need help finding the first Patriot Act -- something very disturbing

[Nordic]

Okay, I'm reading Sen. Robert Byrd's book "Losing America", trying to get to sleep tonight.

And he's talking about the Patriot Act.

Check this out: He says the Patriot Act hit Congress a mere EIGHT DAYS after the September 11 attacks.

Eight days to write, type, and make copies of the Patriot Act.

I want to find the original copy of this, and count the words.

I used to do typing for summer jobs. I can type extremely fast. I've been rated at up to 120 words per minute on a good day.

Yet I really don't think I could write a legal document over a thousand pages long in eight days.

I can't help but think this is rather obvious proof that the Patriot Act, that Ashcroft gave to Congress, WAS WRITTEN BEFORE 9/11.

Anyone? Has this ever come up?

Seriously, I think you could find the fastest typist in America, sit him or her down at a typewriter, and have them try to type the Patriot Act in eight days, and I think they would NOT be able to do it.

So what gives with that?

How do I find the original copy of the patriot act? It MUST be online somewhere.

[Syrinx]

1. it was definitely written before 9/11

I'll try to get the link asap.

[Nordic]

2. you mean "definitely" as in "they admitted it" or "it had to have been"

:shrug:

[Syrinx]

7. "had to have been"

It was just too fast.

[morgan2]

3. i dont think anyone with half a brain

thinks the patriot act was written after 9/11. It was pieced together with things that people came together and said this is what we need to do. It wasnt discussed/debated or given a first, let alone a second, thought.

[Nordic]

4. even if that's the case ....

how could anybody have actually compiled it in eight days?

I think it's impossible.

I think it could be easy to prove that it was waiting in the wings. Waiting for 9/11 to happen.

[Syrinx]

5. not sure if this is the final law, but I guess it is since no debate

http://www.epic.org/privacy/terrorism/hr3162.pdf

On edit:

HTML version

http://www.epic.org/privacy/terrorism/hr3162.html

[Nordic]

9. Man, you guys are fast!

very cool. Actually it would need to be the first one, presented to Congress by the Justice Dept., for the sake of argument.

But maybe they didn't change that much? I don't know.

But thanks.

[Nordic]

10. link doesn't seem to respond. I'll try it again in the morning

gotta go to bed sometime, right?

[Angry Girl]

6. They have word processing pools

While I'm sure you're correct about the timing (I tend to believe the absolute worst of this bunch, believe me), unfortunately they probably use several dozens of typists in their pools.

We need to find some other timing indicators. Something's got to be out there....

[MrMonk]

8. Has anyone compared the Patriot Act

to Clinton's security bill? You know, the bill that was roundly cursed by the House Republicans as being anathema to the Bill of Rights?

[smurfygirl]

11. Alex Jones has compared it

http://www.infowars.com

[stirringstill]

12. Yup--Pre-911 Wish List

The Patriot Act was written in some think tank well before 9-11. I've read a couple of articles which mentioned this in passing. I wish I could find them, but for what it's worth, others have noted this detail that for most disappeared down the memory hole. It would be fascinating to track the evolution of the document that became The Patriot Act. It is quite clear that some group was collecting for years a wish list of sorts that could not have made it into law had it not been for 9-11. The Patriot Act II probably contains the left over wishes that 9-11 couldn't deliver. I doubt there will be a full Patriot Act II, unless there is another terrorist attack. Instead, I think the sunset clause will be removed from Patriot Act I and the "desirable" elements of Patriot Act II will be diced up and then silently passed by being buried in other pieces of critical legislation over the span of several years. But, what group would be creating such a wish list of laws? The Patriot Act was clearly passed because of 9-11. But, if the pieces of this Act were written prior to 9-11, why? The Republicans sold the Patriot Act in part through giving it a name you just couldn't vote against, much less criticize. I have heard conflicting reports on how much time people were given to read the Patriot Act before it was put up for a vote. I've heard just a few hours or none. Any one know?

[Nordic]

13. Senator Byrd agrees with you in his book

that Patriot II will be dismembered and sent, piece by piece, attached to other bills and that we'll hear almost nothing about it.

this has proved correct, seeing as how new parts of "Patriot II" just got passed in the "intelligence reform" bill and now, suddenly, I'm actually seeing stuff in the media like "oh, golly gosh! Look what got "accidentally" got passed along with the intelligence bill!"

[seabeyond]

14. it is known, admitted, documented, was on his desk before

9/11. and the plans to invade iraq

[Nordic]

19. got a link?

would love to see it

[seabeyond]

20. nope, saw when researching

the 9/11 event. going thru all the stuff, and clearly laid out. beleive they said it out loud on news too. when i was watching news obsessively 24/7 and three stations.

should be able to easily find it if you google that time

[w4rma]

15. I find it disgusting that so many Dems in Congress appear to be IGNORING

Sen. Byrd. Sen. Clinton, Sen. Kerry, Sen. Edwards and Sen. Lieberman included.

[Nordic]

17. his book is pretty interesting

From the point of view of a man who lived through the Depression, lived through "Company Towns" in West Virginia, and then spent 52 years in the Senate.

He's got a great perspective.

And he's NOT happy with the way things are, he's angry with both Bushco AND Congress for being asleep at the wheel.

It's pretty disturbing. And I'm only a little ways into it.

[SmartBomb]

16. Another (ignored) 911 smoking gun

Regardless of how long it would take to type, it certainly couldn't be conceived in 8 days. Yet, I remember it being portrayed as a direct response to 911. Which came first, the chicken or the egg? It’s hard to believe this previously unknown, impossible to pass, piece of legislation, just happened to be laying around waiting on destiny.

[Nordic]

18. Just figured it out. It's 56,878 words long, 292 pages

divided by 50 words per minute, we have 1137.56 minutes.

That's 19 hours of solid typing at 50 words per minute (for one person).

I figure it would take three days simply for one person to type the document.

That gives them five days to draft it. Figure one day just for the "oh shit, it's 9/11!" factor to wear off (and that's generous), we have a 292 page, 56,878 word document being completely written in four days.

I just don't see it .........

Sure, I can't prove it. They could always say "we had ten law firms working on this thing around the clock!"

Common sense dictates it was written prior to 9/11

Not that anybody will care.