Walmart-Lovers are making gas prices higher.

[SoCalDem]

It's ironic really, they drive their SUVs, one-person per vehicle, off to WallyLand to buy MORE plastic crap, because half a houseful just isn't enough. Goodness knows, the kids can never have too many pairs of $5.00 jeans and $2.00 plastic flipflops. China deserves to enter the modern era, but Walmartians and others like them have catapulted China, full grown and thirsty for oil, to a position equal to ours, except that THEY have most of OUR money....and what they don't have of it, we OWE them..

China used to be a country that used very little oil or resources, and of course now, they have arrived, and since there are MORE of them than of us, and we are BROKE, and in debt to them, color us Trouble-icious Teal .

Most of the oil that China is buying now (and India), is oil that WE used to have "first-dibs" on. The odd thing, is that American and western companies either refine, transport or indirectly OWN most of the oil in the "world market", so we are in a sense being sold down the river once again, by our own...and the benefit goes to the largest COMMUNIST country on earth. The same people who watch their stocks like teenage boys looking for internet porn, usually rail at the very thought of communism, but if it fattens their portfolios, and enables them to buy cheap plastic stuff for their kids, they couldn't care less about the rest of us..or the world.. They HAVE theirs..

So when you pay $2.50 plus at the pump, take a moment to think about WHY you are paying so much, and who really benefits:(

[cynatnite]

1. What's your source for this statement?

It just seems to be a huge leap to blame the gas prices on people who go to Walmart and buy things YOU don't think they should be buying.

[Wilms]

20. Hardly a huge leap.

Do the math.

Most of the energy is involved with putting the product on a Wal-Mart Shelf. A trip in a SUV is just icing on the cake.

[Spider Jerusalem]

2. Actually, it's Americans in general who've done more than anyone else..

to increase oil prices. The United States has about 4% of the world's population and uses about 25% of the world's petroleum. Exactly how long did you think that could continue? Indefinitely? The massively wasteful "American way of life" has most likely hastened the peaking of oil production by a decade or more (and peaking of production is what's happening now; that's what it means when OPEC says "we can't pump any more than we are").

[cynatnite]

5. I do agree with that, but

to say it's because people go to Walmart is just ludicrous. It's more than driving to a store that some people don't care for. Look at the trucking industry, delivery services and commuting. It's the way our lives have been built around transportation. That is what has increased our dependence.

[Spider Jerusalem]

6. That was my point.

That Wal-Mart is just a symptom of the greater disease.

And it's not "transportation", per se...it's the automobile. If this country had a robust passenger and freight rail network, and a serious commitment to mass rail-transit infrastructure linking major cities and suburbs, then we'd be in much better shape.

[cynatnite]

8. Maybe...I don't know

Looking at the history of the transportation system I don't see it coming about. We'd have to go back and change a good hundred years of thinking and you know how hard that is to do.

Attempting to change it now would require much more incentive and willingness by people to make a 'sacrifice'. I honestly don't see that happening.

Having the automobile of your choice is now identitified with a sense of independence. It's a whole mentality now and a lot of americans are not willing to let go of that...even the democrat americans.

I don't agree that Walmart is a symptom of anything. If you want a symptom, look at the gas guzzling tanks on the roads, today. It's not about where a person goes or what they buy. Look at the automobile makers. Look at their unwillingness to make a real change in what they manufacture.

Your analagy just doesn't apply.

[Spider Jerusalem]

10. The analogy: Wasteful consumption.

Too many people in this country think they have a god-given right to keep consuming as much as they want, and to spend less, relatively, than anyone else on the planet while doing it.

[benevolent dictator]

12. mass transit and having your own car aren't mutually exclusive

if there were mass transit here that i could take to work and school, i totally would. but i would still want a car, too (that i just wouldn't drive as much). why can't we have both? oh yeah, spraaaawwlllll....

anyway, part of the problem with the automakers is it's like catch 22. people are still buying the gas guzzlers, so they keep making them because that's what's selling. when they make smaller more fuel efficient cars... that then don't sell because the technology/materials that make them more fuel efficient are more expensive... well... what are they going to make?

ford just came out with a hybrid explorer that gets 36 in the city and 31 on the highway, which is awesome for an suv. hell, it's better than my little car gets. you can't just blame the car companies, you have to blame the consumers, too. (not that i'm absolving the automakers from all responsibility, i'm just saying it's not 100% their fault.)

[cynatnite]

16. I wish I had access to mass transit

I would take complete advantage of it. I live in a rural area and it would be much cheaper. As it is, I rarely take my care out and when I do I take care as much as possible at one time. I didn't do that until two weeks ago when the prices started going back up.

We flat out can't afford these prices.

I always thought the automakers didn't do enough to promote hybrids or make them. I'm not putting all the blame on the automakers. I think there's plenty to go around.

I do think that a lot of people equate having a vehicle with their independence. They don't have to rely on anyone else, and that includes the transit system. Given how much people rely on their cars for business and pleasure it makes sense.

It's a consumer driven society and you're looking at unwiring the thinking of the past several decades. If the price of gas continues to rise and doesn't go back down, then I think you'll see the beginnings of some change throughout the country when it comes to transportation.

[Dave Reynolds]

3. Military consumption of fuel

is not coming from the strategic reserve, it is coming from the oil that WE used to have "first-dibs" on.

I think the issue is a little more complex than Wal-Mart.

[tsuki]

4. I always like to point out that the GOP is outsourcing our jobs to

India, an ally of Iran, and turning over our manufacturing base to China, an ally of Iran.

[Mick Knox]

7. This makes no sense

Chinese have as much right to purchase it and have a livlihood as anyone else.

[SoCalDem]

13. I didn't say they DIDN'T.. Just that we must realize that OUR

greed for plastic FUELS their need to make the plastic,and the desire for companies that USED to make stuff here, and employ US workers, are now THERE using their cheap labor to send plastic back to us..

It's ALL CONNECTED :)

[riverwalker]

9. blue plastic roses

Wal-mart and K-mart always have a display for Memorial Day of plastic flowers and styrofoam crosses to place on gravesites. Now, there has never been a blue rose in nature, ever. It's one of those things horticulturists have not been able to do. Nevertheless, on Memorial Day there are hideous, grotesque blue plastic roses for sale, glued to styrofoam. We even use surreal fake plastic from China to honor our dead, when a simple bouquet of real daisies would have more meaning.
Anyway, it's always been symbolic to me of exactly what you are saying.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

11. Blue Girl Rose, a real beauty, and quite blue, but, Wally's creations

are nothing like it.

[Iterate]

14. Some good background here

on the Walmart-China Connection and Walmart in general. You can watch the whole thing online. Excellent, as usual from Frontline. I can't recommend it more strongly. Well worth anyone's time.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/walmart/

I think, I hope, what you are suggesting SoCalDem is that Walmart power will corrupt China as much as it has corrupted the US, and that you're not complaining about gas prices or loss of US status. There is a kind of 'follow the money' logic in what you say.

Creating a healthy middle class in China is a peaceful path to democracy there, somewhat like the EU expansion. And it's a bigger issue than Walmart. There are more VW's built in China than in Germany.

The problem with this global China trade strategy is the destruction of the middle class in the counties that engage in it. It's one of the reasons for high unemployment in Germany and a resultant (slight) rightward shift in the politics. And I don't see much thought anywhere about how wealth is increased in China and India without disastrous suburbanization and environmental damage.

[SoCalDem]

15. Eventually it will all implode..it always does..

Mexico used to be the "darling", but their bordertown manufacturinf shanties have not raised the standards of living that much, and lots of the "first waves" of outsourcers left mexico as soon as the people working in that squalor started making demands..

Sadly, the world has an abundance of poor people and the developed countries have an abundance of under-employed people who can only afford cheap stuff..

Walmart is a metaphor... and here they are running new ads showing how Walmart BENEFITS the small town merchants in a fictional town..It makes me want to :puke:

[Iterate]

18. That 'benefits' claim has been shot down so many times

it's probably not possible to count. I mean think about it, you run xyz-truth-non-profit.org, you see that claim and pour youself into investigating it, weeks worth of number crunching, give up your real life for a while, come up with a solid report stating otherwise, and BigWally just steps up the ad campaign with no nod to the truth. Nope, nobody ever beats 'em with truth.

I know personally of five building contractors who were put out of business by the construction of one WM store alone. And that's before the doors opened. It's typical. Not many people ever win with local action.

But yes, the bigger issue. I remember at one point US insurance companies were having a fit over Mexican workers literally laboring knee-deep in toxic waste. No other regulation in force. I think I'll write a friend and find out what happened with that plant.

So, how do we beat Walmart?

[SoCalDem]

19. The only way we can :beat" them is to just tell everyone we know

about how muich that cheap stuff really costs.. Frankly, I am more than willing to wait for a sale at Robinsons-May and get some quality stuff at prices even cheaper than Walmart.. You just cannot impulse buy.. Every few months they have fantastic sales with coupons.. For instance:


A very nice leather purse.. original price $100.00 marked down 50%, On SALE for 40% off lowest marked price..and I had a 25% additional off all purchases on that one day..I paid $22.50 for a $100 leather purse.. It may not have been made in the US, but it was NOT made in China..

Some of their end of season clothing sales are even better.. I paid $4 for a Calvin Klein blouse because the sale was 75% off lowest mark down price..

So people can go to WallyWorld and pay $10 or 15 for a blouse that fits like crap, fades, and falls apart in a few months, but I'll wait for the good sales at decent department stores :)

[Iterate]

21. I agree, starve WM and live better too

Yes, probably a better option than the prison time often associated with certain types of activism.

I agree completely, and I'm surprised at how little I spend on 'things'. Own less, buy quality, take care of it.

Another advantage, I think I treasure the things that I do own much more. I like them, I appreciate the craftsmanship and design, enjoy the aesthetics.

No impulse buys, fewer stupid purchases I later regret. Less 'landfill guilt' when it's worn out. Less time wasted wandering around those awful places. (more time for DU)

When it is time to buy something, it's more of a pleasure rather than a chore. I spend some time, look around only if I feel like it, learn about how things are made, and if I haven't bought anything six months from now, I probably didn't need it to begin with.

And come to think of it, I spend no time feeling bad about not being able to afford something. That alone is worth a fortune.

[OneBlueSky]

17. am I the only person who has never set foot in a Walmart store? . . .

just curious . . .

on edit: and yes, there is one nearby . . .

[Iterate]

22. Yup...I've checked around

and sure enough, I think you might be the only one. Don't tell anyone though, because I don't think WM would take too kindly to it. And don't think you can get away with a quick peek -they have plenty of cameras in the ceiling. Stay clean and be proud.

[benevolent dictator]

25. never bought anything but...

i've been in them, but mostly just to put slips of paper with facts about walmart in the merchendise.

[anarchy1999]

23. Quite the magnificent rant! Kudos to you SoCalDem!

It's late, it's early, I've got to get some sleep. You helped.

[Wilms]

24. .

[Wilms]

26. .