WTF!!!!!!!!!! is up with this Kerry email saying Rummy has to go???????

[tyedyeto]

That has been one of our 'talking points' for many months now........ and he's just now getting it?????

I had my 'Kerry/Edwards' bumper sticker on my car for a looooong time. (Never had any other ever since I've been able to vote!!!) Still have the 'MoveOn' Defend America Defeat Bush one on my car but removed the K/E one.

[NVMojo]

1. Go, Kerry, get the neocons!!

[tyedyeto]

9. Why now??????????

Why not during his campaign??????

Yes, I supported and voted for him but why the silent treatment since Nov........ and why now when he knows that this Repug congress will NEVER support such an idea?????

[emulatorloo]

14. JK called for rummy's resignation during the campaign. . .

he had a petition up when prison scandal broke. . .

[ThorsHammer]

47. Agreed, IMO not being aggressive enough may have cost Kerry the election

[The Backlash Cometh]

17. Who knows? Maybe Bush realizes that he needs a scapegoat

because this really is as bad as it looks to us. It's not about us, mind you. It's about all those families in the red states that may feel they've been dupped. And it's about mending fences with the allies.

Though most of our allies are pretty smart, and they probably already know that Bush wanted this war, Cheney pushed the CIA, Rove (probably) outed a spy over it and Rummy was just fighting a war with the tight resources he was given.

[The Backlash Cometh]

19. self-deleted

[Clark2008]

Well, some of us wanted that from a candidate

DAN RATHER: -- (Don Rumsfeld) Was chief of White House staff in President Ford. If you were president today, would you fire Donald Rumsfeld?

GEN. WESLEY CLARK: Well, if I were president, I wouldn't have appointed Don Rumsfeld. I wouldn't have picked him to be the secretary of defense because I worked around him. I knew what it was and what the system was, and he wasn't up to speed on the way the world had changed since the end of the Cold War. He was still in pursuit of enemies. I had looked at the things he'd written. He was strongly in favor of national missile defense, for example, but he didn't strongly support operations in the Balkans and peacekeeping.

In the future, we're gonna have a lot more wars when states fail and fighting within states than are wars between states. Unless, of course, we invade countries. And so, I would have looked for someone who was more current on the issues.

DAN RATHER: Now, here and now, he is the secretary. Back to the question, if you were president would you fire him now?

GEN. WESLEY CLARK: Well, I think the issue really is that the buck stops at the desk of the president. A lot of people have said he should be fired, but let's be very clear about this, Dan. Harry Truman said, “The buck stops here.'” He had the sign on his desk. This administration and this president has to accept responsibility and frankly, I cannot hold Don Rumsfeld responsible for the operations in Iraq. They were approved by the president of the United States. It was his strategy, his leadership, his authority, not Don Rumsfeld's, and so you cannot escape the accountability by firing your subordinate. I know you can in politics and that's what politics is all about, and you're asking me a political question. I'm talking truth. I'm saying this president is accountable, and if you wanna fix the problem, you have to change the administration at the top.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/11/19/60II/main584554.shtml

[StephanieMarie]

2. I just ordered, "Impeach the Lying SOB".

What makes me actually HATE * are his lies about Iraq that have killed and ruined hundreds of thousands of lives.

[tyedyeto]

13. I've 'hated' him since b4 he was selected him the 1st time......

knew he was going to get us into a war with Iraq and after 9/11 it was obvious he was going to go after Saddam....even if it was Bin Laden who was responsible.

[WildEyedLiberal]

3. Hey dude

Kerry called for Rumsfeld's resignation in May. This is nothing new.

Sorry to interrupt your exclamation-point laden rant.

[tyedyeto]

12. I know he did in May, but why not in.......

June, July, Aug, Sep, Oct and Nov?????????/

Come on.....the Repugs are in 'power'...where does he think this can go now???

[blm]

28. Not what you said in the OP, and the Repugs were in power back then, too

P

U

[WildEyedLiberal]

39. He did. He hammered it for over a year.

But if you're too lazy to look it up, I'm not doing it for you.

And one question mark usually suffices, I think.

[RoyGBiv]

4. Damned if you do ...

etc ...

[DoBotherMe]

5. He sent a petition for Rummy's resignation to supporters

when the torture scandals surfaced. He talked about it throughout his campaign.

[Dhalgren]

6. In the words of Kerry, Biden, and the DLC,

"Get over it!"

[blm]

7. This is Kerry's THIRD call for Rumsfeld to be fired. First was summer/2003

and then again after Abu Ghraib.

Too bad not enough Dems followed his lead, but, then, the media downplayed it as usual. Couldn't upset the boyking, after all.

[WildEyedLiberal]

10. Stop being logical!!!!!!!!!!!111111111

You're interrupting a great rant. There were at least six exclamation points!!!!!!!

</sarcasm>

[zulchzulu]

8. Hey clueless Kerry basher ! Do your homework first!

I saw Kerry in person and have it on video of him mentioning that Rumsfeld resign LAST FEBRUARY. A large part of his campaign speeches were about making Rumsfeld resign.

Here's one article FROM LAST MAY:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/07/politics/main616272.shtml

Do your homework before you act like a mindless stooge that would make Karl Rove proud.

[tyedyeto]

20. I am NOT a Kerry basher..........

I supported him from the time he was the potential candidate.

But it just seems like we didn't her from him about anything significant since the election, then when he does email us, it's about something that can't change since the Repugs are in 'control'.

[Merlot]

11. I'm glad he's speaking out on this

It may have been a talking point for a long time, but fact is rummy still has a job. I think JK might just come out swinging now that the stakes have changed. He's made a national name for him self and has a lot more visibility now.

As an aside: last night channel 13 (now owned by fox, but not calling itself fox news) had a story about voting issues, called something like "Voter Inconsistancies, or Sour Grapes: John Kerry speaks out about how the voting problems may have affected the outcome of the election." Nice they were doing a story, but "Sour Grapes???" It never ends.

[tyedyeto]

16. What good does it do now?

The Repugs will all say 'Get over it'. And nothing will change since the GOP in in power.

[blm]

32. I know when someone is getting off by repeating that the "GOP is in power"

and it's "futile" to fight them now.

[UdoKier]

15. Rummy is the personification of BUSHCHENEY policy.

Getting rid of him does NOT address the problem.

My esteem for Kerry will be restored when he calls for the giggling murderer's IMPEACHMENT, and only then. (and I know it would be a futile effort.)

[shraby]

18. Kerry can't do anything about impeachment.

It has to start in the house. Guess what the chances of that are?

[UdoKier]

21. Of course he can.

He can call for his impeachment.

It may not carry any legal meaning, but he can do it.

But he won't even give anything but blunted criticism. To hell with Kerry and his gave-up-halfway-through campaign.

[meisje]

22. BREAKING - Kerry To Unconced In 2008

[OrwellwasRight]

30. LMAO!

Wait a minute, can I still have my vote miscounted or is it too late?

-Rip van Winkel

[tyedyeto]

23. I am just trying to understand..why now?

When it is futile to even think that what any Democrat thinks or does has any meaning when it relates to this administraion.

The Repugs are in 'power' and don't give a flying fig to what anyone else thinks.

[Merlot]

24. So, according to your logic, we should just stop thinking

since nobondy cares what we think...awww, poor us

[tyedyeto]

27. No, we should keep to the 'Dem message',

But I am questioning ..'why now?'. We've barely heard from the man in 2 1/2 months and now he's asking for something that will never happen since the Repugs took over our country?

[blm]

26. Yeah...sure...futile.

Woe is me and all that. Uh huh.

[tyedyeto]

29. It's not futile?

I've been keeping abreast of the appointment proccesses re: Gonzales and Condi.. even the Dems are kow-towing to them saying how great they are (there are a few exceptions to this but not as many as there should be)

[blm]

31. yeah...I believe you...they're great...uh huh.

futile.

Did it ever occur to you to check into Kerry's efforts to have Rumsfeld fired since 2003 and again in 2004? Do his REASONS matter? Do FACTS not matter? Does GOOD GOVERNANCE not matter?

I think your posts on this are pure rubbish.

[tyedyeto]

33. But did anything happen to resolve this?

I have signed petitions to fire him and done what I could to GOTV in Nov to defeat the Repugs but it didn't happen and now it seems like a moot point.

I may seem like a defeatist, but is there any other way to be in this day and age?

[blm]

35. Baloney. Your OP said that Kerry was just getting OUR talking points NOW.

You were completely oblivious to Kerry's other calls for Rumsfeld's resignation until some of us TOLD you. Now you claim you knew and signed petitions but nothing will help anymore.

P

U

[tyedyeto]

37. Did it do any good back then?? n/t

on edit:
And if it did...why did nothing ever happen because of our 'talking points/petitions'?

[WildEyedLiberal]

41. So therefore, the point of this thread is what exactly?

You've contradicted yourself at least twice. What is the point of this?

[journalist3072]

25. MEMO TO JOHN KERRY

You're a day late, and a dollar short.

In case you didn't get the message, it's a little late in the day for you to be "reporting for duty."

[WilliamPitt]

34. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

This is the THIRD TIME Kerry has called for Rumsfeld's resignation IN THE LAST YEAR.

God fucking dammit. Get mad at smart shit, not dumb shit.

[tyedyeto]

36. I know he has called for Rummy's resig. but what was ever done about it?

Not one damn thing.

Why now? When The party in 'power' won't let any Dems say anything about it?

BTW, Kerry started this by sending an email to his supporters calling for something he knows will never happen.

[WilliamPitt]

38. "what was ever done about it?"

HE RAN FOR FUCKING PRESIDENT. Every day. For two years.

You're kidding me with this ridiculous pathetic bullshit, right?

Please say you are.

[blm]

40. Check out the thread. Someone gets off on repeating "GOP is in power"

get it?

[tyedyeto]

44. God..how I wish it weren't true...

No, I don't get off on that, but that it the way it is today.

I have been a Dem since I have been able to vote in the very early 70's.

I just have a hard time understanding why this point wasn't pounded home before the election.

[blm]

45. You don't understand, because your premise is FALSE. It was a big point

with Kerry but not the media. YOU blame Kerry. I say BALONEY.

[WildEyedLiberal]

42. Hey Will

pzzzzzzzzzcheeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzz

Heh. :P

[WilliamPitt]

48. D'oh!!

Hoist on my own pzzzcheeezzz. How embarrassing.

:) :)

[tyedyeto]

43. Thank you.......

for calling me pathetic. I appreciate that. I have voted Dem all my life. My 1st vote ever was for the most anti-war candidate (McGovern) who lost by a landslide.
I know he ran for President. I even voted for him.
And it wasn't by mistake, I really thought he would win (and I believe the exit polls were right).

But after a couple of months of silence, why is he calling for this again when the Repugs are so solidly in power?

[WilliamPitt]

50. "why is he calling for this again when the Repugs are so solidly in power"

LOL.

What should he do? Stay silent?

I assume you've read the post where I schooled you a bit more:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2969777&mesg_id=2970461&page=

Read it again.

You're attacking Kerry for attacking Republicans while they have the majority. I know, it sounds incredibly stupid, but that's what you're doing.

What would you do in his place?

[tyedyeto]

46. I give up........

Just wanted to find out why our Dem candidate came out to ask us to 'fire Rummy' now when he should have been making that point EVERY DAY for months b4 the election.

If you want to believe this is Kerry bashing, so be it, but I believe he should have been driving this and other anti-* statements home to a greater degree than he did during the campaign.

If you want to believe I am not a Dem, that is your problem, not mine. And if you want to believe I an a Kerry basher, that's ok too. Cuz I know how I'll be voting for many years to come and it won't be the Repug party, just as it hasn't been for that past 35 years.

[WilliamPitt]

49. "he should have been making that point EVERY DAY for months b4

...the election."

He was.

TWO public demands for the firing of Rumsfeld.

DAILY speeches on the catastrophe of 'mismanagement' in Iraq.

And, since he was RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT in order to GET RID OF RUMSFELD, he also had to dabble in wee insubstantial policy discussions regarding Social Security, Medicare, a woman's right to choose, energy independence, the 'war on terror,' September 11, firemen and cops and unions in general, the desires of the Clark grassroots, the desires of the Dean grassroots, the desires of the Kucinich grassroots, the Israeli lobby, fifty different states and all their vast issues and demands, and a partridge in a pear tree just for balance.

So there's that.

I'd be interested to see you join a campaign - early, so you can be near the command nexus - and see you manage to get a candidate to focus on one issue "EVERY DAY for months." Won't happen. Can't happen. That plan = failure. Period.