We sold our house..we are on our way to Southern France.

[cyclezealot]

Anyone else here keeping to their desire to move overseas...? We are on track...Sold our home for about 10% what we hoped to get...But, figure the Bush $ devaluation is on its way and Greenspan's housing bubble burst is just begun..
Finish out our jobs , travel across the US in July..Board a boat in Cleveland, Ohio in mid-July and within five years be bi-national. French , US...If not for inconvience of traveling on a sole French passport and wondering how sole French citizenship effects Social Security( realizing Dubya will probably spend it all in Iraq) we would die happy to just be French...
Of course, Bush not take all the credit for forcing us from US...Planned this years ago...
USA hopeless. Anyone see Amy Goodman Rome report about how the Italian Semi-Nazi PM has buffaloed his people by media ownership..Just like the US soon will be...!

[Scrooge]

1. Congrats!!

oooh ohhhh.. Can I come along??? I dont eat much, and I travel light!!

[Vidar]

2. I lived in southern France years ago. Lovely. Enjoy.

[Catch22Dem]

3. Is 5 years how long it takes to go from OH to FRA by boat?

:evilgrin: I'm kidding, congrats!

[cyclezealot]

14. By freighter 5 days..

can put a car and stuff in a box and put it on a freighter.. Several freighter go from Cleveland, Oh to La Havre in five days...Passengers allowed...
Can be arranged through web site called "TravL Tips."

[Catch22Dem]

16. Very interesting

I wish you the best.

[radwriter0555]

50. I'm leaving for Italy in June myself... trying to put it all together;

what have you done for banking? I'm thinking Barclays has good international services....

I believe we're taking one car.. and not a lot of household goods. Mostly just a few pieces of furniture it looks like. We're also bringing 1 dog, so the freighter won't work for us.

Any hot tips????

[indigobusiness]

65. Here's a link for TravlTips

http://www.travltips.com/

[enough]

4. May I ask .....

Do you mean that you sold your house for 10% of what you were hoping, or 10% LESS than what you were hoping?

What part of the country are you in?

Good luck with your new life!

[reverendpatrick]

5. So long!

The rest of us are going to stay here and work to reclaim our nation!

[cyclezealot]

9. Revereendpatrick

We are claiming an early retirement..Think we have saved up enough money...We have pensions coming...Eventually hope to work only, part time. We have skills that will be beneficial to their country..We have always found the rural French extremely friendly, helpful..Welcoming..And with the religiious nuttiness of the US, I predit they will understand...W/O partime work, we should get along fine..
But, the reason for my post about Italian PM Bercioulini(sp?)..He who owns the media owns all...The Italians are more herded than the US...If only I thought it was not hopeless..For the US..But I do...
Scalia court will do in you remaining civil liberties and you will be outfoxed by the media....Congrats on your will to fight..We have given up...
My wife argued for a day..We took about 10% less than we could have gotten a year ago for our home..Two percentage points in the interests rates and we would probably taken another 20% off that value...And yes, we are seeking advice..Feel a need to get our dollars into Euro's asap..The rest of the world is...

[deutsey]

59. If I could, I would do the same

I have three young children and my wife and I are struggling financially. However, if we sold our house we'd probably make enough bucks to travel abroad. It's very tempting, but then there are the real problems of aging parents and my in-laws are both in dire straits health-wise and financially. They need us close by.

So I'm resigned to fighting it out here in America. But, man, I look out the horizon sometimes and wonder...

[Dem2theMax]

66. I'd be doing the same as you in a heartbeat if I could.

My Dad was two lotto numbers short today. Sigh. lol?

I hope the 'good old U S of A' will survive long enough for me to be able to get out - safely.

I wish you all the best! :)

[Toucano]

10. Speak for yourself.

LOL! ;)

[Piperay]

48. I'll say

I am out of here as soon as I get my affairs in order.

[Deja Q]

28. For as long as we can!

:hug:

Once there's sign of aggresive persecution against the GLBT folks, then I might be leaving as well. But until then, I will remain.

[Zomby Woof]

54. there's nothing to reclaim

What's to save? It's too late for that.

I applaud cyclezealot's decision, and only wish I had the financial means to move to Spain and do likewise.

[kaitykaity]

6. Be sure to take your computer with you.

I hope one of you earns money over the Internet. The
country will welcome you with open arms if you bring
money into their economy.

Congratulations. I am so, so jealous. But I don't
think you could drag me out of Portland, Oregon with
a bulldozer.

[GOPFighter]

7. We considered moving to France

After the 2002 elections my wife (who speaks French) and I agreed that if the Democrats don't get a spine and if Bush wins in 2004, we're outa here. But we were heartened by Howard Dean and how he brought our party back to life, so we're in a wait and see mode. However we are looking at converting most of our savings into euros because I think the dollar is going to do a big swan dive soon.

Good luck and I hope you will continue to post here in DU and let us know of any unexpected problems arise, etc. If the neo-cons do manage to take over the country you may have a lot of DU neighbors!

[offcenter]

35. Soon?

Down 60% from the peak already. The swan dive is accelerating since Nov. 2. Now the central banks of China, Japan & Russia are getting out of US dollars.

[sariku]

8. Well good luck to you!

I hope you enjoy your move.

Wow, I wonder how many of the intelligent and educated our country is going to lose?

[Deja Q]

29. Quite. But the repukes are happy that our cowards are leaving the ship.

Just means a bigger victory for them and no need to botch or falsify elections.

[radwriter0555]

51. I can't see sticking around for the camps and the ovens. I have a child to

protect and a life to live.

You can't beat this regime. They're hitler times 1,000,000.

[karlrschneider]

55. Well, remember the "brain drain" from Germany 60 years ago...

the same thing may well happen here in the face of incipient fascism or totalianism. 220+ years is actually somewhat remarkable for maintenance of a civil society in human history. Many people obviously believe that whatever it is we've had since '76 would endure forever, but nothing is forever. A myopic view of the past is one of humanity's ongoing and possibly unavoidable characteristics.

[BonjourUSA]

11. Where in France ?

Welcome !

I hope you'll feel fine here.

[Deja Q]

30. Don't answer him, the bush nazis will come after you!

And if 31% of Americans already hate the French (to those I say :eyes: ), then it'll be easy for * to rile up at least the undecideds against y'all.

Yeah, it's :tinfoilhat: but it's obvious we're all doomed anyway, so what the suck.

[dddem]

12. Ooh la la!

tres magnifique! (I hope I didn't embarass myself too much - 4 years of high school spanish - only french I know is Bon jour - and that's from watching beauty and the beast with my kids!)
Bon Voyage!

[Ardee]

13. Bon Voyage

I married a girl from Cherbourge, in Normandy. Southern France is even nicer than that, enjoy your retirement.

Incidentally, there are currently over ten million Americans living abroad.

[The Backlash Cometh]

15. Damn you!

Here I sit wallowing in my misery.

[glitch]

17. South France is wonderful - but still continue to fight for democracy to

return to the USA as an ex-pat, please!
Bon Voyage!

[loritooker]

18. I envy you

Say hi to Johnny Depp for me!

[bliss_eternal]

19. How exciting! I am thrilled for you!

Congratulations, Bon Voyage and all of that! I do hope that you will be very happy--please stay in touch with us here.

I will travel to Europe one day. Maybe after seeing it and experiencing it on a personal level I will decide to relocate there. Who knows...:)

All the Best to you and for you!
Bliss :hi:

[murray hill farm]

20. Good for you!! You wont be sorry!!

Been an ex pat for the last four years...never have regretted it for even a second...have spent all those seconds being grateful that i made the move.

[cyclezealot]

31. Our nephew graduated from Cal Berkley.

Lived in Europe/Singapore the last twenty years...He graduated from Berkley Masters in Chemical Engineering and now a Business degree from University of Barcelona...He and his wife never considers returning to the US..Said he would have to apply for a hardship waiver and bribe him to come back..Considers US food,culture, environment, violence unliveable...They plan to retire to Australia after making a bundle in Singapore... Rarely comes back..
His wife would not allow him to return to the US..She is Urugayan..Her brother was one of the 'lost ones' dropped from a helicopter by the 'Authorian ' government fostered by Reagan, out over the Atlantic......She is very bitter..Won't even come to visit with her husband to the US...Should he return, it will be w/o his new wife and she will take him to the cleaners, financially...

[GumboYaYa]

21. I went to school at l'Universite d'Aix Marseilles III

in Aix en Provence. We plan to retire to the South of France ourselves one day. It is one of the most beautiful places I have ever seen.

Have you picked where in Southern France you will live?

[cyclezealot]

24. We have visited France 18 times.

Sort of lost track.Basically every other year...Think it to be 18times...Have seen most of the country...We have decided upon Rousillon...Very reasonable place to live.....OUr home will be near Collioure..About 50 miles north of the Spanish border and about 10 miles inland from the Mediterranean Sea...
Beautiful town...has a stone bridge over a lazy river...My wife teaches French and ESL...( ESL so poorly funded in the US)
I love bike riding .Hope to give bike tours...
We will be expates away from the tyranny of a Scalia court and the Second Amendment which I find an offense to my safety...Until those change, doubt very much we will come back....Keep US citizenship can help you out with our vote with "Overseas Democrats." It will be fun Bush bashing to a more educated public..
And yes, Johnny Depp lives near Toulouse about 60 miles away..wants his children to have a more wholesome upbringing...Away from US violence...( He was great in "Finding Neverland" saw last night..

[alfredo]

22. I have a friend who is looking for a house there.

He has friends there, and spends his summers there.

I could move to south west Poland. I have a friend there.

[Dorian Gray]

23. Southern France is nice....

I hope you like it there. But, why the heck would you sell your house for 1/10th of what it's worth. The housing market may get hit, but it hasn't been yet, and that's quite a bit lower than what anyone expects it to fall. (A $400,000 house would sell for $40,000.)

[cyclezealot]

26. Sorry for confusion.

No, we had to cough up about a $50,000 loss over what it was last summer...We expect a far worse loss by next summer..So guess lucky..Now,what to do with our Bush dollars before they become further deflated..

[Dorian Gray]

57. Thanks for the clarification!!!! :)

I was worried that you sold so low because you couldn't wait to hightail it out of here. I would hate to see you sell for so little, especially if it was retirement money!

Good luck to you and your family. Southern France is really beautiful. I could imagine worse places to retire to!

[GreenPartyVoter]

25. Bon voyage et bon chance! *hugs*

[Deja Q]

27. Bye.

Okay, I do need to say something.

Have fun, good luck. Hope the French don't skeweryou by proxy. And 31% of Americans think France is a threat.

[cyclezealot]

32. i do worry Repugs.

Might retaliate to 10 million Americans who are Xpats...SOmehow,Financially...
recall, all the civil rights figures the French gave refuse..Nina Simone left...Many Black musicians...

[Deja Q]

33. Don't forget anti-American sentiment. Face it. WE

are increasingly disliked everywhere.

There is nowhere to go.

And can we entirely blame them for such sentiments? When other countries rise up in protest against government wrongs, US citizens just tune in to the latest episode of "Desperate Housewives".

We need to stick together.

[cyclezealot]

34. One time I rode up Mt. Ventoux..Meet some Norwegians in route

Their first question, believe it or not..What are your news sources???
They understand...When we tell them our beliefs and that some Americans are not like jingoistic Bushies' they are relieved..They are even sympathetic...They did not hate us..
Yes, they hate the policies of the US...Think they are pleased when we join in their protests...;
Still, not ready to 'Moon' Bush in cold as hell, Sweden...!Not too many Americans become X Pats in Europe and hang around European Socialist party functions...
We can finally become what we are ...Socialists.Which are mainstream in Europe...

[drdtroit]

69. It's not anti-American sentiment!

That is all part of the propaganda program to enable the fears and prejudices in the sheeple here so they will support any sort of criminal action.
I have been everywhere on this planet, have never found a dislike for American people but much hatred for our administration and their criminally corrupt corporate vagabonds.

[KoKo]

36. Good Luck to you! Will you keep posting?

It would be great to hear how your transition is. We are searching areas and I'll check out your location in Southern France to see how the area is.

Are you moving without any contacts there at all? Or, have you met people there in home searching?

[cyclezealot]

37. We host US student cultural exchanges

For the past 10 years.Mostly French..We have many French friends..Some like family..They are anxious for our move..We are very close...Love our town...
As a cyclist and at Socialist events..We got invited into homes quite readily...We have some acquaintances in the Collioure area...Socialist party officials in other parts of France seemed eager to help us get settled in...have some contacts up in Perpignan...No, we are not moving into a totally foreign area...One friend from Lyon area offered to help us in the move in process to our new home..Hope our home will cost about 120,000 euros...Much more than a year ago... Check it out on real estate web sites.
Told can save some cash if you buy in the winter..and the further in from the sea the cheaper...that is ok with us..Don't like the crowds in the beach areas come August..

[amazona]

38. tee hee want some house pests?

I promise not to stay longer than 3 days. :-)

[valis]

39. You mean 10% LESS, I hope....

Or did you really get only 10% of what you wanted (90% loss)?
Nah, I grew up in Europe, things suck there too. The sh*t will hit the fan there as well pretty soon... For starts, the generous social programs they have are a thing of the past, not sustainable... Good place for a nice vacation though...

[Lu Kang]

40. This isn't possible...

You should have looked in to EU immigration first.

Getting authorization to live in damn near any EU nation for beyond 90 days is practically impossible. More than likely you won't be allowed to stay.

[stavka]

41. ...yeah, I was wondering about that.

I've looked into pretty much every western euro country and this doesn't seem to make much sense unless you already had duel citizenship...

[cyclezealot]

42. We have already made preliminary contacts.

Mostly they demand you be sefl sufficient..You can live almost anywhere in the world, if you have the cash..Talked to their office in LA ( visa section)just couple days ago...
Many Americans live in Europe if they are not younger and looking for jobs...We are not in need of work...Early retirement...Think we have enough cash...If you can hold out for five years, on your own- I understand you can apply for citizenship..
Of course we have contacted French immigration...You start the process three months before moving...
Interesting web site on retirment abroad...Called "Escape from America...." If not France...But, pretty sure it will be ok...A second option is Hungary or Romania....Even cheaper...

[Lu Kang]

43. If you can live for 5 years with out a job

then you are in far better shape than a lot of people. If anything you'd think bush's favorable policy towards the rich would make you want to stay.

[cyclezealot]

45. Lu...

we are of early retirment age...Within five years we have social security coming..Should bush not squander it..Have our home equity.A pension...Will have a paid off home in France...Paid off car...Hope our pension will give us a respectable life....
Yes, don't need to . But would like to work part time...Hope crucial phrase is "we don't need to"...
We have skills that will be valuable to the French...We will be bringing more in than taking out...Would like to work part time,if we can....We will live better...Our jobs might even encourage foreigners to visit and spend additional money...
Just had an argument with our neighbor...She said, you people, should not be allowed to take your money out of the country...Then she spouted some scripture on us...
It is our money..We earned it...Thought they believed we are a free country...We are running into lots of friends who want to leave...

[Yupster]

61. You're outsoucing your pension?

That will hurt our economy.

[LaPera]

44. I have friends moving to New Zealand-- Wonderful place!

A little larger in area than California, with very simular weather to California (northern and southern weather is reversed from CA) a beautiful country with great beaches and many other types of different terrain like California, they speak english of course and NZ has only ten percent of California's population (around 3.5 million people). And they like "Yanks".

Best of all New Zealand is a very progressive nation, with a very good economy.

http://www.escapeartist.com/bea/kiwi.htm
:bounce:

"Over the past 20 years the government has transformed New Zealand from an agrarian economy dependent on concessionary British market access to a more industrialized, free market economy that can compete globally. This dynamic growth has boosted real incomes (but left behind many at the bottom of the ladder), broadened and deepened the technological capabilities of the industrial sector, and contained inflationary pressures. Per capita income has been rising and is now 80% of the level of the four largest EU economies. New Zealand is heavily dependent on trade - particularly in agricultural products - to drive growth, and it has been affected by the global economic slowdown and the slump in commodity prices. Thus far the economy has been resilient, and growth should continue at the same level in 2004. Expenditures on health, education, and pensions will increase proportionately."

[fujiyama]

52. Wow

Some of those photos in the real estate link are amazing.

New Zealand looks like an amazing country. I even have some distant relatives living there.

[Padraig18]

46. Bye.

Write if you get work...

[natrat]

47. congrats monsieur zealot !!!!!

will you still have to pay US taxes ?

[Piperay]

49. Lucky you!

CONGRATULATIONS...I'm leaving too but it will be 4-5 years before I have everything in order to make the move.

[Gloria]

53. Ah, another sign!!!

I've been looking at French property/leaseback programs and saw my name (French version) then met a French woman today, now your post!!!

Mon Dieu!! I am going to bring my French up to speed for sure!!! I love France and have also been focusing on the South....

I'm about your age, have some $$....always wonder about actually getting permanent residency...

But your post gave me some travel tips and also another area to check out.....

[KDLarsen]

56. Vacationing in Southern France for as long as can remember..

.. I'd say you've made the right choice. Will you be living on the southern coast or inland?

[stevedeshazer]

58. Quitters.

Good luck! Don't forget to vote! :)

[bluestateguy]

60. Will you do us a favor and stay registered to vote in the US?

Hate to lose a vote, though I wish you well.

[nine23]

62. Congrats cyclezealot! PM me if you have any further questions.

...although it's sounds like you've already done your research over your numerous visits.

My situation is a bit different: I have dual Canadian/EU citizenship (my wife's from Paris; huge extended family in the Bordeaux/Pyrenees region as well as in Canada); we have a little flat in Pau in which we "timeshare" the mortgage with two other family members; I do contract work every spring/summer for an NGO out of Toulouse, so employment is not an issue. Hate to gloat, but life is grand...we have the best of both worlds.

And I'm sure you've already noticed how the average (non-Muslim) citizen in small-town France generally conduct themselves when discussing current US/France relations: with intelligence, courtesy and respect. Compared to the institutionalized hatred of their counterparts in America, it makes me cringe with embarrassment. (And I'm not even American; because I speak non-Brit English and wear Levi's, I'm often mistaken for an American. But no matter, I'm extremely embarrassed to be "North" American by association...).

At any rate, if you have any "nitty-grity" type questions (car insurance/licensing, municipal taxes, etc.) please feel free to PM me anytime. I'd be happy to help if I can

[cyclezealot]

67. Tolerance in France.

Nine 23...thanks for the info..My wife might be PMing you...When we last stayed at a B & B in Provence the host was married a Scot...She had the same thing to say...
Dinner conversations with Europeans vs. Anglo's is far different.Never any anger amongst Continentials...Even Brits..carry that White Man's hang ups...The extended political conversations we have had with the French..So different...
Guess, deep down they think us up tight and haughty...Isn't that a kick..American's think it is the French who are such..It is with the American's I see the anger and intolerance for other's ways ...
We do not intend to drop our citizenship. We will vote and stay in touch with DU...Just out of reach of Aschcroft or Scalia..
But, our pending more relaxed life style with an appreciation of conversation, good food, beautiful scenery, serenity, good wine..Doubt very seriously we will ever come back,except for a visit..
And cyclists are treated like gods...

[cyclezealot]

68. Nine 23...

Appreciate your offer..My wife tried to PM/email you..Could not get through this web site to complete such...Maybe, if you would...Please feel free to PM me, and we will get back...Thanks..CZ
She is interested in Insurance and car registration matters..Also, student status...thanks..
Nine 23--- ps..Is not Pau where you go for the Armanac tastings?

[AlFrankenFan]

63. We were thinking of Southern France...good luck

You'll be safer than us. :hi:

[bikebloke]

64. Lucky you, mate

With my job, I could lobby for a transfer to London. Only I'd suffocate there. Especially with the bike lanes being a whole 3 cm wide. Though even when I was a new world traveller and everything was new and exciting, London never clicked. So I'll keep lobbying for a Sydney office, or a Barcelona office, or an Auckland office, or..we have a bloke in Paris - but I bet he can use an extra hand.

Aye, I'm investigating an out. Though I suspect I'm here for the big mess.

Today I passed a creep sitting in his car plastered with der kleine fuhrer stickers, including one saying "ONE NATION ONE GOD". I hawked a loogie on his hood, giving him a hard stare and the finger.