand bacteria, but not gram-negative bacteria, and Hibiclens reduces the amount of gram-negative bacteria, but not MRSA (Faoagali, 1999). Review of the literature found no research regarding the effect of hand sanitizers and hand bacterial counts on medical and custodial personnel in a school setting. This research project will determine the effects of alcohol sanitizer, triclosan wash and nonantimicrobial wash on bacterial counts on the hands of high school medical and custodial staff.

[Robroy]

11. Glass Houses.

I'm old-fashioned I guess. Life is full of risks. Common sense trumps eccentricity and paranoia, imho.

[Javaman]

15. Here, here...

[CrispyQ]

21. Geroge Carlin once said

his solution to the super germ problem was to build up his immune system & he was going to start by not washing his hands after going to the bathroom. I LOL at that!

Yes, common sense should prevail. For all the anti-bacterial gels out there, which I refuse to use, I rarely see people wash their hands before eating. Another really good habit to adopt is to never touch your mouth or nose until you have washed your hands. A good diet & moderate exercise wouldn't hurt either.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

32. He also said he and his childhood friends...

...used to swim in the Hudson River off Manhattan (i.e. RAW SEWAGE)

"Why don't I ever get sick? Because I swam in RAW SEWAGE"

Et cetera.

[ProfessorGAC]

47. Another Thing

Most handsoaps, without triclosan, carry a pH of about 8. Bacteria do woefully in system above pH 5. There are a few that thrive in high pH regimes, but no pathogens, of which i'm aware.

Also, the use of copious water along with the soap (or detergent, which isn't the same thing), will reduce the surface tension of the skin so that bacteria have difficulty maintain adhesion.

So, what you don't wash off, you will kill with the pH of the hand cleaner.

At the same time, remember that triclosan is such a weak biocide that it doesn't impact the biomass in the sewage treatment systems. So, i really kind of doubt that we can blame this for the superbugs. I think it has more to do with active antibiotics than with topical germ killers.
The Professor

[aeolian]

18. Wohoo! Another reason to fear! MICROBES!! Sounds terrifying

You know, obsession with cleanlieness and sterility is what bred the "super-bugs" in the first place.

[lectrobyte]

19. This sounds like a con to sell a lot of Purel and Clorox and Lysol.

It seems way overkill, and as someone pointed out, more likely to result in more resistent bacteria etc.

What's the point of spraying something into your mattress once a week? If there are germs in there, they got there from you, right?

I never understood the whole medical thing either, I mean, a lot of my friends that get colds go and get antibiotics from their doctor. Aren't colds a virus? Do antibiotics do anything for a virus?

[Horse with no Name]

20. well considering I have no stock in any of the above

it's a mute point.
But to answer your question--viruses don't respond to antibiotics.
If you take antibiotics you get better in 5-10 days and if you don't take antibiotics, you get better in 5-10 days.:)

[aeolian]

28. "Moot" point. Not "mute." Moot. (n/t)

[seabeyond]

29. i will remember that

thanks for clearing that up. if i ever use moot point i will know how to say and spell

[Logansquare]

24. OK, some of this is good advice, and some of it is not

Number 7 seems possible OCD. Our bodies are naturally full of bacteria; we couldn't live without them to help us process our food.

The scary-when-magnified mites that eat our shed skin and dead bacteria sometimes horrify us when we find out about them--but life would be a lot worse without them.

Washing hands frequently (like, after using the bathroom, changing diapers, cleaning out the litter box, and before meals) is sensible, but washing constantly provides no advantage except to chap one's hands.

Our immune systems need to hit a few balls in practice before the big game; that's why some low-level exposure to germs and allergens is natural and, in the long run, beneficial. I recently read some research that children who were bathed more than once a day had higher levels of allergies and chemical sensitivities. My mother said that rolling around in the yard playing with the dog wouldn't kill me, and she was right.

[porphyrian]

25. Actually, it's using the level of antibacterial agents you suggest...

...that have caused the problem in the first place. Doing as you suggest will only make the problem worse in the long run. Just use soap and water, folks, and stop buying and using antibacterial shit.

[conflictgirl]

31. Also, if you want to keep your kids from getting sick...

Making them a lunch at home (not buying Lunchables :P) rather than having them get school lunch would do so much more to keep them safe. Assuming the average public school lunch, your kids are much more at risk from eating the food than from handling the currency to pay for the food.

Do some research about the quality of the food in the school lunch programs. I'm not even saying this to exaggerate how bad the school food is, for the purpose of making some jokes. I've done the research and it strongly convinced me that my kids would NOT get school lunch. If it's the only way a child gets a meal, as in through the free program, then it's definitely better than nothing, but since you mentioned paying for school lunch, I would guess you're in a position to make a choice (as I am).

edited to clarify something

[Horse with no Name]

40. Good point

I live in a fairly poor area and everything in our school cafeteria is fried and doused in grease.
My daughter generally takes her lunch for that reason.

[Patiod]

33. Horse - as an RN, wouldn't you also agree

that some additional ways to keep away from super-bugs:

1) To keep any wounds or breaks in the skin obsessively clean

2) to stay out of the hospital if possible

3) if forced to go to a hospital, to try to get to one with relatively low rates of VRE and MRSA

3) to rely on people like you (MDs, RNs, techs, all hosp employees) to be OCD. Personally, I'm delighted to hear you being accused of being somewhat OCD. Clinicians have to be obsessed about this stuff if the infection rates are going to have to go down.

Almost lost a friend to necrotizing fasciitis after a "routine" hip operation. Nasty stuff.

[Horse with no Name]

38. Thanks

after being flamed all afternoon for just trying to make some more aware of the problem out there--I almost feel that anyone gets what they deserve.
I agree with what you say--however I would make a couple of suggestions.
If you have an open cut or wound--make sure it is covered if you are going out around any "unfamiliar" germs.
Best thing for healing is to be open and that is highly recommended, but you also don't want it to get infected.
Chances are you won't be able to find the statistics on the VRE and MRSA, but try to get a private room and don't feel bad about insisting that your healthcare workers wash their hands before they examine you and don't feel bad about expecting your room to be kept clean. :)

[cheezus]

36. 15. Exercise on a regular basis

keeps your immune system strong

[SmokingJacket]

37. Getting enough sleep and avoiding excessive stress

will go a long way toward keeping your immune system strong.

I'm not obsessive enough to kill every germ in my house. But I do try to not over-stress my body so that my immune system can battle stuff off.

[noonwitch]

39. Keep yourself, your kids, your house clean and take vitamins/eat right

Those are what I think are the best ways to fight disease without antibiotics.

Since I started taking vitamins, I have not had a cold, and I smoke, so that's saying something.

I did get that nasty stomach flu a couple of weeks ago. I caught it from my sister, and I wasn't washing my hands as much as usual, and I shared a pop with her, drinking from the same bottle. But that wasn't an illness that needed any treatment other than lots of water and rest.

[VOX]

46. Live like Howard Hughes for mere pennies a day!

I go along with hand-washing after using the restroom, etc., but unless one's immune system is **severely** compromised, much of this seems excessive.

Handling money, putting our street clothes in a closet for another wearing, walking through the house in shoes, shaking hands and hugging/kissing in greeting -- these are all commonplace, daily activities that simply must occur. Frankly, I wouldn't want to live in a world where touching was verboten.

[SiouxJ]

48. Hello Howard Hughes

I thought I was bad.

I agree that washing your hands a lot is a good idea. I do, and I haven't had a cold in years. I also wipe down hotel rooms with disinfectant wipes when I'm going to be staying there for more than one night; just the doorknobs, phones, light switches and especially the TV remote. I used to get a cold almost every time I would travel and I haven't gotten one since I stared doing this.

I also will not touch the salt shaker in a restaurant or the door handle in a public restroom.

Beyond that, I'm not going to go to the extremes you mention with regard to washing clothes and showering often as I live in a state that has little water to go around. I also don't think it's good to be spraying all that crap (Lysol) around in the air I breathe, so I won't be doing that. The long term exposure to those chemicals can be worse for you than the germs. You have to figure out the simple things you can do, without becoming a paranoid nut like Howard.

[ProfessorGAC]

51. Good Call Sioux

The OP is guilty of hyperbole here. What we now are willing to call epidemic or pandemic is VERY different than what it was centuries back.

The superbugs have everyone freaking out, and if they're that "super" no amount of handwashing and bathing is going to save anyone.

People are already too willing to waste water on washing and bathing when they don't need to be any cleaner. Water is precious and expensive and to be wasteful in the hopes of warding out theoretically possible illnesses is silly.

I wonder if i wouldn't have contracted MS if i had washed my hands a million times a day!
The Professor

[SiouxJ]

52. If only it were as simple as that huh?

The only reason I go a little overboard on the hand washing and hotel cleansing is because of my MS. Coming down with a cold can trigger a flare, so I can't take any chances. I'm not concerned about getting anything but a simple cold. If it weren't for that, I'd live dangerously and indulge in the salt shaker at my favorite restaurant ;-) .

And as far as the daily dirt and who knows what, that gets brought into my house, well that's a losing battle with my two dogs around, so I just don't worry about it. Anyone who has dogs or cats has learned to live with a certain amount of tracked in muck :-) .