A POLL: If Privatization Fails What Do You Think Bush's Backup Plan Is?

[Itsthetruth]

If Bush's "private accounts" Social Security scheme fails what do you think Bush's main backup plan is to attack Social Security?

[napi21]

1. I think his plan is to reduce benefits.

Simply make a statement, if you don't like my idea of privatising, fine, then we're just going to save money be reducing everyone's benefits!

[Sapphire Blue]

2. Do you mean

after he steamrolls it through Congress or if he fails to steamroll it through Congress?

In either case he'll get advice from the Torturer General on how to do whatever the heck he wants.

[Warpy]

3. all of the above, probably

What he won't do is raise the cap on earnings subject to premiums; nor will he prevent Congress from robbing the 40% now overpaid by working people. The last thing he wants is for people to notice just what a total disaster his tax cuts for the rich and corporate have really been.

[Just Me]

4. Other - another war to distract everyone. Then, a sneak-in piece,...

,...in some other piece of legislation.

He's not willing to compromise. He simply does a bait-n-switch or some "perception management",...then, gets through what he wants. He truly is a dictator wrapped in "democracy" and the flag.

[Jim Sagle]

5. He'll do it by executive order (backed by martial law if necessary).

[stepnw1f]

10. Jay-Zussss

you think dim boy has grown big ones? Arrogant maybe... brave? Uh uh.

Well, he is a bit stupid... so maybe.

[Fridays Child]

6. The plan IS for it to fail.

[Just Me]

9. Okay. I wanna' know more. eom

[Fridays Child]

32. Here's a link.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/020605X.shtml

[stepnw1f]

7. State Budget Cuts in Blue States

Cuz Red States receive Welfare from Blue States.

[EVDebs]

8. Republicans have always favored "Every man and woman for themselves"

[warrior1]

12. declare

war on Japan.

[Sapphire Blue]

15. And, of course, give more tax cuts to his haves & have mores

[EVDebs]

18. DU should have audio video of the Santorum group's chant of

"Hey Hey Ho Ho, social security's got to go !"

ROFLMAO !!!!!

[Sapphire Blue]

25. Hey Hey.... a Quicktime clip

http://www.moveon.org/lte/lte.html?lte_campaign_id=17&zip=98148&id=5123-3796744-l38d_qXKSJiK8XqTVRSwmw

[Itsthetruth]

26. Thanks

Just checked out the clip. Thanks for the link.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

11. Kill all the old people.

[Sapphire Blue]

16. Don't forget the disabled & survivors

[randr]

13. Hell, lets all go to Mars!

[LostInAnomie]

14. Laugh at the poor people.

[ohkay]

17. He doesn't need one. God told him this would work!

[Itsthetruth]

19. Price Indexing A Real Threat

I think that switching from wage to price indexing is the biggest threat.

It sounds innocent enough. Benefits will be "increased" and determined according to the increase in the cost of living, not wage increases. That doesn't sound so awful until you look at how benefits would suffer drastic cuts (up to 40%) under the price indexing scheme.

And Bush might have enough votes from Republicans and Democrats in Congress to get it passed. I don't think any Democratic Party leaders have spoken yet against price indexing. I hope I'm wrong. If someone can find such statements please post them.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

20. Terrah, terrah, terrah. What else? eombof.

[Itsthetruth]

21. eombof???

I'm sort of a newbie. What does "eombof" mean?

[HysteryDiagnosis]

23. It's new, I just made it up, it is built on eom, meaning end of message,

It's out of place in this thread, but I figure there will be places where "end of message beginning of flames" will fit rather nicely. I have been here for several months and only recently realized that LTTE was "letter to the editor", I had a duh moment, but recovered rather quickly... :)

Welcome to DU if you are really new, if not, then just welcome again.

[bowens43]

22. Another unprovoked attack on a much weaker nation.

[Canuckistanian]

24. They've only begun to fight...

[mikehiggins]

27. Back up plan? Who needs a back up plan? He plans to win it!

What is wrong with you people? Did he have a back-up plan for Iraq? Bush does not conceive a reality in which he does not get what he wants. If things don't work out exactly as planned he lies about what he was up to in the first place, or finds someone to blame. What reason does he have to change his M.O. now?

[Itsthetruth]

28. No Deals With Bush On Social Security!

He and other Republicans have said that other proposals, such as price indexing, are up for negotiation and discussion, with or without privatization.

I believe they are. We must be alert in the event an agreement cannot be reached for some form of privatization. Hence, the "back-up" plan.

I don't want to hear any member of Congress claiming "victory" because privatization was defeated while they vote for other cuts in order to "save" Social Security.

No compromises or deals with Bush on Social Security!

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Itsthetruth]

30. Cuts Can Only Happen If Dems Fail To Stop Them

If there are social security cuts the people will blame it on the Dems for finding common ground with George Bush ... if they give him the votes he needs.

None of Bush's Social Security proposals have a chance if the Democratic Party and its representatives in Congress go all out and fight them. Filibuster if necessary! Tie up Congress. Bring Washington D.C. to a grinding halt! The Democratic Party can do that. That's what an opposition party does.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Darkhawk32]

33. If it fails, then he would need another PNAC "Pearl Harbor", because...

there first "Pearl Harbor" has worn off.

[waywest]

34. Invade Iran

*

[BuyingThyme]

35. Agreed.

[Jack Rabbit]

36. To say it's working and call anybody stating the obvious disloyal

Like he always does.

[Telly Savalas]

37. Bankrupt the entire government by invading and occupying Syria

[Itsthetruth]

38. Congressman Michaud (D-Maine) Explains Indexing Scheme

The Administration's Social Security Privatization Plan: Reading the Fine Print
By Rep. Michael H. Michaud (D-Maine)

February 24, 2005
Magic City Morning Star

.... their real trick for lowering the costs of Social Security is to cut benefits. But they can't come out and say that because, of course, any direct benefit cut would meet massive opposition. So they do it in a much more subtle way, hidden inside the overall plan. It's called "indexing"- by changing the indexing formula, they can take a big bite out of everyone's retirement benefit.

Indexing is an important feature of Social Security. As everyone knows, wages go up over time, and in general, most people are better off nowadays than they were in 1940. Retiring with dignity means something very different today than it did back then, because we all expect to have a lifestyle that reflects the improving standard of living in America.

So, Social Security has always been set up so that benefits are "indexed" to wages-meaning, as people are paid more and the standard of living in America goes up, benefits also go up. However, the Administration would like to change the formula so that benefits are "indexed" to prices instead. That means that the amount of benefit only increases to match inflation.

This is simply wrong. Seniors shouldn't be condemned to live in poverty. The numbers make this very clear. Today, a worker who retires at age 65 gets a benefit of $15,336 per year. But if price indexing had been used instead-like the Administration wants-that same retiree would receive only $6,180 per year. That is 60% cut in benefits.

http://magic-city-news.com/article_3189.shtml

[jayfish]

39. A Massive Tax-Increase On The Middle Class.

IMO this was the plan all along. Since SS money is not protected and can be used for general spending, they get a huge infusion of our cash today for a problem that won't rear it's head until late-tomorrow. It's a real nice way to reduce the deficit numbers.

Jay

[ComerPerro]

40. Backup plan?

[Itsthetruth]

42. Price Indexing, A "Backup" Plan To Cut Benefits.

I believe that if the privatization scheme should fail, Bush will insist on changing to price indexing in order to "save" Social Security. So I describe price indexing as his "backup" plan to cut benefits. Pegging social security benefits to price increases sounds almost good until you dig under the surface and learn that changing from wage indexing to price indexing will mean huge cuts in future benefits. Bush and the Republicans would say something like: "If prices go up your social security benefits will go up!" Now who in the world can oppose that? He might get the votes for that.

[ProfessorGAC]

41. None Of The Above

They have no plan B. They agreed already taht teh privatization scheme will not correct teh shortfall due in 40+ years. Hence, there is no intention of saving SS. They just want to starve the system mor thoroughly because they ideologically oppose the concept, despite its success for the last 70 years.

Go figure.
The Professor

[Itsthetruth]

43. They Are Determined To Cut Benefits

I agree that they want to destroy social security in the long run. But, if they can't accomplish that the first time around it's obvious they at least want to cut future benefits. Price indexing may be their main instrument to accomplish that.

[ProfessorGAC]

44. I Don't Think They've Thought That Far

They want to ruin it. Cutting benefits doesn't ruin it. That could be a simple damage control tool later on, when things are just about blown up in SS. But, there is no plan B, IMO, just the goal to tear it down. That is Plan A. I honestly don't think there is a Plan B.
The Professor