Who Is Our Version Of Ann Coulter?

[arwalden]

Do we have anyone as venomous as that Coulter bitch is? If so, who?? If not, what's the closest thing we've got?

Are we losing the battle of words by playing fair and being nice and telling the truth? Are we missing an opportunity to help shape public opinion by spewing our OWN lies and venom? --- It's working for them, why not for us? Why should we cripple ourselves?

If the game is rigged, ought not we be cheating too? Shouldn't we fight fire with fire, lies with lies, hate with hate, venom with venom?

Isn't the philosophy of "not-sinking-to-their-level" a guaranteed recipe for failure every time?

-- Allen

[elehhhhna]

1. I could do it.

[Cats Against Frist]

60. Yeah, I was going to say -- I could do it too

I know the inside and out of their little game, what they've done with language, and I also know exactly how their GOP masters have made lap dogs out of them, and I know how to tell them that.

Evidence, my earlier post on the "fuck unity thread:"

The Big-Government, Authoritarian Right is on the march, and behind them, they've got the delusionals, for one, and the freepers, who are also delusional, but are under the impression that they voted for "liberty," "freedom" and "small government."

The joke is most definitely on them.

But you know the real reason that I'm not going to unite? Not even because they've twisted the language, they hate science, and they're sitting around waiting to get zapped out of their clothes and whisked off to a cloud.

Not because they've traded 3,000 innocent dead bodies for 50,000 innocent dead bodies, and their nationalistic moral relativism doesn't phase them.

Not because they kicked Jesus out of the Bible, and replaced him with Mammon.

But because I remember, back before I understood what the Constitution meant, and what the Constitution protected, that maybe those "big tough" militia people, playing gun and rolling around in cammo, actually stood for freedom.

Now, they've rolled over like bitches for the Patriot Act, a theocratic government, a corpo-fascist government a man who "thinks it would be easier to be a dictator," possible voter fraud and the submission of Constitutional principle to religious nuttiness and fear.

Guess what, you freeper pigs -- "Big Brother" has a Brother, and his name is RIGHT-WING TOTALITARIANISM, and I would NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER align with such obvious PUSSIES, who succumbed, because Fake Rancher and Skull & Bones Elite Georgie Porgie promised he'd save them from the A-rabs, and that he's make sure that their fears are pacified by Mammon Jesus.

What a bunch of chickenshit, knee-knocker fuckers. They're too scared to even fucking enlist.

On principle, I can't align with such spineless dolts who fell for it so stupidly.

I'd have to watch my language, on-air, though. :)

[calimary]

63. So could I. Let's call 'em what they are: republi-CONS. Who can take

their CON-JOBS by their CONMEN and CONWOMEN and go ride straight back outta here on the whores they rode in on.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

2. james carville with a lot of practice and hard work could be

[neener3]

3. Mo Dowd

[Art_from_Ark]

12. Dowd's not on the progressive/liberal side

She dissed Gore big time in 2000, and gave Lord Voldemort a mostly free pass. I for one will never forgive her for that.

[AmandaRuth]

37. amen

mo dowd is for mo dowd only, just like stern, although his fans on this board will not admit it.

[Lindacooks]

4. No, we don't have anybody that ugly and mean.

The closest thing we've got is probably Ariana Huffington, but she's pretty mild.

And yes, we are losing by playing fair and being nice and telling the truth. If we aren't cheating, we need to get some cojones and start calling Repukes on their cheating and lies. Kerry collapsing like that at the end was a huge disappointment to me.

And yes, we have to sink to their level - but the thing is, we have the truth on our side. So no matter what, if we start to fight hard and intensely, we WILL win.

[arwalden]

9. Yes, Truth Is On Our Side... But The Truth Doesn't Win

Nobody listens to or cares about the truth. We've tried that, but their lies beat our truth every single time.

I admire your fortitude and positive outlook... but I don't believe that we will win simply by fighting hard and intensely.

We're suckers for not playing the game in the only way it can be won: dirty, and cut-throat.

-- Allen

[calimary]

65. You make a good point, Allen.

And, frankly, one that we at least ought to consider.

[CBGLuthier]

5. Well sometimes

Ted Rall. The only difference is I agree with him. :-)

But some of his cartoons are just as vicous (sp) as anything Coulter says. Only difference is he speaks the truth.

[sniffa]

6. me

i don't mind gettin dirty

[RevCheesehead]

7. Howard Stern - in more ways than one!!!

[knight_of_the_star]

8. We don't have anyone that stupid

Or full of shit. Let's just follow Harry Truman's advice,

"The Republicans say that when I tell the truth I'm giving them hell."

[derby378]

10. Randi Rhodes

She hits about as hard as anyone I've ever seen or heard.

[annabanana]

17. She's tough AND she tells the truth...

And she triple vettes everything she says on her show!

[jdj]

24. yes, she would shred Coulter

[madinmaryland]

11. Is that what we want to become?

:wtf:

No fucking way. It will not help our cause.

[arwalden]

13. Mild Mannered And Polite Surely Isn't Winning The Battle...

Shall we continue to allow their lies and venom to emasculate us? We need to fight fire with fire!

The playing field is not level. The game is rigged. The rules are different for us. If they cheat and lie, then we must cheat and lie too.

-- Allen

[sangh0]

20. Fallacious Dichotomy

The world offers us more choices than "mean" or "nice". The black and white, your either with us or agin us, point of view is for the other team.

[arwalden]

26. That's About What I Expected

If I said the sky was blue, you'd likely find some shade of blue that was more perfect. --- I think you understand the point that I'm trying to make, yet it's more fun to pick nits, hyper parse, and be antagonistic, isn't it?

-- Allen

[sangh0]

27. Yes, I understand and I disagree

but instead of addressing my point, which you do understand, you try to attack me personally.

I didn't make any personal attacks or call you any names in my post, but I'm the antagonistic one?

[arwalden]

28. Bullshit!

[sangh0]

29. Well, no one will accuse you of picking nits

.

[arwalden]

30. :-)

[sangh0]

35. But people who don't defend themselves and their idea are losers

You say you want to fight, but at the first sign of a challenge you retreat.

You're definitely no Coulter. AT least she has balls.

[arwalden]

38. :-)

[sangh0]

44. Coulter doesn't smile

it just looks that way when she's licking her chops

[arwalden]

45. :-)

[mark11727]

47. ...and an adam's apple

[mark11727]

46. Unfortunately, Murkans in the red states only think in black and white...

...this nuanced, shades-of-gray stuff we liberals like to use burns up too many brain cells for them to handle.

[sangh0]

48. Even worse

some of those black and white thinkers are right here on DU.

this nuanced, shades-of-gray stuff we liberals like to use burns up too many brain cells for them to handle.

Yeah, they're winning elections. Yep, they're the dumb ones.

[calimary]

64. I'm with you, Allen.

If the way to win is to cheat, or rig the game, then how can we even hope to win if we don't recognize and make use of the new rules of the game?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1329987

[kcwayne]

14. Janeane Garafolo

She gets unleashed with vitriolic attacks on crackers and religous wackos. She is not nice at all. While I agree with her sentiments, I know that any conservative listening to her would find her just as unbearable as we find Coulter.

[eataTREE]

18. Yes. Plus she is from "Hollywood"...

...which all good Repubniks know is the land of Satan incarnate. (Hey Red-staters: if Hollywood is so freakin' evil, why are you all still flocking to the multiplex every weekend?)

It would be cool if we could come up with a spokesperson who is both a Hollywood actor/actress and a trial lawyer. I think that that would make right-wingers spontaneously combust...

[Swamp Rat]

52. You can do it too, and watch them explode.

I have been challenging right wingers and religious wackos right to their face - no holds barred. They cannot believe it when it happens... they are dumfounded when I challenge their patriotism and faith directly.

[lanparty]

42. I love her but ...

... but those attacks are NOT going to win over any swing voters.

Cracker and Redneck are racial/social stereotypes. Their use is no different than Nigger. At least the right has largely learned to stop hurling N-Bombs around. But somehow, our side has NOT realized their hypocrisy in using negative stereotypes when it applies to white rural citizens!!!!

I've also detected frequent use of the epithet "Cretin". Guess What???? A cretin is someone from the island of CREET. It is no different than labeling someone a wetback, spick, mick, etc...

Finally, "Mouth Breathers" is probably the lowest term that I've heard from the left. I have chronically congested sinuses as well as a deviated septum. As a result, I tend to breath from my mouth, especially in my sleep. It's a medical condition!!! And it's effectively the same thing as mocking the handicapped!!!!

The left wing needs to hold itself up to the same high standards it wants others to act by. Otherwise, it just comes off as hypocrisy. I LOATHE hypocrisy WHEREVER it comes from. And it saddens me to see this language coming from Malloy and Garafolo!!!!

[Swamp Rat]

51. I personally don't give a shit if conservatives find her unbearable.

When she unleashes her wrath against these Amerikan Nazis, I stay tuned to Air America and note who are the sponsors. Crackers and religious wackos deserve to get ridiculed and I'm doing it face to face with these reptiles.

[LTR]

15. Does anyone really take Trann Coulter seriously?

She preaches to the hardcore crowd. The average person I doubt really gives a shit about her juvenile rants.

[China_cat]

16. If we sink to their level

then rational people who might be persuaded have a legitimate right to say 'they're all the same'.

I don't think I could support anyone who would do that. There's too much hate as it is without advocating more.

[LisaLynne]

19. We don't have one because ...

we rely on facts and truth. She just spews hate. We don't need one of those. Somebody on AAR was talking yesterday about how he "debated" her once or something and that she really doesn't have much of a range and can only talk about maybe one or two topics, mostly just about how liberals suck. I know we don't need that.

But, on the other hand and what I think you're getting at, is that we need somebody vocal and visible. I totally agree. We need somebody who can run off to the TV stations at a moment's notice and shoot their mouth off. The difference would be that what that person said would be in the realm of reality and truth, unlike that Coulter woman.

[kcwayne]

21. There is no one better than Katrina vanden Heuvel

She is an exceptional speaker, very knowledgable, unflappable, believable. She Rocks.....

She is my brain goddess.

[eataTREE]

34. I love Katrina vanden Heuvel!

Every time she's on TV, my wife accuses me of bugging out my eyes and drooling. ;)

[The empressof all]

22. I'd nominate that Kathy (red-head) Griffin----- Comedian

I saw her on MSNBC-afterhours during the election. She was wild and wicked and totally out of control. Actually her impersonation of Anne Coulter was better than Annes-and Kathy is a hell of alot smarter.

[OnionPatch]

23. We don't have an Ann Coulter

and I'm thankful for that. I don't want us to sink to that level, I really don't. And I don't believe it's a recipe for failure. In fact, I thought our side stood for honesty, tolerance, etc. When we stoop to that level, we might win some short battles but in the long run we will be promoting the exact kind of garbage that we are trying to stand against. Fight dis-information with information.
And let Ann make an ass of herself. I think even many people on the right find Ann Coulter dispicable. I really don't think she does anymore good for her side than she does for ours! For everyone on the right who thinks she's great (and therefore is so far gone they aren't going to change anyway) there are others who think she's disgusting. She makes them look bad.
(On edit) I think Randi Rhodes, Janine and perhaps Mike Malloy are the closest thing we have. I love them and believe they are doing our side a great service but there is a big difference between them and Coulter. None of them are diabolical LIARS, nor do they promote violence, genocide and totalitarian governments.

[helnwhls]

32. Bingo!

thanks for putting it down so succinctly!

[arwalden]

36. Recipe For Failure? Really?

Look at what a failure they are! Wow!

Being polite for the sake of being polite is just stupid. It makes us look like wimps when two talk show guests go face to face and the Republican interrupts our "polite" spokesperson. Oh sure, he looks rude for doing so, but HIS message is OUT THERE and repeated. Our guy just looks timid and like a victim and the message (if there was one) never gets out because NOBODY HEARS IT.

[lanparty]

Anne Coulter is NOT influencing anybody !!!

Anne Coulter is just the shrill voice in the choir who's "doesn't need a microphone". Put her front and center I say!!! And I'm damn proud of Bill Maher who is playing her like a fiddle on "Real Time"!!!

[arwalden]

41. She Gets The Air time, We Don't. --- Limbaugh Is Just The Same...

less shrill, but just as bad. Can you argue that HE'S not influencing people? His lies are taken as the truth a hundred times a day. That's pretty influential if you ask me.

Our timid little spokespeople do split-screen interviews with the RW's most obnoxious sourpusses, and we get run rougshod all over the place. We're polite, to be sure... we tell the truth, certainly... but our message gets lost and is quickly forgotten.

Who's going to be the Democrat to say "Shut up, shut up, shut up, shut up!"?

-- Allen

[rndmprsn]

25. Randi Rhodes

http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/main.html

she's one tough gal...likes to get in fights with her callers sometimes, but thats passion for ya.

edit - link

[demokatgurrl]

31. Al Franken and he's much better looking. n/t

[MUSTANG_2004]

33. Ted Rall's pretty venomous (n/t)

[lanparty]

39. No comparison ...

No one sinks to that serpents level of utter stupidity and rabid tirades!!!!

On our side:
Garafolo: She needs to stop all the "Redneck/Mouth Breather" comments. The folks she refers to are just deceived. And you will NOT convince ANYONE by calling them a toothless igornant back water, swamp running redneck.

Malloy: Malloy has the strongest rhetoric on our side. I agree with it. But he does some of the SAME stuff as Garofolo.

Randi Rhodes: Randi manages to avoid racial/cultural stereotyping of white rural voters. But she DOES manage to make a handful of historical references on a regular basis that JUST ARE NOT TRUE!!!!

Honestly, the CLOSEST thing we have is HOWARD STERN!!! And he's really not on our side a lot of times!!!

Id say that Malloy is our Hannity while Rhodes is our Rush. Both are WAY more accurate than either of those right wing clowns. But I would still like to see some higher standards.

NEVER criticize a potential swing voter with a cultural stereotype!!! Only criticize the politicians that deceive them!!!!

The right has NOTHING to compare with Al Franken. He is accurate, he's graceful, he does NOT insult swing voters. At the same time he has a pretty dry sense of humor. It takes a bit of "adjustment" to get Al because he's so accurate. The closest analogy for the right would be Ben Stein, and he doesn't even do radio!!!!

[PissedOffPollyana]

56. Right on all counts!

Bear in mind, I am an unshakable progressive. To elaborate, I am an atheist who has been involved in Leather activism, campaigned for Kucinich and against the rising tide of corporatism. I point this out because since I keep busy with research, 'blog, creating features for our website, etc., visiting DU is not a major passtime; I'd hate the low post-count to act as inspiration for some to 'shout' the all-too-common "freeper" nonsense.

Yet, I turn off AAR as soon as Al Franken leaves the mic. Why is this? The other hosts turn me right off. Imagine what folks who are not a member of the choir feel when they listen to "our" version of arrogant vitriol. Rhodes, Garafalo, Seder, Malloy and any others who use the blueprint of Hannity, Limbaugh et al, in this opinion do more harm than good. They act as a perfect example for the psy-ops forces of the right, who love nothing more than strident, angry derision from anyone seen as a "voice" of the left. "See!" they say, "This is what these liberal elites really think about you and your values."

It does us no good to champion "voices" that use their mic to stoke derisiveness and simply create an alternate ideological vacuum. Rather we need more like Al Franken, who translates anger and frustration into something constructive, something that inspires understanding instead of destructive intolerance of anyone who is not "like us".

Al Franken is no less passionate. He is far more informed. He and Katherine Lanpher make the same points and make them more forcefully by appealing to the best in their listeners. They are a perfect example of what I see as the cornerstone of progressive thought, the positive lessons we learned from Gandhi, Mandela, King. Fighting with virtue and respect wins more real progress than throwing bombs.

Let's look to Franken, Vidal, Krugman and others like them and take their example of how we can fight without turning into the very thing we fight against.

[RPM]

40. As a straight white male, I'd say...

Al Franken - smarter and much more attractive :-)

[elemnopee]

43. We don't have one, and we don't want one

We deal in facts, she deals in peddling hysteria, hyperbole, and hate.

[arwalden]

49. Minus The Hate... I *DO* Want One...

I'm sick of milquetoast Democrats and liberals who walk on eggshells trying not to offend and play by some obsolete rules that no longer apply to politics in the 00's.

We need more hyperbole. We need to stir up some hysteria.

[Swamp Rat]

50. We don't have a fascist party doll

[arwalden]

53. This Is My Favorite Doll

[Swamp Rat]

54. HA! Isn't she lovely?

This would be a good X-mas gift for your favorite "toothless igornant back water, swamp running redneck."

[animuscitizen]

55. Marilyn Manson!

Marilyn v. Coulter--I'd love to see that on one of those stupid "debate" shows.

From Marilyn Manson, Portrait of an American Family:

"You spooned us Saturday morning mouthfulls of maggots and lies disguised in your sugary breakfast cereals. The plates you made us clean were filled with your fears. These things have hardened in our soft pink bellies. We are what you have made us. We have grown up watching your television. We are a symptom of your Christian America, the biggest Satan of all. This is your world in which we grow. And we will grow to hate you."

"VCR and Vaseline, TV-fucked by plastic queens. Cash in hand and dick on screen, who said god was ever clean?
Bible-belt round Anglo-waste, putting sinners in their place
Yeah, right, great if you're so so good explain the shit stains on your face
White trash get down on your knees, time for cake and sodomy."

[pat1962]

57. Ann Coulter Counter-part

In a one on one conversation with any of the right wing shrills you can have any number of people challenge the accuracy of the statements they make. Ann Coulter is a wimp who hides behind a tv camera or makes sure that the crowd she is speaking to is a conservative one. None of the right wing pauble pukers will ever debate on neutral ground. They know that they will lose any argument that uses facts over fiction. The last time Ann Coulter appeared on "Real Time with Bill Mahr", she did it by remote setup. She knows that she will not have to face any opposition directly and she can end the interview at any time. Quite frankly there is no one on the left who is willing to go on these talk shows and take some crap in order to get thier point across. The other thing is people who listen to Coulter and Hannitty and Limbaugh are not people whose minds you can change. They beleive only in the faux channel and in Newsmax or Matt Drudge. Every other source of information is liberal and therefore is wrong. As a party we cannot waste our time with these people we can only hope that they don't breed. If this county is attacked again by UBL I can guarantee you that they would find some way to blame it on Clinton. Richard Belzer was right when he called her a right wing facist party girl. Just ignore her and treat her with the contempt that she deserves.

[arwalden]

62. I Take Many Of Your Points. And I Especially Like The Final One About...

treating her with the contempt she deserves. But I disagree with you when you say that people who listen to and believe (and idolize) people like Limbaugh are people whose minds cannot be changed. --- Take me for example.

-- Allen

[Generic Other]

58. Vicious leftwing hag here

Reporting for duty.

[pdx_prog]

59. Just my ex wife...lol

[NewJeffCT]

61. Coulter is just a tool to further the RW agenda

Ann Coulter is just a tool, people. She helps to move the debate farther to the right just by spouting off her crap. She is so far to the extreme, extreme right wing that when somebody comes along and is "only" extremely right wing, people will think, "well, at least he or she is not as bad as Ann Coulter"

Think of it this way. In 1964, Barry Goldwater was considered such an extremist conservative that he was unelectable and lost the popular vote by a historic margin. Yet, if you look at his actual political views, he is about the same as today's loveable "moderate" John McCain. Goldwater was pro-choice (McCain is anti-choice, I think), Goldwater was pro gays in the military and pro-environment. I am pretty sure that McCain is pro-environment, and I am not sure on gays in the military. But, you can make a case that 1964 radical rightist Goldwater would be considered more liberal than John McCain in today's world.