Powell gives a big "F-U" to Taiwan, embraces Chi-Coms

[UdoKier]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041026/ap_on_re_as/taiwan_us_china_1

TAIPEI, Taiwan - Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) has angered Taiwanese officials and lawmakers by making unusually strong comments denying that the island is an independent nation and suggesting Taiwan should unify with China.

Ah, how lovely. It brings back fond memories of when Powell played grabass and danced and sang for the VERY SAME EVIL COMMUNISTS that we were told that we HAD TO DIE FIGHTING in SE Asia or else end up FIGHTING THEM HERE.

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/07/27/powell.sing/


What is it with Powell and doing little performances for Asian audiences? First this, then in drag for ASEAN at Brunei, then dressed as one of the Village People in Indonesia this year? It's bad enough he has to be a clown for Bush, but for the world as well? Does Powell have no self-respect at all?

[swag]

1. Bush and Powell are Red Chinese Communists!

[AIJ Alom]

2. Oh my God ! You mean the Bush Administration who always says freedom is on

the march is supporting communist China over Democratic Taiwan ???

[OutsourceBush]

10. the neo-con Christian fundamentalists have declared war on democracies

and democrats. They do not want people to have any power anywhere in the world.

[specter]

3. Powell and Rice

are tokens thats all!

[trespam]

4. Rejoining is inevitable

I will differ from what may be common opinion here. I worked with someone from Taiwan a while back. His opinion on the whole matter: china is china. It has a long history. Someday, Taiwan will rejoin the mainland. Hong Kong has rejoined, with some bumps. Taiwan probably will as well someday.

[UdoKier]

7. And there are THOUSANDS in my neighborhood who fled the handover.

They were none too happy to join the red utopia.

But I am happpy to have them here. They are wonderful neighbors.

[Gaffey Duck]

12. Depends...

If they're Hoklo, Hakka, and non-Chinese aboriginals, they're the good guys in Taiwan. If they're Mainlanders who fled with the Chiang family, their evil far-rightists and have had ties to the American right for a very long time.

[UdoKier]

22. Handover meaning Hong Kong, not Taiwan.

They got out while the getting was good. I haven't met many Taiwanese in my corner of San Francisco.

[lanparty]

23. What if Taiwan doesn't WANT to join????

Hell, should Tibet be part of China???

The facts on the ground is that Taiwan is a distinct, independent entity. Our diplomatic BS is that we have a "One China" policy.

What none of the diplomats EVER say publicly is NEITHER of the Chinas are the China we want!!!!!


Next we're going to here about a "one Soviet Union" policy from Putin. I suppose we should honor that as well!?!?!?!?!?!?

Finally, what you think of as a monolithic entity IS NOT. The diversity of language in China is pretty stunning for being "one people". With all the ethinic diversity of the US, we are probably more liguistically homogeneus than the Chinese.

But I guess we aren't speaking the same languange ... ARE WE????

[wingover]

5. US Expected To Sell Nuclear Reactors To Communist China

http://www.freepressinternational.com/nuclear.10192004.uschina.11836.html

[Deja Q]

6. Cool. Armageddon is nigh.

They get our money.

They get our jobs.

They now get our weapons.

Yet they're an empire that Saint Ronnie would call evil because they're communist?!

Uh, aren't these communists supposed to be evil?

Why are we asking them to merge with a smaller, democratic, nation? Last I recall, large eats small. Not vice versa.

[lanparty]

24. They get our manufacturing base ...

Guess what, we are an industrialized society. Guess what happens to an industrialized society when they don't work their own machines??? They become dependent on foreigners.

What will become of our independence as a nation when 60% of our goods are manufactured in China and the other 40% is produced on the footsteps of the red army (indochina). Will we be independent??? Could we make our own decisions.

Say what you like about Reagan. He understood that the citizens of dictators were little more than serfs and slaves. One does not enhance the life of serfs OR slaves by trading with the slavemaster!!!!

Taiwan isn't a perfect Democracy. There is no such thing. But they're a HELL of a lot better than mainland fascist China (thats right, they dropped all their communist pretension, they're no different than the Nazis now).

What amazes me is only a few people understand this equation. And half of them are paleo-cons like Tom Tancredo. We cannot survive as a strong nation in charge of our own destiny when the skills and crafts of civilization all reside outside our borders!!!!!

[newyawker99]

14. Hi wingover!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[David__77]

8. Taiwan is not an independent nation, it is a part of one China.

I disagree completely with prevalent sentiment on this board. It had been bipartisan policy since 1979 that there is one China and Taiwan is a part of China. This is a matter for the people of the PRC and on Taiwan to decide. In fact, prior to their miseast rampage, the neocons were quite warm towards the Taiwan separatists and were interfering in China's affairs. Progressives should support the sovereignty of the PRC and oppose moves to intervene.

[Gaffey Duck]

11. I see no reference to...

1. The rise of left-leaning anti-China parties in Taiwan.

2. The will of the Taiwanese people, excluding the far-right Mainlander imperialists of the Chinese Civil War.

3. The far-right policies of the pro-China parties in Taiwan, of the CCP (trust me), and of the pro-Beijing parties in Hong Kong.

4. The fact that few Republicans have ever supported Taiwanese independence under the terms of Taiwan's Taiwanese nationalist movement, but rather Chinese unification under the terms of the far-right Kuomintang and its allies, now in league with the CCP since it realise that it has no future and will continue to lose power to left-leaning pro-independence parties unless it surrenders to the CCP.

5. DEATH TO THE CCP-GOP-SAUD FAMILY AXIS OF EVIL AND ALL WHO SUPPORT IT!!!!!!

The ironic thing is, the fundies who see this as "Taiwan good China bad" withoout understanding the nuances behind China and Taiwan are going to be very alienated between this and the civil union remarks,

[lanparty]

25. Careful!!!

. DEATH TO THE CCP-GOP-SAUD FAMILY AXIS OF EVIL AND ALL WHO SUPPORT IT!!!!!!

You just advocated assasination of the president indirectly. You shouldn't do that. We are being monitored!!!!!

[trespam]

17. The fellow I worked with thought the same

And he was from Taiwan. I'm not sure of the circumstances of his leaving Taiwan to live in the US, but he took a very philosophical, long-term perspective on the whole matter, thinking that there was a larger China, Taiwan is part of it, and thinks will have to work out.

I believe economically there already is a lot of integration between the mainland and Taiwan. I expect it to increase. Taiwan and China will have to find a way for Taiwan to maintain significant independence while China saves face by considering them part of larger China.

I don't think Taiwan is worth WWIII. I think keeping China stable as it modernizes is going to be a big enough problem. China could very well explode one of these days. Unlike other Asian nations like Japan in which there is a great deal of cohesion, I've gathered that the Chinese could spin out of control with little impetus.

[lanparty]

26. Cold War 2 is inevitable !!!!

We cannot continue to hand China the keys to our economy AND expect them to Democratize. They have ZERO motivation.

The bitch about China is that they DITCHED the planned economy model that did NOT work for the Soviet Union. They WILL NOT collapse under their own weight. In fact, we are now PROPPING THEM UP by letting them into the capitalist club.

Let me go on record that we shouldn't trade on favorable terms with nations that treat their citizens like serfs. We should NOT reward tyranny with trade!!!!! It will be the end of our own freedom.

We will wake up one morning and be in the pocket of Beijing if we don't change course. We are shipping all our critical industries into the heart of the dragon or directly onto it's doorstep!!!!

The soundest foreign policy for China is to stimulate provincial independence. We don't need re-unification with Taiwan. We need to break apart what Chin has made. We need an indepedent Hong Kong, Manchuria, Shezhuan, Mongolia, ETC!!!!!!

China CANNOT concievably Democratize because it is inherently an Imperium in conception form and function. The emperor is simply has a different title now. Nothing changed when Mao-Zhe-Dung took over. They merely traded one tyrant for another!!!!!

I don't care HOW OLD the current Emperor is. His best interest STILL maintaining his rank, status and position!!!! Democracy is fundamentally opposed to this. China will jerk us around and take "small steps" to create the appearance of change. But nothing will!!!

[UdoKier]

20. Supporting PRC sovereignty doesn't rule out Taiwan sovereignty.

Taiwan does NOT want to be ruled by the mainland, any more than Iraq wanted to be ruled by us, or our puppet Allawi.

[NewJeffCT]

29. unfortunately

If China went to the UN, they would garner a heck of a lot more support for reunification than we did with Iraq... China has quietly been going around the world negotiating great trade deals with smaller countries in Africa, South America, the Middle East, etc with the long term goal of winning UN votes for when they have the inevitable showdown with Taiwan. If they have a showdown with Taiwan, what does the US do? Go against the world again & side with Taiwan?

[fdr_hst_fan]

9. Isn't it amazing?

Fifty years ago, you wouldn't catch a Repuke DEAD in Red China; also, a Repuke wouldn't be caught DEAD endorsing an "illegal war". How times HAVE changed!

[Tomee450]

13. I maybe wrong

but I doubt that Powell makes many of the decisions in this administration. I suspect he just goes along.

[0007]

15. After all China is carrying all our paper. Go figure!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

16. Chi-Coms?

What is this, the early 1960s?

[UdoKier]

21. The usage is half tongue-in-cheek

It points out their hypocrisy for attacking Saddam while embracing the brutal Beijing regime. China is far drom a worker's utopia, with grinding poverty still the norm despite the huge economic growth of the last 2 decades. Thousands are executed every year by the state. Even members of the Falun Gong cult cannot practice their superstition in peace. Some of the people here act as though Tienanmen square never happened.

I will agree with a "one China" policy when the majority of Taiwanese vote for it.

[lanparty]

27. 12 China policy !!!!!

Manchuria, Tibet, Taiwan, Hong Kong, etc..., etc....

It's the only way for the problem to take care of itself!!!!!

[lil-petunia]

18. Hell, shoot down our spy plane, we are all friends here.

Yeah, and those democratic folks across your water, forget about democracy. WE figured out how to ignore it, just like you.

[Zynx]

19. China owns the lion's share of our debt

$$$$ = leverage = power.

[tom_paine]

28. This is completely consistent with the behavior of Tyrannies like Amerika

Bunnypants* and his Foul Stooge are simply behaving as you would expect Totalitarian Tyrants who HATE freedom (but are forced to pretend they LOOOOVE freedom for Filthy Little Nobodies like us).

And yes, more and more they are revealing themselves as being on the side of history that Hitler and Stalin were on.

Naturally, they take the same position as Hitler and Stalion towards the World Court and Justice in general.

This is but another very in keeping with what they are step for the disgusting and Tyrannical Busheviks.