BBV: Voting without auditing. (Are we insane?)

[Andy_Stephenson]

SEATTLE, WASHINGTON Nov 3 2004 -- Did the voting machines trump exit polls? There’s a way to find out.

Black Box Voting (.ORG) is conducting the largest Freedom of Information action in history. A series of public records requests has now blanketed the U.S. to obtain internal computer logs and other documents from 3,000 individual counties and townships in order to audit the election.

Among the first requests sent to counties (with all kinds of voting systems -- optical scan, touch-screen, and punch card) is a formal records request for internal audit logs, polling place results slips, modem transmission logs, and computer trouble slips.

Such a request filed in King County, Washington on Sept. 15, following the primary election six weeks ago, uncovered an internal audit log containing a three-hour deletion on election night; “trouble slips” revealing suspicious modem activity; and profound problems with security, including accidental disclosure of critically sensitive remote access information to poll workers, office personnel, and even, in a shocking blunder, to Black Box Voting activists.

Black Box Voting is a nonpartisan, nonprofit consumer protection group for elections. You may view the first volley of below here: Freedom of Information requests here

Responses from public officials will be posted in the forum, is organized by state and county, so that any news organization or citizens group has access to the information. Black Box Voting will assist in analysis, by providing expertise in evaluating the records. Watch for the records online; Black Box Voting will be posting the results as they come in. And by the way, these are not free. The more donations we get, the more FOIAs we are empowered to do. Time's a'wasting.

We look forward to seeing you participate in this process. Join us in evaluating the previously undisclosed inside information about how our voting system works.

Play a part in reclaiming transparency. It’s the only way.

[TheDebbieDee]

1. (Are we insane?)

Why, yes. Yes we are!

[VeniceBeat]

2. Thanks for Fighting for Us So Hard and Smart, Andy

You're more God than Cheney!

:)

If there's anything I can do for you guys in Southern California, let me know!

[Andy_Stephenson]

6. We may be down...

but not out.

Sign up at BBV.org we will have marching orders in the next day or so.

Keep the faith Brother.

Andy

[loudsue]

3. Thanks, Andy, for posting.

I'm so depressed right now, I could buckle any minute.

We all KNOW this election was stolen. We've been telling people for (in my case) 4 years that this was the case. Now we could be stuck with dubya for 4 more years. WE WON'T EVEN HAVE DU IN 4 MORE YEARS -- WE'LL BE ILLEGAL!!!!!

If he is truly put back in office, not only is this country fucked, but the whole world is fucked. The other world leaders will not tolerate this mad man. They figured the first election was stolen and they would wait until we voted for real. Now they can see that they stole the election again, so there is no stopping the neocons and their PNAC agenda. They will NOT show mercy.

I'm glad you posted here tonite....I really needed to see you here -- and Bev if she's not up to her ass in alligators with the fraud going on around her.

Holy shit I'm depressed!!!

:kick::kick:

[Andy_Stephenson]

5. Hugs Sue

Don't be depressed. Now is the time to redouble our efforts.

Urge candidates not to conceed.

America...We have the right to say NO to this travesty!

Watch out. Yall aint seen nothing yet.

:loveya:

[HysteryDiagnosis]

23. Not to worry.... here is something to give to any freepers you may still

speak to... it is something that they might relate to... maybe not... but if they read it.. they cannot go away untouched in some way...

http://www.antipasministries.com/oldnews/afga.html
"There is another important connection between our situation today and the Cold War. Terrorism has replaced Communism as the rationale for the militarization of the country, for military adventures abroad, and for the suppression of civil liberties at home ... The word 'communism' was used to justify the most egregious violations of human rights. So much that went on during the Cold War was justified in the name of fighting Communism, leading to the deaths of millions of people ... A vast leap took place from 'fighting Communism' to actions against people and governments that had nothing to do with Communism. In 1954, the United States overthrew the government in Guatemala, which was not Communist but which was expropriating the United Fruit Company. In 1973, the government in Chile was overthrown in the name of fighting Communism. The government was not Communist, but it was not serving the interests of Anaconda Copper and ITT ..."

[RedEagle]

4. Recounts folks, recounts

Don't let your federal candidates give up much lest Kerry/Edwards.

Manual recounts of the original, voter-generated ballots.

Help out on www.blackboxvoting.org for the work Andy explained.

If you believe that all is not well with the elctoral system, then fight for the honest results in this election- and help us overhaul it!

The scam began years ago between election officials and vendors. WE have been kept out of the "system."

No more. Take it back.

E-voting and HAVA only HELPED muddy the waters.

The Election Center- Gotta go

(On edit- The Election Center came into existance in the Bush/Reagan era @ 1984)

Penolope Bonsall, FEC- Gotta go

NASED and NASS officials involved in the voting system fiasco- gotto go

Get involved at the grass roots level and don't let them shake you.

Cryptography as the next "solution," gotta go

[VeniceBeat]

7. Copy that, Red Eagle!

No concession!

Mission: Justice!

[Andy_Stephenson]

8. No Concession

No Concession

NO CONCESSION!!!


MAKE IT THE MEME!!!!!

Say it everywhere!

[Chovexani]

9. I heard you on AAR

Thanks for all the work you do.

[Andy_Stephenson]

12. Thanks for your support

here is the meme

NO CONCESSION!

[ConsAreLiars]

10. Thank you!

Heard the AAR call-in. Short but to the point.

More here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1290765&mesg_id=1290765

[Andy_Stephenson]

11. Thanks Bumbler...

Peace Brother.

[RedEagle]

13. Andy, more help needed in Ohio?

Kick!

[hunter]

14. Nice to see a familiar face.

The time bomb went off. Let's clean up the mess.

[Andy_Stephenson]

15. Where did it go off...

is it a big mess? Should I bring a broom and dust pan? Or should I bring a shovel and wheelbarrow?

[hunter]

17. Shovels and wheelbarrows...

...there's shit everywhere.

God bless all the folks who are not running away from it.

I think I'm going to smack the next person who screams, like Chicken Little, "It's over."

Fucking cowards, just like George W. Bush.

[Andy_Stephenson]

19. It's not over till the fat lady sings...

and she hasn't even started warming up yet.

I have my wheel barrow and shovel ready.

[althecat]

16. Thank god for you guys!!!!

[althecat]

18. The Exit Poll Results Have Been Changed....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=201&topic_id=1162#1186

[VeniceBeat]

20. Rally in Columbus, Ohio!

OPEN THE MACHINES!

NO CONCESSION!


The woman in Florida who saw a summary for a Republican Ticket after voting straight Democratic on an blackbox-- who's to say it's just a bad apple machine!

Grounds for investigation!

MAJOR FRAUD!

NO CONCESSIION!

[MudBug]

21. yes

[BevHarris]

22. State of Minnesota 'You'll get no help from us'

Have been informed they plan to stall the reply for "at least 30 days, or longer." And I quote: "You'll get no help from us." -- Luci Botzek, Minnesota Association of County Officers.

This one is not negotiable, folks. And we need your help. We have a smattering of counties for which we do not have the right type of contact information -- counties who do not list it on their Web sites, those that need a little more digging (like a phone call).

If you can help make a few calls to get this information, and e-mail it to us, please let me know -- [e-mail].

We have two more FOIA requests coming pell mell, and we don't want to leave anyone out.

Bev Harris

[Junkdrawer]

24. Just contributed at www.blackboxvoting.org...

www.blackboxvoting.org

Work like this takes money. And If anyone has the address of other organizations engaged in this work, please post a link.

I, for one, am putting my money where my mouth is.

[BevHarris]

25. Thank you. This one was stolen, folks.

We have three chances to prove fraud before it is all moot -- and laws, like FOIA, are rolled back beyond repair.

Black Box Voting has a minimal infrastructure, and we need as much help by volunteers as possible.

We are honing in on collusion and racketeering. We need the records as quickly as possible.

We need volunteers to crunch more of the hard-to-find local contact information into our database (we are using it to find records sometimes purged or "lost" from larger entities, by doing criss-cross records requests).

We have to write a check to pick up those records every time. One of my key Freedom of Information requests in Georgia alone will cost $3000 to obtain. Junkdrawer's contribution goes directly toward paying for records, and we've got some killer requests, very strategic, going on behind the scenes.

Whatever you can do to help, now is the time to jump in.

Bev Harris

[in_cog_ni_to]

26. kick

:kick:

[VirginiaDem]

27. I need statistical help and I can't start a thread! I

For some reason I no longer have enough posts to start threads. Here's the deal: I believe I can prove statistically that evoting dropped votes. Maybe other statisticians can run similar regressions. I need a list of all states with non-evoting, all states with evoting and paper receipts and all states with paperless evoting. I then need 2000 and 2004 turnouts for those states. With those numbers I can check to see if the turnout was not big enough for the evoting states.

Who has easy access to these numbers?

[tom_paine]

28. kick

[BevHarris]

29. All the states have evoting. It is the central computer and remote access

where the fraud is most likely to occur. This business about looking only at touch-screens is a distraction from the real issue, which is auditing the vote.

What good does it do to have a paper ballot that we are prohibited by law from using for an audit? The paper ballot machines are just as bad, under current electoral procedure.

But do crunch the numbers on the evoting. I would expect that those perform even worse than the paper ballot systems, since you can play with the central tabulator and there are fewer ways to catch manipulaton.

But don't be distracted, folks. The common denominator is "final votes counted by a computer program with secret software." Which means about 80 percent of America.

Bev Harris
Black Box Voting
http://www.blackboxvoting.org

[VirginiaDem]

32. thank you for your work! n/t

[LuCifer]

30. 2 things NEEDED: PAPER TRAIL & INDEPENDENT PROGRAM ANALYSIS

We need a friggin paper trail to these damn computer machines. And we need INDEPENDENT analysis of these machines' computer programing.

OTHERWISE, HTF ARE WE EVER GONNA GET WHO WE VOTED FOR A KNOW WE DID LEGITIMATELY!?!?!??!

Lu Cifer, REVOLT! REVOLT! REVOLT!

[BevHarris]

31. It will never happen until we unseat certain public officials

Conspiracy, in law enforcement terms, is called "Racketeering."

No one will support a system put in place through collusion and kickbacks. Follow the money, and prove the fraud.

It's an auditing problem.

Bev Harris
Black Box Voting
http://www.blackboxvoting.org

[Rjnerd]

33. Surprising abstention rate...

How accurate are the turnout figures?

If the 120 million national figure is something aproaching correct, the reported popular vote total of 113 million, is more than 5%.

Gets worse if you just take Callifornia: With a reported 12 million turnout, they only tallied 9.5 million PV's. Better than 20% Thats the difference in the national PV total...

Oh yea, is there any way to get a handle on the possible "straight ticket error" - just how many people in the states that had the option, wound up with the "default" reversed choice.

-dp-

[T Roosevelt]

34. We need to look comprehensively at all the data available

What seems to have happened yesterday has been my biggest concern about counting votes and electronic voting (and others have posted this same sentiment) - exactly how do we know whether or not the results correlate with what was expected?

I've seen a couple of threads looking at different precincts, exit polls, etc.

I would also imagine that some blogs (mydd, leftcoaster, others) will be looking at some things.

But here on DU we have access to tremendous analytical talent, resources, numbers, etc.

I envision an indepth analysis of nationwide results, at a precinct level, looking at registrations by party, votes by party, vote counts in each and every race and (and ballot initiative?), previous election results, etc, looking for discrepancies and inconsistencies in what we are seeing.

I for one cannot believe that Florida shifted from stolen from Gore to big for *. I also cannot believe that this nation went from majority Gore to big? majority *.

Something is fishy, and I for one would like to get to the bottom of it.

I'm thinking a more organized, academic approach - a very task-oriented study, consistent methodology, coordinated effort that takes into account more than what's being discussed in the thread. Something that cannot be disputed. I don't want the smoke - I want the gun.

[VirginiaDem]

35. That sounds good...

I'm rethinking the turnout approach because the national turnout did actually go up significantly, as did Florida. So the angle may be the PVs. I'll look around.

[lthuedk]

36. Our present state:

http://www.light-to-dark.com/new_god_country.html

Stephen Pitt

[Gin]

37. just donated...thanks for all the hard work...

g

[Andy_Stephenson]

40. Thank you GIn

I promise your money will be put to good use resolving this issue once and for all.

Andy

[TrustingDog]

38. thanks Andy! I've been dour for hours but you lifted my spirits...

I don't want to put all that responsibility on ya, but hey, I know you have big shoulders.
A big hug to you and Bev and the so many that have worked so hard and are not giving up.

You Are America.

[Andy_Stephenson]

39. I hear ya on the dour thing...

But chin up Brother...we have a lot of work to do over the next 10 days.

Kerry may have conceeded but the counting is not over yet nor has the election been certified.

Andy

[TrustingDog]

41. dour for years, on edit.

[Andy_Stephenson]

42. Now Now...

DOn't be so glum. We have a lot of work to do. We have to get the BBV issue handled before the midterms.