Neocon talking point (question) on Sgrena...how did she get to airport

[karlrschneider]

after the ambush? I was arguing with some people elsewhere and they are asking this question. I don't know the answer. Their "point" of course is "if 'we' were trying to kill her, how and why was she allowed to fly out to Italy"...

Do we really even know enough to figure this out? I have read she was treated at a Baghdad hospital, which obviously makes sense if she was alive after the attack...it's all so damn confabulating.

[autorank]

1. Well aren't they a bunch of dumb fucks!

If we did try to kill her and botched it, it would just confirm that we were trying to kill her if we actually killed her before she got to the airport. We are "through the looking glass" and it's getting stranger every day. I expect * to speak in tongues and do a happy dance at his next press conference; it will be called "a vary private moment with a spiritual man." Good Lard, these people are f'ing crazy.

[Zenlitened]

2. I realize freepiots aren't the brightest bulbs on the ol' Jumbotron...

... but what's there to question?

US forces investigated once they'd stopped the vehicle, and called in for medics. They transported her away from the scene... and eventually she gets on a plane with Italian diplomats and goes home.

Just how desperate to spin this away are they? :shrug:

[FreedomAngel82]

3. They're desperate

to save someone's ass.

[seabeyond]

4. the difference between trying to murder her and accident

the point of this, and i feel it is valid, is if they were trying to kill her, how did she get to hodpital alive. if it was done on purpose why isnt she dead

i have to have the facts, whether it works for and especially against bush. doesnt make sense to me saying america meant to kill her, yet they took her to hospital

[bpilgrim]

6. if the operational cover was 'it was a tragic accident' then of course we

would provide transportation to any survives... the problem with the plan is that she did.

be hard to explain murdering them at such close range now wouldn't it?

of course that is just 1 possibility.

peace

[bpilgrim]

11. karlrschneider, let us know what they come back with

:hi:

peace

[Zenlitened]

7. Well, with several surviving Italian diplomats on the scene,..

... I guess the jig was sort of up.

(You and karlschneider double-teaming on this?)



edit spelling

[seabeyond]

12. my first instinct, and second and third was they were trying

to kill them. i find it hard to believe that italians arent aware of the touchy trigger fingers at these posts. all know about this issue with military and fear of suicide bombing. i find it hard to believe the italians would go thru any posts

but then on fourth thought, i couldnt see them allowing her medical care if they purposely tried to kill her.

i dont know that much about story. i havent read about several italian diplomats on scene. i know there were like three others besides the reporter. two wounded and one dead. i would think they owuld just finish off those two also. if a crowd had gathered, that would be another reason they wouldnt be able to kill them off. if there were serveral italian diplomats, beyond who was in the car, i could certainly understand. but then i would want to know where they came from.

i just need more of the story. and i havent seen more of the story in any of the articles i have read that answers my questions. so until answered i cant say for sure. not convincing me yet

(You and karlschneider double-teaming on this?)
this i dont know what you are tlaking about though

[sharman]

15. Italian troops at the airport

Don't know about diplomats, but I've read there were Italian troops at the airport.

It's also possible that the low-level grunts on the patrol weren't in on the grand plan, so it wouldn't exactly do to tell them to go to Plan B and shoot identified westerners at point blank range

[sharman]

16. In fact, now that I think of it

Here's the plan. A sniper, in on the plot, fires the shot meant for Sgrena, that Nicola takes for her. The patrol, not in on the plot, is just set up to start shooting and create the cover. When the sniper fails, the patrol is already quite aware that the car is friendly, and there is no further opportunity for snipering

[seabeyond]

21. a story i hadnt thought of

but could make sense. i just like to see reason if possible. now not saying it is true, but at least it is buyable and would fit

[neweurope]

20. They were talking on their cell phones... maybe that's what kept them

from finishing them off. Also maybe soldiers from the nearest checkpoint came inquiring when they heard the shooting (Sgrena said they weren't shot at a checkpoint but rather were ambushed). In bith cases the only thing they could have done was to say "oops - call an ambulance".

---------------------

Remember Fallujah

Bush to The Hague!

[LynnTheDem]

19. Who says they took her to a hospital? US military, when asked who took

her anywhere after the shooting, "declined to answer".

The US says they called medics over. An hour after the shooting.

[karlrschneider]

5. I guess they are basically saying "if 'we' wanted her dead, why didn't

someone just fire one more shot and finish the job"

(Most of these insane goobers are calling her a "communist bitch/traitor", etc.)

Again, surely the devil is in the details. I imagine that by the end of the fusillade there would have been witnesses, it's just that there don't seem to be many 'facts' forthcoming...and the military doesn't know where the car is...

It all makes my head hurt.
edit: minor typo

[Zenlitened]

8. Well, be sure you're not getting played by these goobers.

They're just trying to fling as much crud as they can, hoping something sticks.

And even if you answer every one of their questions, they're going to be:

a) too stupid to inderstand what you're saying; or

b) already playing their next game

[rzemanfl]

9. Not knowing where the car is is as believable as the lump on

Bush's back in the debate being caused by a poorly tailored shirt. Nonetheless, a lot of dumbf***s are going to believe it. "Chaotic conditions in Iraq" yaddy yaddy. My head hurts too, life in this country get more bizarre every day.

[Disturbed]

10. The ignorance and stupidity of Freeps..

is never surprising. A Pathologist would know at what range a bullet entered a body. An independent investigation is paramount in this case. No one will accept the DOD version of any investigation. It is akin to foxes investigating hen house murders.

The family of the slain man and the injured reporter should file a law suit.

[Straight Shooter]

13. The answer is: They don't know what she relayed via phone to SB's office.

Remember they were communicating with Sylvio Berlusconi's office via cell phone transmission when the attack occurred. The U.S. military ordered the cell phone transmission to be cut.

The U.S. had no way of knowing what sort of information had already been relayed; thus, it was to their benefit to render aid and comfort ASAP.

No matter how you perceive it, major major FUBAR on the part of the U.S. There is no repairing this damage, not in the hearts and minds of the Italian people.

[karlrschneider]

14. excellent point, I had forgotten they were on the phone. Devil in details

So there HAD to be some kind of high level control over this, to have the cell phones blocked. I don't think a field Major would have the authority (or ability) to do that. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[NightOwwl]

17. Well, we would have killed her...

if Nicola Calipari, the secret agent hadn't thrown himself on top of her. Obviously that fucked up Plan A, so the special ops had to move to Plan B, which I suspect was to let the troops (who were unaware of the arrangement) believe it was an accident and carry on as such.

[LynnTheDem]

18. Coulda been them Italian troops and US Colonel 400 metres away put a dent

in any ability to deliver the coup de grace.

You fire 300-400 rounds in a vehicle, anyone that near is going to hear it. Expecting the car any minute and they hear those 300-400 rounds going off? I bet those Italian troops didn't just stand around looking at each other.

Just a thought.

[SillyGoose]

22. Regardless of whether this was intentional or just a HUGE fuck-up

the * administration needs to answer for this in a big way. Either way you look at it, this admin is wholly incompetent militarily. There have been too many screw-ups since the brainless one and his minions decided to wage this immoral war. They need to be held accountable for their actions in an international court.