My Sister...How Sad

[Steely_Dan]

Like clockwork, I received a call from my sister who is a big Bush supporter.

The first words out her mouth were (in a sing-songy kind of voice): "Who is the President?"

I knew that this was coming and I responded in a very magnanimous way (I believe that we need to rise above the frey...at least with our families)...I said..."It's President Bush." "Congrats...you did a great job."

We continued the discussions on other topics...but her tone of voice was this..."I told you so."

Near the end of the conversation she repeated the sing-songy question: "Who is the President?"

That was enough. Without even thinking, I told her to "Fuck Off" and hung up on her.

She called back and asked: "Did you just hang up on me?"
I said "yes, I did." Then she started laughing. I siad..."So, you think that this is funny?" "Listen to me hang up on you AGAIN." Click...I hung up on her a second time.

Minutes passed...I started feeling guilty. After all, she is kin and I didn't respond very well. So I called her back to apologize. I told her that I was sorry and that it wasn't an appropriate way to respond. But I also told her that I didn't want the fact that Bush was re-elected rubbed in and I didn't appreciate being laughed at. She said something to the effect that "You are way too serious and I don't think I want to talk to you anymore." I yelled..."THIS IS SERIOUS."

She hung up on me...I think our relationship is over. I am very saddened. It has really shaken me up.

-Paige

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

1. I am estranged from my brother.

One must do what one must do. Cold? Yes. Effective? Most certainly.

Sometimes you just don't have a choice.

[Romulus Quirinus]

60. How did that help anything? O.ø nt

[devilgrrl]

87. Got any solutions 'Answer Man'?

Keep your sanctimony to yourself.

[Iris]

91. Maybe helped his peace of mind? Self-respect?

Why should relatives have free reign to crap all over us?

[Ladyhawk]

2. Some of us are going to lose family and friends over this.

I already have. I don't want to see my family's faces. Ever. I don't want to see my fundy "friend." Ever.

I feel cut off.

[Eye and Monkey]

3. uniter, not divider

:eyes:

[SammyWinstonJack]

41. The chimp should be proud!

:grr: I won't lose any family members over this since they are mostly Dems and the ones who aren't I haven't seen in years anyway. I feel greatful for that.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

4. I'm sorry your Dad didn't use a condomn.

:puke:

[mountebank]

42. A truly Progressive reply. n/t

[crispini]

5. Oh, jeez, I'm sorry.

If it helps, I would've done exactly what you did, without even thinking about it......

[annxburns]

6. Wait.

Then when more soldiers get killed, send her a little email?

So how many more did your President kill today?

She'll eventually shut up.

[NoSheep]

38. That oughta do it

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

7. Never, EVER apologize for being angry.

Not about this.

Never.

[Fridays Child]

8. I'll be your sis, okay?

:hug:

[NoSheep]

36. Mee too!

:hi:

[Qanisqineq]

9. I think my sister and I will soon be going the same way

we never really got along as kids. In recent years we were starting to mend things but then she became a born-again christian. I still tried to work things out with her. Last week she claimed god told her Bush would win. She claims Kerry is immoral. If she even tries to rub my face in this at all, it is over. Fuck her. I'm sick of her describing the things I study for my job (evolution is a big part of it) as "fairy tales".

[RevCheesehead]

49. Tell her God told me and other Dems that Kerry would win...

..and ask her if God was sending "mixed messages" to America.

[Qanisqineq]

59. thanks for the laugh

I needed it today

[disgruntled_goat]

10. hmph. at least it's over for you

and at least no one got killed.

mark my words:
the fallout from this election will sunder family relations just as surely as in the Civil War.

[Vickers]

11. I'm probably gonna have a few conversations like that in the next few days

Thanks, George, you're fucking up my FAMILY!!!!!

[happynewyear]

12. I have a brother like that and ...

believe me, I RARELY talk to the asshole!

Blood is thicker than water they say? I say BULLSHIT!

Hang in there! :D

baldearg

:dem:

[DIKB]

13. You are more my family

than those blood relatives who supported this retarded monkey.

[Liberal Veteran]

14. Okay...so let me see if I understand this?

Your sister called you up to rub your nose in a loss and when you get angry about her callous disregard for your feelings, she makes you feel guilty about it?

I'm sorry, but I'd call her up and say she proved she was a poisonous person who brings nothing useful to your life and if that is the type of person she wants to be, you will be cordial when your paths must cross but your relationship is pretty much over.

[AuntPatsy]

15. I feel for you, I know exactly how you feel, my first phone call of the

day awoke me at 630 am, I answered a bit groggily just to hear my husbands voice saying, guess who's president, I called him a moron and said that it didn't surprise me since he was a theif and a liar and I had had no doubt he would steal this election.

He said Kerry was a wimp and the better man won. I said whatever and hung up.

Three more times he called me to gloat, this man who proffesses to care about me? Spare me, it was ugly and reminisent of something you would see from Hannity and company, I finally laughed at him and told him how sad that he cannot think for himself enough that he has to parrot every lying talking part from that worthless network..

It's not getting any better, what an ass...

[Liberal Veteran]

20. Not to put too fine a point on it, but I would file for divorce.

That was NOT how a person who cares about you and your feelings is supposed to behave toward you.

And take him to the cleaners with an activist lawyer just to rub it in.

[AuntPatsy]

45. Oh this is not over, I expected a slight gloating but not this angry

useless tirade against a man he has no clue about other than what people like that she devil coult and company spout with such venom...he knows better than to have gone to such lenghts to be so vile when we discuss politics, he is obviously being overworked, but those excuses have long since run out, at least his heavy paycheck will be put to good use by his oil cronies when I get my share in alimony....

Never discount a woman scorned, contrary to what he was hoping me to become still after all these years, a clone of Laurie butt kisser was never my goal in life....

Oh he shall pay, of that have no doubt though he seems to not look ahead...when his kids, all of whom are of draft age begin losing their lives or limbs or minds because of his faith in such deviants who put others in their place to fight injust wars that have to do with financial gain and little else....

God forgive him...

[CrispyQ]

25. Time to pull a Maria Shriver on him . . .

Only instead of 2 weeks, make it 4 years.

[lachattefolle]

73. If my husband did that it'd mean a divorce n/t

[calico1]

16. Do you realize something?

She behaved like a typical Freeper. You behaved like a typical, magnanimous Democrat. Maybe that is our problem. We keep thinking that if we play nice the other side will. She is you sister of course so I know its different than if it were a neighbor or friend. A suggestion--you know that before this term is up she will probably be very sorry she helped get him elected. When that happens and she starts complaining you can say something "Who is the President? Oh, I forgot..you helped put him in there!"

[Kali]

29. yeah this is both our problem and our strength

Empathy, feelings, caring - to the point of trying to be nice to people that have no respect, empathy, fellings or caring.

We need to take a page from their book and quit trying to be nice to 'em. Civil sure, but apologize to them for when they are the offenders? Can you say codependant?

[cynatnite]

85. I've always said we dems have always tried to stay above

it all. We've played fairly and treated everyone equally. We didn't demean the beliefs of others and their choices no matter how much we disagreed with it.

Because we play nice and fair, we're painted as immoral and cowards. We get creamed for being willing to accept those different from us and respecting the world. We're accused of being anti-American because we can look beyond the water's edge and see the world and it's nuances.

I still remember the posts prior to the election asking how we should treat them should Kerry win. A lot of people stood up and said we should unite and work to heal this nation.

The responses here tells me the repukes and the religious self-rightous are gloating in their hypocrisy and love to rub it in our faces.

If those that claim to love you treat you in such a way, I say that tells you all you need to know about them. Cut 'em loose.

[libbygurl]

17. I can be your virtual sis, too. This, the legacy of the "uniter". nt

[patrice]

18. I can be your online sister if you want.

This thing has been causing divisions in families. I care about the Bushies in our family, but I am forever changed toward them. I basically just cannot accept Bush's War, and even the nice young men in my family who are helping out with the killing, exist in a different relationship to me from what we previously had.

Let me be clear. I Care about them (Love is a very ambiguous word, so I don't use it that much when talking relationships), but I guess I don't trust them anymore. Something has changed.

[CrispyQ]

19. I'm so sorry to hear that, but not surprised.

They are sore losers & even worse winners. I too received a gloating call this morning. Very sad.

I know some people say you should make nice with your family, but this is more than politics. It's a world view & how you believe you fit into it. Bushco lacks integrity, pure & simple. They don't give a shit about anyone but themselves & they don't think it's wrong to lie if it furthers their cause. I believe the people that voted for him are the same.

[Liberal Veteran]

26. I am not one of those people...people who cannot be gracious in winning...

...have no place in my life.

Particularly if they behave in a disgusting manner with utter disregard for you.

[fudge stripe cookays]

21. I'm sorry PLA.

My mom was working on her brother and his wife. They live down in the Texas Hill Country.

She's taken them literature from reprehensor and I, trying to change their minds. His wife claimed she was voting for Bush because he was a Christian. :eyes:

This is a lady I always admired for being very tolerant of the bullshit she had to put up with from his ex wife and daughters. And she told off my step monster years ago, so got a big gold star from me. Not anymore.

The other day, mom sent them an article from smirking chimp.com and asked them what they thought of it.

They opened the envelope, read it, sealed it back up, then marked "Return to sender, Not known" on the outside. She got it back yesterday.

Another family bites the dust.
FSC

[wildeyed]

22. If anyone tries to rub my face in this election, they will regret it.

I don't blame you for hanging up. But that said, I hope eventually you can mend fences.

[HardRain]

23. I Know How You Feel

I am thinking of canceling Christmas at my daughter's because of her repubican husband. All he cares about are his taxes. I love my 1 yr old grandson but find it increasingly difficult (maybe not impossible) to put up with his father's know-it-all, I got mine, F you Jack attitude.

I am so so sad and wounded.

[placton]

24. You all need to read the LEFT BEHIND series

These books, for fundies, CELEBRATE the fact that evil-doers (and evil-DUers) like us will go to the pit of hell. Folks like my brother, nephew and niece love these POSs. I read my share of gory novels, but nothing about people I love condemned to burn in hell forever - and these folks read this for fun. And, then, WE have to tip-toe around THEIR sensibilities?

[CrispyQ]

32. I wish the fucking rapture would happen today . . .

& get these assholes off the planet.


on edit: I don't believe in all that crap, btw. Just wanted to clear that up!

[Greylyn58]

130. Actually If the Truth Be Known

it would probably be us who left and not them as I don't consider any of those people true Christians.

You have to love your neighbor, do good unto others, help the poor, the sick, the weak, the helpless. The Bible doesn't say just help those who believe as you do.

Jesus, helped everyone. He never drew a distiction between anyone, like these so-called "Good, Christian People"

:think:

[Francesca]

27. wow odd how similar a lot of our experiences have been

with Republican kin... This morning my husband and I walked into our family run business and it was very obvious to anyone looking at us that we had been crying for hours and we were met with laughter and jeers by a number of our coworkers/family members.... they have apologized since then but we are feeling murderous right now....

Funny how we both discussed last night how to be considerate today to them after Bush lost, we discussed how we did not want to rub it in etc....

I am sorry but it's the Dems who are the moral party the Republicans only have a monopoly on the jargon and doublespeak..

[Liberal Veteran]

37. When they apologized what you should have said...

...was "I'm sorry too. I thought you were a better person than that and I was a better judge of character."

[phylny]

134. My daughter was mercilessly humiliated and taunted by her

roommate in college. Daughter voted Kerry, roommate voted Bush. I mean, the same sing-songy crap others have mentioned, "Can't wait to hear his ACCEPTANCE SPEECH!"

I told daughter to tell her born-again roommate that her boyfriend may no longer sleep in HER room in the SAME bed. Morals indeed.

Roommate eventually apologized, but too little, too late. The meanness of the Republicans is evident everywhere. By their works you shall know them!

[Boomer]

28. My family just got smaller, too

My niece is a right-wing fundie redneck in Texas. For the last year we've had sporadic email exchanges of our respective propaganda pieces. But with Bush's win, I just can't take it anymore.

I'm gay, she knows I'm gay, and her views are cementing my status as a second-class citizen in this country.

Fuck blood ties. I don't need this kind of abuse from anyone.

[hackwriter]

30. Paige, I'm so sorry for this...

I'm lucky in that everyone in my family is on the same team.

What bothers me about the Republican voters is that it's not enough for them that they won; they have to crush us into nothing. That's what they want because they feel so empty and so small inside.

"Living well is the best revenge", my friend. Let's all stick together, rely on each other, and rebuild, starting now. Rely on your friends, virtual and real, and we'll all get through this.

[NoSheep]

31. Your sister was wrong. You have to honor your own feelings. nt

[merh]

33. I am estranged from one of my sisters (responded to her pro*

email with the facts) and the others have been scarce - they know my politics and I know they drank the kool aide!

My prayers for peace go out to you and for strength! :grouphug:

[Ganja Ninja]

34. I'm estranged from my whole family and it was my choice.

It dosen't sound like she cared much for your feelings. I don't know why you should care about hers. There's and old saying that you can pick your friends but you can't pick your family. Sometimes you can and should for your own sake.

[Lorien]

117. Agreed. Toxic relationships within one's family

do no one any good. Best to cut it off with your sister now before it makes you even more sick at heart. I cut off my relationship with my toxic sister 15 years ago, and I've never regretted it.

[JusticeForAll]

35. Paige

I think a lot of us are going to experience what you are going through.

Have you ever hung out with gay people? We call each other "family" for a reason. He's "family" or she's "family" means that yes, they are gay, and yes, they have come out of the closet and experienced the isolation, loneliness, discrimination, intolerance, and even the same cynical laughter you just experienced over the values and ideals we hold dearest to our hearts.

We gay people have lost friends and lost family because of who we are and what we believe in. While it is sad, there is nothing wrong with your anger or your expression of grief. We all need to find friends and family in our own ways.

My view is just like gay people need to rebuild their families, some of the most dedicated Democrats among us are going to need to rebuild theirs. I think we Democrats are going to need a lot of "family" to get through what we just did, and to make the best of what is to come.

So, while we DU-Dems do not know you, we can relate to you in some ways deeper than those you have trusted most.

We are family.

[SW FL Dem]

76. Beautiful post! Thank you

I need my DU family more than ever today.

[sadiesworld]

39. This "you are way too serious" response from * supporters

is sickly fascinating. I hear this in a lot of DUers stories about repug friends and family members. Isn't it rather demeaning? Is it part of the collective fascist mindset that they share? Too much Rush and Fox?

[Karenina]

63. The bottom line

is their win-lose mentality. When approaching those with whom you have a connexion, asking "Can we get a win-win" out of this? Agree to disagree? Make certain topics off-limits that we can build on the base of our connexion?" They will say yes, but use every bit of information they can extract from you as ammunition against you. In my 50+ years I've learned that Maya Angelou was completely correct when she said, "When someone tells you who they are... BELIEVE them the FIRST TIME."

[July]

70. Typical reply of all rude people everywhere.

Here's how it goes:

1. I needle you.

2. You react.

3. I tell you you're too serious/can't take a joke.

Works great for the rude person -- make the other person feel bad, then blame them for it.

My husband's standard reply to this is: "If you kick me in the back, don't be surprised if I get mad."

[phylny]

135. Perfectly said! n/t

[Sarrek420]

40. Thank You DU

I am so glad that this place exists. Because at least I know that I am not alone in severing my relations with my Bush worshipping friends/family.

I know what storm is coming for our beloved country. And I am sorry, but I cannot be friendly with 'anyone' who supports it or its engineers.

[0007]

43. My father and I have had our abouts, as of now we're on the outs

he is 92 years old, and this isn't the first time. I went twenty three years without speaking or seeing him. He is a racist, a bigot, a hypocrite and a liar, and thinks that junior is sitting on the right hand of God. When I was a little boy he tried to mold me with his fascist ideas. He succeeded with my brother. My life is better when they are not a part of my life.

I don't believe blood is thicker than water. I don't want it this way, but that's the way it is....

[bratcatinok]

44. Thankfully, my sister was very

low-key when she called. She asked me if I had heard * had won and when I told her I had, she told me "I know you wanted a different outcome. I'm sorry you are feeling unhappy and disappointed today. I love ya and hope you get to feeling better soon cos y'all put up a good fight!"

I'm sorry your sister couldn't be more like mine.

[Booster]

79. Wow, what a nice sister you have who sounds like she truly

loves you and respects your feelings. I hope you grasp, and I think you do, just how wonderful she really is.

[UNIXcock]

46. I disagree with my brothers on politics, but I love them still

... fortunately, we remain civil in our political differences. The love for my family is greater and stronger than the loss of any election to divide us.

[The Backlash Cometh]

47. God bless you for even caring.

My mother once said, it's better to be alone than in bad company. I do find that when I'm around Republicans, I can't stand to hear their self-serving conversations. I've gotten to the point of just telling them right there and then when they cross the line.

It is funny to see the sparks fly because most of the worst ones are social climbers who want to believe they're not racists. They befriend me because they figure I'm not really a minority because I'm too intelligent to be a member of a minority group. But, boy, if there is such a thing as a latin temper, I let them have it when I think they deserve it. It has brought chuckles and looks of appreciation from people who know me because I think they wish they could do the same thing.

[Occulus]

69. "My mother once said, it's better to be alone than in bad company."

You just cleared up something big for me. All these years I'd been wondering why I wanted to be alone so much. Ever since I was a little kid, even as far back as first grade.

Now I know. Thanks. :)

[The Backlash Cometh]

115. You made my day.

Cheered me up knowing I could help somebody else.

[Kanary]

48. This story is being repeated all over the country.....

I couldnt' think of some punchy subject line, so I know this won't even be read.

I know you wanted to have peace in the family, but peace take two. It goes both ways.

There are many people who don't have a real choice..... they are dealing with family members being sent to a war they don't believe in, so they cant' tolerate the * cheerleading.

For those of us who are poor and disabled, and know our death from cutoffs is imminent, we can't maintain friendships with those who cheer all the policies of the RW. We don't have much choice but to get away from those who don't care about our very survival.

Your situation is not so extreme, so your choice is not so clear-cut. However, since what I say here is likely to not even be read, and since I don't have hoards of support, I will say that I take your action with your sister as support for me and others like me, who don't have a voice in what happens to us.

Thank you for taking a stand.

Kanary

[morillon]

118. *I* read your message.

And I doubt I'm the only one. I DO care what happens.

I know the Republicans talk about ending Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. They'd like to do it. But I think that is the hottest of hot third rails, and if they even TRY to destroy the social safety net, there will be holy hell to pay from everybody except the most diehard Kool Aid drinkers. Little old ladies who still believe Bush is Jesus's president will change their minds in a flash if their checks quit coming.

[kilaana]

50. I'll be your sister, too!

I'll be your sister too!

I'm having a real problem with my republican family members and acquaintances (can't really call 'em friends any more), who seem to have a gloating attitude "My guy WON! Your guy LOST! Nyah Nyah!"

I don't see this election as a freakin' football game, where it's my team versus their team, and "oh goody I hope my team wins". To me, it's about trying to get our country back to being a kind, benevolent, tolerant democracy, who treats ALL its citizens with respect and fairness, and who takes it's place in the world humbly with all other nations.

Instead, our ever so slight majority apparently continues to support a self-centered, "my way or the highway", "god is on my side", mentality. It's mean-spirited, and I don't see how this can be good for our nation.

It's not about winning or losing a game... it's about the direction our country is taking. And the direction we're taking scares me.

[LizW]

51. She intentionally called to hurt you

and when you were nice and didn't rise to the bait, she tried again.

That's just wrong. You have nothing to feel guilty about.

Al Franken's supposed friend did the same thing to him live on the radio today. I don't understand how people can be so callous and unkind.

[drbtg1]

89. I think they treat it like a game

kind of like how Yankee fans treated Red Sox fans for eighty-six years.

Unfortunately, they generally have no idea what's at stake. F'instance, I tell them Bush should be in jail for what happaned to Valerie Plame. They respond with a blank stare, no iota of who Ms. Plame is and what that represents.

If they had a clue, Kerry would have won easily.

[wickywom]

122. They have to treat it like a game...

it's classic denial.
That's why she can't handle your being emotional-- she is reminded of reality.

[July]

125. It's a reality show to them.

Cheating, lying, backstabbing are all part of the game.

Winner gets to be obnoxious.

[Historic NY]

52. I got an instant message from a co-worker gloating, here is how it went.

How did I do?

2:07 PM]: You must be disappointed
<2:07 PM>: yeah and so will you
<2:07 PM>: I've been around a while
<2:08 PM>: LOL!
<2:08 PM>: laugh now - died later
<2:08 PM>: :-P
<2:09 PM>: lets me ask you one thing that he has done that has made your life better?
<2:09 PM>: don't say taxes cause you only got 300 bucks
<2:11 PM>: It is not anything in particular that he has done or not done, I just cannot stand the Liberal Democrats, they are assholes.....Kerry, Edwards, Bill Clinton, Hillary
<2:11 PM>: Well your wrong its the liberals that gave you the Bill or Rights - you know the first 10 amendment to the Constitution.
<2:12 PM>: wait to you see what happens now I hope your one of them church going republicans
<2:12 PM>: remember people talked about holy rollers
<2:13 PM>: I have no problem with religion being involved in the government
<2:13 PM>: Republican Taliban is coming.
<2:14 PM>: you are very naive that why there is a separation of church & state
<2:14 PM>: it was to prevent one religion from ruling over all
<2:14 PM>: that is why people came here in the first place
<2:15 PM>: we are suppose to be a secular government
<2:16 PM>: Let me tell you this, I am not a Holy Roller, but I think there should be some religious influence in the government, I am a Catholic and I think the 10 Commandments should be in the court houses, it is a guideline to live by for anyone. I am not a big fan of non-JudeoChristian Religions anyway, if these people do not like the way it is here in the US they can leave
<2:18 PM>: I'm a Catholic too and even the signer of the original constitution & declaration of Independence realized that this was necessary. Heck Carroll was a papist from Maryland he was a signer and later Bishop
<2:18 PM>: Leave you really sound like a Jackass,
<2:19 PM>: I may sound like a jackass, but that is the way I feel. This country was established by people who believed in GOD
<2:19 PM>: I don't doubt that the voting was fucked up when all the polls except for 2 states were on the mark.
<2:20 PM>: Whose God?
<2:20 PM>: Jefferson was an atheists
<2:20 PM>: The God of the Jews and Christian
<2:20 PM>: people
<2:20 PM>: it was God neutral
<2:20 PM>: a belief in a higher being
<2:21 PM>: I think "UNDER GOD" should stay right where it is and "IN GOD WE TRUST" should stay too
<2:21 PM>: Yes but whose GOD?
<2:21 PM>: Our God
<2:21 PM>: it is God neutral
<2:21 PM>: Who is your God?
<2:22 PM>: Not the Buddhist God, or the Muslim God etc............it is people from radical, non-God believing countries and backgrounds that have made morals go out the window
<2:23 PM>: Why is that they worship a GOD
<2:23 PM>: God meant a higher being, so Native American Indians should be excluded?
<2:24 PM>: they are the only true Americans
<2:24 PM>: you logic or argument is incorrect
<2:25 PM>: it is not up to a secular government to demand the worship or adoration of a particular God
<2:25 PM>: American Indians worship nature which is OK because God greeted the earth anyway. It is not like they worship a Fat Buddha or Allah etc
<2:26 PM>: No they worship a higher being, do you know any, have you ever been to one of their ceremonies
<2:26 PM>: Well then you are a racist since their God doesn't look or act like yours.
<2:27 PM>: What difference should anothers God be to you?
<2:28 PM>: I have never been to one of their ceremonies, but I do not have a problem with the Indians.....and you know what is you want to label me a racist the go ahead, I know what think is the way things should be and I have every right to think that way.
<2:29 PM>: well your definitely bias
<2:29 PM>: Yes, I am! I am not going to argue with you about that, I admit it
<2:30 PM>: That can be a problem since you have a preconceived notion that all people should be just like you.
<2:32 PM>: listen these are my personal beliefs which I have a right to have. I like being surrounded by people that share my beliefs and my values etc. I do not want to be part of a diverse group of people etc
<2:34 PM>: wait a minute America is a group of diverse people from many nations, a melting pot if you will with very different ideas, notions of what liberty and freedom is. To be so rigid is to deny others, their beliefs. It goes back to what I said. Your family and mind were not born here we came here to escape the same stuff your sprouting.
<2:35 PM>: if you cannot accept America as a diverse nation then what does that make you?
<2:36 PM>: I am saying that I do not personally want to live among all these "different" people and it is my right an American to feel this way. You do not have to like the way I feel and that is your right also.
<2:38 PM>: no, it is not your right, it is a privilege if your truly an American as you say. Look there is not true American unless your talking about the Indian tribes, they were here long before any of us.
<2:38 PM>: Do you remember after 911 how unified this country was?
<2:38 PM>: is it now?
<2:39 PM>: Haven't you ever wondered why?
<2:40 PM>: There wasn't red states or blue states, Dems or Repub. Muslims or Catholics, Jews or Indians. Haven't you wondered why things changed?
<2:40 PM>: I have.
<2:41 PM>: But lets forget about all this now. From this day forward the Republican will have to accept the blame for everything. There cannot be the blame game that Clinton was at fault, you own whatever happens, every little bit.
<2:42 PM>: I Agree! and I have to get going now
<2:42 PM>: You will own the continuing count of the dead in Iraq, which has exceeded the entire first 6 yrs of the Vietnam War until now.
<2:43 PM>: there was only 550 then
<2:43 PM>: OK. i really gotta get going, I will see you later


Well did I win?

[Sugarbleus]

107. WooooooooW!!! You did very well

Geeeeeeeeeeez this is going to get ugly for a while. It makes me shudder to hear this. I know there are biased people in this country..but holy moly, to read this is just stunning. Your co-worker being so bold as to admit she was a bigot? AND a radical religionist.
I don't suppose her "religion" makes her anymore compassionate towards poor people either...Can't stand that type.

I almost forgot, Hubby also got a phone message from a fundie friend this morning early. The guys voice was upbeat, sparkly, sing-songy; he didn't mention anything about politics but my gut tells me he is happy because of this election. He almost never calls anymore.

I wanted to pick up the phone and tell him to fuck off but thought I'd better leave that to hubby as he chooses.

I'm older; parents dead, kids grown up. My existing family are all liberal. There isn't one thing I wouldn't say to these types of whackos if confronted. I'm leaving my anti-bush bumper stickers on my car and buying more...drive around with them PROUDLY. I say to the bushites, BRING IT ON.

[lulu]

53. My sister still thinks that we have liberated Iraq

We never discuss politics, and I rarely speak to her anyway. It is very sad.

[chelaque liberal]

54. Same with my brother

First thing this morning I got an email from him-subject: quote of the century. It was a picture of Monica Lewinsky with the caption, I voted Republican this year. The Democrats left a bad taste in my mouth."

We have always seen things differently but we were respectful to each other. I shot back "Go Cheney yourself."

I don't care if I ever hear from him again.

[RevCheesehead]

55. I think it would be fair to say to your sister,

"You know, that's the difference between you and me. I would never have thought of calling you up to gloat if Kerry won...and I'm surprised and hurt that you think this means nothing to me. It does. And the fact that your desire to gloat is more important to you that your consideration of my feelings really hurts me deeply."

[GreenPartyVoter]

56. *big hugs* I've always wanted a sister, if you are interested. :^)

-------------------------------------------------------------------
FIGHT for election reform at the municipal and state level!
Clean up the American government from the ground up!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/electionreform

[Czolgosz]

57. My sister and I are both huge Kerry supporters, but our brother is

an major Republican. He moved from Texas to Ohio, and although we couldn't persuade him to vote against Bush, as a compromise, he agreed to cast his vote in Texas where he was voting his conscience but not voting to crush our hopes for regime change at home. That averted a disaster in our relationship.

I'm sorry your sister was not so understanding. All the Bush supporters I know fall into four categories: (1) the fearful, (2) the intellectually insecure (i.e., the dumb who are resentful that you are smarter), (3) the religious zealots, and (4) the fraternity-sorority types who misperceive their self interest. The main thing these folks have in common is that none is susceptible to reason: (1) you can't talk someone out of their unfounded fears, (2) the dumb are only offended by your attempts to educate them, (3) you can't persuade a zealot that we are right and his preacherman is wrong, and (4) and the country club Republicans were raised that way from birth and they won't change unless they fact a life-altering tragedy.

[Brewman_Jax]

58. Relationships could end

My freeper dad voted for Bush* because of gun control. While he's worried about his precious guns (I don't remember the last time he's been to the firing range), he complains that what health care he has from retirement is costing him more money and he's getting less coverage. He's likes the idea of income tax cuts, but his local and state taxes are going up. He's a dumbass anyway and we're just on...cordial terms. Mom voted for Kerry.

If I lose any freeper friends, I could live with that. Wouldn't lose any sleep for their sorry freeper asses. They can't deal with facts, anyway.

The Bush voters/freepers I know are all white males (like anyone is surprised :eyes: ) and a couple of white females. They can suffer when their kids are drafted, or they get laid off because the company leaves the US, and they can only work for Wal-Mart or Starbucks because those are the only options. They can't get health care because they can't afford it.

They got what they wanted. A war president they could drink beer with who doesn't make them feel stupid who stopped gay marriage and will put those dark-skinned terrorists and druggies in jail and away from their nice neighborhoods with the white picket fences.

They may feel different once they have to suffer in the hell of their own construction.

End of rant.

[Sarrek420]

61. " I don't understand how people can be so callous and unkind. "

LizW, I believe that you probably actually do understand - you just haven't applied your knowledge yet.

For the most part, we're talking about Christians here. And NO BODY in the history of mankind has caused more suffering, death and destruction to force their ideologies than the Christians have.


Jesus said: "Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword." -- (Matthew 10:34 NIV)

^ ^ This is what won last night.......

[pelagius]

112. Could everyone please lay off the anti-Christian postings...

...for just one effing day!? Look, I'm sorry about whatever Christians did to make you hate them so, but JUST DROP IT FOR TODAY, PLEASE.

Millions of Christians -- myself included -- worked and voted for Kerry and other Democratic candidates. In the 30 years I've been active in liberal politics, I feel like I spend half my time listening to ignorant rants about "Christians" from so-called liberals. I'm on your side, for Pete's sake, quit pushing me and "my type" away.

Just knock it off. Now.

[pelagius]

113. Oh, and you quote Jesus out of context, too.

Consider studying the Bible before quoting it.

[one_true_leroy]

62. sometimes it's a blessing...

i'm the only person in my family who cares about politics. my parents have never voted. EVER. i had to tell my sister who was running against bush about a month ago. i don't have to ever woeey about these kind of divisions (hopefully)

i am sorry about your sister. unfortunately, it seems lock-step with his supporters.

[Ellen Forradalom]

64. The arrogant Hitlerjugend of the 30s weren't smiling

when they were dying on the front lines or their hometowns were destroyed.

It is, in fact, a tragedy.

You have my sympathy.

[xxqqqzme]

65. last talked 2 my Mother in June,

my brother swallowed tednugget koolaid - And they think I'M strange!

[SarahB]

66. Thank goodness my parents and almost-ex are Dems...

We have enough to fight about.

[dethl]

67. Luckily...

my immediate family are all liberals. No divison is going to happen. Hell, my republican grandparents hated Bush more than Kerry. My family isn't going to be divided so easily.

[donheld]

68. I'm petrified to know if my brother and sister are bushies

i don't think i'd ever wanna see them again. Maybe i shouldn't take this so personal. But as a Gay man it's hard not to see a vote for bush support as a vote against me.

[lakemonster11]

86. I don't know if we should take it personally or not

but I know that I am. I feel insulted by every man and woman who voted for Bush, and, let me tell you, if I were gay I would feel like I had been slapped in the face.

Luckily no one in my family (at least my close family, who knows about the others?) voted for Bush. I'm not sure I could ever look at them the same way again.

If I live to be a hundred, I'm never voting for a Republican. If I like the Republican candidate better than the Dem, I'm voting third party. The Republicans have betrayed all of us.

[expatriate]

71. You have my sympathy.

I am pretty much estranged from my brother. We have never had anything in common. I'm pretty sure he voted for Bush. I've had no contact with him in almost a year now - not out of any particular acrimony, just because I have less in common with him than I do with someone from Pluto.

Coming from a very dysfunctional family, I can say something to those of you here who are hurting today, and who are being deliberately hurt by people who should love you.

There is an old saying - you can choose your friends, but you can't choose your family. Yes, in essence this is true, but I do believe you can choose your family. What is family, really - an accident of birth, or a support network of loving people, who can put ideology aside and care for and love each other regardless. If your birth family is treating you badly, make another family for yourself. Sharing genetic material does not guarantee tolerance and devotion, and I personally believe people endure more pain from family members than from any other people in their lives.

We're all going to be mourning for a while, but then we'll pick up and continue. Let part of your healing be seeking out and befriending people who will be true friends to you, no matter what.

[SemperEadem]

105. I so agree with you... you can choose your family

very well said.. thank you because I needed to read that today.

[TexasSissy]

72. I have Repub relatives, too. Though they won't act, I think, the

way your sister has.

Still, what to do regarding them is an issue. I dislike them very much right now.

[Sabriel]

74. they have forced me to choose my children over them

They don't seem to realize how deadly serious this is. Essentially, they voted against their own grandchildren and nieces and nephews. To them I say, don't send me any holiday cards or birthday greetings. I ain't opening them anymore.

[grasswire]

75. not the first time in American history

Think of the time of the Revolution, when families were split over Loyalism and Revolution. Our patriots pledged their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor. In doing so, they lost family forever.

The same happened in the war between the states. Brother against brother. Enemies to the end.

It's sad. I'm not taking any calls from my fundie sister today.

[Barrett808]

114. Arthur Schlesinger said that no issue was as divisive as the WWII debate

He was intereviewed a couple of years ago, and he said that no issue in living memory was as divisive as the debate over entering WWII. Lifelong friendships and families were broken irretrievably.

Looks like we have similar era at hand.

[ellacott]

77. I feel bad for what happend to you

My family are democrats but I have(had)a close relationship with a friend that is a Bush supporter. Our relationship has been severely strained over the past months and it may never get back to the place that it was.

This is another thing that I'm angry at bush about. He is a divider, not a uniter. He has divided us from the rest of the world and now that division has spread to personal relationships.

My friend has not gloated(yet) and I hope he doesn't. I have been in tears all day and I think I would go off on him if he did that.

[still_one]

78. THERE ARE NO CHECKS AND BALANCES ANYMORE

I am sorry for your argument with your sister

I do not even discuss politics with my brother, that is probably the best way to handle it

Hang in there

[info being]

80. What's her number? I'll tell her to fuck off myself.

[JDPriestly]

81. Stand up to your sister

We Democrats are far too unwilling to offend people who disagree with us. The Republicans confront, insult, say what they want and think they are doing us confronted and insulted a favor. That is because they firmly believe they are right. They will not respect or listen to us Dems until we confront and insult them. That is because Republicans will only believe that we Democrats really believe what we say we believe if we believe it enough to confront and insult and offend people to defend our beliefs.

[July]

127. Who cares if they don't believe we mean it?

I try not to be like them.

I do use icy politeness to underline their rudeness. Logic helps, too, they don't have much defense against it most of the time.

And if they want to keep insulting me, I walk away. End of relationship. My time's too valuable to me.

[Soopercali]

82. I haven't spoken to my brother in two years.

My mother said, "But he's your brother!"

I said, "I don't see him that way anymore. To me, he's an enemy of democracy."

[AngryOldDem]

83. God. I am so sorry

I wrote a friend earlier and said that I don't trust Bush when he says he wants to bring this country together, and that I trust his followers even less.

I think this is what I'm afraid of the most -- having to deal with Bush supporters on a daily basis who treat this like it was a junior high class election.

I hope you are able to find some common ground with your sister. I know you have to be hurting.

[mbee]

84. I think the fact that it is your sister makes it very hard, but

I've decided I don't want anything to do with my wingnut relatives down south. What a bunch of dimwits!

[Buddyblazon]

88. The following is the email I got back from my Dad today.

A little background:
He is a Vietnam Vet. We argue politics all the time...end every argument with I love you.
When I sent my email on Monday, I just had a bad feeling that Kerry would lose. My email was a response to his sending of an article about Sinclair playing their piece.
My sister and him are estranged...and have been for 20-25 years.




----- Original Message -----
From: XXX XXXXXXXX
To: XXXXXXX XXXXXXXX
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: 'Stolen Honor' Reaches 90 Million Homes!


They've already been debunked.

I feel sorry for you sheople. Really pathetic. Especially given that you can stand by while Bush uses smears directed at Vietnam Vets on a regular basis. First McCain...then Gore...then Kerry.

You must really be self-loathing to stand behind a guy that somehow avoided combat...and every Vet he runs against gets bashed. It's amazing...3 out 4 campaigns he's been in have been against Vietnam Vets...and amazingly all the Vets he ran against were smeared as immoral and shady characters and their service was questioned. Wow...WHAT ARE THE ODDS!? Just dumb fucking luck I guess. (If you actually believe that its "luck"...you are naive).

I just don't get you. You would vote for a guy with an MO of bashing Vets. YOU ARE A SUCKER!

This is a big reason the Veterans for Kerry don't like him. He has little if ANY problem with bashing people for their honorable service...by means of "outside" groups that make up ridiculous outlandish lies (but thats the type of guy you are...FEAR...FEAR...I remind you about the "millenium bug"). Thats fucking dispicable given his record (not a bad record...but it sure as hell wasn't combat).

Here's what I KNOW about you pop. You made your decision. Too bad I already voted. Can't change my mind.

And it looks like President Bunnypants is going to win it tomorrow anyway.

But when he does...I think you and I should take a couple of months off. Kelley, Jim and the Kids are coming to town for Thanksgiving. I'm spending Thanksgiving with them in Breckenridge. Rachel and I will come down for Christmas. But other than that...I think I just need some time away from the conversations.

I'll call you when it gets closer to Xmas. Hopefully you'll get a good "de-programming" before than. But I doubt it.





XXX,

Sorry that you've taken this approach. Perhaps you're right. The millenium bug was real and was attacked and the majority of problems wee remedied before hand. There were still some glitches but because of the work ahead of time when they occurred they were quickly focused on and were corrected. There were about 25 or 30 problems that we experienced at US West. So much for the millenium bug.

I'm sorry that you've become so angry. I'm quite hurt by the names you call me. I'm sure that there will be a "big Conspiracy" put out by the losing party over this election. Call whenever you can. I'll probably still be around. They haven't given me a timeframe for my entry on the Obituary page yet. Have composed it but it's not ready for submission.

have a good time in Breckenridge. Let us know about Christmas whenever you can.

Obviously you don't want to invite me to meet your friend who is a Veteran for Kerry. Quite alright. I'm sorry that you think I need re-programming. I accept the fact that you believe what you believe. I don't put you down for it. I've tried to be very supportive of what you've done and have bragged about how you've gotten involved and tried to make a difference with you activity with your party. I believe that I've even told you that and have encouraged you to get involved on a fulltime and for-pay basis.

Let me share this with you. The most down-heartened I've been in my life was when I was a liberal in Chicago and had flunked out of the University of Illinois. I tried hard to make a living off of my folk music and painting. I was very much into the crowd of Joan Baez and people with the same line of philosophy. One night when I saw what was happening within that group made me ask myself if that's what I wanted to become. My answer was a resounding "no." I looked closely at them and realized they were people with some wonderful ideas and caring hearts. However, to a person, they were filled with deep anger and they couldn't see a better approach than the one they were taking. I didn't want to be continually angry and so very negative. It took me years to get beyond that. I have moments it still creeps up on me and I try to banish it as quickly as possible. Since my close brush with death in 1995 I have taken a totally different look at life.

No matter what, I love you and only wish you well. I will respect your wishes and won't call you any more. I will miss talking with you, but I've grown used to having my children not wanting to be around me. Kelley has trained me well and my Brothers have gotten me to get over it and beyond it. Sorry that our personal beliefs have taken us to this point. Not my choice. I will not be driven to a position that I do not believe in.

I love you.

_____________________________________________________

I'm about to give him the shun treatment. We talk everyday. But I was so pissed at him before the election. He's a lonely man...and I just want to teach him how much he's taken me for granted. Always been "me, me, me." Didn't help me with college. Won't help me finish it off (I need 18 credits but didn't time my student loans correctly...and maxed out a semester early, with all my funds exhausted). He takes me golfing with him to show off his brand new top of the line golf clubs (the 2000$ ones that could of paid for my last semester...the ones he bought after I talked him into getting active again and taking him out for his first round in 31 years).

I just don't get it...and I think it's time he understands how wonderful the world is when BOTH your children shut you out.

[Iris]

92. Obviously pushing down feelings of anger and resentment has

really made his life worth living.

If anything, that's the kind of thinking I see over and over with Republicans. They don't anyone to get anything they don't have and sometimes they don't want anyone else having the opportunity to get what they have.


I love the way he tries to turn your passion into a way to make money.

[Kaysera]

98. I don't see this at all ...

I love the way he tries to turn your passion into a way to make money.

What I see is a fatherly concern for a young adult child's ability to support themselves (and family).

[Kaysera]

95. He really doesn't sound so bad ...

No matter what, I love you and only wish you well. I will respect your wishes and won't call you any more. I will miss talking with you, but I've grown used to having my children not wanting to be around me. Kelley has trained me well and my Brothers have gotten me to get over it and beyond it. Sorry that our personal beliefs have taken us to this point. Not my choice. I will not be driven to a position that I do not believe in.

I love you.

He sounds like he's willing to agree to disagree with you.

There may be more to it, ... but I just don't see it here.

Didn't help me with college. Won't help me finish it off (I need 18 credits but didn't time my student loans correctly...and maxed out a semester early, with all my funds exhausted). He takes me golfing with him to show off his brand new top of the line golf clubs (the 2000$ ones that could of paid for my last semester...the ones he bought after I talked him into getting active again and taking him out for his first round in 31 years).

How old are you ?

Are you independent of your parents ?

I just don't get it...and I think it's time he understands how wonderful the world is when BOTH your children shut you out.

I understand that you're angry ... but you and your dad actually seem to have a pretty good relationship (aside from your political differences).

Are you sure that you want to punish him this way ... simply because he doesn't agree with you ?

[Iris]

96. I think its obvious there's more going on here than that. n/t

[Kaysera]

99. I see love ...

Who would you call up everyday that you didn't love ... ?

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

109. Love?

Yeah. They're hugging you with one hand while trying to CUT YOUR THROAT with the other hand.

I wouldn't need that kind of "love".

[Kaysera]

110. Where do you see any evidence of ... trying to CUT YOUR THROAT ?

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

119. The fact that he voted for Bush says it all.

If you don't believe that the next four years will be hell for America, then I consider you one of the sixty million.

THAT'S what I mean by trying to CUT YOUR THROAT.

[Kaysera]

120. So if one does not agree with you politically ... they are your enemy ?

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

141. You don't get it.

THAT'S HOW THEY THINK.
THAT'S HOW THEY VOTE.

It's not about them agreeing with me. It's about them mortgaging my future. It's about them endangering my country.

And YES, I now believe that since they don't vote like me, they're not worth my time. Don't give me any mamby-pamby "how sad, I pity you" kind of argument. If they're bitching about ANYTHING within six months, complain to me, and I find out they voted for Bush, I'm gonna say "aww, too bad you're one of the 60 million stupid."

I'm not going to be nice to them anymore. I'm not going to give a crap about them anymore. (This reply really fits in the other GD thread, but hey, what the fuck...)

[Puglover]

121. How fucking easy and cheap is it

to say "I love you" and think that takes care of everything. How naive.

[Kaysera]

124. On the contrary ...

The poster described a situation in which his/her father seemed to be very supportive and involved with him/her (i.e. phoning on a daily basis).

This is more than <b> ... saying ... "I love you"</b>.

Even the original poster of this thread agreed that the father sounded compassionate to their position.

I hope that you are not really this cynical.

[Puglover]

139. You exhibit about as much depth

as a teacup.

[Love Bug]

128. Goodness.

Your email to your father had language that was a bit inflammatory, but this response from him:

"Call whenever you can. I'll probably still be around. They haven't given me a timeframe for my entry on the Obituary page yet. Have composed it but it's not ready for submission."

is emotional blackmail. Just because he says "I love you" at the end doesn't excuse the stuff that came before. But, hey, you know him and I don't. Perhaps my take on this is wrong.

[Iris]

90. So what if she's kin? She's treating you like shit. Would you let a

friend treat you that way? A significant other? A boss? A co-worker? A stranger?

[SemperEadem]

93. don't feel sorry--your sister is the one at fault in this scenario

in the first place, she called you to bait you. She was in the wrong and she should be apologizing to you for her rude and immature behavior--how old is she, 7?

But if it helps any, remember this biblical phrase: Pride goes before destruction and a haughty spirit before the fall. If the bible is truth--as they believe--then if they indulge such attitudes, their own God will dig a hole for them to fall into to neutralize their 'high spirit'.

Take the high road and the long view to see her forthcoming.

[The Minus World]

94. If it helps you any,

My sister did almost the exact same thing. She called me up on three-way with a family friend just to shout "four more years". I hung up on them and called each of them back individually.

Bush's administration has officially driven people insane; it's getting to the point where they're openly antagonizing one another for their political beliefs.

I felt as though I had to defend my position, so I tore into my sister, telling her that Bush puts on a moderate face while pandering to the Christian right, but quietly furthers a corporate agenda. Apparently that makes me a "conspiracy theorist". I was condescended to; I was told that Kerry's alleged "flip-flopping" was worse than Bush's outright lies; I was told that Michael Moore was a "fat lying fuck" who pulled the wool over America's eyes; I was told that her beliefs were vindicated by the re-election of this criminal.

How will we deal with such a rift in our country when so many people believe the cascade of lies being showered upon them?

[Lisa]

97. I see she's emulating the dignity and emotional maturity of her leader!

Figures. Hang out with the guy long enough, and you start to muff multi-syllabic words and giggle at infantile humor.

[sui generis]

100. she was being insensitive and immature

it's not always our job to take the high road. We are human too. If she isn't grown up enough to get over it, that would be sad.

Otherwise, I think you should tell her that she was being insensitive and you had a right to react that way, and leave it at that.

[pdx_prog]

101. Something I heard a long time ago....

When you are wrong, admit it....

When you are right, shut up.....

[nadinbrzezinski]

102. I am sorry for that personal loss

but there is something to look forward

I hate to say it... but when the roosters come home, she may then see the light but most likely will not

This is feeling more and more like a civil war

;-(

[Princess Buttercup]

103. I spent the whole drive to work planning

what to say if one of my co-workers started gloating about the election. I'm sorry it was your sister who did the gloating to you. If it helps, here's the gist of what I was planning to say:

I feel like someone died and I resent you gloating about the outcome. This isn't a popularity contest or a football game where you picked the winning team, it's the future of our country. Don't you realize that we all lost?


She didn't say anything, at least not today. So at least she has some sense. Her situation kind of reminds me of what is outlined in "What's the Matter with Kansas?" in that she gets an odd sort of empowerment out the Republicans having somehow "outsmarted" the Democrats. How she, with her associate's degree, somehow knew more about the outcome than someone with a Ph.D. (in political history, no less!).

[disgruntledgrunt]

104. You're not alone

My parents basically disowned me after I told them I voted for Kerry. They told me not to bother calling them at all, especially if I'm in trouble.

Any suggestions?

[Kaysera]

108. Give it time ...

Everybody hackles are up due to the the very intense election campaigns.

People will start to chill out after a while.

[July]

131. Don't call them.

It may be hard to do, but don't go where you're not wanted. They may catch on eventually and regret what they've said. Until then, they're going to treat you poorly. They already have. Don't blame yourself, they're busy doing that, and they're mistaken.

Line up other friends or relatives for those times when you really need someone.

[Dukkha]

106. everyone who is now estranged form a relative or friend

should write down their story and share it with the "uniter" in the White House. He should know just how much he has polarized the nation.

Perhaps a book like Michael Moore's correspondences from soldiers in Iraq.

[Steely_Dan]

111. Thank You, Everyone

Thanks...I know now why I am a Democrat.

I have learned so much from your kind responses. It is difficult sometimes to have the courage of your convictions.

The responses were all very supportive...But here is my response to some of them...

Yes...thanks for offering to be my new sister. (All of you) - My entire life has been spent being a "little brother." Maybe now I can be someone's "older brother."

Your right, I would have never contacted her and rubbed a Kerry victory in her face.

And..I agree that she (and other repubs) do not appreciate the seriousness of this situation.

Thanks to the one who wrote about his Dad and their relationship. I thought that you father was very compassionate...but then again, I really don't know him.

I realized that I am not alone in my suffering. Because of you...all of you...this is a little easier to accept.

I am a proud American. I am patriotic. And I love my country beyond measure. Regardless of what those on the right might say, they could never deny the fact that I truly love my country.

Thanks everyone.

-Paige

[Lorien]

116. If my mom voted *, that's it

we're done.She's been shutting me out for years since she became "born again", and decided that since I was born out of wedlock, i'm not in "God's plan", and thus don't deserve anything in this life.

Sometimes it's healthier for all involved just to let go of some family member's. The heartsickness they give us simply isn't worth the stuggle. Some of us have family members who are our friends, others have friends who are our families.

[Love Bug]

126. Your mom shuns you because you were born illegitimate?

Uh--how did you happen-- immaculate conception? I'm sorry, I don't mean to make joke of what is obviously a painful situation for you, but I just don't get that "logic" at all.

As for me, I have a brother who hasn't spoken to me for 2 years because I took my sister's side in a dispute. Sigh.

[Lorien]

133. Yes. Abortion was illegal when she had me

I am her "shame". She's very attached to my sister, though. My sister and I share the same father, the only difference is that my mom was married to him by the time she had my sister. Religious zealotry can be just plain sick.

[Puglover]

123. A co worker just walked up to me

and we started to talk. I asked her if she voted (she's very apolitical) and she said yes. I foolishly asked for who. She smirked and said "Bush, I just didnt like Kerry" I said "When your brats get drafted spare me the tears." I think anger managment may be called for.

[Love Bug]

129. I'm avoiding known repuke cow-orkers for just that reason

I don't want to see their smug looks and condescending smiles like they won the lottery or something. They are fools and I don't want a run-in with HR because I lost my temper--they are not worth it.

[TedsGarage]

132. I'm fortunate

Everyone in my family is a Democrat. My father used to work for Michigan Gov. William Milliken (a Republican who voted for Kerry). I've never heard him express an immoderate opinion on any topic, but on Wednesday, he told me he wanted to run over Bush with a truck.

My stepsister was married to a Republican, but now she has an order of protection against him. It's that macho, keep-the-woman-in-line thing they have.

[hangemhigh]

136. I don't speak to Mother anymore

In her single glory days she was a fag hag (to use the vernacular) and now she is in her born again, hate the gays phase. A lifelong democrat, she supports Bush, is terrified of gays and terra ists. At least I won't have to listen to her bitch about her declining SS check and expensive prescription drugs now.

[Wabbajack]

137. Brothers and sisters of all ages

fight every day.

Give it some time.

Call her in a couple weeks.

Don't lose your family over Bushit.

[redqueen]

138. It's not over, it's just a spat.

Next time you talk to her, instead of hanging up on her, just tell her why it's serious.

[Hephaistos]

140. Write down your conversation, as best as you can remember

There will be a day, maybe in few month, maybe in two years, whenever the sh*t really hits the fan, she'll regret voting for * - that's the day you send her your transcript, without comment.

If she apologizes, she'll be your sister again. If not...